Man convicted of groping Minnie Mouse

[diznygirl]

I know this is basically a man bashing forum over all because of the men:female ratio here but am going to post my opinion anyway.

In those costumes how in the heck would you know where her chest is to even grab at it? Secondly you are always rushed into taking pics with the characters because there are so many in line. If you have never been there before like this man, and now he is being put into the spot of taking photos and seeing other people putting arms around the characters thought it was okay and thats what he was doing just putting arms around the character not even knowing where his hand was and so busy paying attention to the photograph not realizing the character was trying to push his hands away. Again in those costumes do you really know where anyones "parts" are at?

Again I have no idea if this was intentional or not but when it comes to men most everyone here likes to shoot first and ask questions laters.

I remember a thread a few years back where a female cast member claimed she was raped by several male cast members in their apartment. Many people here screamed that they should be put in jail immediately that this should be done to them and that.....and you know what? It turned out the girl lied...it was consensual and there was proof. The thread went dead after that...I dont recall people coming back and saying "Oh I was wrong"

There is a thin layer of padding - you can feel things through it. DH is a Greeter. You have to have eyes in the back of your head to be able to see everything at once, especially in the greeting rooms like in ToonTown Fair. There is usually only one Greeter and as many as 4 characters.

He's overheard the people (usually guys) plotting in line about the photo they want to stage with Jasmine etc. When this happens he heads them off by staging his own with their arms crossed.


Stuff like this happens all the time.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

For the defense to say "it's a mouse, not a person" was an attempt to make the victim be inhuman. I would have to say that was a HUGE mistake.

If they wanted the court to believe in their client's innocence--to make the plaintiff inhuman was not the way to go. Thus I have a difficult time believing their side of the story. Perhaps it wasn't their intent. But it is how it came across.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I She was worried about getting fired, so she "stayed in character"? But she came forward later?

Characters cannot break character on stage for any reason of their choosing.

Should they have a need to leave, they have a way of informing the handler and they will be whisked away.

It has nothing to do with reporting an incident once they are backstage.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

For the defense to say "it's a mouse, not a person" was an attempt to make the victim be inhuman. I would have to say that was a HUGE mistake...

I agree - If I were him, I would sue my attorney for that incredible mistake. It is almost certainly what cost him the case.

But, for what its worth, the accused never said it. He just said that he never thought of the person in the suit as a girl or guy - just a character (Minnie). Why would a guy grope someone that he never thought of as a girl?

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Characters cannot break character on stage for any reason of their choosing.

Should they have a need to leave, they have a way of informing the handler and they will be whisked away.

It has nothing to do with reporting an incident once they are backstage.

I understand and agree...

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

This man was convicted of a crime based on the testimony of a single girl, when there were many other people in the room who say they saw nothing.

Crimes of a sexual nature do not require an audience. Just b/c someone didn't personally witness a groping doesn't mean that it didn't happen. The victim IS a witness.

I do not have the intricate knowledge of this specific case--but crimes against child molestations do not have witnesses except for the child. I don't know how those are prosecuted successfully--but I do know that it didn't require people to have witnessed it personally.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Was this trial by jury, anyone know?

 

[beattyfamily]

For the defense to say "it's a mouse, not a person" was an attempt to make the victim be inhuman. I would have to say that was a HUGE mistake.

If they wanted the court to believe in their client's innocence--to make the plaintiff inhuman was not the way to go. Thus I have a difficult time believing their side of the story. Perhaps it wasn't their intent. But it is how it came across.

Hey, Lisa loves Pooh!! Long time no see! You been away or have I just missed you?? Nice to see a familiar face around these parts.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Crimes of a sexual nature do not require an audience. Just b/c someone didn't personally witness a groping doesn't mean that it didn't happen. The victim IS a witness.

Look, if you see enough evidence to find him guilty, fine. I do not. We can agree to disagree, right?

I do not have the intricate knowledge of this specific case.

Maybe you should read up before you decide this guy is guilty...

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Look, if you see enough evidence to find him guilty, fine. ....before you decide this guy is guilty...

I didn't say he was guilty.

 

[KinPA]

Yes, this trial was by jury. My FIL didn't testify because it was toward the end of the day and his lawyer wanted it to go to the jury Mon night. The plan was that they were sure there was not enough evidence to find him guilty. They were hoping the jury would come back with the verdict that night and find him not guilty and he could come home. Well, the plan backfired. The jury had to come back Tues morn and decided he was guilty. From what I hear the video shows the judge shaking his head in disbelief after reading the verdict. What does this mean? He was given the chance a few weeks ago to take a plea: plead guilty and serve 25 hrs community service in PA. He chose not to because he believed in his innocence....I guess that also backfired.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Yes, this trial was by jury. My FIL didn't testify because it was toward the end of the day and his lawyer wanted it to go to the jury Mon night. The plan was that they were sure there was not enough evidence to find him guilty. They were hoping the jury would come back with the verdict that night and find him not guilty and he could come home. Well, the plan backfired. The jury had to come back Tues morn and decided he was guilty. From what I hear the video shows the judge shaking his head in disbelief after reading the verdict. What does this mean? He was given the chance a few weeks ago to take a plea: plead guilty and serve 25 hrs community service in PA. He chose not to because he believed in his innocence....I guess that also backfired.

What are his appeal options?

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

I didn't say he was guilty.

My mistake, and my apologies...

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Yes, this trial was by jury. My FIL didn't testify because it was toward the end of the day and his lawyer wanted it to go to the jury Mon night. The plan was that they were sure there was not enough evidence to find him guilty. They were hoping the jury would come back with the verdict that night and find him not guilty and he could come home. Well, the plan backfired. The jury had to come back Tues morn and decided he was guilty. From what I hear the video shows the judge shaking his head in disbelief after reading the verdict. What does this mean? He was given the chance a few weeks ago to take a plea: plead guilty and serve 25 hrs community service in PA. He chose not to because he believed in his innocence....I guess that also backfired.

In a situation with very little evidence, it does not look good that your FIL didn't get to state his side of the story. The lawyer wasn't thinking about the alleged victim and how it would appear to the jury and did your FIL a grave injustice.

I can't say if your FIL was guilty or innocent--but the lawyer screwed up big time.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

My mistake, and my apologies...

No worries!

 

[KinPA]

He's not back home yet and I haven't talked to him ...so I don't know. I have a relative who is a Chief of Police and he viewed the video and said he should definately appeal.

 

[Ppufi]

Well, you know when you feel violated. If she felt that, then that man was crossing the line. Doesn't matter who saw or didn't see.

 

[Tink888]

Okay, I'm a woman, wasn't there, didn't see it except for the picture. Only Minnie and the guy know what really happened but here's my take on it.

I agree with Feral Peg and Eyeore's Butterfly and have no doubt as to the amount of crap the CM's (especially characters) have to put up with. And I also believe that the CM really did feel that she was touched inapppropriately.

But I also believe KinPA that her FIL didn't intentionally do anything wrong when that happened. I know lots of guys, who when displaying affection (for lack of a better word) toward other guys, will put their arm around the back and lay their hand on the chest. Do you know what I mean? Now, they DON'T go around hugging girls that way (of course) but I also have been to WDW enough times to have seen my kids (even myself) get totally wrapped up in the moment and a character and forget that there's an ACTUAL person underneath the costume. So, in my mind anyway, it's very possible that the guy wasn't even thinking about a person (let alone a female) being under that costume. He was just thinking it's Minnie Mouse and he showing affection the same way he would to a buddy.

Perception is reality and what one person thought was innocent could very well be taken as not innocent by someone else. That's why in almost every other workplace, any kind of touching is strictly prohibited. But you can't do that as Disney.....with beloved characters. Maybe someday there will be a rule that guests can't have physical interaction with characters. Until then, this kind of stuff is always going to happen. Some innocent, some with bad intentions.

That's JMHO. I feel bad for the CM and I also feel bad for the guy. KinPA - Welcome to the DIS. I appreciate your post and I feel bad for your FIL. If it was truly unintentional (and it seems like it was to me), it's definately a hard lesson learned.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

I know this is basically a man bashing forum over all because of the men:female ratio here but am going to post my opinion anyway.

In those costumes how in the heck would you know where her chest is to even grab at it?

I am going out on a limb here and hopefully will not regret this. I have done that job, I have worn that costume (see my sig). Believe me, the majority of guests know that certain characters are almost always exclusively played by females. There are just not many men wandering around who are that short.

In that costume, the character's "chest" is your chest and it is very obvious whether or not you have something up there to grope. Any guest looking at it can see that right away. I don't know what happened. What we have a case is he said, she said. But if a jury convicted, I'm going to assume there was some overwhelming evidence.

Having been in her position with guests and seeing the picture, it does look like his hand is where it should not be and she is trying to physically restrain him. Maybe he didn't realize it, I don't know. But again, I have been that person so am more familiar than most with how these things work.

I have literally had a guest lift up my costume shirt in front of a line of children. I have had a drunk guy all over me at 9:00 am, I have been punched, I had a friend who was groped. It happens more than people realize it, but most of the time we don't do anything about it.

I don't see this a man bashing forum at all. I know for a fact these things can happen by mistake. But he was convicted by a jury of his peers. The way I look at it, innocent until proven guilty. If the jury finds you innocent, I will believe you are innocent, if they find you guilty, I will believe you are guilty.

 

[beattyfamily]

Just had to say that I've definitely been able to tell when Minnie and even Mickey were women. DH and I got a chuckle when Mickey had something(s) up there if you know what I mean.