Malestrom Becomes "Frozen Ever After"

[lugnut33]

If a 10 minute reduction isn't a big deal, then why are the 5-10 minute (alleged) increases earth shattering?

What does "little appreciable difference" mean to you?

And we all know FP+ usage is much higher than the old system, that leads to longer lines in the FP+ return queue. But that in no way has changed the riders per hour of the attractions.

 

[Hunterr]

I still think this is annoying as f.
It just seems bizarre to put this in Epcot. I suppose this will bring more traffic to the countries, though...
I hope they are expanding that indoor queue. It's gonna be packed.

 

[Gena001]

NNNOOOO! We leave 6/6/16

There will be soft openings.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

What does "little appreciable difference" mean to you?

And we all know FP+ usage is much higher than the old system, that leads to longer lines in the FP+ return queue. But that in no way has changed the riders per hour of the attractions.

It means that it should be equally applied in both scenarios. We all know this.

 

[Gena001]

I enjoyed Maelstrom and will miss it. BUT for the life of me I can't recall the "Spirit of Norway" movie.

Better call Sig Hanson....

 

[hogwartsdropout]

Queue area is too small for an attraction this big. Hopefully they extend it. I don't want to see miles of people queuing down the middle of the pavilion.
I'll miss Maelstrom.

 

[jhaig]

Please don't if I get on with you.

I may even wear Viking horns

 

[wisblue]

And we all know FP+ usage is much higher than the old system, that leads to longer lines in the FP+ return queue. But that in no way has changed the riders per hour of the attractions.

Of course, the number of riders per hour for an attraction hasn't changed. But more people with FPs does not necessarily mean longer FP return times if a higher percentage of capacity is devoted to FP holders.

I don't think you have any real support for your claim that FP+ has made FP return waits longer.

 

[lugnut33]

How can you have a higher percentage of FP holders, and not have increased lines? That makes no sense. Think about it, do you think there is any difference between ride capacity now and say 2012? The only thing FP+ has done is switch people into different lines. It has done nothing to alter ride capacities which would only be effected by increasing the number of attractions (or in Soarin's case, increasing the number of theaters).

 

[Tarheel girl 1975]

Its important to note that even though the actual track layout will not change, the loading/unloading area WILL CHANGE with the new ride configuration, the former loading area will be converted into an entirely new scene while the former unloading area will now serve dual-purpose as both the loading and unloading area. This will certainly add some time to the ride, not to mention the former loading area is quite a large space which means that the first scene will be a LARGE scene.

So will the queue go through the theatre? That would definitely add more line space.

Not really an appropriate tribute to the "blockbuster" status of this movie but it is what it is. I don't like the placement. I am glad they are doing something with "Frozen" but this is a replacement not an addition. If capacity is marginally improved due to new load/unload areas it will still be a low capacity ride. So, if 30,000 to 50,000 people are in the park on a given day, then around 10,000 people can ride this ride at some time during a day from 11AM to 9PM...typical hours for world showcase. Add about 900 per hour if they open it earlier than the rest of World Showcase. I am concerned this will result in a horrible FP+ situation as well as upset guests.

I will probably try to get a FP+ for this in 2018 but the thought of having to do this is sort ridiculous.

That's my other concern with this. And if the queue overflows into the pavilion, then what?

That would happen with any new attraction they build and it's not a good reason not to do it. It is though why I say building new attractions won't relieve the crowding at any park- the more they build, the more people come. Again, not a good reason not to build more attractions, but a good reason to have a system in place that can disperse the crowds more evenly.

They could have tried designing a new attraction with a much higher capacity. It's not like they don't know whether or not the ride will be popular.

I have a hard time believing that a simple overlay will make this appreciably better. Sounds like this will be very much like the Little Mermaid ride considering the animatronics they are employing. I'll reserve judgement until I ride it, but I'm skeptical.

I though they were using projections like 7DMT.

Systems to handle crowds first, attractions second. New attractions will not solve the problem by itself and I think the system needed to be in place first.

Outside of RSR, building rides at DCA really seems to have dispersed crowds. Compare the wait times for Soarin and TSMM in DCA with WDW and both of those rides are at least 10 years old.

Having those 3 attractions be tier 1 and having those 3 attractions being desired will disburse crowds. The proportion is unknown. But now instead of a set number of guests scurrying to 2 rides. They are now scurrying for 3 rides.

So long as we don't see an attendance jump, that is.

It will free up more FP for Soarin and TT, not sure how much it will help with the overall wait times.

So they will use the same track as Maelstrom? Perfect! I hereby vow, on this day, that whenever I ride this new ride, I will narrate the old Maelstrom ride as loudly and as thickly-accented as possible.

I have to admit I might be a little tempted to call out "You are not the first to pass this way"

 

[wisblue]

How can you have a higher percentage of FP holders, and not have increased lines? That makes no sense. Think about it, do you think there is any difference between ride capacity now and say 2012? The only thing FP+ has done is switch people into different lines. It has done nothing to alter ride capacities which would only be effected by increasing the number of attractions (or in Soarin's case, increasing the number of theaters).

Let me use some hypothetical numbers to illustrate why more people with FPs does not necessarily mean longer waits in the FP line.

Soarin is a good example because FPs there were always fully distributed. As soon as the park opened the FP return times would move out quickly until the FPs ran out, often by early afternoon. If more people are using FPs than before at Soarin, that can only mean that they are distributing more per hour. So, let's say, for example, that Soarin has a capacity of 1500 people per hour, and before they issued 1000 FPs per hour, devoting 2/3 of the capacity to FP holders. Now if they increase that to 1200 FPs per hour, but devote 80% of the capacity to FPs they will still be able to accommodate all of those people in an hour and the FP wait would be the same, with fluctuations based on how those people return.

That would obviously mean that fewer people per hour would be admitted from the standby line. If the standby wait has actually gone down slightly, that would mean that a standby wait of 60 minutes translates into fewer people standing in that line than when a higher percentage of capacity is devoted to standby.

My experience and observation has been that this is what is happening at several of the rides that used to have FP+. The FP waits are not longer than they used to be because the standby line is being held longer to accommodate guests with FPs.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

I enjoyed Maelstrom and will miss it. BUT for the life of me I can't recall the "Spirit of Norway" movie.

Better call Sig Hanson....

That's because for all the love of the movie they ended up leaving the doors open because people complained about having to wait through it and every showing had about 3 people in it. The problem with the movies is they are cool the first and maybe even second time you see them but after that not so much.

 

[BrianL]

The problem with the movies is they are cool the first and maybe even second time you see them but after that not so much.

I agree with you there! The WS films are all very good, but they are not kept up to date. The Norway movie was a great look into that country...in the 1980s! And while I might want to ride Maelstrom multiple times on a visit, I probably only want to watch that movie once (if that). They should move to digital projection in all the theaters so that it is easier to update the films.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I enjoyed Maelstrom and will miss it. BUT for the life of me I can't recall the "Spirit of Norway" movie.

Better call Sig Hanson....

It opened with Vikings and didn't it flash back and forth between that and shots of a young boy looking up at a large Viking shop model in a museum?

 

[lugnut33]

Let me use some hypothetical numbers to illustrate why more people with FPs does not necessarily mean longer waits in the FP line.

Soarin is a good example because FPs there were always fully distributed. As soon as the park opened the FP return times would move out quickly until the FPs ran out, often by early afternoon. If more people are using FPs than before at Soarin, that can only mean that they are distributing more per hour. So, let's say, for example, that Soarin has a capacity of 1500 people per hour, and before they issued 1000 FPs per hour, devoting 2/3 of the capacity to FP holders. Now if they increase that to 1200 FPs per hour, but devote 80% of the capacity to FPs they will still be able to accommodate all of those people in an hour and the FP wait would be the same, with fluctuations based on how those people return.

That would obviously mean that fewer people per hour would be admitted from the standby line. If the standby wait has actually gone down slightly, that would mean that a standby wait of 60 minutes translates into fewer people standing in that line than when a higher percentage of capacity is devoted to standby.

My experience and observation has been that this is what is happening at several of the rides that used to have FP+. The FP waits are not longer than they used to be because the standby line is being held longer to accommodate guests with FPs.

You example shows a net gain of zero, which was exactly my point. Cakebaker said that no new rides need to be built, that first they must get the people management correct and FP+ has done that. I do not agree with that at all. Only thing FP+ has done is jiggled some lines around.

 

[wisblue]

You example shows a net gain of zero, which was exactly my point. Cakebaker said that no new rides need to be built, that first they must get the people management correct and FP+ has done that. I do not agree with that at all. Only thing FP+ has done is jiggled some lines around.

I was simply addressing your point that FP+ has resulted in longer lines in the FP return queue, which is what I thought you said here.

And we all know FP+ usage is much higher than the old system, that leads to longer lines in the FP+ return queue. But that in no way has changed the riders per hour of the attractions.

If what you meant was that the lines are longer in that they have more people in them, but not longer in terms of the amount of time it takes to get through them, then we agree. I think most people care about how much TIME they have to wait, not how many people are in line ahead of them.

 

[Planogirl]

It opened with Vikings and didn't it flash back and forth between that and shots of a young boy looking up at a large Viking shop model in a museum?

Yes it did. I thought that it was rather cleverly done.

I was a staunch defender of Maelstrom but didn't care to watch the movie over and over. It was fine the first few times but like many attractions once or twice is enough.

 

[BebopBaloo]

. If only they could mimic real Italian gelato, cause what they call gelato in Disney is nothing like what I had in Italy. Sigh.

Never fear...your real gelato will soon be here ..or there.. http://disneyparks.disney.go.com/bl...-downtown-disney-at-walt-disney-world-resort/

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Yes it did. I thought that it was rather cleverly done.

I was a staunch defender of Maelstrom but didn't care to watch the movie over and over. It was fine the first few times but like many attractions once or twice is enough.

I actually enjoyed the movie.

 

[summerw]

Opening June 20, 2016!

Any more info on this? Another site was predicting may 1, which sounded better to me.