Lots more scooters riding the buses now

[goofy4tink]

That's just it. When a lot of people take advantage of the handicapped in their group and use it to cut ahead in the bus line, it causes shame for the handicapped because people are going to feel the unfairness: I get why the handicapped has to be loaded first, but what about his large able bodied family? But if the handicapped is allowed just one companion, it will reduce the unfairness and the resentment there is.

There is only a small percentage of people that show this resentment. Perhaps they need to learn to feel empathy and compassion instead of resentment.

 

[BabybetterDisney]

Ok. I’m going to say it. If waiting an addtl 5-8 mins and possibly having to stand on a bus is going to be an issue, then perhaps this type Transportation isn’t for you. You could rent a car, use Uber.
Disney is expected to provide ‘equal’ treatment to all its guests. This means that a family with someone using a scooter gets to board the bus together. There is signage at each bus stop suggesting that parties if more than 6 split up.
As I have said, repeatedly, I’m at WDW a lot. Probably spend at least 40-60 days a year there. The times I’ve seen two scooters on one are very limited. The number of times I’ve seen more than 5 or 6 family members boarding with an ECV are also limited.
I’m sorry you’ve had this experience. But there is no way Disney is going to limit the number of people boarding with that ecv guest to one. Just isn’t going to happen.

Why are you sorry that I've had this experience? I never complained about the experience being bad. I'm observing the situation and making an impartial judgement. I'm merely suggesting that there is a more fair way of doing things. They don't have to limit it to one. It can be some other number, like 3. 6 is too high, that's all.

Just because I say something that I consider a better approach doesn't mean I hate scooters, or that I hate going on the bus with scooters, or any such nonsense. Why is it that some people can't have a reasonable discussion? If I so much as suggest reducing the number of people getting first seats with the scooter, I better call a taxi. Really?

 

[kaytieeldr]

Oh, man.

No, it's not discrimination; it's not like they are not allowed on the bus; they are given previlege to board the bus by cutting ahead of the line, just NOT THE ENTIRE PARTY. The rest of the party, who are not handicapped, are to wait in line like everybody else.

You. Did. Not. Answer. My. Question.
You are saying you, as an able-bodied person, should be allowed to board and ride the buses with your entire party, but I, using an ECV, can board with only one - or fewer - persons. Apparently this is because i inconvenience you. May i ask how much experience you have operating public transportation companies?

Why is it unlikely? That's when it's most likely. They get to board the bus before everybody else.
Disney only allowed a limited number to board the bus right now. I'm saying the limit should be raised to 1 person.

Again, why should your party be able to board together, but my party should not?

That's not true. The bus drivers don't hesitate to confront a guest. I've seen them yell at guests who push their strollers onto the bus, not knowing that it is not allowed. I got yelled at myself when I first went to WDW.

Your lack of awareness (and/or observation) that strollers must be folded before boarding a bus is completely different. Your whole party still boarded the bus together.

Making a simple suggestion shouldn't be an excuse to close the thread.

It is not a simple suggestion.
It has been spdiscussed many, many, many times before.

getting loaded ahead of the line is a previledge

Boarding empty buses is a necessity, not in any way a privilege.

You are not necessarily splitting up, it depends on how full the bus is and how big your party is. When the handicapped group is big enough, it is supposed to be split up either way.

No, this is the personification of splitting up. Even splitting able-bodied groups into twos isn't equivalent, because they can simply line up and board consecutively.

I'm suggesting that the number should be reduced to one or less, the one caring for the handicapped person.

we experienced mobility device users, along with some compassionate posters, are saying you're wrong.

 

[BabybetterDisney]

There is only a small percentage of people that show this resentment. Perhaps they need to learn to feel empathy and compassion instead of resentment.

When something is unfair, people will resent it, and the percentage will increase with the increase of scooters. Compassion is letting the scooter person get ahead of the line, not his able bodied party get ahead of your perhaps less abled party. Let me repeat: I DON'T RESENT SCOOTERS MYSELF. I think they are absolutely wonderful inventions. I'm planning to use a scooter myself soon. I am merely observing the situation to figure out a way to make things better. If you really want to look for a selfish reason, then here it is: I want to reduce the resentment as much as possible for when I have to use a scooter.

 

[Allison]

If you really want to look for a selfish reason, then here it is: I want to reduce the resentment as much as possible for when I have to use a scooter.

The by all means, go ahead and split up your party if you think that will make someone not resent you. Nothing is stopping you from doing that.

 

[kaytieeldr]

When the party is 2 adults, the handicapped person can go alone. If that's not possible, then it is not reasonable to go to Disney world with one dependent handicapped person 3 more little kids. You need more people.

I mean, what if a person goes to Disney World alone with 3 little kids? Should they get priority seating on the bus too? No. I've done it.

It is not up to you (or me, or any other visitor) to decide what is reasonable. That is up to the company and the law. A person traveling "alone" with three little kids can logistically board a bus with peopke already on it. A mobility device user generally can't, plus it would be harder and much more time-consuming for the driver to tie down the device.

If it's husband, wife and 3 kids the husband can go by himself and the wife can take the 3 kids. If the husband can't make it by himself the wife should not be going to WDW while having to care for a medically dependent husband AND 3 kids by herself. What happens when she is caring for her kids while her husband has a medical problem?

Using a mobility device dkes NOT mean the user is medically dependent. Just like you are allowed to wait in line and board a bus with your entire party, so am I.

Why are you sorry that I've had this experience? I never complained about the experience being bad. I'm observing the situation and making an impartial judgement

l
You are not being impartial. Disney's standard procedure annoys you to the degree where you feel the need to not only make an unreasknable suggestion, but to refute any responses that don't align with you.

 

[BabybetterDisney]

Oh, man.

You. Did. Not. Answer. My. Question.
You are saying you, as an able-bodied person, should be allowed to board and ride the buses with your entire party, but I, using an ECV, can board with only one - or fewer - persons. Apparently this is because i inconvenience you. May i ask how much experience you have operating public transportation companies?

Again, why should your party be able to board together, but my party should not?

Your lack of awareness (and/or observation) that strollers must be folded before boarding a bus is completely different. Your whole party still boarded the bus together.

It is not a simple suggestion.
It has been spdiscussed many, many, many times before.

Boarding empty buses is a necessity, not in any way a privilege.

No, this is the personification of splitting up. Even splitting able-bodied groups into twos isn't equivalent, because they can simply line up and board consecutively.

we experienced mobility device users, along with some compassionate posters, are saying you're wrong.

Just because other able bodied people get to get on their bus together doesn't mean you should get to also. Reason: your entire party cut ahead of the line and obtain seats. Unless the line is extra long, they will all get on the bus with you, just not with first seats.

Let me explain something: this is not an emotional discussion. This is not about me not liking scooters. This is not about me not having compassion. This is not able me not needing a scooter. This is about making the situation more fair. This is what I consider more fair for when I need a scooter in Disney World.

Just because you or your loved one are handicapped doesn't mean you can't think rationally or have to take every discussion of scooters as a lack of compassion or personal attack. Just because I make a suggestion about limiting scooter's companions doesn't mean it's a bad suggestion for scooter users. I believe my suggestion will benefit scooter users in the end.

But I'm not discussing this anymore, being that handicapism is too overwhelming that people can't think straight about it. I have a severely mentally handicapped son. That's how I know.

 

[kaytieeldr]

When something is unfair, people will resent it, and the percentage will increase with the increase of scooters. Compassion is letting the scooter person get ahead of the line, not his able bodied party get ahead of your perhaps less abled party. Let me repeat: I DON'T RESENT SCOOTERS MYSELF. I think they are absolutely wonderful inventions. I'm planning to use a scooter myself soon. I am merely observing the situation to figure out a way to make things better. If you really want to look for a selfish reason, then here it is: I want to reduce the resentment as much as possible for when I have to use a scooter.

You reduce your resentment with meditation, or counseling, or even just enjoying time in line with your family and ignoring what anyone around you is doing.

One can be as compassionate or as selfish as one wants. This does not change the ADA, or Disney's decades of experience, or logistics, or the unreasonableness of forcing a party to split up (potentially onto different buses) simply because a member uses a mobility device.

Before you decide the mobility device user should not board a bus until their leparty can, this also does not work. This bus might have both spots open but the next one has both in use. Then the next bus has people seated in those seats refusing to stand. Then the ramp is broken on the third bus.

 

[Allison]

Let me explain something: this is not an emotional discussion.

Yet you are using words like cutting ahead, and implying people aren't thinking rationally if they don't agree with you and that they can't think straight. It certainly seems emotional.

If you want to make a suggestion, you need to make that suggestion to Disney, not on a fan site.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Just because other able bodied people get to get on their bus together doesn't mean you should get to also. Reason: your entire party cut ahead of the line and obtain seats.

My entire party makes itself aware of, and follows the procedures set forth by the business owner.

Unless the line is extra long, they will all get on the bus with you, just not with first seats.

The line is extra long much of the morning and evening. And there are other reasons (see above) that your whole party can board a bus but mine can't.

Let me explain something: this is not an emotional discussion. This is not about me not liking scooters. This is not about me not having compassion. This is not able me not needing a scooter. This is about making the situation more fair. This is what I consider more fair for when I need a scooter in Disney World.

It does not matter what you or i or anyone else here thinks is "fair". If you believe sending the mobility device user off completely on their own is fair, you can certainly make that a rule when you operate a transportation service.

I believe my suggestion will benefit scooter users in the end.

Can you please explain how your suggestion will benefit mobility device users?

But I'm not discussing this anymore, being that handicapism is too overwhelming that people can't think straight about it. I have a severely mentally handicapped son. That's how I know.

It must be difficult raising a severely mentally handicapped child. I don't have one, so i would not deign to make suggestions to you. In the same way, you aking suggestions regarding physically disabled persons is disingenuous.

 

[kaytieeldr]

That's just it. When a lot of people take advantage of the handicapped in their group and use it to cut ahead in the bus line

You cannot be serious.

 

[Hopefully]

You don't know that I have no idea. Just because I suggest a more fair approach doesn't mean I'm full of hatred towards ECV users. I never said I didn't need an ECV or won't be needing one in the future. I'm fully planning on using an ECV in the near future, and in Disney when I need it. And when I do, I plan to get on the scooter with one person from my party and have the rest wait in line, even if Disney doesn't impose my suggestion here, to be more fair to others. I have a severally mentally handicapped person in my family (though physically OK and don't need a scooter), and that's the one I will have with me, only because he needs it.
Again, it's because the number of scooters that I'm talking about this. If there were just a few scooters once in a while like in the past, it's no big deal. But if the number of scooters continue to increase, Disney will have to do something about all the non handicapped people cutting ahead of the line and getting premium seats, while the little kids and the elderly has to stand.

After reading your many, many, many negative replies this morning, I strongly stand by my statement. You CLEARLY have no idea what it is like to NEED a Mobility device.
I feel anger at you and sorry for you at the same time. What a negative life you must live. Perhaps it’s a result of raising a severely mentally handicapped son. But I would never pretend to know.
Good Luck to you

 

[Queen of the WDW Scene]

Making a simple suggestion shouldn't be an excuse to close the thread. Your party can only be separated when the bus is full and the line is long. And people don't seem to realize that getting loaded ahead of the line is a previledge that is needed by handicapped people but not the rest. The people who travel with the handicapped automatically get seats in a full bus. How is that fair?

It's not a privilege but you're right it is a need since that is the only way it can work.
It's only your opinion that it is unfair.
Btw it's usually a full bus in the morning and evening so that would mean people would be separated if not allowed on with the scooter.
A party that does not have a scooter could just wait for the next bus but a party with a scooter should not be forced to separate just because it annoys you.
Btw I'm coming from an unbiased place since my party does not have a scooter yet I have no issues with scooters and their families.
I suggested the thread not be allowed to go too long due to posts such as the one I'm quoting that are trying to get people to argue.

 

[kaytieeldr]

The number of scooters have risen dramatically. When the effect of the scooters increases, it is only reasonable that Disney should control more stringently to avoid delays of the bus.

The number of Walt Disney World visitors has increased dramatically. It is mere common sense that the number of each type of visitor has increased at the same rate.

It is not ridiculous; the splitting rule is already in; you are not supposed to bring your large party onto the bus with a scooter. I'm suggesting that the number of people accompanying the scooter should be reduced to one, that's all, to be more fair to other guests.

You are saying that ARE should implement your suggestion, to make things more "fair" to other guests. The reasonable opposite of this opinion is to be unfair to mobility device users.

Why are you sorry that I've had this experience?

YEah, I'm not sorry you feel this way. Only you can be sorry. On the other hand, it's regrettable that you feel this way.

Just because I make a suggestion about limiting scooter's companions

A scooter is a thing. Please stop referring to the user as the device

 

[JoJoGirl]

Wow, what a discussion! In 25+ years of visiting WDW with many different groups of people, I’ve experienced this issue from all sides: I’ve been in groups with everyone being able-bodied, or with one or two family members using wheelchairs, with family members in large strollers, and with a family member using a rental ECV. Groups ranging from 2 people to 10. Far and away, the easiest trips bus-wise are those where no one is using a mobility device.

Here are my takes on the main concerns discussed here:

ECVs and wheelchairs get to board the bus first:
As previously discussed, this is by far the quickest and safest way to do it. The fewer people on the bus, the easier it is to load these devices and the less chance of feet and shins being clipped. If it is any consolation, ECV and wheelchair users also exit last, after all the able-bodied parties are gone. You will be halfway to the turnstiles before they are even off the bus. So you end up ahead in the end.

Sometimes ECVs get on the first bus while people who have waited in line longer have to wait for the next bus:
This cuts both ways. My experience is that those using ECVs and wheelchairs have to wait for the next bus MORE OFTEN than those in the general line, due to capacity issues and reasons already mentioned (there is a thread on the DisABILITIES forum discussing this). You just may not notice this as much it because, well, you are getting on the bus and it doesn’t effect you.

Families with a member using an ECV or wheelchair should be separated in line, so that they don’t take too many seats/spots from others:
Disney is a family vacation destination, where groups go to spend time together: grandparents and grandchildren, siblings, friends, parents and children. That includes enjoying each other’s company and assistance in lines for attractions and transportation. Disney respects this and tries to keep families together whenever possible. Able-bodied families are not arbitrarily separated without choice, so the same courtesy is extended to those using mobility devices. For what it’s worth, the average group boarding through the back much smaller. If they are the full six or seven, half are usually children who need to be watched and are best kept with their family unit.

The problem as I see it is not Disney’s policy for handling users of mobility devices and the groups accompanying them. It is the overall lack of bus capacity for EVERYONE, able-bodied and ECV-users alike. If there were more buses running more often, none of this would be an issue.

 

[Collette]

Wow, is right!

Two experiences I had during my trip in May. The first was a long line of people waiting for a bus back to AKL/Kidani Village from Hollywood Studios at close. Definitely would need the second bus. About the time a bus pulled up so did an elderly woman on a scooter. She certainly needed one. Eleven adults boarded with her. There was no complaining. No one said a word. Splitting up families wouldn't be ideal. It would have been a nice gesture to follow the suggestion of six.

My second experience. I can't remember the time of day, park or situation, but I do remember what happened. Another long line of people. A person on a scooter boarded first with others. When the rest of us in line boarded the bus, the other family members were already standing near the person on the scooter to give others a place to sit. I thought it was a very kind, considerate gesture.

 

[mgrayar]

Wow. I think this wins as the most offensive post ever. Maybe people who are so impatient and lacking in even a little compassion should rent cars, rather than mingle with people who use Ecvs.

You think this is the most offensive quote on a message board “ever”.

Well let me be the first to welcome you to the internet. You must be new here!

 

[Oliviaxxx]

If handicapped people and their families getting on the bus before you distress you so much then you should stay home. People will wait for hours to ride a ride, wait in the hot sun for parades to start, and wait at night packed like sardines to watch fireworks. But in the rare occurrence that a wheelchair guest extends their bus line wait its automatic outrage.

I'm saying it's rare because if the bus line is so packed that the handicap people and their families keep you waiting for the next how do you even know if you would have made it on that bus?

 

[Oliviaxxx]

When something is unfair, people will resent it, and the percentage will increase with the increase of scooters. Compassion is letting the scooter person get ahead of the line, not his able bodied party get ahead of your perhaps less abled party. Let me repeat: I DON'T RESENT SCOOTERS MYSELF. I think they are absolutely wonderful inventions. I'm planning to use a scooter myself soon. I am merely observing the situation to figure out a way to make things better. If you really want to look for a selfish reason, then here it is: I want to reduce the resentment as much as possible for when I have to use a scooter.

It is not a handicapped person to worry if people at Disney resent them!!!! When my mom does Disney in a scooter it's not her job to alter the accommodations she needs so people "don't resent her". My brother and I board the bus with her we help her throughout the park and I am being completely honest when I say I do not care if that upsets people. People make eyes at ECVs and make comments and get mad. What are we suppose to do? Spend the whole day worrying whether or not we have upset or inconvenienced the hundreds of people we have come in contact with?

If you get so worked up about a family boarding with their disabled family member rent a car. From the hostility I have read in your posts in the forum you seem deeply bothered by this issue. If this bus issue disrupts your vacation this much then maybe you need to take your own transportation.

 

[wiihoo888]

Just something I noticed on my last trip a few weeks back...Disney is really trying to make things less stressful for everyone. I was staying at AoA, and there were three occasions in the AM when the line was super long, and there were ECV’s (3 max each time) in the separate queue. A cast member came up and told us every morning, in that queue, that they were trying out new bus services and that we would be accommodated. Always reassuring when you are stuck and attached to a seat on wheels.

Here’s what ended up happening...a second bus pulled up each time while the ECV bus was loading. It was directly behind, and was taking on ambulatory guests while the ECV guests were being accommodated. The ECV guests were less rushed, and all three of those ambulatory guest busses left first.

Here’s the thing though...I’m not sure how many ambulatory guests noticed this change. It was very obvious to me, and I thought it was a super cool new way to make sure everyone felt accommodated and it made me feel less rushed. Kinda like the new queues in the parks that accommodate ECVs. There will always be older ones that don’t, but most of the newer ones do. Does anyone notice us ECV folks in line there too? Not sure, but we are there!

Guess my point is...it is easy to get aggrevated by what we see and whay our perception is. The reality is Disney is constantly retooling the guest experience. Please keep your eyes out for these types of changes. If you are not on an ECV, and you are looking out for these changes, you may be surprised what you see now