Looking for a Disney cop for a question

[disney david]

Let me begin by saying that my husband is in probation. Does he always carry he gun? no. We tend to go to a different city than the one he works in when we go out. But sometimes we do go out in the county he works in. There have been many times that he has gotten out of the car when he saw someone who doing something that violated their probation. He spoke with them and told them to report the next day. We are not dealing with people who necessarily respect that he is a LEO. There have been many that he has sent back to jail, put on house arrest, etc. In no way is his carrying a gun a liability, he is certified and knows what he is doing. He does not go looking for trouble. But his needs are totally different than any civilian. Again, until you have had your family and life threaded you really can't understand.
At the same time I don't understand why you would not want a police officer carrying his gun at all times. Police are stretched thin and I personally am happy for any police officer to carry his gun as added protection against what ever may happen. Even for little things like a pocket book being stolen outside a mall.

Around two years ago their was this off duty officer who had a guy at gun point after he caught him trying to break in to a car. when a county police officer was was respomd to a call from 911 about a guy with agun he saw the man with a gun he was in plain clothes. The county officer shot and killed the off duty officer. This happened in westchester ny between a county officer and a mt vernon officer he was in plain clothes so just because they can carry a gun it also makes it dangorus when traviling to another county or city where they dont know your a off duty cop. if another officer see you have a gun they will reacat to it as if it a gun call not just a fellow officer who off duty with a gun.

 

[princessmom29]

Around two years ago their was this off duty officer who had a guy at gun point after he caught him trying to break in to a car. when a county police officer was was respomd to a call from 911 about a guy with agun he saw the man with a gun he was in plain clothes. The county officer shot and killed the off duty officer. This happened in westchester ny between a county officer and a mt vernon officer he was in plain clothes so just because they can carry a gun it also makes it dangorus when traviling to another county or city where they dont know your a off duty cop. if another officer see you have a gun they will reacat to it as if it a gun call not just a fellow officer who off duty with a gun.

Exactly. Another reason NOT to carry a gun if you are not wearing a uniform. The boards are doing weird stuff today. It was not my OP you were quoting, but it had my name.

 

[disney david]

Exactly. Another reason NOT to carry a gun if you are not wearing a uniform. The boards are doing weird stuff today. It was not my OP you were quoting, but it had my name.

Sorry I just pressed the quote button your right. The boards are acting today

 

[princessmom29]

Let me begin by saying that my husband is in probation. Does he always carry he gun? no. We tend to go to a different city than the one he works in when we go out. But sometimes we do go out in the county he works in. There have been many times that he has gotten out of the car when he saw someone who doing something that violated their probation. He spoke with them and told them to report the next day. We are not dealing with people who necessarily respect that he is a LEO. There have been many that he has sent back to jail, put on house arrest, etc. In no way is his carrying a gun a liability, he is certified and knows what he is doing. He does not go looking for trouble. But his needs are totally different than any civilian. Again, until you have had your family and life threaded you really can't understand.
At the same time I don't understand why you would not want a police officer carrying his gun at all times. Police are stretched thin and I personally am happy for any police officer to carry his gun as added protection against what ever may happen. Even for little things like a pocket book being stolen outside a mall.

It doesn't matter if you are trained or not, carrying a gun is a liability for the person carrying it. If you choose ot use it, you are liable for proving that it was a good shoot. That is harder to do off duty. Many LEO's don't want ot be put in that position. I don't want a police office carrying thier gun at all times becuase I have no way of knowing they are an LEO, even if they say so. It is hard to tell the bad guys form the good guys if they are all dressed the same. Plus more guns on the street equals more potential for them being fired, regardless of what side they are on. A situation is much more likley to escalate if an off duty LEO pulls thier gun. I have seen several off duty LEOs shot and killed pulling thier guns on someone who didn't believe they were a cop.

 

[cm8]

I do not know rules but unless person HAVE TO BY LAW, I would be unconfortable to see someone carrying a gun on my vacation. I wonder if such a person required to carry a gun on his vacation when he is clearly off duty. If he is not required but simply has a right to do so, and chooses to carry a gun to food court area in resort, then sorry, I believe something is wrong with his judgement.

 

[livie1205]

And I have no problem with his policy which is infact a LAW for him in his case, he has no choice. I am talking about those who have a right but also a choice. Wonder if he still must to carry gun to places where it is forbitten like parks and if he brakes policy when he doesn't.

no,but it is a very slippery slope....when they say for him to choose safety he BETTER know what the right right choice is lol really no kidding ...its just that iffy....but that is just his job,he has been doing it many years so he does not think twice about it know.

 

[livie1205]

My husband is a LEO. Does he take his weapon to Disney? No.

But..... for those that are saying that a LEO should never carry off duty
Have you ever ran into someone you arrested? or someone that threaded your family? My husband does not carry off duty b/c of his ego, he carries it for our safety.[/
QUOTE]

Wonder if he is off duty and has a gun for his protection, does it make him a civilian who has right to carry gun and if he has any right to use his gun unless someone attacks him ? Not trying to besmart here, just wondering.

YES he does have right to use that gun to protect his family and himself.OFF DUTY is thrown around alot but really they are hardly ever "off duty"He sees people he has put in jail all the time and it worries most cops.

 

[Dominus]

Around two years ago their was this off duty officer who had a guy at gun point after he caught him trying to break in to a car. when a county police officer was was respomd to a call from 911 about a guy with agun he saw the man with a gun he was in plain clothes. The county officer shot and killed the off duty officer. This happened in westchester ny between a county officer and a mt vernon officer he was in plain clothes so just because they can carry a gun it also makes it dangorus when traviling to another county or city where they dont know your a off duty cop. if another officer see you have a gun they will reacat to it as if it a gun call not just a fellow officer who off duty with a gun.

That just points out the beauty of states that have concealed carry for their citizens. LEOs in Texas have to enter a situation like that thinking that it's very possible that the guy in plain clothes with the gun is the GOOD guy. They can't assume that only bad guys wear plain clothes and have a gun. I love the people who don't see a "need" for anyone to carry a gun. That they are "looking for trouble". For most victims of crime "trouble" finds them. At least by carrying a gun you can equalize most threats you'll encounter. And if your would be perp. is armed with a club or knife, you then are able to defense yourself from a position of strength. But most likely the bad guy will run and look elsewhere for a more suitable (read as unarmed) victim. I don't understand why one would WANT to put themselves at the mercy of a criminals conscience, unless they live somewhere they'd have to. diclaimer:Carrying at a theme park is not a good idea.

 

[disney david]

Exactly. Another reason NOT to carry a gun if you are not wearing a uniform. The boards are doing weird stuff today. It was not my OP you were quoting, but it had my name.

That just points out the beauty of states that have concealed carry for their citizens. LEOs in Texas have to enter a situation like that thinking that it's very possible that the guy in plain clothes with the gun is the GOOD guy. They can't assume that only bad guys wear plain clothes and have a gun. I love the people who don't see a "need" for anyone to carry a gun. That they are "looking for trouble". For most victims of crime "trouble" finds them. At least by carrying a gun you can equalize most threats you'll encounter. And if your would be perp. is armed with a club or knife, you then are able to defense yourself from a position of strength. But most likely the bad guy will run and look elsewhere for a more suitable (read as unarmed) victim. I don't understand why one would WANT to put themselves at the mercy of a criminals conscience, unless they live somewhere they'd have to. diclaimer:Carrying at a theme park is not a good idea.

Your right after that the started to train them to handle that differently they try to bring charges against him but he was found inconet.

 

[KellyNY]

That just points out the beauty of states that have concealed carry for their citizens. LEOs in Texas have to enter a situation like that thinking that it's very possible that the guy in plain clothes with the gun is the GOOD guy. They can't assume that only bad guys wear plain clothes and have a gun. I love the people who don't see a "need" for anyone to carry a gun. That they are "looking for trouble". For most victims of crime "trouble" finds them. At least by carrying a gun you can equalize most threats you'll encounter. And if your would be perp. is armed with a club or knife, you then are able to defense yourself from a position of strength. But most likely the bad guy will run and look elsewhere for a more suitable (read as unarmed) victim. I don't understand why one would WANT to put themselves at the mercy of a criminals conscience, unless they live somewhere they'd have to. diclaimer:Carrying at a theme park is not a good idea.

Actually, carrying a gun may only bring trouble in many situations. Criminals do not attack people on high traffic streets, giving them warning half block away and time to throw your gun. They attack in dark corners, empty train stations and so on. They attack when they are already too close with a gun or khife already out. Try to get gun out and they will attack, simply reaction, not a need to kill. Most criminals wants your bag, your jewerly, money, giving it to them, definitely unfair but better then playing hero and loosing your life(Ghost). So no, having gun does not really protect you, unless you carry it in your hand ready to fire every moment. Guns give a false feeling of safety. That was regarding civilians carrying guns.

As for LEO, I agree that some has to do it due to nature of their jobs or policies. Other then that leave it home. Less guns on streets better for everyone. People die in crossfire and it does not matter if it was bad or good guys gun.

As for bad guys, no ammount of LEOs may solve the problem. It takes much more investigation, undercover, planned operations to find roots and send bosses and those who sell illigal guns, dugs, and so on to jail, breaking gangs apart and leaving them without support. LEOs can treat the symptom by randomly catching bad guy here or there but the problem will remain.

One more thing to consider, if LEO lives is criminal area, he can do much good, if he lives in quiet area, he can never see any crimes and having his gun with him off duty is simply pointless.

 

[TinkBride]

No matter where a person lives, there is always the "possibility" for a crime to occur. Like a PP said - if my husband had put guys in jail, arrested them, etc. I would want him protected at ALL times. Granted anything is possible, but knowing he has the ability to protect me and my family if the need were to arise, is something that I would be supportive of.

Are there dirty cops? of course. But, I believe the majority of law enforcement is a "good guy" and not willing to look for trouble, unless trouble finds them first and if it does I would hope they are prepared to protect the citizens that they took an oath to do. On or off duty.

That is like saying if a doctor is at the mall with his family and a person has a heart attack in front of him/her he should not stop and help the victim as he is trained to do. Everyday cops have to make decisions on what is best - and MOST of the time the deicision is right and all of us are protected because of that decision.

If a cop can carry a gun on duty - he should certainly be able to carry a gun off duty. His oath did not change just because he is not wearing his uniform. Life can change in a split second and people should be prepared to protect themself if need be. And I would argue a cop (on or off duty) has a much larger target on their back than the average citizen. They have made more enemies with their line of work than most professions held by others.

Soooooooo.........I leave for Disney in 1 week and 5 days! And my accountant husband will be leaving his 8 guns in his safe at home.

 

[The Iron Giant]

Exactly. Another reason NOT to carry a gun if you are not wearing a uniform.

Remember - hope is not a strategy. Just because you hope and believe that nothing bad will happen to people at Disney World doesn't mean it won't.

Lt. Col. David Grossman has an excellent article on his website about why police officers need to carry their weapons at all times.

Its worth a read if you're so inclined if only to find out if you're a wolf, sheepdog, or a sheep: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm

 

[princessmom29]

Remember - hope is not a strategy. Just because you hope and believe that nothing bad will happen to people at Disney World doesn't mean it won't.

Lt. Col. David Grossman has an excellent article on his website about why police officers need to carry their weapons at all times.

Its worth a read if you're so inclined if only to find out if you're a wolf, sheepdog, or a sheep: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm

I don't buy into it, sorry. I am not naive and realize that bad things happen everywhere, but still feel that off duty LEOS carrying wepons don't do anything to solve the problem. In most cases it makes an already bad situation even worse. For every story of someone storming to the rescue there are several where it ends badly, very badly, because an off duty pulled there gun. I feel that is you are not in a uniform you do not need to be carrying a wepon. Period. No propoganda is going to make me feel otherwise.

 

[The Iron Giant]

I don't buy into it, sorry. I am not naive and realize that bad things happen everywhere, but still feel that off duty LEOS carrying wepons don't do anything to solve the problem. In most cases it makes an already bad situation even worse. For every story of someone storming to the rescue there are several where it ends badly, very badly, because an off duty pulled there gun. I feel that is you are not in a uniform you do not need to be carrying a wepon. Period. No propoganda is going to make me feel otherwise.

I think the article speaks for itself. People for the most part fit into those three categories - wolf, sheepdog, or sheep.

Personally, I'm grateful to our sheepdogs - police officers, soldiers, even ordinary citizens like Todd Beamer who put themselves in harms way for our benefit.

I don't want to drive this thread too far off topic except to say that I think David Grossman has a great insight into people when he says...

"Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn’t tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, “Baa.”

Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog."

That's my final opinion on the topic.

Thank you to all the sheepdogs on the DIS for keeping us safe

 

[TinkBride]

Thank you to all the sheepdogs on the DIS for keeping us safe

Ditto - I am totally a sheep but I love and appreciate all the sheepdogs..........on or off duty, uniform or no uniform.

Without those few people to protect us in a moment where nothing was expected - what would the consequences be?

 

[princessmom29]

I think the article speaks for itself. People for the most part fit into those three categories - wolf, sheepdog, or sheep.

Personally, I'm grateful to our sheepdogs - police officers, soldiers, even ordinary citizens like Todd Beamer who put themselves in harms way for our benefit.

I don't want to drive this thread too far off topic except to say that I think David Grossman has a great insight into people when he says...

"Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn’t tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, “Baa.”

Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog."

That's my final opinion on the topic.

Thank you to all the sheepdogs on the DIS for keeping us safe

This is NOT my perspective at all. I am happy for the sheepdogs to be sheepdogs as long as they look like a sheepdog. I don't mind seeing them in uniform. I teach high school in a rough neighborhood. Not ady goes by that a student in not arrested from campus. I am greatful for police officers and the job they do every day.
My question is how do I know the sheepdog dressed as a sheep is not really a wolf, and how do the other sheepdogs know this if he is dressed as a sheep? How do I know who to trust when everone is dressed the smae an pointing guns??? THIS is my problem with off duty LEO and weapons. It happens a lot in the neighborhood where I teach. An off duty pulls a gun, no one believes he is a cop, and a bad situation becomes a deadly one when it didn't have to end that way. If they had just called an on duty officer, no one would have had to die.

 

[KellyNY]

Remember - hope is not a strategy. Just because you hope and believe that nothing bad will happen to people at Disney World doesn't mean it won't.

Lt. Col. David Grossman has an excellent article on his website about why police officers need to carry their weapons at all times.

Its worth a read if you're so inclined if only to find out if you're a wolf, sheepdog, or a sheep: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm

And what is the point of this article? What exactly it showed? How officer in line protected poor sheep from those guys? So he declared he is a tough one and so they moved from him and continued harrasing the rest of the line and he returned to his book. Yes it is a job of officers to protect people around just like we(sheep) have other jobs, to serve, to threat and so on. What it has to do with anything? Yes, something happens, sheep look for sheepdog. Sheepdog gets sick, he looks for doctor. Different people serve different roles in society. And yes, bringing gun to church is crazy, unless you have to do it by law, policies, your job situation and so on. Doctor does not have his instruments with him all the time. One more thing, sheepdog in real world does not look like wolf nor sheep, there is no mistake who he is. I would prefer to have more officers in forms just walking around, wolves do not attack when they see a sheepdog. Sheepdogs in sheeps skin do not prevent crimes, they can only act when something gets wrong and sometimes making situation worse. Remember the goal is to protect people, not catch criminal. Those who work in banks know their instructions in case of robbery, give him money, put in an ink money and do not, by any means, do not attract any attention, let him leave the building with people. Now imagine officer jumping on this guy, he may also has a gun, how many people can get hurt?
So, I'm sorry, but I do not see how this article can be useful to proove any point at all, except declaring that some people are tough and some people are tough in other areas.

 

[andrews_dad]

Sometimes this site amazes me. Some threads that I think are great last 10 posts and disappear forever. The OP posts a single request for a LEO to contact him via PM and it is already 120 replies.... and now I just added to the insanity!!! HAHAHAHA

 

[Dominus]

Actually, carrying a gun may only bring trouble in many situations. Criminals do not attack people on high traffic streets, giving them warning half block away and time to throw your gun. They attack in dark corners, empty train stations and so on. They attack when they are already too close with a gun or khife already out. Try to get gun out and they will attack, simply reaction, not a need to kill. Most criminals wants your bag, your jewerly, money, giving it to them, definitely unfair but better then playing hero and loosing your life(Ghost). So no, having gun does not really protect you, unless you carry it in your hand ready to fire every moment. Guns give a false feeling of safety. That was regarding civilians carrying guns.

As for LEO, I agree that some has to do it due to nature of their jobs or policies. Other then that leave it home. Less guns on streets better for everyone. People die in crossfire and it does not matter if it was bad or good guys gun.

As for bad guys, no ammount of LEOs may solve the problem. It takes much more investigation, undercover, planned operations to find roots and send bosses and those who sell illigal guns, dugs, and so on to jail, breaking gangs apart and leaving them without support. LEOs can treat the symptom by randomly catching bad guy here or there but the problem will remain.

One more thing to consider, if LEO lives is criminal area, he can do much good, if he lives in quiet area, he can never see any crimes and having his gun with him off duty is simply pointless.

There is certainly a difference in relation to the region you live in. Here not a week goes by that you don't here of a store clerk shooting a would be robber. Or a home owner shooting a home invader. I guess you don't see that stuff on the news in NY. By you "don't resist the bad man" logic, you shouldn't try to fight off a rapist, cause it might make him kill you. I have zero problem with people who feel that they don't need a gun to defend themselves, I do have a problem when people want to impose that belief onto others. Method of self defense should be everyone's personal decision. I'm okay with off duty LEOs being held to the same standards as citizens who have a chl. If joe citizen can't carry in a theme park, then neither should an off duty LEO.

 

[KellyNY]

There is certainly a difference in relation to the region you live in. Here not a week goes by that you don't here of a store clerk shooting a would be robber. Or a home owner shooting a home invader. I guess you don't see that stuff on the news in NY. By you "don't resist the bad man" logic, you shouldn't try to fight off a rapist, cause it might make him kill you. I have zero problem with people who feel that they don't need a gun to defend themselves, I do have a problem when people want to impose that belief onto others. Method of self defense should be everyone's personal decision. I'm okay with off duty LEOs being held to the same standards as citizens who have a chl. If joe citizen can't carry in a theme park, then neither should an off duty LEO.

You do not understand what I say. There are situations to resist and do not resist. Rapist already a threat to your life, you fight as much as you can. There are ways for women to apply some technics that can actually help. Point is, you do not try to fight rapist, you are dead. You try to fight someone for $20, you are dead. Every situation is unique. My sister was 7 months pregnant whe she entered her building and 2 men grabbed her and pointed knife at her belly. You think she had to fight for justice? She gave them whatever she had just to stay alive. Thanks God they did not pushed into her appartment as she could be dead right now. No LEO was around as bad guys choose their battles carefully and no gun she could have would not protect her from a quick knife slice and she would loose her baby and possibly her own life. I do not propose people to stay inactive but choosing your battles is a key to survive and this is all that matter.