long term maternity leave (debate)

[damo]

Everyone keeps talking about choice, that the Canadian system is bad because we have no choice of what to do with our money. Well, we (the majority) chose the government, we (the majority) chose the system and we choose reform by voting in new governments with new mandates. If we didn't like the system we would change the government. We still have a choice, it isn't a dictatorship.

Is it not like this in the USA? Do you elect someone into office and then not trust that they will do what is best for you?

 

[poohandwendy]

Do you elect someone into office and then not trust that they will do what is best for you?

LOL, you obviously haven't been following any of the political threads lately, eh?

Seriously, for me it is not about distrust, I just do not think extended maternity leave is something the govt needs to govern. It should be up to the individual to plan for, IMHO. It really is that simple.

 

[jmmom80]

Originally posted by poohandwendy

Seriously, for me it is not about distrust, I just do not think extended maternity leave is something the govt needs to govern. It should be up to the individual to plan for, IMHO. It really is that simple.

my thoughts exactly.

 

[damo]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
LOL, you obviously haven't been following any of the political threads lately, eh?

Seriously, for me it is not about distrust, I just do not think extended maternity leave is something the govt needs to govern. It should be up to the individual to plan for, IMHO. It really is that simple.

Oh but, pregnancy is so often unplanned. The Canadian system protects those who forget to protect themselves.

Actually, I see the biggest winner in many of the social programs to be the children. I think that it pays dividends in the long run.

 

[DarrenSt]

Again the EI premiums we pay help to cover more than just a womans maternity leave they cove injury and illness and also lay off and job loss. Can you honestly plan to go into work one day and have them hand you a pink slip and say sorry but you just are not needed work is slow. All the planing in the world doesn't eliminate this from happening and yes they say you should try and save up atleast 3 months worth of living expenses how many people have atleast 3 months worth of expenses saved for that just in case time. IT is a safety net in place to help out in those situations along with aiding during the first year of raising a child it really is a great system if manyof the folks in the US could see past the government running it I honestly think that is the biggest hang up alot of them are having. Say you contributed this off your pay and it was mandated everyone had to put money into it but it was run by a bypartisan agency not the govt would you then say it was acceptable?

 

[poohandwendy]

Oh but, pregnancy is so often unplanned. The Canadian system protects those who forget to protect themselves.

Hey, I totally understand, my first pregnancy was at 19 and unplanned. But, I feel that we have more freedom when we take care of ourselves. I think it is a nice program, but I just don't like the mandatory part of it.

 

[Maleficent13]

Originally posted by damo
Oh but, pregnancy is so often unplanned. The Canadian system protects those who forget to protect themselves.

I think this is exactly what's the crux of the matter. Some of us don't think it should be the government's responsibility to protect those who forget to protect themselves. It basically feels like parenting by the gov't. I don't need the government to parent my choices. I can handle the consequences of what I sow just fine, and I should have to.

 

[poohandwendy]

Originally posted by DarrenSt
Again the EI premiums we pay help to cover more than just a womans maternity leave they cove injury and illness and also lay off and job loss. Can you honestly plan to go into work one day and have them hand you a pink slip and say sorry but you just are not needed work is slow. All the planing in the world doesn't eliminate this from happening and yes they say you should try and save up atleast 3 months worth of living expenses how many people have atleast 3 months worth of expenses saved for that just in case time. IT is a safety net in place to help out in those situations along with aiding during the first year of raising a child it really is a great system if manyof the folks in the US could see past the government running it I honestly think that is the biggest hang up alot of them are having.

I disagree, I think most people have a problem with it being MANDATORY. The only reason the govt has been mentioned is because that is who would take care of it. I would disagree with it if anyone (private or govt) was requiring me to contribute to that specific program.

Again, we already contribute to unemployment compensation. So, we essentially have the same program, just without the maternity part. That is the part I don't want.

Say you contributed this off your pay and it was mandated everyone had to put money into it but it was run by a bypartisan agency not the govt would you then say it was acceptable?

Nope, wouldn't want it.

 

[poohandwendy]

Originally posted by Maleficent13
I think this is exactly what's the crux of the matter. Some of us don't think it should be the government's responsibility to protect those who forget to protect themselves. It basically feels like parenting by the gov't. I don't need the government to parent my choices. I can handle the consequences of what I sow just fine, and I should have to.

ITA and I would add 'anyone' in place of the government...no matter who....govt, private sector, employers...I don't need or want to be told how to protect myself for future pregnancy related issues.

 

[damo]

Originally posted by Maleficent13
I think this is exactly what's the crux of the matter. Some of us don't think it should be the government's responsibility to protect those who forget to protect themselves. It basically feels like parenting by the gov't. I don't need the government to parent my choices. I can handle the consequences of what I sow just fine, and I should have to.

But what happens to those who can't handle the consequences? Don't you end up paying for them anyway?

 

[poohandwendy]

Originally posted by damo
But what happens to those who can't handle the consequences? Don't you end up paying for them anyway?

Um, the people who cannot handle not having a year off to have a baby generally aren't the productive, working (ie contributing) types anyways. So, that is sort of a non-issue.Basically what I am saying is that you are talking about a 'perk' but we aren't losing productive workers to the welfare lines because they had a baby. It just isn't a problem. Yes, it is an inconvenience to go back to work, but not a problem.

 

[damo]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
Um, the people who cannot handle not having a year off to have a baby generally aren't the productive, working (ie contributing) types anyways. So, that is sort of a non-issue.

So anyone who cannot afford to take a year off to have a baby isn't a productive, working type?

 

[poohandwendy]

So anyone who cannot afford to take a year off to have a baby isn't a productive, working type?

Since when is a year off required or even necessary when you have a baby?

IO edited my last post, this may explain my thoughts further:

We aren't losing productive workers to the welfare lines because they don't get a year off when having a baby.

 

[jrydberg]

Originally posted by DarrenSt
Say you contributed this off your pay and it was mandated everyone had to put money into it but it was run by a bypartisan agency not the govt would you then say it was acceptable?

Nope. Still unacceptable to me.

 

[Maleficent13]

Originally posted by damo
But what happens to those who can't handle the consequences? Don't you end up paying for them anyway?

I don't pay for them to collect wages and have protected jobs while taking extended leaves of absence from work. Unfortunately, yes, I do pay for their food and housing sometimes through various taxes I am required to pay. I'm not saying do away with it entirely, but I think that could be handled better as well. I certainly wouldn't want any more added to it.

 

[damo]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
Since when is a year off required when you have a baby?

I'm quoting you. You said that not me.

 

[DarrenSt]

Well there you have it they just don't feel like giving up a small portion of their money just in case they never use it is what I am reading here. No matter if it would benefit themselves or a loved one etc.

 

[damo]

Originally posted by Maleficent13
I don't pay for them to collect wages and have protected jobs while taking extended leaves of absence from work. Unfortunately, yes, I do pay for their food and housing sometimes through various taxes I am required to pay. I'm not saying do away with it entirely, but I think that could be handled better as well. I certainly wouldn't want any more added to it.

If you do not use your EI, do you get the money back?

 

[Maleficent13]

I don't have EI.

 

[poohandwendy]

Originally posted by DarrenSt
Well there you have it they just don't feel like giving up a small portion of their money just in case they never use it is what I am reading here. No matter if it would benefit themselves or a loved one etc.

Oh come on...spare me the dramatics...I just don't see the need. I think things that are mandatorily taken from my paycheck should come from a NEED not a want.

I'm quoting you. You said that not me.

No, you did not quote me.

I said that the people who CANNOT HANDLE not having a year off when they have a baby are generally not the productive types. I said nothing about being able to afford it.