Let your daughter spend night with friend...only Dad home?

[mefordis]

I shared a photo from date night tonight with my SO and made a comment that our daughter was spending the night with her friend "jane". Two mutual friends of both us and "jane"'s parents sent me FB messages this evening asking if I knew the mom was out of town and only the dad was home. I told them both we did. One commented back "I just wanted you to know. Better safe than sorry..."

It made me wonder why this bothers some people. We know the family really well and we do not view the dad in any ways suspect. I was really taken aback by such an attitude. I want to respond "safe from what?"

It sounds like they might know something about that guy but didn't want to come right out and accuse him. I wouldn't feel comfortable with this at all.

 

[mummabear]

First of all the mom being there doesn't nessecarily protect anyone in the first place.
I second the previous poster who suggested asking if the commenters knew anything that was making them comment

 

[ilovefh]

DD is too little to have friends but DS does. He has two close friends. I'd be okay with DD staying at one friend's house when only the dad was home, but not the other. Not that I think he'd mistreat her, but I think he's weird. He once said he would "gut" the kindergartener who taught his DS to say "nanana boo boo" if he met the kid. He's just all kinds of extreme.
I have thought about how sleepovers will play out when DS gets older. When I was little we all went to the neighborhood school and our parents all knew each other because we lived close by. DS goes to school 20 mins from home and I don't know anything about anyone he goes to school with.

 

[Hikergirl]

It sounds like they might know something about that guy but didn't want to come right out and accuse him. I wouldn't feel comfortable with this at all.

The OP said that she knew the family very well.
If someone knew something and just made some vague statement on a FB message instead of calling me and telling me exactly what they knew and why I shouldn't allow my child there I would assume they were just the paranoid about dads type, especially if I knew the family well.

 

[Shmily1]

I would have had to ask "safe from what?" Then when they replied with their next vague innuendo, I would have said "maybe you need to worry about your own family and not so much other families." I guess I don't take stuff like that well. I certainly don't like people that put one gender down, and specifically one person down, but have no reasons to back it up. There are bad people of sexes.

 

[cabanafrau]

As I said before, listening to your child's instincts is important. It's important your child know their instincts are respected and that they need to learn to respect and rely on their instincts themselves. Parents who decide to chart a course of micromanagement and shutting down all potential risks they "see" run the risk of stunting their child's ability to recognize the cues their instincts send them, which in the end results in a person being more vulnerable because they haven't flexed their own self preservation muscles so to speak. It's a fine line, in heavy fog, drawn in gray. Unfortunately it's one of those roots and wings dilemmas parenthood likes to torture all of us parents with.

 

[NHdisneylover]

As I said before, listening to your child's instincts is important. It's important your child know their instincts are respected and that they need to learn to respect and rely on their instincts themselves. Parents who decide to chart a course of micromanagement and shutting down all potential risks they "see" run the risk of stunting their child's ability to recognize the cues their instincts send them, which in the end results in a person being more vulnerable because they haven't flexed their own self preservation muscles so to speak. It's a fine line, in heavy fog, drawn in gray. Unfortunately it's one of those roots and wings dilemmas parenthood likes to torture all of us parents with.

I think that is really important. I always told my kids to trust their instincts about people. It was a little harder with DD who was anxious about just about anyone, but we talked about knowing what her normal anxiety felt like, versus something stronger/more/different. And then we backed her up when she was a toddler (too young to have even had the discussion) and freaked out by one particular neighbor of our in laws, or in second grade and scared of one particular substitute teacher, and when she was not comfortable in the kids' club on the Disney ship, etc.

We also spoke with the kids over the years about adults who harm kids. I tried to put it in perspective and explain they were not likely to ever be harmed, just like there are fire drills at schools but most kids never have an actual fire at their school---but just like fire drills it is good to know what to do just in case. I was especially careful to make sure they knew that adults who harm kids nearly ALWAYS try to convince the child not to tell. They might tell the child that they will hurt them or family or friends if they tell, or the adult might tell the child it is his/her fault for looking or acting a certain way, or the child might even think the thing feels good at some point and then the adult tells them that makes it their fault, etc. We stressed that these are things bad adults do to try to protect themselves--that it is NEVER the child's fault and adult will lie and tell them all sorts of things to try to cover up--and at the end of the day that is the biggest red flag of all--anything that an a child is told not to share with their parents or other trusted adults (a surprise, which they know will make the other adult happy and is only temporarily being kept secret, like a gift is different) means the adult KNOWs that they, the adult are doing something wrong and that our kids could always, always tell us about such things, could always and always should (but also that if they did not right away for any reason, that was still not their fault and they could still come to us whenever they realized).

I may be totally off base, but it seemed like a much better way to protect my children than to teach them to fear one gender, or keep them only with people we know well (since people you know well are often the abusers--and yes e told kids that too--and that those people will say the child will not be believed, and that we would believe them).

 

[cabanafrau]

I think that is really important. I always told my kids to trust their instincts about people. It was a little harder with DD who was anxious about just about anyone, but we talked about knowing what her normal anxiety felt like, versus something stronger/more/different. And then we backed her up when she was a toddler (too young to have even had the discussion) and freaked out by one particular neighbor of our in laws, or in second grade and scared of one particular substitute teacher, and when she was not comfortable in the kids' club on the Disney ship, etc.

We also spoke with the kids over the years about adults who harm kids. I tried to put it in perspective and explain they were not likely to ever be harmed, just like there are fire drills at schools but most kids never have an actual fire at their school---but just like fire drills it is good to know what to do just in case. I was especially careful to make sure they knew that adults who harm kids nearly ALWAYS try to convince the child not to tell. They might tell the child that they will hurt them or family or friends if they tell, or the adult might tell the child it is his/her fault for looking or acting a certain way, or the child might even think the thing feels good at some point and then the adult tells them that makes it their fault, etc. We stressed that these are things bad adults do to try to protect themselves--that it is NEVER the child's fault and adult will lie and tell them all sorts of things to try to cover up--and at the end of the day that is the biggest red flag of all--anything that an a child is told not to share with their parents or other trusted adults (a surprise, which they know will make the other adult happy and is only temporarily being kept secret, like a gift is different) means the adult KNOWs that they, the adult are doing something wrong and that our kids could always, always tell us about such things, could always and always should (but also that if they did not right away for any reason, that was still not their fault and they could still come to us whenever they realized).

I may be totally off base, but it seemed like a much better way to protect my children than to teach them to fear one gender, or keep them only with people we know well (since people you know well are often the abusers--and yes e told kids that too--and that those people will say the child will not be believed, and that we would believe them).

All true. Teaching your kids to trust their instincts and be self reliant goes far beyond the issue of sexual predators, too. It's just a lifeskill to have a healthy dose of self reliance on one's own abilities to deal with other human beings.

There's plenty of times in parenting when you run smack up against a reminder that, if you're doing it right, you're making yourself ever more redundant and superfluous on a daily basis. I now officially have two adult children. I'm still their parent. They still need me. But honestly they haven't "needed" me for a lot of things for a long time. Overall it feels pretty darned good.

I can tell you I didn't miss buckling people up in car seats or zipping coats when they took over those duties themselves. I sometimes miss picking out cute little clothes and going for walks and leaving trails of bubbles flying through the neighborhood. Now I'm enjoying watching one's prom dress dreams come to life and seeing lots of indications that she's found a calling she's passionate about and has natural talent for or sometimes get to participate in an occasional wine discovery adventure with the oldest from time to time. It's different, it's quite often a lot of fun and our conversations are frequently hilarious and/or surprisingly deep and intellectual/philosophical. They're fun and interesting people all of their own merits, not because I attempted to breed individuals who would think and behave the way I want under my control. They're the kind of humans I'd chose for friends if I weren't related to them I doubt I'd like them as much if they were raised to knuckle under to my thinking, my fears or my control. I know I couldn't sleep at night if suddenly they were going to venture out in the world without any practice of listening to their instincts or any practice of trying to use them. I taught them as best I knew and my time is up for the most part. Now they're at the wheel and I think they did a fairly thorough amount of practice runs under our watch and can handle the road without us.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

First of all the mom being there doesn't necessarily protect anyone in the first place.

What if Mom is the predator? Or both of them? Or Mom turns a blind eye?

I understand statistically speaking it's unlikely. But not impossible.

 

[cabanafrau]

What if Mom is the predator? Or both of them? Or Mom turns a blind eye?

I understand statistically speaking it's unlikely. But not impossible.

In a certain sense it's not statistically unlikely at all. Not that I mean to suggest that there's a predator lurking around absolutely every corner, absolutely not. The sad truth is, the way the dynamics of sexual predation works would shock the heck out of most people. Depending on the work that has been done to lay the groundwork (predators tend to be very good long-term strategists) both parents being home provides no extra protection.

My work brings me up close and personal with this horror on a too frequent basis. I learned the most from a case of a young, single mother who had herself been abused as a child. She loved her children deeply and would have done anything she could to protect them. I would not have believed if I had not seen with my own eyes how she both understood on a level her child was being abused, tried to set up a system to prevent it and bring in needed intervention without making the report herself, denied to herself it was happening until she literally walked in on the abuse taking place, reported it, told what she had done to try to prevent it and simultaneously denied she had any reason to suspect or know it was happening. As long as I live I will never shake that case and the devastation surrounding it. It's been several years and I still discuss it from time to time with the psychologist who consulted in the case because I simply cannot wrap my brain around the diametrically opposing things that took place. Were I to simply read the info on this one I would not believe it possible. Having done interviews myself with different parties involved in the case and being present for several of the court proceedings opened up an entirely different realm in which these things happen under watchful eyes and how and why that can be possible.

 

[DopeyDame]

What if Mom is the predator? Or both of them? Or Mom turns a blind eye?

I understand statistically speaking it's unlikely. But not impossible.

In one of the most famous cases, it's almost certain that Jerry Sandusky's wife was in the house while he was abusing children.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

I know some men wouldn't even want their DD having a sleepover at their house if it was only dad at home and no mom. My XH or my current SO wouldn't allow DD to have a sleepover if it was just them home. Not because they think something would happen but because kids make false allegations. Crap happens. And they would rather not be in that situation.

 

[nugov2]

I know some men wouldn't even want their DD having a sleepover at their house if it was only dad at home and no mom. My XH or my current SO wouldn't allow DD to have a sleepover if it was just them home. Not because they think something would happen but because kids make false allegations. Crap happens. And they would rather not be in that situation.

OMG this is a sad, sad sentiment. I'm so glad I live in a different world where this isn't even a blip on our radar. Never think twice about who is home who isn't going to be home when my kids ask for sleepovers. They are often spur of the moment with rock paper scissors deciding who is hosting the gaggle of girls (because it's rarely one). I am truly grateful we live in a bubble of people who feel as we do and until reading here never crossed my mind to be worried about if it is only dh home or only a dh home where my dd or ds go. We trust the people in the family where my kids spend both their days and nights. False accusations can happen even if mom is home and don't think her being there would make a difference so not sure why that matters anyway.

 

[nugov2]

The more I think of this the more my head hurts. I can't imagine telling my kids no to sleep over because only dad is home. Do you tell your kids that is a rule and if so do yiu tell them why? My husband does everything I do...trips to the movies, grocery shop with kids in tow, visits to doctors and haircuts so having something be a no because its dad would be so out of place in our world. Can kids play at your house when dad is only home. I just can't wrap my head around this rule and trying to make it seem like a normal rule to my children. I guess the old no because I said so would work, but we live in a house like i stated where dad does everything mom does...including laundry

 

[mi*vida*loca]

The more I think of this the more my head hurts. I can't imagine telling my kids no to sleep over because only dad is home. Do you tell your kids that is a rule and if so do yiu tell them why? My husband does everything I do...trips to the movies, grocery shop with kids in tow, visits to doctors and haircuts so having something be a no because its dad would be so out of place in our world. Can kids play at your house when dad is only home. I just can't wrap my head around this rule and trying to make it seem like a normal rule to my children. I guess the old no because I said so would work, but we live in a house like i stated where dad does everything mom does...including laundry

My kids aren't allowed to have sleepovers unless it's family or VERY close family friends so they don't even ask. I don't know any of the school moms so that's not even an option. There are family friends that I would be fine if just dad was home and DD spent the night there.

I'm saying my XH or SO would be uncomfortable with another child that they didn't know was spending the night at the house with DD if I wasn't home. If it were cousins or close family friends kids they would be fine with it. And it has happened before. But DD10 friends that we don't know and we don't know their parents....no they would not be comfortable with that.

And in my world parents here let their kids sleep wherever. DD's friend spend the night a few months ago. The mom did not even know me. Not my name, phone number, address, NOTHING. And she released her DD to me for a whole weekend. It's mind boggling to me but that's the norm in my area.

Like I said previously, I think part of it is cultural. We grew up and sleepovers were not allowed. We were told that you have your own bed and you sleep in it every night. End of story. We had our sleepovers with cousins and we had TONS of cousins.

 

[mefordis]

My kids aren't allowed to have sleepovers unless it's family or VERY close family friends so they don't even ask. I don't know any of the school moms so that's not even an option. There are family friends that I would be fine if just dad was home and DD spent the night there.

I'm saying my XH or SO would be uncomfortable with another child that they didn't know was spending the night at the house with DD if I wasn't home. If it were cousins or close family friends kids they would be fine with it. And it has happened before. But DD10 friends that we don't know and we don't know their parents....no they would not be comfortable with that.

And in my world parents here let their kids sleep wherever. DD's friend spend the night a few months ago. The mom did not even know me. Not my name, phone number, address, NOTHING. And she released her DD to me for a whole weekend. It's mind boggling to me but that's the norm in my area.

Like I said previously, I think part of it is cultural. We grew up and sleepovers were not allowed. We were told that you have your own bed and you sleep in it every night. End of story. We had our sleepovers with cousins and we had TONS of cousins.

I agree with your approach comletely. My mom was very much that way about sleepovers. She was like, "You don't need to do that. You sleep in your own bed" Lol. I am not quite to that point but I do allow sleepovers with family and my dd has a close friend who we are friends with her family so I feel comfortable with that. However, no way in heck I would allow my girls to go spend the night at someone's house who I don't know personally with a very close relationship if they are not family. I

 

[nugov2]

My kids aren't allowed to have sleepovers unless it's family or VERY close family friends so they don't even ask. I don't know any of the school moms so that's not even an option. There are family friends that I would be fine if just dad was home and DD spent the night there.

I'm saying my XH or SO would be uncomfortable with another child that they didn't know was spending the night at the house with DD if I wasn't home. If it were cousins or close family friends kids they would be fine with it. And it has happened before. But DD10 friends that we don't know and we don't know their parents....no they would not be comfortable with that.

And in my world parents here let their kids sleep wherever. DD's friend spend the night a few months ago. The mom did not even know me. Not my name, phone number, address, NOTHING. And she released her DD to me for a whole weekend. It's mind boggling to me but that's the norm in my area.

Like I said previously, I think part of it is cultural. We grew up and sleepovers were not allowed. We were told that you have your own bed and you sleep in it every night. End of story. We had our sleepovers with cousins and we had TONS of cousins.

I get everyone has different philosophies on if sleepovers are appropriate or not, but for it to be yes when mom is home or a blanket no when dad is home on either side is not a idea I've ever even imagined was an issue. So I'm really curious would your xdh or so allow your dd to have friends over at all if you're not home? Would they take your dd and her friends to the movies, mall or out to dinner without you? I love taking my kids out with their friends and so does dh. Sometimes we all go, sometimes just I go or dh goes. Sad to think a parent is missing out on that experience with their kids for fear of people accusing them of something because of their gender. Like I said, I just never imagined people actually thought I wonder if my dd should have friends over when dw isn't home.

 

[NHdisneylover]

I feel like only allowing kids (old enough to speak for themselves, etc, not tiny kids) to sleepover where mothers are present, or only with close family, etc gives them and the parents a false sense of security and makes the kids feel less like they can report abuse which does happen (because they have been taught to believe women do not abuse, or their aunt and uncle would not abuse, etc so might be afraid no one will believe them).

The older they got, the more I let THEM make judgements about which homes they felt comfortable and safe in--even if I barely knew the parents (by high school). I figure by college they are making judgements about where to go and who to spend time with 100% of the time, without us even there to chat with in person the next day, or knowing where they sleep on any given night, so I might out to loosen the control bit by bit long before then. Heck DS17 has spent several nights at his best friend'S house, and i have never met the dad or older siblings who often are there on visits--just the mom and younger sister. I trust DS to judge the situation though.

 

[JaxDad]

So I'm really curious would your xdh or so allow your dd to have friends over at all if you're not home?

A little off-topic, but she definitely indicated XH, not XDH (although that is not as strange as DXH)...
:^D

 

[cabanafrau]

I feel like only allowing kids (old enough to speak for themselves, etc, not tiny kids) to sleepover where mothers are present, or only with close family, etc gives them and the parents a false sense of security and makes the kids feel less like they can report abuse which does happen (because they have been taught to believe women do not abuse, or their aunt and uncle would not abuse, etc so might be afraid no one will believe them).

The older they got, the more I let THEM make judgements about which homes they felt comfortable and safe in--even if I barely knew the parents (by high school). I figure by college they are making judgements about where to go and who to spend time with 100% of the time, without us even there to chat with in person the next day, or knowing where they sleep on any given night, so I might out to loosen the control bit by bit long before then. Heck DS17 has spent several nights at his best friend'S house, and i have never met the dad or older siblings who often are there on visits--just the mom and younger sister. I trust DS to judge the situation though.

That time when they're off to college is here quicker than you can imagine, isn't it? I don't know if it's because she's the youngest or what, but my second daughter turning 18 seems more significant, more the end of an era somehow than it did with her sister.

About two years ago I was a little shaken up when my younger DD told me she had made an excuse to an old friend to avoid spending the night at her house. Lovely, really bright girl who's been her friend since kindergarten, with countless sleepovers back and forth over all these years. They still hang out all the time, but DD decided to end the sleepovers on the pretense of her over busy schedule getting in the way because she's started to feel funny about the way her friend's father has started to behave, suddenly wanting to chat and "hang out" with the girls when they're over there, to an extreme level. My daughters are both very tight with their dad, used to him knowing and chatting to their friends when they're at our house, have had their friends call to talk often to him about computer issues, ask if he can come take their pictures for a special event, whatever. They're not shy about men or dads. DD has known her friend's dad since she was five, never a problem. She flat out told me she felt he had suddenly changed around her and the other girls when they were over at the house, it made her radar go up and she made the choice not to be in the situation anymore. I trust my daughter's instincts and am very thankful she listened to them and figured out a way to handle the situation.

We talked about it, I told her what she did is exactly what I would have recommended and reminded her to always listen when that alert system goes off in the back of her brain. We've talked several times about things like date rape and how in that type of situation that alert system in your brain might trigger and she needs to learn to recognize it and act on it immediately. A few months ago her sister drove that point home by telling a story that happened in her circle of friends at college. Happening within one of the clusters of a long-term group of friends really shook DD up, particularly as there have been many occasions she has gone to pick him up alone because he was drunk and needed a ride. She never once felt the need to have any defenses up with him and that shook her, made her rethink a lot of things.

Parental instincts are important. It's just as important they learn to listen for what their own instincts have to say, because you can't keep them home in their rooms forever.