Just found out that WE DIDN'T REALLY CLOSE on Oct. 7th...

[Caren90]

Before I sent back the signed closing documents on our last contract, I had the listing agent confirm the points with Disney that day.

 

[dis-happy]

I am confused, I thought you could NOT close typically if a member had a reservation in the system but you got an e-mail saying you closed on Oct 7??? Yea I would be looking for compensation along with my money back until the real closing happens, why should TSS hold the funds for a few months when you get nothing! So sorry this happened.

Is TSS (closing service division) still holding the funds or did they already forward to the seller? My guess is the latter?????

 

[edk35]

I am confused, I thought you could NOT close typically if a member had a reservation in the system but you got an e-mail saying you closed on Oct 7??? Yea I would be looking for compensation along with my money back until the real closing happens, why should TSS hold the funds for a few months when you get nothing! So sorry this happened.

YES we most certainly got an email. THEN we got hard copies from the title company a week or so ago saying it had closed. Those were dated Oct. 7th. They had faxed a copy of the executed deed to Disney.
This paperwork stated that it takes Disney approximately ten business days to update their records and acknowledge us as the new owner.

 

[edk35]

This is what we got on Oct. 7th:


Welcome Home to The Disney Vacation Club. Escrow has closed and you are now a Disney Vacation Club member with 100 Wilderness Lodge points.


Please remember that it can take Disney 14 to 28 days after closing for DVC to recognize that you are the owner of your points. Once you are in the DVC system, you can call Member Services and make your first reservation. You may have verify your identity by social security number or home address until your membership card arrives. Here is their contact information:


Disney Vacation Club Member Services
800-******** or 407-566-3800
Hours: 9 am - 5:30 pm (eastern time) 7 days a week


Within the next 30 - 60 days you will receive a welcome packet in the mail from the Disney Vacation Club. Following that, you will receive another mailing with your DVC membership cards. Also in a few months, you will be sent a certified copy of the deed. Please do not hesitate to call me should you have any questions.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

So what is the current situation? Can you force the seller to cancel the reservation so you can close now? Do you have the option to cancel? I know in our paperwork we had to sign the disclosure that closing may take longer than the specified closing date. Was there such a disclosure with TSS? If its simply the fact that you can't close as the paperwork stated, you may not then be able to cancel the contract.

 

[edk35]

So what is the current situation? Can you force the seller to cancel the reservation so you can close now? Do you have the option to cancel? I know in our paperwork we had to sign the disclosure that closing may take longer than the specified closing date. Was there such a disclosure with TSS? If its simply the fact that you can't close as the paperwork stated, you may not then be able to cancel the contract.

Hi Hope. I will have to pull the paperwork. I know that that there was nothing on the listing about the sellers not being able to close until a certain date. There was nothing mentioned to us at all over the phone, in an email, or in the paperwork we signed about not being able to close until a later date due to a pending reservation. We are still getting the points that we purchased ...2011 UY but they must have banked some they are using. I am just surprised this has happened. The entire process went so smoothly...this really just surprised us. This just delays us being in the system so much longer.

 

[edk35]

So what is the current situation? Can you force the seller to cancel the reservation so you can close now? Do you have the option to cancel? I know in our paperwork we had to sign the disclosure that closing may take longer than the specified closing date. Was there such a disclosure with TSS? If its simply the fact that you can't close as the paperwork stated, you may not then be able to cancel the contract.

This is what one of the papers said:



While the search is underway, we order Estoppel information from the resort. This is the current owners
account status. We are verifying that the Maintenance and Taxes are current, when they are payable
again, mortgage information (if applicable), status of use, and if there are any transfer fees. If an owner is
behind on Maintenance and Taxes, we simply clear the account at closing via funds from the Seller’s
proceeds.

ONE would have thought that when this was done...... they would have seen an existing reservation.

 

[dbs1228]

YES we most certainly got an email. THEN we got hard copies from the title company a week or so ago saying it had closed. Those were dated Oct. 7th. They had faxed a copy of the executed deed to Disney.
This paperwork stated that it takes Disney approximately ten business days to update their records and acknowledge us as the new owner.

So are you truly closed or not, if you have documents saying you are closed then you should own the contract. I would be all over this!!!! Once again until you have the contract (points) to make ressies I would ask for my money back. Keep us posted.

 

[marynvince]

would certainly like to see someone from TSS chirp in here regarding how this happened. They are certainly more than willing to chime in when things are in their favor??

 

[edk35]

So are you truly closed or not, if you have documents saying you are closed then you should own the contract. I would be all over this!!!! Once again until you have the contract (points) to make ressies I would ask for my money back. Keep us posted.

Well we did get hard copies saying (dated Oct. 7th) that our closing has taken place. The executed Warranty Deed has been forwarded to the coutny in which the resort resides for recording. It said that typically the recording is approximately 4 to 6 weeeks following submission. They also faxed a copy of the deed to the resort. It also said that the original recorded deed will be mailed to us once the title insurance poicy has been issued for the new purchase.

I did send The TSS another email to the TSS asking more details about what happened.

 

[GoofItUp]

would certainly like to see someone from TSS chirp in here regarding how this happened. They are certainly more than willing to chime in when things are in their favor??

There is also a non-TSS poster on here that is always the first on the "Fidelity did this-or-that" threads to cite how incompetent Fidelity is and how he would never use them. He would only use one of the other brokers because they never have this happen. Haven't seen him post on this thread, either.

Clearly a mistake was made and needs to be rectified. It would not preclude me from using TSS again if I was in the market for another add-on. Just like I would use Fidelity again if they had the contract I wanted. TSS has a good reputation and will hopefully do the right thing in this unfortunate situation.

Keep us updated, OP.

 

[edk35]

I just spoke with The Magic Title Company. She called Disney after day 10 to see if the transfer had taken place because usually they hear from them that it has taken place. When she did call, she was told of the pending reservation. This contract should have been a DELAYED CLOSING. She also said that CLOSING AND A TRANSFER are two completely different things. The TSS said "whatever you want to call it.... closing or transfer can't take place until Dec. 15th". She said that the closing took place on Oct. 7th, we own the property, it is deeded to us and that Disney can't transfer it to us until the reservation has taken place. She also said that Disney as a courtesy will sometimes, but not always, let the broker know if there is a pending reservation. The owners have not been paid until the transfer has taken place. NOW..... she said she had NO IDEA why this reservation was not disclosed at the time it was listed. She told me to call TSS and ask if the owners signed a disclosure with them stating there was a pending ressie. She also said that it could be an OVERSIGHT by Disney because these owners also own three other contracts/properties. SO maybe Disney got it mixed it up. That is something that has to be checked on today. I am calling TSS next.

 

[edk35]

There is also a non-TSS poster on here that is always the first on the "Fidelity did this-or-that" threads to cite how incompetent Fidelity is and how he would never use them. He would only use one of the other brokers because they never have this happen. Haven't seen him post on this thread, either.

Clearly a mistake was made and needs to be rectified. It would not preclude me from using TSS again if I was in the market for another add-on. Just like I would use Fidelity again if they had the contract I wanted. TSS has a good reputation and will hopefully do the right thing in this unfortunate situation.

Keep us updated, OP.

We also purchased a contract through Fidelity at the same time and so far so good with them.

 

[JimMIA]

There is also a non-TSS poster on here that is always the first on the "Fidelity did this-or-that" threads to cite how incompetent Fidelity is and how he would never use them. He would only use one of the other brokers because they never have this happen. Haven't seen him post on this thread, either.

That might be me, although I'm certainly not alone.

First of all, my advice here is the same as it would be with Fidelity -- CANCEL...unless this deal is such a sweet deal that you just can't match it.

There is no excuse for this. If the points are correct (OP says they are correct), then either the seller lied to TTS about not having any reservations pending or TTS made a mistake not showing the listing as "Can't close until..."

From OPs subsequent explanation, it sounds to me like the original lie/mistake was then compounded by a Disney mistake on the estoppel letter.

Regardless of who's to blame, OP has a two-month opening here, and if it were me, I'd be looking for a better deal. She could buy now and still close before this deal will close.

My gripe with Fidelity has always been two-fold:

1. They used to have this kind of problem pretty regularly...not once, but more like once a month. And every time, they seemed to be mystified -- like everything they do they are doing for the first time. You expect a learning curve when a company goes into a new business, but their learning curve has been about 5 years long!
2. More important -- they previously never checked anything prior to listing. They have now corrected this, and hopefully that will eliminate most of these issues.

 

[JimMIA]

The TSS said "whatever you want to call it.... closing or transfer can't take place until Dec. 15th".

That's not a good answer -- very UNlike TTS. If that's the way they said it, I'm disappointed.

She said that the closing took place on Oct. 7th, we own the property, it is deeded to us and that Disney can't transfer it to us until the reservation has taken place.

I assume you're talking to Nancy, and she knows this stuff better than anybody and has no interest other than making sure everything is done right.

However, it's always been my understanding that if there is an existing reservation, Disney automatically cancels it. I'd double-check that with her.

-The owners have not been paid until the transfer has taken place.

Then you're in the driver's seat.

She told me to call TSS and ask if the owners signed a disclosure with them stating there was a pending ressie.

I've sold two contracts through TTS and both times I had to sign a disclosure specifying any reservations that were pending and also verifying that there were no legal encumberances on the contract (divorce, bankruptcy, etc). And that was required BEFORE they would even list the contract.

She also said that it could be an OVERSIGHT by Disney because these owners also own three other contracts/properties. SO maybe Disney got it mixed it up. That is something that has to be checked on today.

That's quite possible, and it's also a possible resolution avenue.

DVC MS does sometimes take points from the wrong contract for a reservation, and it should be a simple matter to get that reversed. And even if that's not the case, they may be able to just switch the reservation to another contract they own and free your contract up.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

I just don't understand why this existing reservation is not being cancelled so the OP can close?

 

[edk35]

That's not a good answer -- very UNlike TTS. If that's the way they said it, I'm disappointed.I assume you're talking to Nancy, and she knows this stuff better than anybody and has no interest other than making sure everything is done right.

However, it's always been my understanding that if there is an existing reservation, Disney automatically cancels it. I'd double-check that with her. Then you're in the driver's seat.I've sold two contracts through TTS and both times I had to sign a disclosure specifying any reservations that were pending and also verifying that there were no legal encumberances on the contract (divorce, bankruptcy, etc). And that was required BEFORE they would even list the contract. That's quite possible, and it's also a possible resolution avenue.

DVC MS does sometimes take points from the wrong contract for a reservation, and it should be a simple matter to get that reversed. And even if that's not the case, they may be able to just switch the reservation to another contract they own and free your contract up.

TSS quote via email: ........ now this property can't close or transfer (whichever term you want to use) before 12/15/11.

I spoke with the Broker at TSS. He told me that the person that listed it the day it came in, who has worked there 14 years, missed the 120 points when they checked the contract. (20 points are banked apparently) but listing had 2011 UY 100 pts. available and there was no were no banked points listed or a delayed closing date. THEN the broker that did the paperwork (our broker was out on leave when the ball started rolling), MISSED IT. He also said that Disney usually ALWAYS catches things like this if indeed they are not caught by the TSS. Our broker said the checks and balances were missed TWICE by them the TSS. He also got an email from the seller asking WHY the delayed closing now?????? So now we are thinking that because the owners have other DVC contracts that maybe the points were pulled from the wrong contract. Our broker was contacting the sellers to call Disney and inquire about this. However it sounds like this contract had 20 banked points that maybe MS pulled first for the ressie they made. Banked points always get taken out first. So..... we are waiting to hear what is going to happen. NONETHELESS........none of this should have happened.

 

[Chuck S]

First of all, my advice here is the same as it would be with Fidelity -- CANCEL...unless this deal is such a sweet deal that you just can't match it. .

I agree, I'd drop this deal. It sounds like the seller was not completely upfront. And I don't know why DVC is not cancelling the existing resevation to complete the sale.

 

[JimMIA]

TSS quote via email: ........ now this property can't close or transfer (whichever term you want to use) before 12/15/11.

I suspect they're wrong, and Nancy's right. I also suspect there are three terms in play here, not just two: closing, transfer, and settlement.

According to the title agent, the transaction has already closed -- meaning ownership of the DVC timeshare contract has transferred from the seller to you, and presumably the new ownership deed has also been recorded with the county (which is something you might check). If that's the case, and this can't be worked out any other way, it is possible that the only way to fix things will be for you to quit-claim the property back to the seller and get your money back.

The internal Disney transfer of the DVC account obviously has not happened or we wouldn't be having this conversation. Again, that may possibly be fixed by just switching the existing reservation to another of their contracts. If they're pestering the closing company for their money, I'm inclined to believe the BIG mistake was made by DVC MS and the seller didn't know the points had been taken from the contract you were buying. If that can be reversed, it's probably an easy, quick solution for everyone.

Settlement is the process of paying everybody, which the closing company doesn't do until everything is completely finished. Until then, your funds are held in escrow for safekeeping -- so your money is not GONE yet, and can be recovered.

 

[dis-happy]

What a mess. Makes you wonder what your $400. or so in closing costs is actually getting you. Attention to detail? Guess not. It's kind of telling that TSS is saying that "Disney usually catches the error when we don't". Makes you wonder how often they miss it.

One time I wasn't in the system for ages because the paperwork they gave me had the wrong contract number. I'm still annoyed about how blase they were about the whole thing. And that was after a series of other errors, including lost paperwork and telling me something had been submitted when it hadn't.

I'm with Jim. If they aren't making this right (and if you are a saint and willing to wait you should be compensated a large portion of your closing costs IMO), cancel and go with another contract and a different closing agency.