Just back and not happy

[TwinPrincessMermaids]

The people tracking system is already there. They won't remove it and start over. So they can't possibly make you or anyone with this outlook happy. If you're done with WDW for this reason, then you are done. fortunately there are other parks in the Orlando area that aren't purchasing people tracking systems.

They can take off the limits and make us happy. Like I have always said, it is fixable. But there is a whole lotta trial and error going on... about half success and half error.

 

[JimmyV]

I was curious so I checked wait times: It's 11:00 am in Orlando on a Friday and the current times are 15 min for PoC, 20 min for HM, 25 min for Buzz, and 40 mins for BTRR. I wouldn't call those out of the ordinary and not prohibitive to riding as many times as you like.

Accepting the premise that these wait times are "not out of the ordinary", meaning that they are pretty much what we have grown accustomed to in the past, where did the $1.5B go? Did WDW spend all that money just to keep us at the status quo? Saying that "things are no worse off than they were before, and for the most part, are pretty much the same" is faint praise for a nine figure crowd re-distribution system, no?

 

[catra121]

Accepting the premise that these wait times are "not out of the ordinary", meaning that they are pretty much what we have grown accustomed to in the past, where did the $1.5B go? Did WDW spend all that money just to keep us at the status quo? Saying that "things are no worse off than they were before, and for the most part, are pretty much the same" is faint praise for a nine figure crowd re-distribution system, no?

Except that crowds themselves are not the same...they are bigger....

 

[MaryKatesMom]

Originally Posted by AnAmericanInDisney
That used to be true, but now a visitor is forced to be on the app and use technology to get the Fastpasses and make the trip worthwhile. If I'm paying to fly and stay at Disney, I want to ride some rides. You used to be able to wander around and grab a few fastpasses for later. You used to be able to "wing it" and still ride plenty of rides. FP+ has made that impossible, even without adding dining to the equation.



That is not really true either. When I took the kids well before either fast pass was available we planned where we were going that morning. I think there is a lot of families plan day to day based on weather, kids moods and if they want to sleep in.

I think the issue with the new system is that it makes lines where things really never had any like HM and POTC. My daughter and I went in August in 2012 and we rode both of these countless times in one day. Maybe it would have been a better idea to have created the system with just the attractions and rides that had long lines. (like meet and greets and the mountains...etc...)

2012 we walked out the door of BC on the way to DHS and saw the boat pull out. Rather than wait or walk we changed gears and went to Epcot, just because we felt like it. Epcot is my favorite park.

Spaceship Earth never in my memory, had a late afternoon/ early evening line as most guests hit it earlier on the way in. Now it does so we don't bother backtracking before dinner it has a line.

The other issue is we like waterparks. You don't know until the day before if you are going. All my days were planned AK/WP or EP/WP or MK/WP or DHS/WP. I now have to make a choice months ahead of time. Get morning FP+ no waterpark or evening and hope the weather is good.

 

[Beer Me]

You have to also figure that >1M people are now walking through those same gates. I was curious so I checked wait times: It's 11:00 am in Orlando on a Friday and the current times are 15 min for PoC, 20 min for HM, 25 min for Buzz, and 40 mins for BTRR. I wouldn't call those out of the ordinary and not prohibitive to riding as many times as you like.

Not bad at all. I have absolutely waited 60+ minutes for HM and Pirates on occasion during summer visits. These people who waltzed on rides multiple times at the height of a crowded day are either delusional or don't realize they were just lucky. If you were able to work the old FP system to ride (for example) Soarin 5 or 6 times on a busy day I'm not sorry if you can't do that anymore.

There have been times when we've encountered a headline ride without much of a wait and it's always a pleasant surprise. My last trip 5 years ago we hit EE 4 times one day because the wait was 10 or 15 minutes. It happens (right time right place) but you can never count on it.

In the 5 years since our last visit to Disney we have been to Universal twice. I much prefer the FP system (old or new) to the extortion over there. I paid because the lines are miserable. At least Disney has better queues when you do have to wait.

 

[flicx]

Accepting the premise that these wait times are "not out of the ordinary", meaning that they are pretty much what we have grown accustomed to in the past, where did the $1.5B go? Did WDW spend all that money just to keep us at the status quo? Saying that "things are no worse off than they were before, and for the most part, are pretty much the same" is faint praise for a nine figure crowd re-distribution system, no?

Also it was posted on here recently that there were several years in the 90's when crowd levels were at or close to the same level they have now. So the more people excuse is also a poor one. Disney is basically saying sorry customers we don't have the money to make attractions, we spent it to track you and try to maximize profits. Hang with us a few years and maybe then we'll try harder!

 

[tup1830]

I don't understand people saying 1 million more people, yada yada yada....thats over 365 days people...so its not 1 million more people everyday.

On a given day thats not even breaking 3000 more people. AND of that not everyone can go on every ride (those numbers include infants, pregnant woman, eldery that can't ride some rides, etc.)

Wait times were able to be seen before the my disney app

The system is pretty complex. Since this is supposed to be a system for the masses...why didn't they try it in Disneyland or even the Disney Cruise Line to test it and perfect it before rolling it out to the most populous parks in the world?!?

Solution: Raise prices to $500/day (which will end up paying for the lost money in FP+) and then you'll have only a few hundred people in the park each day...woohoo!!!

 

[rsimon]

They can take off the limits and make us happy. Like I have always said, it is fixable. But there is a whole lotta trial and error going on... about half success and half error.

Limits are there because they allow it to be scheduled in advance. If you didn't have limits, early planners would grab all the fast passes before anyone else could.

Limits are fine in the current implementation. HOWEVER, I think they should go to a hybrid of the old and the new. No pre-planning, but you can go to the attractions after you enter the park, use your magic band to get a FP time assigned to you. After 1 hour, you can get another fast pass at ANY ride as long as it doesn't conflict with a time you already have assigned.

This would allow you to collect FP similar to before, but also limit people. You could get multiple FP for the same ride if you wanted, but the times would be spread out based on availability and not conflicting with one you already have. Having to wait at least 1 hour between getting each FP would make you prioritize your ride preferences but would also allow you to stack them if there was availability.

If they implemented something like this, it would bring some of the fun of FP back and still provide some of the FP+ benefits.

Unfortunately, I don't think Disney wants to have the mad dash of guests at rope drop trying to get their first FP. That could be fixed by not allowing any FP for the first hour. So everything is just standby for the first hour of opening. You still get the rush of standby riders at opening now, so this is nothing new.

 

[PlutoMars]

Also it was posted on here recently that there were several years in the 90's when crowd levels were at or close to the same level they have now. So the more people excuse is also a poor one. Disney is basically saying sorry customers we don't have the money to make attractions, we spent it to track you and try to maximize profits. Hang with us a few years and maybe then we'll try harder!

Thanks for the insight into the board room. It was like you were sitting right there next to Iger.

 

[JimmyV]

Except that crowds themselves are not the same...they are bigger....

Not really. And if so, negligibly. Crowd levels are very, very close to pre-9/11 levels. We're talking about changes in the single digit percentages. Do the math and calculate how much longer a 40 minute line would be if the crowd increased by 5%. Current wait times are within the margin of error that accounts for that increase, so the crowd re-distribution system hasn't changed all that much (for the guest). Look. There's a reason why the MDE Grand Poobah got canned. Somebody in the board room is not seeing the results that they had hoped for.

 

[CTDisneyfan816]

Disney is one nefarious company:

Hiring reputation defenders to come post on the DIS

Violating guests' constitutional rights.

Spending 18 kazillion dollars on a "tracking system" because that is all the My Magic+ project is all about.

Kidnapping people at the airport

Forcing people to use magic bands

People should stop giving their money to this evil empire

If Disney wants to know where I am at a certain time, call me up on the phone, I'll tell them exactly where I am and what I'm doing and who I'm doing it with!

 

[flicx]

Thanks for the insight into the board room. It was like you were sitting right there next to Iger.

Actual attendance numbers MK 2012 17.5 million, 1991 18 million, Epcot 2012 11 million , 1991 14.4 million, Studios 2012 10 million, 1994 10.4 million. Looks like very similar attendance to me.

 

[JoeA]

Actually the last figure given was over 1.5 billion dollars for the my magic system with an estimated .5 to 1 billion dollars more to be spent. Self serving ,I think it is obvious how self serving the my magic system is for Disney. This company got its theme parks to this point by building more attractions not people tracking. Pleasing customers should be a top priority for Disney. I don't think you can argue that 10 or 15 new attractions (which could conservatively be built with that much money) would have gotten a lot more people to come to the parks and also spread out the crowd. How happy would the customers be then? I am sure of one thing 100% happier!

They spent over $1B to revamp DCA and it only helped...DCA. They are going to have to invest $500M for "Avatar Land" alone. You really think they can build 10 to 15 new rides for the same money as they've spent on MM+?

So let's say they were going to build 10-15 new rides and expand. That's basically another "land" or so. I think "Avatar" will have 2 or 3 rides, maybe. So 10 rides would need about 3 "lands" at a minimum, and now you are at $1.5B. So maybe you're right, or at least close. Now Disney spent $1.5B on WDW alone and you're happy. I'm happy. All WDW fans are happy! Yeah!

But...there is a big ol' world out there that will potentially capitalize on MyMagic+. Disney can use the "people tracking" to maximize queue management, enhance the guest experience, and increase attendance all while building IT infrastructure. Maybe now they are ready to expand WDW??

Sure, they got to this point, but they now have to get to the next point. MyMagic+ is also looking at the other 125M people who go into Disney parks worldwide, with the goal of making the guest experience much better.

Disney just updated Fantasy Land, is building "Avatar Land", there are rumors all over about new ideas for HS and EPCOT. They're also investing overseas expansion. Again, this isn't all about WDW and keeping you happy.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

if they had built 10 to 15 new attractions there would be threads on this board complaining about being disappointed by the attractions they built. No matter what they were.

Bring back exceptional customer service and park maintenance.

Now this is something realistic that they could actually do! Stop cutting back on staffing.

 

[JimmyV]

Actual attendance numbers MK 2012 17.5 million, 1991 18 million, Epcot 2012 11 million , 1991 14.4 million, Studios 2012 10 million, 1994 10.4 million. Looks like very similar attendance to me.

Why cite to facts and statistics when invective posts will further the discussion! (Thanks for digging these up. Saved me the trouble as I am certain that someone who "knows better" will challenge my "Not really. And if so, negligibly" comment.)

 

[eliza61]

But what could they do to make you happy? Go back to the old system? That's not going to happen.

How about keeping the old kiosk. What was so hard about that? Why force me now to find a fp kiosk, wait in that line or force me to waste time trying to connect with lousy web capability. Why force me to ride, attractions that I don't want to in the name of some tiered system Yes, I know they won't go back but why do you insist I have to like a lousy inferior system?

Sorry I will not applaud only being able to ride 1 major attraction without a hassle.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

I never said you had to like it. It is perfectly reasonable not to like it. What I said is that even if you complain about it and insist WDW do something to make you happy, it is not going to go back to the way it was. If that is the only thing that will make you happy, then you are not going to be happy at WDW anymore. And if you're not, then you are not. I know that when one says "then go somewhere else" on this forum it is not considered a legitimate answer, but really, in that case, what else can you do? Paper fastpasses dispensed outside the rides on a first come, first served basis are not coming back.

 

[jade1]

Accepting the premise that these wait times are "not out of the ordinary", meaning that they are pretty much what we have grown accustomed to in the past, where did the $1.5B go? Did WDW spend all that money just to keep us at the status quo? Saying that "things are no worse off than they were before, and for the most part, are pretty much the same" is faint praise for a nine figure crowd re-distribution system, no?

They are saying SB is no worse-FP+ is dispersed through the parks and hotels (on and offsite) and restaurants and airports and planes and other states and doctors offices and dentist offices and grocery stores and liquor stores and taxis and buses and monorails and boats and lakes and golf courses and shops and pools and beaches-just for use today.

 

[TwinPrincessMermaids]

Limits are there because they allow it to be scheduled in advance. If you didn't have limits, early planners would grab all the fast passes before anyone else could.

Limits are fine in the current implementation.

Dude. Already said all this (maybe on another thread). Disney has created their OWN feeding frenzy of FP demand by allowing them to be booked a month or even months in advance. No other park does that, anywhere. The only thing that comes close are booking excursions and Palo on the cruise line (and that's after you have PIF for that cruise and its only you and maybe 2000-4000 other guests.) They saw how much more people were spending when they could get excited and book out 6 months in advance, and they decided to see if they could lock people's dollars in by doing the same thing for rides. They want people to buy more days at Disney instead of going here one day and going to Universal another day, so the more FP they get, the more days at WDW they need. So they can secure more bucks in advance, and people have to buy their tix in advance in order to be able to reserve them. But because of the early reservations, they knew people would take the best ones (duh) and so now they make you choose one or the other. But it never used to be that way, and it doesn't have to be that way. This is Disney creating a ridiculous frenzy of demand way ahead of time that never used to exist.

 

[JoeA]

Accepting the premise that these wait times are "not out of the ordinary", meaning that they are pretty much what we have grown accustomed to in the past, where did the $1.5B go? Did WDW spend all that money just to keep us at the status quo? Saying that "things are no worse off than they were before, and for the most part, are pretty much the same" is faint praise for a nine figure crowd re-distribution system, no?

So now we're talking about two different things, entirely. People were saying that lines are much longer because of MM+ and I think based on your post we're at least "status quo" so the complaints are not valid.

Now we can talk about the investment in MM+ and did we benefit, vs. had the Disney Corp (not WDW) take that same money and build something "tangible" in WDW (i.e. a roller-coaster). Me personally? I want rides; however, I can easily see where this will benefit Disney on a global scale.