Just back(6/26-7/2)...a little sad

[AngiTN]

Universal manages their Express Pass lines differently. It seems to be a set percentage of Express Pass then regular line. WDW's FP lines seem to get priority or at least a much higher percentage. Stand-by can feel truly Standby at Disney...their priority is making sure FP gets on. Universal also doesn't have it on their HP rides which IMO is a smart thing. I also don't think there are as many stoppages to assist people due to the nature of their rides in general

Anyway just pointing out that the two systems are different which is why the lines may have felt different.

They do now, as of July 1

 

[AngiTN]

I'm sorry the trip didn't go as well as you thought it would have.

Sometimes you do need a break from Disney. It's easy to get burned out.

I don't hate the FastPass system but I can see how it could be frustrating when you have more than two people in your party. It's very easy to say you grabbed 5011 FastPasses when you're a party of 1 or 2. When it's a family of 6 it's a different story.

True, what you find does vary by party size but OP is 3, so shouldn't be hard to find them. I travel with a party of 2 or 3 and we find plenty. OP doesn't mention if they ever looked for additional FP during their trip or not. I wonder, if they did

But yeah, breaks are good and people grow and needs change. Sometimes absence makes you want to try it again and see it in a new light. Nothing wrong with that either. We love and enjoy Universal ourselves but could never spend a lot of time there due to so many sim rides. They all grow old after so many days. We are over them and that doesn't leave much. We can do multiple days and trips a year at Disney but half, if not less, of that at Universal.

 

[anniemae]

I think we will also take a break soon. The crowds and lines are just getting a little too crazy for us. I know Disney wants the parks/hotels filled to capacity at all times, it is great for the business side. But for guest experience, not so much. Nobody wants crowds at Disney. There are what feels like hundreds of threads daily about crowds and questions daily like, "tell me about crowds the first week of May" etc.

Fact is nobody wants to wait in line for very long and spend park time standing in line. Especially when it is a very expensive vacation. The prices keep going up, and the crowds keep coming. Again, it's great from a business standpoint. Lets face it, if you own a hotel/restaurant or anything, you WANT it full. But if you are a guest, you don't want to wait for a table, or swim in a pool that is wall to wall people.

 

[anomamatt]

Nobody wants crowds at Disney.

There will always be high crowds -- or insanely high prices ($500 a day for 1 MK ticket might do the trick).

 

[aprincessatlast]

Long story short we were disappointed.

I still love Disney and will plan to get our Disney fix on Disney cruises in the future. Our week on the Fantasy in 2015 ranks up there as one of our best vacations ever. But putting theme parks on hold for now.

Completely understand, it is nice to be able to come back and voice your frustrations and be heard. We too love DCL and the parks just do not come close. We discovered them when we noticed major changes in WDW around 2010.

I will say though after just getting back from DL Paris I was so wishing they had magic bands. Waits in the 90-140 minute range for the big rides and the small rides were 60 minutes. They only had FP for a few rides and half the time they were down. It would have been nice to have 3 rides and then choose a few small ones so we could soak up the parks instead of standing in line the whole time. They also use paper for everything, even for your meal plan. So you have to bring a pack of vouchers with you everywhere. A beautiful park though, for sure!

I think too you have to think about the amount of increase with attendance. I think WDW is a lot more popular than we we used to go every year pre 2010, so changes were inevitable.

 

[ArwenMarie]

I remember hearing on a DIS Unplugged podcast that the FP/SB ratio is 10:1 for the busier times and attractions. Apparently the merge point is the post from heck for cast members.

Oh wow that high. Makes sense though, they have to get the FP people on

 

[AngiTN]

Fact is nobody wants to wait in line for very long and spend park time standing in line. Especially when it is a very expensive vacation. The prices keep going up, and the crowds keep coming. Again, it's great from a business standpoint. Lets face it, if you own a hotel/restaurant or anything, you WANT it full. But if you are a guest, you don't want to wait for a table, or swim in a pool that is wall to wall people.

True but it's a Catch 22. Without crowds there is no money to build new things and without new things guests complain there is nothing new to go see. It's a fine line to walk to have enough visitors to build new things and keep crowds manageable. It's not hard to argue things are veering over to the too crowded side BUT if you read reports for this summer, and over to last, you'll see most feel waits are more manageable than they've been. It may be teetering over the other direction a bit. Maybe. Just a little

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The current Fastpass system can be "gamed," much like the old one could. I don't purport to be an expert, but I've seen people use Fastpass to their advantage. Honestly, for all the talk about how Fastpass+ forces folks to plan in advance, I haven't found that to be true. In my experience, there are two attractions in all of Walt Disney World where Fastpass times regularly sell out far in advance: Frozen Ever After and Seven Dwarfs Mine Train. I suppose we can now add Avatar Flight of Passage to that list. To prove that point, I just checked the Touring Plans Fastpass availability page and checked for tomorrow, a busy holiday. Every attraction has Fastpass times available except for the three I've already mentioned and Na'vi River Journey.

So to say that Fastpasses are difficult to come by, I don't really buy it. You could decide right now you wanted to go to the Magic Kingdom tomorrow and book prime times for virtually everything, from Peter Pan's Flight to Space Mountain. Maybe I'm being a Disney apologist, but I don't think so.

The one thing that rarely seems to be included in people's talk about FP availability is if it was not available period for their traveling party or if it was a case of the time not desirable.

Blanket statements of "no FPs" don't seem to be of much help when actually describing the issue, at least IMO.

 

[Shanti]

But if you are a guest, you don't want to wait for a table, or swim in a pool that is wall to wall people.

We stay at Disney resorts a few times a year, including summer, and have never seen a resort pool crammed with people.

 

[brockash]

We (me and my two girls, ages 12 and 14) just got back tonight from a week in Orlando. We did 2 days at Disney (Epcot Monday, MK Tuesday) Disney Springs Weds then spent 3 days at Universal. Honestly we went this time for the HP Universal stuff but we wanted to do Disney too. I will preface my thought by saying that the last time we were at Disney was Thanksgiving week 2013. This was in the middle of the paper FP/FP+ switch. We were offsite (timeshare) and basically locked out of FP that week bc onsite guests could book FP+ and we could not and the paper FP were very limited. Before that point we were yearly WDW visitors since my girls were tiny. I was one who planned everything using crowd calendars, booked dining, knew how the FP system worked and we got pretty used to riding everything we wanted multiple times a day with the combination of rope drop and FPs. I went into a Thanksgiving trip fully prepared--except for the lack of FPs. It was a transition time and we understood but it felt like every day by noon our choice was to wait over an hour for everything (I had never seen Nemo and Small World with hour waits before!) or just give up and find other nonpark things to do. We did voice our concerns and Disney was nice enough to grant us 2 day tickets for a future visit. I watched the FP+ process unfold for a long while and was never convinced but decided when we were going to Universal for my HP obsessed 12 yo that we would give Disney another try.

Long story short we were disappointed.

For us Disney has lost its magic. I am not complaining really, just sad. I can't see paying $100/day to be guaranteed to ride 3 things with less than an hour wait. I found it difficult to predict what we would want to ride when 2 days in advance--can't imagine figuring it out months in advance. I can't stand waiting in lines that just don't move for no reason. In 3 days at Universal we waited longer than 30 min once--and did not have express pass of any sort. We rode all the HP rides repeatedly with less than 30 min waits. The lines there never stop for 10-15 min at a time. We rode Test Track twice back to back at rope drop. First time took 20 min. Second time after FP returns started it took an hour--same length line in a really low crowd situation(seriously Epcot was so empty--yet Frozen had 90 min waits). Similar experience at MK--more crowded but combination of wait times and weather caused us to get to ride exactly 4 rides (major storm, not Disneys fault--but still 4 rides before noon (bc 7DMT took 90 min at park opening) when we used to be able to do all of Fantasyland before noon). I think Disney could do a much better job of line management than they do. It seems like they are intentionally increasing wait times by holding the standby line. I can't imagine why a continuously moving ride like Ariel or Nemo should ever have a line that stops (other than briefly to load those that need more time) even with FP. It's totally me but standing in lines like that make me angry and then it ceases to be fun. I fully admit we were spoiled in the past and we choose not to aceept and go with this new reality. I am truly grateful we had those years when my kids were little. I still love Disney and will plan to get our Disney fix on Disney cruises in the future. Our week on the Fantasy in 2015 ranks up there as one of our best vacations ever. But putting theme parks on hold for now.

We agree that it's definitely not what it used to be. We used to enjoy doing main attractions at rope drop and then only waiting 10 mins. or so for more "filler" rides and those days just don't happen anymore and it really does take away from the enjoyment.

 

[scjo68]

We were there the week before OP. There were large crowds and I can certainly see how it is not for everyone. So if OP feels like they need a break from WDW it's probably a good idea.

However that week we were able to get plenty of FP the same day, and we are a family of 4. We rode FOP once with a FP but on a different day we rode it by getting there at 7:00 am, so there are strategies if you don't have a FP.

Several times we were using our FP for things and the FP line was backed up for whatever reason. At that point they were clearly stating to standby guests that they were going to experience a longer wait. They let the FP line go through and held standby until the FP line was shorter. That could account for lines that don't move. But if people have FP wouldn't it make sense to give them priority? Op liked the old paper FP and the FP priority policy was the same then right? The only difference is advance planning.

One example this trip is when we rode Kali. We had FPs and the FP line was stretched very long out of the entrance. The sb line was not visible from outside and much of the standby line was empty. The posted wait time was high- longer than I would have waited. So we were in the long FP line, moving slowly, and stand by guests were walking through their line briskly. Laughing..."glad we don't have a fast pass!....I think they posted the time wrong! Fast pass is slowing them down! Ha ha!" Well, they were letting FP in and holding the standby line which was long once they got inside to the switchbacks. They stopped laughing.

At the time, FP were still available for Kali. Everyone is allowed 3 FP, included in park ticket. An accurate long wait time was posted for standby. It makes sense to me that they should let FP through to give them priority over stand by. The folks in stand by made a choice to either use their 3 FP for other attractions or refused to participate in FP. Either way it was their choice.

There were attractions with long sb times posted that we did not have FP for. We chose not to get in line at the time. I either made a plan to return when I knew sb would be short or I made a FP for later if possible. Either way- in one week we rode everything we wanted to ride, often multiple times, without waiting longer than 20 minutes at most.

When I go to parks where the only way to get a queue pass is to pay for that, then I really feel frustrated. Other than rope drop, there is no way to avoid lines, and they can be very long. So I would be very sad if Disney returned to no FPs at all.

 

[stobaugh6]

We went to WDW late April 2015. That was our first experience with fastpass+. We were use to the old fastpass system and the new fastpass system was unfamiliar. We left that trip not loving the new system. We've been back twice since then and have figured out how to make it work effectively. I love the new system now! I think it just takes a bit to figure out if you are use to the old system.

 

[Roxyfire]

For us Disney has lost its magic. I am not complaining really, just sad. I can't see paying $100/day to be guaranteed to ride 3 things with less than an hour wait. I found it difficult to predict what we would want to ride when 2 days in advance--can't imagine figuring it out months in advance. I can't stand waiting in lines that just don't move for no reason.

So this point sticks with me. There are many people out there who just don't know what they want to do on a given day. At WDW (rather than Disneyland) they will be totally behind the curve. Especially if they have never been or haven't been in a while. Some people don't know what they'll be having for dinner tonight, others have that planned out for the month. One is not better than the other but it is a big point of difference. To take full advantage of the whole FP+ thing, you really need to decide on those in advance at some point. I think can cause some people to overthink and get analysis paralysis with all the choices. Adding in multiple children with different likes and dislikes doesn't make it any easier.

If you do decide to return, and with that experience of waiting in line a lot I can see you not wanting to. But if you do, consider getting together with your girls and saying "hey what do we all want to ride together?" Forget the optimization and crowd calendar stuff. Pick one day for each park, pick 3 fastpasses you all agree with. Then, if you travel in the summer, either arrive early or stay late in order to experience other things. After you do that just go with the flow. I think as long as you either get there early or stay late, you can reduce your wait times quite a bit. It won't really be walk on but a 20-30 minute wait is ok for most rides, in my opinion.

So we were in the long FP line, moving slowly, and stand by guests were walking through their line briskly. Laughing..."glad we don't have a fast pass!....I think they posted the time wrong! Fast pass is slowing them down! Ha ha!" Well, they were letting FP in and holding the standby line which was long once they got inside to the switchbacks. They stopped laughing.

This happened a few times to us too. Notably on space mountain. People cause delays at the tap points because they think they have a FP or just want to go in that line without one. We did have a problem with an anytime FP that just didn't work. It was later in the evneing and I didn't want to argue with the guy so we stood to the side while I pulled it up on my phone. Most people will just stay there and block the whole line until they get their way.

 

[anniemae]

We stay at Disney resorts a few times a year, including summer, and have never seen a resort pool crammed with people.

I was not referring to Disney. I was just saying if you own ANYTHING i.e. a hotel, a restaurant, a go-kart business, whatever, you want it to be packed all the time. people=money. No people=no money. Just saying it is fantastic to see wall to wall people in your establishment if you own the establishment. Not so much if you are visiting. Nobody who visits Disney wants crowds.

And fwiw, we have been in a Disney pool that was crammed with people. So much so that you could not really swim without bumping into people, getting hit in the head with a foam football, or kicked in the side by someone swimming. No place to sit because all the seating is either used, or being "held" with bags/cups/flip flops etc. We even saw people argue because one desperate family moved some towels off a chair and onto a table so they could sit for a minute. Yeah, I have seen the pools extremely crowded and crammed at Disney.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I rarely wait for more than 30 minutes for anything at a Disney park and that is the week before Christmas. Going at rope drop, I can get in 10 rides in 2 hours at MK.

This is our experience as well, whether we've gone in Jan or Aug.

We do RD, maximize FP use, don't mind planning ahead, and know WDW rides REALLY WELL to help plan when to hit what rides.

 

[Disney_and_Wine]

To take full advantage of the whole FP+ thing, you really need to decide on those in advance at some point.

Agree. And I think you could swap out the word FP+ and substitute in almost anything worthwhile that is travel related and get the same result. We recently returned from a cruise to the Greek Islands. If you didn't plan your daily activities ahead of time, you would have been shut out or left with undesirable choices. We booked private tours at every port stop and did so well in advance. People who did not plan in advance boarded the ship only to find out that most of the ship's large-group excursions were sold out and that private tour guides were fully booked as well. There was simply no advantage to traveling without a plan. The same can be said for restaurant reservations in destination locations. If you want to dine at an iconic restaurant in a popular location, you simply cannot count on walking up to the podium that evening and getting a table. Even museums, historic sites, national parks, and national monuments book well in advance. In Florence, if you want to see "David", you either book your time in advance online or you wait in a line that is hours long. Same is true for the National Museum of African-American History and Culture in DC. It's just the way things are today. Is it a shame that an amusement park requires the same degree of preplanning? I suppose. But it is a fact and we must adjust or learn to be disappointed.

 

[KimBean]

We (me and my two girls, ages 12 and 14) just got back tonight from a week in Orlando. We did 2 days at Disney (Epcot Monday, MK Tuesday) Disney Springs Weds then spent 3 days at Universal. Honestly we went this time for the HP Universal stuff but we wanted to do Disney too. I will preface my thought by saying that the last time we were at Disney was Thanksgiving week 2013. This was in the middle of the paper FP/FP+ switch. We were offsite (timeshare) and basically locked out of FP that week bc onsite guests could book FP+ and we could not and the paper FP were very limited. Before that point we were yearly WDW visitors since my girls were tiny. I was one who planned everything using crowd calendars, booked dining, knew how the FP system worked and we got pretty used to riding everything we wanted multiple times a day with the combination of rope drop and FPs. I went into a Thanksgiving trip fully prepared--except for the lack of FPs. It was a transition time and we understood but it felt like every day by noon our choice was to wait over an hour for everything (I had never seen Nemo and Small World with hour waits before!) or just give up and find other nonpark things to do. We did voice our concerns and Disney was nice enough to grant us 2 day tickets for a future visit. I watched the FP+ process unfold for a long while and was never convinced but decided when we were going to Universal for my HP obsessed 12 yo that we would give Disney another try.

Long story short we were disappointed.

For us Disney has lost its magic. I am not complaining really, just sad. I can't see paying $100/day to be guaranteed to ride 3 things with less than an hour wait. I found it difficult to predict what we would want to ride when 2 days in advance--can't imagine figuring it out months in advance. I can't stand waiting in lines that just don't move for no reason. In 3 days at Universal we waited longer than 30 min once--and did not have express pass of any sort. We rode all the HP rides repeatedly with less than 30 min waits. The lines there never stop for 10-15 min at a time. We rode Test Track twice back to back at rope drop. First time took 20 min. Second time after FP returns started it took an hour--same length line in a really low crowd situation(seriously Epcot was so empty--yet Frozen had 90 min waits). Similar experience at MK--more crowded but combination of wait times and weather caused us to get to ride exactly 4 rides (major storm, not Disneys fault--but still 4 rides before noon (bc 7DMT took 90 min at park opening) when we used to be able to do all of Fantasyland before noon). I think Disney could do a much better job of line management than they do. It seems like they are intentionally increasing wait times by holding the standby line. I can't imagine why a continuously moving ride like Ariel or Nemo should ever have a line that stops (other than briefly to load those that need more time) even with FP. It's totally me but standing in lines like that make me angry and then it ceases to be fun. I fully admit we were spoiled in the past and we choose not to aceept and go with this new reality. I am truly grateful we had those years when my kids were little. I still love Disney and will plan to get our Disney fix on Disney cruises in the future. Our week on the Fantasy in 2015 ranks up there as one of our best vacations ever. But putting theme parks on hold for now.

I'm sorry for what you experienced but really surprised. I've been looking at wait times this week and they haven't been bad. I've been hearing that June is the new November and November is really busy. I get there Nov 27th. Bahahaha!!! I think some of us who had the luxury (or like me made it happen) of going during the recession and the struggling years after are just in for shock now.

 

[Davey Jones II]

If certain CMs do a lousy job of managing the FP line versus the standby, I would lodge a complaint about them, either during or after the trip. If they really are doing a lousy job and favoring one line too much over another, Disney could correct that. Or if Disney's policies need correction, maybe that will happen if enough people complain.

 

[SimonSez]

I know it doesn't help now, but with FP+ you absolutely can ride 10+ rides a day without ever waiting in the standby line. Even on a day like Christmas, there are FPs waiting to be used. It just takes some time to learn the kinks, and I'd suggest reading the FP+ FAQ top to bottom.



Well, they are certainly not intentionally slowing down the lines... WDW is very busy, always is. That makes fully understanding the FP system all the more important.

Have they improved FP+ since 2014, because the most we ever got was 4 a day on our last trip. Not doubting this at all, just want to know the strategy, if there is one, behind getting that many FPs I will also say that we probably (definitely didn't) utilize our FP+ to their maximum capacity on our last trip. We also had a family member, who lives in Orlando, touring the parks with us so we had to change our strategy a little bit--don't ask why story for another day Okay edited to add that I actually read and didn't skim anomamatt's post and I saw where he/she mentioned the FAQ's on FP+. Guess it pays to actually read and comprehend things, but you know...lazy

 

[Davey Jones II]

We were there the week before OP. There were large crowds and I can certainly see how it is not for everyone. So if OP feels like they need a break from WDW it's probably a good idea.

However that week we were able to get plenty of FP the same day, and we are a family of 4. We rode FOP once with a FP but on a different day we rode it by getting there at 7:00 am, so there are strategies if you don't have a FP.

Several times we were using our FP for things and the FP line was backed up for whatever reason. At that point they were clearly stating to standby guests that they were going to experience a longer wait. They let the FP line go through and held standby until the FP line was shorter. That could account for lines that don't move. But if people have FP wouldn't it make sense to give them priority? Op liked the old paper FP and the FP priority policy was the same then right? The only difference is advance planning.

One example this trip is when we rode Kali. We had FPs and the FP line was stretched very long out of the entrance. The sb line was not visible from outside and much of the standby line was empty. The posted wait time was high- longer than I would have waited. So we were in the long FP line, moving slowly, and stand by guests were walking through their line briskly. Laughing..."glad we don't have a fast pass!....I think they posted the time wrong! Fast pass is slowing them down! Ha ha!" Well, they were letting FP in and holding the standby line which was long once they got inside to the switchbacks. They stopped laughing.

At the time, FP were still available for Kali. Everyone is allowed 3 FP, included in park ticket. An accurate long wait time was posted for standby. It makes sense to me that they should let FP through to give them priority over stand by. The folks in stand by made a choice to either use their 3 FP for other attractions or refused to participate in FP. Either way it was their choice.

There were attractions with long sb times posted that we did not have FP for. We chose not to get in line at the time. I either made a plan to return when I knew sb would be short or I made a FP for later if possible. Either way- in one week we rode everything we wanted to ride, often multiple times, without waiting longer than 20 minutes at most.

When I go to parks where the only way to get a queue pass is to pay for that, then I really feel frustrated. Other than rope drop, there is no way to avoid lines, and they can be very long. So I would be very sad if Disney returned to no FPs at all.

In reference to the bolded above -- can you provide some examples? How and when do you know that the SB will be short?