Josh is the voice of reason on FP+

[john398]

A couple of things.


This is basically dead.

It's true that I do move faster than your average family. But I also meander a lot, take a lot of pictures, change lenses, pose for pix with my adoring fanz etc.

For example:


etc. etc.

But have you looked at Epcot? 70 minutes for test track and for Soarin

 

[dsw13]

That could very well be a problem. But I also think it's a problem with the current system regardless. By not having a first come/first serve "live" (paper) system you basically set up the system to waste if people don't show up.

Does anyone know if they 'overbook' time slots like airlines do seats under the assumption that some % of people will not show up? Granted there was waste in the paper system but there were also several times I remember handing my paper FP ticket to someone about to get in the standby line just because I couldn't use it. Talk about making people happy... can't do that anymore though.

I think FP+ makes it less likely that FPs go to waste because of the ability to change on the fly if you can't make it on time and because the three FP limit makes each one more valuable. Thus, if you are unable to make the return window, you're more likely to change to something else so that a third of your FPs don't go to waste (presuming you're still in the same park, although that was the case with the old system as well).

We were at MK this past Saturday and had FP+s for Peter Pan for between 5:00 and 6:00. I have two small children so we needed an afternoon break. When planning, I thought we'd be able to easily make it back to the park and to the FP return by 6:00, but we wound up starting the break later in the day than I anticipated. Back at the hotel, I tried changing to a later time without much success. But after checking one or two more times (over the course of an hour or so), a slot starting at 8:30 opened up (my kids are not interested in the nighttime parade). Because the afternoon nap was later, this time worked out for us (small children and all). Under the old system, we would have lost the FPs. Also, getting the later FPs made us very happy (although the person who changed their slot to open up one for us didn't get the joy of seeing our happiness).

ETA: And by changing out of our 5-6 slot, a new FP slot opened up for another family of four.

 

[magicbob]

Why is it that people here just have to jump on every positive thread and insist on telling people why they are wrong. Everyone travels differently, and what works for one family, wont work for another, that doesn't make them wrong.

For the record, I have NEVER told anyone they are wrong...


... just that I am right.

 

[skater]

Wow. This thread grew faster than my 8 year old.

I like Josh's writing style, I like his wit, I like his logical approach to WDW.

I like Josh. Heck, you can even find a picture of me in his blog if you look back far enough.

But my takeaway from his blog is he has confirmed what people on these forums have already been saying:

1. Get to the parks early
2. Save your FP's for the afternoon or evening

His pictures are proof that even on busy days you'll (only?) have a couple of good hours before the waits are long.

Hopefully in the future that will still be the case (and is essentially the subject of many debates on these boards).

Josh will no doubt keep posting his reports and provide plenty of pictures. We can also count on him to highlight both the positives and the negatives in a balanced manner.

This is all true (and a great re-cap). And for me, it will work. I'm just glad that when my kids were younger (and it was all about how much could we squeeze into our day), that we had a system that allowed us to do more. Josh is great, but he can go often. When I took my family to Disney once a year, it was important for us to be able to do more. If we could only ride Soarin' once, that might be it for a year. If Josh can only ride Soarin' once, he can come back next week for another go.

 

[notfrostyjosh]

But have you looked at Epcot? 70 minutes for test track and for Soarin

Yeah bro it is Epcot. They have two rides. Book one FP+ and do the other first thing in the morning or last thing at night. Or Soarin' with FP+ and Test Track single rider.

 

[JanaDee]

A couple of things.

This is not an EMH morning. It's the Saturday of Martin Luther King Jr. weekend and by attendance, one of the 25 busiest days of the year. In the afternoon, they are only about 6,000 people away from discussing the possibility of a phased closure. That's still about 15,000 people away from actually needing a phased closure, but a phased closure is rarely a concern. I purposefully waited until a busy, non-recommended Saturday to show how much you can expect to accomplish first thing in the morning, even when the afternoon is "insane." I'm sure there will be plenty of "NEVER AGAIN IN JANUARY" threads incoming, but this is one of the least busy four week periods of the year at the Parks.

If this was today (the 22nd, a most recommended day on easywdw, overall crowd level '4,' highest crowd level of the day on touringplans) touring would be even easier and we would see much shorter afternoon waits. This is what we're talking about:

This is basically dead.

It's true that I do move faster than your average family. But I also meander a lot, take a lot of pictures, change lenses, pose for pix with my adoring fanz etc.

For example:

Larger: http://imgur.com/ohmyDd1

Each pic with red text is a stop.

And while I might move faster than your average family of eight, the cheat sheet timing is more conservative. Even families with 2 year olds, grandpa, and a "stop and strike a pose for the scrapbook" aunt should be able to complete each step within the time allotted. I'm ahead of the timing as I point out, but a couple minutes here and there for strollers etc. isn't going to throw you off too far. and it's already factored into the timing. Because I'm a little quicker personally, I end up about 30 minutes ahead of schedule. But also, on my particular touring day, I take 25 minutes in between Haunted Mansion and Pirates of the Caribbean and both Pirates and Jungle Cruise are still walk-ons.

If you showed up at 11am at Magic Kingdom on this particular day, you'd be pretty screwed whether we're talking about FASTPASS or FP+. FASTPASS return times for Peter Pan would be out to 3pm or 4pm, Space Mountain would have a 100 minute wait and FASTPASS out to 6pm etc. If Jr. wanted to re-ride Big Thunder Mountain at 1pm, you would initially wait 75 minutes or have had to pull a legacy FASTPASS by 11:30am. Then you'd have to wait 100 minutes in line or pull a legacy FASTPASS for a return time of 3pm.

etc. etc.

Thanks for the clarification Josh.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Based on your later posts, I would say you were not accurate in that statement....

Because I do enjoy rides, that means I don't also understand that there's more to WDW than rides? The two are not mutually exclusive.

Why is it that people here just have to jump on every positive thread and insist on telling people why they are wrong. Everyone travels differently, and what works for one family, wont work for another, that doesn't make them wrong.

I didn't tell anyone here they were wrong...though you did actually say directly to me that my own statement about what I enjoy about the parks was wrong.

And I sincerely thanked the person who helped me see that some things I didn't think would be possible in busy season may still be possible. Not everything that poster wrote would work for our family, but it helped me see something a different way...much differently than being told to go visit universal if I don't like FP+

 

[JanaDee]

Everyone travels differently, and what works for one family, wont work for another, that doesn't make them wrong.

Oh irony, thy name is yours.

 

[jade1]

Wow. This thread grew faster than my 8 year old.

I like Josh's writing style, I like his wit, I like his logical approach to WDW.

I like Josh. Heck, you can even find a picture of me in his blog if you look back far enough.

But my takeaway from his blog is he has confirmed what people on these forums have already been saying:

1. Get to the parks early
2. Save your FP's for the afternoon or evening

His pictures are proof that even on busy days you'll (only?) have a couple of good hours before the waits are long.

Hopefully in the future that will still be the case (and is essentially the subject of many debates on these boards).

Josh will no doubt keep posting his reports and provide plenty of pictures. We can also count on him to highlight both the positives and the negatives in a balanced manner.

Agreed, proof that even busy days you can knock out many attractions (if that's what you desire) first thing, non busy days should be even better.

 

[john398]

Yeah bro it is Epcot. They have two rides. Book one FP+ and do the other first thing in the morning or last thing at night. Or Soarin' with FP+ and Test Track single rider.

ok got it, but they have lots more than 2 rides that I like...

 

[Lindaland]

For the record, I have NEVER told anyone they are wrong... ... just that I am right.

Hahahahaha!!

 

[Bullseye]

My 2 cents is, yes, a WDW vacation is expensive but I spend that money for a Disney experience. Rides, shows, food, magical surroundings and awesome accommodations on site that also provide me with free transportation all over property. I have three children, all princesses who, while they love to ride, also realize that there is a ton more to do. They also realize that waiting in line is part of life. Sometimes getting to bypass a large line is an option but you will always have to wait sooner or later. We leave Monday for a seven night stay and I'm not the least bit apprehensive or negative because WE WILL BE IN DISNEY. Where it's way warmer than home and there is so much fun to be had. My feeling is, if you have kids who like to re-ride, drag your butt out of bed, be prepared the night before and get to RD. You can accomplish more rides that way and I don't think having kids slows you down all that much. Josh's site is where I go at least once a day because he is accurate, helpful and FREE! I just don't get all the whining about having to wait in a line.

Nice! So many good posts in this thread, but yours does a good summing up my feelings as well.

The more pressing question for Disney isn't you (general you) maximizing your ride count or keeping it where it was last trip. I think they are looking at the average attraction count of all guests and trying to push the extremes into the fat middle. I would wager your experience that day was on the high end of the ride count while some other people are on the low end. If your ride count goes down and theirs goes up Disney has succeeded at their goals. The people already in the fat middle will very likely not be affected and the fat middle, by definition, is the majority.

This is what many opponents of FP+ don't get. FP didn't work for everyone! I keep seeing opponents of FP+ saying they don't give a crap about anyone else vacation except theirs, we'll Disney does does...because they are in the "vacation" business. They want to spread the goods more equitably. They took it away because it wasn't working for the majority of guests.

 

[magicbob]

Hahahahaha!!

And I've never said "I told you so" either.

 

[donnajherren]

If you're that concerned about money and how much "value" you are getting out of your vacation. WDW is the last place you should go.

I have to point out that these two things are not the same. My husband and I planned our first family WDW vacation so we could live kind of high on the hog--Deluxe resort, 3 TS dining plan, etc--mostly because we would have been really mad at ourselves if we had lowered our own enjoyment because of budget constraints. We figured we could always back off on things that didn't add to our good time--as, it turned out, the overstuffed dining plan did not. But we really enjoyed the Beach Club and its proximity to Epcot (because I looooove the World Showcase! ), and stayed there again on our next trip.

My point being that we weren't "concerned about money", but we approached the whole thing very much with an eye toward value. And I think that's where most disagreements over the FP+ thing are happening, because people value different things.

That said, I've seen a few variations on the whole "Disney isn't a great value, get over it" theme, and it's mind-boggling to me. Where else in a consumer society would this sort of thing be lauded, even trumpeted by fans? It's not cheap, agreed, but I've found it to be a very satisfying way to spend my money in the past.

(Disclaimer: we have a trip planned for June, but I think I'm going to push it to October. By then, the errant technical glitches should be cleared up, and we should know whether they're going to make any changes to the FP+ system.)

(Second disclaimer: I really hope they do add some sort of options for purchasing extra FPs. Yes, I'm one of those horrible people who would pay for it. Because I would find value in it. )

 

[momof2n2]

It is more than rides, I agree. I'm not a huge ride person myself...if I ride maybe 4 or 5 rides in a day (including the bottom tier rides lol). Throw in a show or a parade, I'm good.

But I do think there it's reasonable that people expect a certain amount of rides for the prices that Disney charges for their tickets.

I'm not a huge ride person, but my kids are. They don't people watch or linger over dessert. They want the repeats and we are not alone in this.

 

[MsMagical]

I've been looking for this voice of reason for a while now. We're planning our 2nd trip since September and, while maybe not a pro yet, I'm also not an amateur either and I had already figured this out for the most part. It's fairly simple I think. I'm not usually a "morning person" but I will be in order to get what I want out of my experiences.

It seems to me that gaming the system just became harder and that must be frustrating to some. I'm not judging here. If you figured out how to game the system, good for you. If you are lazy like me and never cared to game the system, this new system just isn't that big of an impact. But, even during the busiest times (like the day that Josh blogged about), mornings are really reasonable when it comes to attraction availability. Honestly, if your kid wants to ride Barnstormer 3 times in a row, there is nothing stopping you from letting that happen.

Yes, fp+ presents new challenges timing wise and, of course, Epcot is just kind of hilarious to plan out but it isn't impossible to enjoy ourselves.

I guess my perspective is that I know so many people struggling right now just to survive. These people will never go to WDW, much less ride Space Mountain twice. And believe me, they work just as hard as anyone else does. If my biggest worry is that I can't ride my favorite attraction more than once or twice in my trip, then I'm probably doing all right. This blog told me exactly what I needed to hear: We can do this.

 

[Sparkly]

EasyWDW is a breath of fresh air after spending 20 minutes on this forum alone.

 

[skater]

I've been looking for this voice of reason for a while now. We're planning our 2nd trip since September and, while maybe not a pro yet, I'm also not an amateur either and I had already figured this out for the most part. It's fairly simple I think. I'm not usually a "morning person" but I will be in order to get what I want out of my experiences.

It seems to me that gaming the system just became harder and that must be frustrating to some. I'm not judging here. If you figured out how to game the system, good for you. If you are lazy like me and never cared to game the system, this new system just isn't that big of an impact. But, even during the busiest times (like the day that Josh blogged about), mornings are really reasonable when it comes to attraction availability. Honestly, if your kid wants to ride Barnstormer 3 times in a row, there is nothing stopping you from letting that happen.

Yes, fp+ presents new challenges timing wise and, of course, Epcot is just kind of hilarious to plan out but it isn't impossible to enjoy ourselves.

I guess my perspective is that I know so many people struggling right now just to survive. These people will never go to WDW, much less ride Space Mountain twice. And believe me, they work just as hard as anyone else does. If my biggest worry is that I can't ride my favorite attraction more than once or twice in my trip, then I'm probably doing all right. This blog told me exactly what I needed to hear: We can do this.

Game the system?

 

[KatieCharlotte]

This is what many opponents of FP+ don't get. FP didn't work for everyone! I keep seeing opponents of FP+ saying they don't give a crap about anyone else vacation except theirs, we'll Disney does does...because they are in the "vacation" business. They want to spread the goods more equitably. They took it away because it wasn't working for the majority of guests.

I do care about other people's vacations. I am staying onsite and I am disappointed by the different treatment of offsite guests, especially the vast majority who had no idea legacy FP was disappearing. I get to visit every couple years and often spend a week, but I upset on behalf of those who can only have a once or twice in a lifetime day at Magic Kingdom and want to pack in as much magic as possible. My kids care much more about Haunted Mansion than the mountains, but I'm upset on behalf of those who loved riding them over and over with fastpass. I have never used a FP for Test Track (rode at RD and used rider switch) or RnRc (we're not big coaster riders), but I still think the tiers stink.

I honestly don't believe that Disney was motivated by a desire to be more equitable or because FP wasn't working for most guests, but none of us have the inside info to know.

 

[MsMagical]

Game the system?

By that, I mean beating the system but by being smart about it and figuring out how the system works and how you can use it in the most efficient way for whatever you value. Not by cheating but by working within the system or winning the "game" that is the system. I'm not putting any negative connotation on it. Does that make sense?