JonBenet Ramsey - a question for those who follow this story

[Sandy Cross]

Kids can be very smart when they don't want to get in trouble.

Kids also can be very smart about when their sibling is lying to them, particularly if said sibling presumably violently attacked them with a golf club.

You do know you lose ground every time you keep moving the line? Not an effective means of convincing anybody anything you say is credible in the least.

Your misunderstanding what I am saying. I'm not insinuating that Burke took that golf club and attacked Jon Benet. I'm saying she could have been running around paying and right when she ran near he swung the club pretending to not know she was there just my opinion no facts just how it might have happened.

 

[Sandy Cross]

When you say, my opinion is Burke did it, my opinion is the parents made the garrote and strangled her to cover up for Burke -- those are accusations.

No they are opinions. If I said Burke did it or Patsy and John did it that's an accusation.

 

[msjprincess]

I think Sasquatch did it. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

 

[cabanafrau]

Your misunderstanding what I am saying. I'm not insinuating that Burke took that golf club and attacked Jon Benet. I'm saying she could have been running around paying and right when she ran near he swung the club pretending to not know she was there just my opinion no facts just how it might have happened.

Just in case you ever get called in as a potential juror, I think I'll offer up this criminal jury instruction which will be given to you by the court, but I don't think can be overemphasized enough.

Reasonable doubt is just that, a reasonable doubt arising out of the evidence or lack of evidence. It is NOT simply a possible or imaginary doubt.

ETA, it's a shame Burke never strongly pursued athletics. Given your speculation he must have lightning quick reflexes and incredible peripheral vision.

 

[Sandy Cross]

Don't muddy things up with facts.

No one know if it was an accident or not but Burke.

 

[RitaE]

Your misunderstanding what I am saying. I'm not insinuating that Burke took that golf club and attacked Jon Benet. I'm saying she could have been running around paying and right when she ran near he swung the club pretending to not know she was there just my opinion no facts just how it might have happened.

Okay. But that's awfully pre-meditated and frankly, pretty good athletic hand-eye control and athletic for a young grade school kid.

 

[Sandy Cross]

Just in case you ever get called in as a potential juror, I think I'll offer up this criminal jury instruction which will be given to you by the court, but I don't think can be overemphasized enough.

Reasonable doubt is just that, a reasonable doubt arising out of the evidence or lack of evidence. It is NOT simply a possible or imaginary doubt.

ETA, it's a shame Burke never strongly pursued athletics. Given your speculation he must have lightning quick reflexes and incredible peripheral vision.

Because a six year old is lightening fast and so quiet at play that you can't tell when she is close.

 

[nugov2]

That does make sense and I can see that could be a problem but John and Patsy had all night to coach him on what to do and say and maybe told Burke he would be taken away from them and sent to jail if he told anyone. If during that morning someone offered to take him out of the house and care for him and the Ramsey's said no they wanted him there that would look suspicious as if they were hiding something just my opinion no facts.

They couldn't have had more than an hour or so to coach him. Patsy had to put on her makeup and write a three page ransom note while watching movies to get quotes (because lets be real who remembers quotes from movies when their beloved child has just been killed by their other child). JR had to construct the garrote and strangle his daughter, run to the gas station and get just one persons dna sample. All of this occured in 7 hours if JBR was killed at 10. This timeline gives them no time to grieve, freak out and take time to plan this decision. At best they had 1 hour to coach him while successfully carrying out the other tasks they had to accomplish to stage the crime scene. How all of that plus the type of coaching required to convince a 9 year old to stay quiet all done in 7 hours...that so unlikely to have occured I have to agree with the alien theory a pp suggested. I mean we weren't there so we don't know aliens didn't help carry out the plan. Maybe JR is tight with aliens and they helped him out.

 

[cabanafrau]

Because a six year old is lightening fast and so quiet at play that you can't tell when she is close.

Oops, you misjudged where you moved the line here. That implies accident on the part of Burke.

 

[Sandy Cross]

Because a six year old is lightening fast and so quiet at play that you can't tell when she is close.

Reasonable doubt is a broad concept what might be reasonable for you might not be so reasonable for someone else.

 

[msjprincess]

Because a six year old is lightening fast and so quiet at play that you can't tell when she is close.

Oh, so you do believe it was an accident. I thought you were implying he did it on purpose. My bad.

 

[LisaR]

That does make sense and I can see that could be a problem but John and Patsy had all night to coach him on what to do and say and maybe told Burke he would be taken away from them and sent to jail if he told anyone. If during that morning someone offered to take him out of the house and care for him and the Ramsey's said no they wanted him there that would look suspicious as if they were hiding something just my opinion no facts.

No, No, No! You can't have it both ways.
Either Burke was an out of control 9 y/o who murdered his sister or he was a typical 9 y/o boy. Which is it? If Burke could be coached in that short period of time to "do the right thing," don't you think John and Patsy would have coached him before and prevented this to begin with? "Hey, don't forget, let's keep this to ourselves, okay?" isn't going to work on a child with serious impulse control issues. I'm thinking they might have mentioned a few times in the past that he shouldn't hit, smother, or otherwise abuse his sister. How'd that work out? Now you think they can just tell him a couple times not to tell anyone what happened, all the while running around like crazy people trying to cover up the murder of their daughter that was committed by their son, and Burke, an out of control murderer would finally get it? You don't get to make Burke out to be a monster who is out of control when it is convenient, but turn him back into a typical 9 y/o when you need him to be "normal" to fit your narrative.

 

[Sandy Cross]

They couldn't have had more than an hour or so to coach him. Patsy had to put on her makeup and write a three page ransom note while watching movies to get quotes (because lets be real who remembers quotes from movies when their beloved child has just been killed by their other child). JR had to construt the garrote and strangle his daughter, run to the gas station and get just one persons dna sample. All of this occured in 7 hours if JBR was killed at 10. This timeline gives them no time to grieve, freak out and take time to plan this decision. At best they had 1 hour to coach him while successfully carrying out the other tasks they had to accomplish to stage the crime scene. How all of that plus the type of coaching required to convince a 9 year old to stay quiet all done in 7 hours...that so unlikely to have occured I have to agree with the alien theory a pp suggested. I mean we weren't there so we don't know aliens didn't help carry out the plan. Maybe JR is tightwith aliens and they helped him out.

All your opinion and just as far fetched as an intruder stomping through their house writing notes going to the laundry room to get Jon Benet's favorite blanket and Barbie night gown and feeding her pineapple and knowing what John's bonus was and knowing the movies they had in their video collection in their bedroom and knowing what staircase to put the ransom note on since there were multiple staircases all while the family slept upstairs oh and Patsy slept in the same clothes and makeup she wore to the Christmas Party the night before. I think you might be right aliens....

 

[cabanafrau]

Reasonable doubt is a broad concept what might be reasonable for you might not be so reasonable for someone else.

In a court of law reasonable doubt is exactly what I posted above, which is the instruction that is given to a criminal jury before they are released to deliberate the facts of the case.

If you are ever called to partake as a juror, please share your reasoning in this case with the court, theprosecutor and the defense attorney during voir dire. That is exactly the type of opinion and thought processes they are looking for being informed about when they probe the panel and ask if anyone has any opinions or beliefs they feel should be shared.

ETA -- Also, keep moving that line, you're almost convincing me.

 

[msjprincess]

All your opinion and just as far fetched as an intruder stomping through their house writing notes going to the laundry room to get Jon Benet's favorite blanket and Barbie night gown and feeding her pineapple and knowing what John's bonus was and knowing the movies they had in their video collection in their bedroom and knowing what staircase to put the ransom note on since there were multiple staircases all while the family slept upstairs oh and Patsy slept in the same clothes and makeup she wore to the Christmas Party the night before. I think you might be right aliens....

Those are all your theories on why they it's not possible. You completely ignore everyone that gives a plausible explanation for all of those things.

 

[cabanafrau]

All your opinion and just as far fetched as an intruder stomping through their house writing notes going to the laundry room to get Jon Benet's favorite blanket and Barbie night gown and feeding her pineapple and knowing what John's bonus was and knowing the movies they had in their video collection in their bedroom and knowing what staircase to put the ransom note on since there were multiple staircases all while the family slept upstairs oh and Patsy slept in the same clothes and makeup she wore to the Christmas Party the night before. I think you might be right aliens....

Does the intruder have to stomp? Must the intruder be a stranger to the family?

IMO, no.

 

[Sandy Cross]

No, No, No! You can't have it both ways.
Either Burke was an out of control 9 y/o who murdered his sister or he was a typical 9 y/o boy. Which is it? If Burke could be coached in that short period of time to "do the right thing," don't you think John and Patsy would have coached him before and prevented this to begin with? "Hey, don't forget, let's keep this to ourselves, okay?" isn't going to work on a child with serious impulse control issues. I'm thinking they might have mentioned a few times in the past that he shouldn't hit, smother, or otherwise abuse his sister. How'd that work out? Now you think they can just tell him a couple times not to tell anyone what happened, all the while running around like crazy people trying to cover up the murder of their daughter that was committed by their son, and Burke, an out of control murderer would finally get it? You don't get to make Burke out to be a monster who is out of control when it is convenient, but turn him back into a typical 9 y/o when you need him to be "normal" to fit your narrative.

You see I'm not saying he meant to murder her I'm saying he hit her and she died as a result. I think if you told a child that they could be taken away and put in jail that could scare them enough to keep quiet in my opinion. I think he had anger issues and I think keeping quiet is different then not controlling a violent outburst.

 

[cabanafrau]

You see I'm not saying he meant to murder her I'm saying he hit her and she died as a result. I think if you told a child that they could be taken away and put in jail that could scare them enough to keep quiet in my opinion. I think he had anger issues and I think keeping quiet is different then not controlling a violent outburst.

Then how were they able to control his violent outbursts in the future? Or should that be, than how were they able to control his violent outbursts in the future? I'm getting confused.

 

[cabanafrau]

Those are all your theories on why they it's not possible. You completely ignore everyone that gives a plausible explanation for all of those things.

Plausible explanation is a broad concept -- and apparently a very flexible and adaptable concept depending on the theory you must support at all costs.

 

[Sandy Cross]

Those are all your theories on why they it's not possible. You completely ignore everyone that gives a plausible explanation for all of those things.

There is a plausible explanation for everything and I'm not ignoring I'm just not convinced I am still forming my opinion not saying anyone else's opinion is right or wrong and I don't consider my opinions right or wrong.