John Edwards comment...

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by theSurlyMermaid
Yeah, god forbid Cheney's daughter should actually BE a lesbian.

Oh wait.....

At least the VP isn't ashamed of his daughter. Too bad his wife is.

Elizabeth Edwards???? Is that you????

 

[Kendra17]

Originally posted by peachgirl
Are you saying that conservatives are anti-gay? They would actually vote for Kerry because the VP has a gay daughter????

Haha, no, of course I'm not saying that. I was saying that it seemed as if Kerry brought her up thinking that some Conservatives would be.

Edited to add: As you know, we're often referred to as bigots. We're also referred to as racists when we don't support affirmative action programs. You know, same old, same old.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by dmadman43
Elizabeth Edwards???? Is that you????

 

[peachgirl]

You know, same old, same old.

Yep, same old, same old......

 

[tonyswife]

I don't have an opinion about whether or not Kerry/Edwards should mention Cheney's daughter. I think it's very clear that she has a good, loving relationship with her parents and probably doesn't care what people say about her. I think Lynn Cheney's response was just motherly protectionism. I can't believe anyone would call her a bad mother with little to evidence of such. anyway...

I've seen several people out right say or imply that the Cheney's are hypocrites because they have a gay daughter yet do not support gay marriage.

Unless someone can point me to a place where I can read Cheney's daughter's position on gay marriage, I don't think anyone can call them hypocrites. Not all homosexuals have the same opinion about gay marriage.

 

[faithinkarma]

No one can possible know what the relationship between a daughter and her parents is like, nor can anyone judge it. They have dealt with it as best they can, in the spotlight, and I would certainly not call them hypocrites for not supporting gay marriage.

I do, however, have a problem with the fact that they said nothing when the republican Keyes came right out and called their daughter names, and yet did say something very publicly last night. Either something offends you or it does not....you don't get to choose the degree according to who said it ( and I think everyone would agree that what Keyes did was far worse ). To my mind this was clearly a case of Lynn Cheney making political hay, and that I would call hypocritical.

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
No one can possible know what the relationship between a daughter and her parents is like, nor can anyone judge it. They have dealt with it as best they can, in the spotlight, and I would certainly not call them hypocrites for not supporting gay marriage.

I do, however, have a problem with the fact that they said nothing when the republican Keyes came right out and called their daughter names, and yet did say something very publicly last night. Either something offends you or it does not....you don't get to choose the degree according to who said it ( and I think everyone would agree that what Keyes did was far worse ). To my mind this was clearly a case of Lynn Cheney making political hay, and that I would call hypocritical.

My guess is they would say "Alan Keyes??? is that guy still around?"

 

[JoeThaNo1Stunna]

Alan Keyes has nothing to do with this, but he also has a gay daughter.

Lynne is not ashamed of her daughter, she doesn't think the opposition should use her sexual orientation for exploitative purposes!

 

[Kendra17]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
No one can possible know what the relationship between a daughter and her parents is like, nor can anyone judge it. They have dealt with it as best they can, in the spotlight, and I would certainly not call them hypocrites for not supporting gay marriage.

I do, however, have a problem with the fact that they said nothing when the republican Keyes came right out and called their daughter names, and yet did say something very publicly last night. Either something offends you or it does not....you don't get to choose the degree according to who said it ( and I think everyone would agree that what Keyes did was far worse ). To my mind this was clearly a case of Lynn Cheney making political hay, and that I would call hypocritical.

I understand this line of thinking, but I think that 1) Alan Keyes has been marginalized anyways. Ignoring his comments was probably the best thing to do in that case. Why cause a big huge thing over some inane comment when it doesn't matter (I mean it's not like he's posting on Disboards or something!) 2) The statements Edwards and Kerry made were on national television and had a much wider audience. Also, there is a lot riding on this, obviously--they're opponents. And, when Alan Keyes said what he said he wasn't Bush and Cheney's political opponent. He was just a guy with a forum and an opinion. However, Kerry and Edwards politicized the daughter's sexuality. . .he used it to forward his own agenda or make Cheney and Bush look bad or something (not because Cheney has a gay daughter, but because Bush is against gay marriage). And, that is different then Alan Keyes or Pat Buchanan (I don'tknow if he's said anything or not--I'm just citing an example of someone who might have anti-gay views) or ANYONE, actually, saying something.

It may have been in Cheney's best interest to just let Alan Keyes' comment go. But, what Kerry and Edwards did seemed calculated, rehearsed, and was an intentionally exploitive (imo), AND a response by the Cheneys seems reasonable to me.

As a Bush supporter, I thought Kerry did really well last night FOR THE MOST PART. I really thought Bush won the debate, but I thought Kerry did well. UNTIL he said, "we're all god's children" in what seemed like a rehearsed remark. And, until he brought up the daughter. And, of course, at the end, when he couldn't think of anything wonderful to say about Teresa --especially when one compares Bush's wonderful remarks and demeanor.

So, even if the liberals DON'T find anything wrong with his comments, the fact is that MAny people DID for real reasons.

 

[AmyBeth68]

I didn't find either Kerry's or Edwards' remarks "offensive" ...but it did seem phony and calculated. I just don't think it was appropriate.

Other than that, I thought that Kerry did a very good job last night in the debate.

 

[JPN4265]

Originally posted by theSurlyMermaid
Yeah, god forbid Cheney's daughter should actually BE a lesbian.

Oh wait.....

At least the VP isn't ashamed of his daughter. Too bad his wife is.

So I guess that if its okay to bring up the fact that VP Cheney's daughter is a lesbian, then its okay to bring up, that Elizabeth Edwards is a fat sow that gets her only excercise from pushing herself away from the dinner table.

 

[peachgirl]

Elizabeth Edwards is a fat sow that gets her only excercise from pushing herself away from the dinner table.

First, why is it the only comparisons to saying publicly that Ms.Cheney is gay are negative? Do you consider being gay, bad?

Secondly, if the Kerry campaign used Elizabeth Edwards' weight for political gain, then it would be fair for the right to bring the subject up as well.

Of course, I don't think it would be fair to use ther term "fat sow" any more than it would be to use insulting words that can be used for being gay either.

 

[JPN4265]

Originally posted by peachgirl
First, why is it the only comparisons to saying publicly that Ms.Cheney is gay are negative? Do you consider being gay, bad?

Secondly, if the Kerry campaign used Elizabeth Edwards' weight for political gain, then it would be fair for the right to bring the subject up as well.

Of course, I don't think it would be fair to use ther term "fat sow" any more than it would be to use insulting words that can be used for being gay either.

So it does matter what people say in public.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

What happenned to the other one where we were discussing this? I don't feel like searching for it, anyaway. I just wanted to thank Kendra for giving me an honest answer on that one.

Look how weird this one has gotten. Now someone is knocking "fat" people. Oy vey....

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
No one can possible know what the relationship between a daughter and her parents is like, nor can anyone judge it. They have dealt with it as best they can, in the spotlight, and I would certainly not call them hypocrites for not supporting gay marriage.

I agree.

I do, however, have a problem with the fact that they said nothing when the republican Keyes came right out and called their daughter names, and yet did say something very publicly last night. Either something offends you or it does not....you don't get to choose the degree according to who said it ( and I think everyone would agree that what Keyes did was far worse ). To my mind this was clearly a case of Lynn Cheney making political hay, and that I would call hypocritical.

This is where I disagree. What Alan Keyes said might have been mean but it's just his opinion. She may or may not fit that opinion. It may not offend her either. But there's no getting around the fact that she is gay and Kerry/Edwards used that fact as a political poison pill. It was shameful of them to do so.

If someone made the comment that I'm stupid, well that's just their opinion. If they made fun of me because I'm bald on top, it's still their opinion about the making fun part but that fact remains that I am bald on top. I don't need to be offended by both comments to be consistent. I can pick and choose what things offend me. It's certainly not being hypocritical if I respond to one criticism and not another no matter what someone else thinks of the reason for a response or lack of one.

 

[inaminute]

This is where I disagree. What Alan Keyes said might have been mean but it's just his opinion.

Not sticking up for Alan Keyes, but to my mind, the difference is he was specifically asked about his opinion concerning his views on homosexuality and how they pertain to Ms. Cheney.

John Kerry wasn't specifically asked about Ms. Cheney. He was asked if he believes homosexuality is a choice. He chose to use her as an example in answering the question. Who know what his motives were in doing this; to me, they are highly suspect.

 

[peachgirl]

Originally posted by JPN4265
So it does matter what people say in public.

You didn't answer the questions.

 

[treesinger]

Originally posted by Kendra17
I understand this line of thinking, but I think that 1) Alan Keyes has been marginalized anyways. Ignoring his comments was probably the best thing to do in that case. Why cause a big huge thing over some inane comment when it doesn't matter (I mean it's not like he's posting on Disboards or something!) 2) The statements Edwards and Kerry made were on national television and had a much wider audience. Also, there is a lot riding on this, obviously--they're opponents. And, when Alan Keyes said what he said he wasn't Bush and Cheney's political opponent. He was just a guy with a forum and an opinion. However, Kerry and Edwards politicized the daughter's sexuality. . .he used it to forward his own agenda or make Cheney and Bush look bad or something (not because Cheney has a gay daughter, but because Bush is against gay marriage). And, that is different then Alan Keyes or Pat Buchanan (I don'tknow if he's said anything or not--I'm just citing an example of someone who might have anti-gay views) or ANYONE, actually, saying something.

It may have been in Cheney's best interest to just let Alan Keyes' comment go. But, what Kerry and Edwards did seemed calculated, rehearsed, and was an intentionally exploitive (imo), AND a response by the Cheneys seems reasonable to me.

As a Bush supporter, I thought Kerry did really well last night FOR THE MOST PART. I really thought Bush won the debate, but I thought Kerry did well. UNTIL he said, "we're all god's children" in what seemed like a rehearsed remark. And, until he brought up the daughter. And, of course, at the end, when he couldn't think of anything wonderful to say about Teresa --especially when one compares Bush's wonderful remarks and demeanor.

So, even if the liberals DON'T find anything wrong with his comments, the fact is that MAny people DID for real reasons.

Kendra, do you play for the Yankees? Because you just hit a home run there! You said EXACTLY what I was thinking!

I also thought it a bit odd that Kerry didn't mention his wife except for the "marrying up" comment. (Truth be told, that's the first time Kerry made me laugh this entire campaign. Self-deprecation can go a long way towards amking you look human)

 

[Kendra17]

Originally posted by treesinger
Kendra, do you play for the Yankees? Because you just hit a home run there! You said EXACTLY what I was thinking!

I also thought it a bit odd that Kerry didn't mention his wife except for the "marrying up" comment. (Truth be told, that's the first time Kerry made me laugh this entire campaign. Self-deprecation can go a long way towards amking you look human)

Thanks, Treesinger--but the truth is I'm a lot like Kerry regarding your first point; I throw like a girl.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by peachgirl
First, why is it the only comparisons to saying publicly that Ms.Cheney is gay are negative? Do you consider being gay, bad?

To me, I don't think being gay is bad.

Secondly, if the Kerry campaign used Elizabeth Edwards' weight for political gain, then it would be fair for the right to bring the subject up as well.

But they didn't and no it wouldn't. Not even if she was mentioned by name. One would hope there are still some standards of decency in regards to bringing in someone's personal situation into a political debate for the soul purpose of gaining political points.

Of course, I don't think it would be fair to use the term "fat sow" any more than it would be to use insulting words that can be used for being gay either.

Again, they didn't and no insulting words were used to describe Cheney's daughter. It was however very much inappropriate to bring her into the debate regardless. Kerry could of (and should have) not done that. There were many other ways to get his views across.

From a line from one of my favorite movies...

Guardian Knight: He chose.... poorly.