Jodi Arias Trial Part 8 EXTREME CRUELTY: PROVEN

Penalty phase...what will the jury decide? (1 day poll!)

  • Death

  • Life (judge will sentence within 60 days, LWOP or Parole in 25 years)

  • No unanimous decision...new penalty phase jury will be empaneled.


Results are only viewable after voting.
Oddly enough, there's a system put into place in case a jury can't agree on a penalty, the State can decide whether or not to pursue the case. If this next jury can't agree then the judge will hear argument from both counsels and decide LWOP or Life with a possibility of parole after 25 years. Maybe the next jury will know that.

What the family wants in this and are willing to endure all over again will also play a role in whether they continue with this, I feel that JA and her DT will not be willing to settle and plead out. They probably feel like they can get a jury to agree to Life.


Another thought:
As for the cost to the tax payers. Since HLN and that Arizona station had exclusivity to the actual coverage, do you think they had to pay a fee to air the trial and if not.. IMHO they should have and big money too.
 
I think because that is what most people wanted, but they had a lot more information than the jurors did. Also, because they all voted premeditated, it seemed like that would be the next logical step if they believed she planned and carried out the murder.

For me personally, I was surprised they didn't come back with the DP because of the premeditation. But now, I get the they were asked if they could if the situation warranted it. Some believe it did, and others believed it didn't, for what ever crazy reason...lol j/k for their own personal reasons.

:rotfl: I take back what I said, they all did NOT vote premeditated, 7 voted premeditated and 5 voted felony murder which I wish we had some clarification about, but that may have been an indicator that there was even a bigger chance of a hung jury to Willmott when she portrayed Arias as human. I personally don't like people who say they'd never hurt a spider (people like that are stupid), but I also come from a long line of police officers who know some times you have to kill someone to protect yourself or others.

And I said this earlier in one of these threads, there will be no peace for the Alexanders if Jodi lives, she will always be in their mind, the only peace is her death, I know that from personal experience too.
 
What the family wants in this and are willing to endure all over again will also play a role in whether they continue with this, I feel that JA and her DT will not be willing to settle and plead out. They probably feel like they can get a jury to agree to Life.


Another thought:
As for the cost to the tax payers. Since HLN and that Arizona station had exclusivity to the actual coverage, do you think they had to pay a fee to air the trial and if not.. IMHO they should have and big money too.

I agree with you, Jodi won't plea out because she's a player and she's gonna get her full appeals process (another chance) if she gets the DP and she'll play her hand to gamble for a decision by the judge for LWOP or Life chance for parole after 25 if the jury decides that. I think Judge Stephens might give her LWOP.

I'd love to see the contracts for these televised trials, man, people all over the world made money off this one. I noticed that TawniDilly slapped commercials on her Youtube uploads and no telling what Chris Hughes is gonna pull in for naming himself CEO of the Travis Alexander Legacy.
 
I don't understand why everyone believes this jury should have handed down a death penalty and if they didn't they lied when they said they could consider it, they considered it and 4 decided against it. :confused:

No, they did not have to vote for the death penalty. All I am saying is if they had any doubts they should have said so, as this was on the table. They made her DP qualified. But they were horrified that the judge declared a mistrial and they did not know it, they should of had someone come back and really explain it to them in full till they understood. They may have come back with some kind of sentence.
 

It is because it seems as though the penalty aspect was taken into consideration when the other verdicts were deliberated, which from what I understand is not what they were supposed to do.. And now they are shocked that this lead to a mistrial for the penalty phase. What did they think, the judge would be the one to hand down a sentence?? Couldn't they have asked what would happen, oh wait they did ask that didn't they??

How do you figure the jurors took into consideration the penalty when they found First degree murder? Do you have any evidence of this?

  1. This jury found premeditation unanimously and partially felony murder in the first degree.
  2. This jury found the murder to be exceptional cruel in the aggravation phase. Without finding excessive cruelty and suffering by the victim, the sentence would have been life. So if they were minimize the penalty, they would have done it in the aggravation trial.
  3. This jury was split 8-4 for Death. By a 2-1 split, the jury wanted to sentence JA to death. The 2 sides were probably too far apart and entrenched to come to a consensus for the penalty. In the minds of the 4 jurists who did not want to vote for death, there were some mitigation factors that they fought outweighed the aggravation factors.

I don't follow your thinking that the jurists were even thinking about penalty as they convicted her. JA was 2/3 of the way in the last phase in being placed on death row that day.

I read that in the 4 retrials of the death case penalty phases that had a hung jury, 3 ended in a death sentence. JA is not off the hook by any stretch.
 
I agree with you, Jodi won't plea out because she's a player and she's gonna get her full appeals process (another chance) if she gets the DP and she'll play her hand to gamble for a decision by the judge for LWOP or Life chance for parole after 25 if the jury decides that. I think Judge Stephens might give her LWOP.

I'd love to see the contracts for these televised trials, man, people all over the world made money off this one. I noticed that TawniDilly slapped commercials on her Youtube uploads and no telling what Chris Hughes is gonna pull in for naming himself CEO of the Travis Alexander Legacy.

Do you think he won't be fair and reasonable as CEO? I know you have issues with PPL and the folks from that group (many of us do) but I think it is unfair to imply that he would be less than trustworthy with a fund in honor of his friend.
 
I agree with you, Jodi won't plea out because she's a player and she's gonna get her full appeals process (another chance) if she gets the DP and she'll play her hand to gamble for a decision by the judge for LWOP or Life chance for parole after 25 if the jury decides that. I think Judge Stephens might give her LWOP.

Judge Stephens cannot commute a death sentence verdict given by a jury. Only an appeals court can commute a death sentence to Life in Arizona. Other states the judge has more latitude. But not in Arizona.

Also, the original trial judge in Arizona cannot sentence a defendant to death if a jury does not render a decision of death. Only a jury can decide a death sentence.
 
:rotfl: I take back what I said, they all did NOT vote premeditated, 7 voted premeditated and 5 voted felony murder which I wish we had some clarification about, but that may have been an indicator that there was even a bigger chance of a hung jury to Willmott when she portrayed Arias as human. I personally don't like people who say they'd never hurt a spider (people like that are stupid), but I also come from a long line of police officers who know some times you have to kill someone to protect yourself or others.

And I said this earlier in one of these threads, there will be no peace for the Alexanders if Jodi lives, she will always be in their mind, the only peace is her death, I know that from personal experience too.

I thought that 5 of the jurors voted for first-degree premeditated murder, and 7 of them voted for both first-degree premeditated murder and felony murder, so doesn't that mean that all 12 jurors unanimously found her guilty of premeditatated murder? ... However, they did not find her unanimously guilty of felony murder? ... I get so confused :confused3 ...
 
How do you figure the jurors took into consideration the penalty when they found First degree murder? Do you have any evidence of this?

  1. This jury found premeditation unanimously and partially felony murder in the first degree.
  2. This jury found the murder to be exceptional cruel in the aggravation phase. Without finding excessive cruelty and suffering by the victim, the sentence would have been life. So if they were minimize the penalty, they would have done it in the aggravation trial.
  3. This jury was split 8-4 for Death. By a 2-1 split, the jury wanted to sentence JA to death. The 2 sides were probably too far apart and entrenched to come to a consensus for the penalty. In the minds of the 4 jurists who did not want to vote for death, there were some mitigation factors that they fought outweighed the aggravation factors.

I don't follow your thinking that the jurists were even thinking about penalty as they convicted her. JA was 2/3 of the way in the last phase in being placed on death row that day.

I read that in the 4 retrials of the death case penalty phases that had a hung jury, 3 ended in a death sentence. JA is not off the hook by any stretch.

It has to do with an impression I get from the way the foreman spoke in his post trial media interviews that have already been posted here but also this one:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=186405651

PHOENIX (AP) — They were 12 ordinary citizens who didn't oppose the death penalty. But unlike spectators outside the courthouse who followed the case like a daytime soap opera and jumped to demand Jodi Arias' execution, the jurors faced a decision that was wrenching and real, with implications that could haunt them forever.

In an interview Friday, jury foreman William Zervakos provided a glimpse into the private deliberations, describing four women and eight men who struggled with the question: How heinous of a killing deserves a similar fate?

"The system we think is flawed in that sense because this was not a case of a Jeffrey Dahmer or Charles Manson," Zervakos told The Associated Press.

"It was a brutal no-win situation. ... I think that's kind of unfair," the 69-year-old added. "We're not lawyers. We can't interpret the law. We're mere mortals. And I will tell you I've never felt more mere as a mortal than I felt for the last five months."

Zervakos said the most difficult time of the entire trial was hearing directly from victim Travis Alexander's family as his brother and sister tearfully explained how his killing has shattered their lives.

"There was no sound in that jury room for a long time after that because you hurt so bad for these people," he said. "But that wasn't evidence. That's what made it so hard. ... This wasn't about them. This was a decision whether we're going to tell somebody they were going to be put to death or spend the rest of their life in prison."

Zervakos described a deliberations room full of tears and spinning moral compasses as each juror struggled to come to grips with their own beliefs about what factors — including Arias' young age at the time of the killing and her lack of criminal history — should cause them to show mercy and spare her life.

"You've got Travis Alexander's family devastated, that he was killed, that he was brutally killed. You've got Jodi Arias' family sitting in there, both families sitting and seeing these humiliating images and listening to unbelievably lurid private details of their lives, and you've got a woman whose life is over, too," Zervakos said. "I mean, who's winning in this situation? And we were stuck in the middle."

Zervakos declined to discuss his thoughts or those of other jurors on whether Arias should have been sentenced to death or life. But he said he was torn between her two personas: a killer and an average young woman struggling through life.

"You heard (prosecutor Juan) Martinez say she was only 27. ... She's old enough that she should have known better," Zervakos said. "I didn't look at it that way. I'm looking at 27 years of an absolutely normal everyday young woman that was living a life that was perfectly normal. Then something changed the trajectory of her life after meeting Travis Alexander, and it spiraled downhill from there."

The same jury on May 8 convicted Arias of first-degree murder in Alexander's killing, but couldn't reach a decision Thursday after about 13 hours of deliberations on whether she should live or die.

Judge Sherry Stephens was forced to declare a mistrial of the penalty phase and dismissed the panel.

A conference with the judge and attorneys is set for June 20 to determine how both sides want to proceed. In the interim, Stephens set a July 18 retrial date.

The mistrial set the stage for a whole new proceeding to determine whether the 32-year-old former waitress should get a life sentence or the death penalty for murdering Alexander five years ago.

Arias stabbed and slashed him nearly 30 times, slit his throat slit and shot him in the forehead. Prosecutors said she attacked Alexander in a jealous rage after he wanted to end their relationship and planned a trip to Mexico with another woman. Arias contends it was self-defense.

Prosecutors now have the option to take the death penalty off the table and avoid a new penalty phase. The judge would then determine whether to sentence Arias to spend her entire life behind bars, or give her life with the possibility of release after 25 years. Given Arias could not afford her own defense, taxpayers footed the bill for court-appointed attorneys at a cost so far of nearly $1.7 million, a price tag that will only balloon if the case moves forward.

Should the state decide to seek death again, jury selection alone could take months, given the difficulty of seating an impartial panel in a case that has attracted global attention and become daily cable TV and tabloid fodder with tales of sex, lies and violence, said jury consultant Jo-Ellan Dimitrius.

"Will it be impossible? No. Will it be tough? Absolutely," she said.

Dimitrius noted that jury selection in the widely publicized trial of infamous serial killer Richard Ramirez, known as the "Night Stalker," who is on death row in California, took six months as attorneys weeded through more than 2,000 prospective jurors.

If Arias faces a new penalty phase, her murder conviction would stand, leaving the new panel tasked only with sentencing her. However, the proceedings could drag on for several more months as the new jury reviews evidence and witness testimony.

If the second jury cannot reach a unanimous decision, the judge would then sentence Arias to one of the life-in-prison options. The judge cannot sentence Arias to death.
 
I thought that 5 of the jurors voted for first-degree premeditated murder, and 7 of them voted for both first-degree premeditated murder and felony murder, so doesn't that mean that all 12 jurors unanimously found her guilty of premeditatated murder? ... However, they did not find her unanimously guilty of felony murder? ... I get so confused :confused3 ...

All 12 jurors voted for premeditated murder. 7 jurors voted for both premeditated and felony murder. 5 jurors voted only for premeditated murder.

First degree murder can be either premeditated or felony murder (murder while committing a felony. It doesn't matter how each juror voted, as long as they select at least one of the 2, premeditated or felony for 1st degree murder.
 
How many juror's gave an interview? On websleuth's some one said that the juror went against the judges orders and was on the internet.
 
It has to do with an impression I get from the way the foreman spoke in his post trial media interviews that have already been posted here but also this one:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=186405651

I can understand his feelings. He said he felt compassion on both sides, but the jury had to go through each mitigation factor on each side.

I personally think if anyone felt strongly for either one side, it would be very difficult to be objective. Probably impossible. He was just saying he found the task to be extremely difficult. It's that law is extremely ambiguous and subjective to each person. I think he and the rest of the jury were trying to be fair minded to the murderer and the victim and he/they found it to be difficult.
 
I can understand his feelings. He said he felt compassion on both sides, but the jury had to go through each mitigation factor on each side.

I personally think if anyone felt strongly for either one side, it would be very difficult to be objective. Probably impossible. He was just saying he found the task to be extremely difficult. It's that law is extremely ambiguous and subjective to each person. I think he and the rest of the jury were trying to be fair minded to the murderer and the victim and he/they found it to be difficult.

Yes but what I did not like was the comparison to her not being a Dahmer or Manson.. Plus he made it seem like they had a deal.. First degree but I am drawing a line in the sand with the DP..
 
I don't use hair dye. I don't need it. All my hair is falling out. I'll be bald before I need to actually dye my hair.

Maybe wigs??? ;)



Thank you!


Plus he talked about how when the verdict of guilty in the 1st was said he didn't want to look at her but he did and he will never forget the look on her face... So clearly he was making up for that by being a hold out on the DP.

Yeah, that bothered me. Basically, he was saying he knew that she deserved 1st degree but then felt bad for her when she got it. Would NOT have been the same if Travis had done it to Jodi. :worried:


Copied this from one of the links posted - http://wildabouttrial.com/jury-foreman-says-life-or-death-decision-unfair/:

"You heard (prosecutor Juan) Martinez say she was only 27. ... She's old enough that she should have known better," Zervakos said. "I didn't look at it that way. I'm looking at 27 years of an absolutely normal everyday young woman that was living a life that was perfectly normal. Then something changed the trajectory of her life after meeting Travis Alexander, and it spiraled downhill from there."

Sounds like the Defense registered with him. Personally, I didn't find her life to have been perfectly normal up to that point. Maybe it's because I know more than the jury knew. Maybe it's because this guy felt sorry for her. I don't know, but I hope that she at least gets LWOP. We'll see, I guess...
 
Maybe wigs??? ;)




Thank you!




Yeah, that bothered me. Basically, he was saying he knew that she deserved 1st degree but then felt bad for her when she got it. Would NOT have been the same if Travis had done it to Jodi. :worried:


Copied this from one of the links posted:

"You heard (prosecutor Juan) Martinez say she was only 27. ... She's old enough that she should have known better," Zervakos said. "I didn't look at it that way. I'm looking at 27 years of an absolutely normal everyday young woman that was living a life that was perfectly normal. Then something changed the trajectory of her life after meeting Travis Alexander, and it spiraled downhill from there."

Sounds like the Defense registered with him. Personally, I didn't find her life to have been perfectly normal up to that point. Maybe it's because I know more than the jury knew. Maybe it's because this guy felt sorry for her. I don't know, but I hope that she at least gets LWOP. We'll see, I guess...

Yep he believed the crap JW was spewing.. Too bad he was thinking of the trajectory of her life and not the trajectory of the BULLET in Travis' head..
 
:rotfl: I take back what I said, they all did NOT vote premeditated, 7 voted premeditated and 5 voted felony murder which I wish we had some clarification about, but that may have been an indicator that there was even a bigger chance of a hung jury to Willmott when she portrayed Arias as human. I personally don't like people who say they'd never hurt a spider (people like that are stupid), but I also come from a long line of police officers who know some times you have to kill someone to protect yourself or others.

And I said this earlier in one of these threads, there will be no peace for the Alexanders if Jodi lives, she will always be in their mind, the only peace is her death, I know that from personal experience too.

I think they did.
 
Yes but what I did not like was the comparison to her not being a Dahmer or Manson.. Plus he made it seem like they had a deal.. First degree but I am drawing a line in the sand with the DP..

Right, so basically the only way he could deliver the DP was if it was in an extreme case like Dahmer or Manson. He should have said that when he was asked initially. JMHO
 
Right, so basically the only way he could deliver the DP was if it was in an extreme case like Dahmer or Manson. He should have said that when he was asked initially. JMHO

The thing about comparing her to Manson is, It has never been proven, nor was he convicted of killing anyone with his own hands. He was sentenced to death and never committed a killing. His death sentence was over turned when CA Superior Court abolished the Death Penalty. He has been up for parole many, many times, so many he doesn't even attend any longer, and has always been denied.
 





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