Jodi Arias Trial Part 4, starting with redirect of "expert" Dr Samuels, March 19

[MaryAnnDVC]

Exactly!! If you look at the picture of Travis on the floor of the shower (during the supposed photo session), that's the point I think Jodi shot him abover the right eyebrow, slightly to the right. And Jodi not being too well versed in weapons didn't realize that little pea shooter wouldn't kill Travis right off and especially since she aimed downward which put the round thru his sinus cavity going to his cheek, may have tried to get off another round and the weapon jammed (letting her use some of the truth for her ninja story the gun jammed). I think Travis came up outta that shower, looked in the mirror to see what she'd done and ended up spitting blood all over the sink and she started the numerous stabbings to his back. He ran down that hallway and she followed. Struggling (crawling) down that hallway, she finally cut his throat at the end and that definitely was all he could take.

Oooooo...interesting! I was wondering why he would go over to the sink and the mirror! Very good point. Excellent point! He may not have seen the gun at all and wasn't sure what hit him.

Here is a thought, would all bullets be the same? Meaning if they took that bullet and compared it to the bullets from any of the boxes at her grandmothers home. Wouldn't each box of bullets may different from the manufactures ?

I don't know. I think they have to have the gun to know if a bullet actually came out of that gun.

Oh yeah!! I'll look for the reciept, it's in that bank statement, my problem is I get sidetracked reading even more stuff.

Listen, even four fruit trees can be work if you're doing everything suggested for them and we ain't got time for that!

Actually, I don't think he's doing much of anything, since the fruit isn't very good. I almost never go way back there (at least 150 feet! LOL), and if I do, they're usually past their prime and have been attacked by birds and other crazy wildlife. I'm an indoor girl. Mosquitoes and snakes and other critters are a huge deterrent to my being out there. DH doesn't even LIKE fruit, so he doesn't have much incentive to pick anything.

 

[usnuzuloose]

Oooooo...interesting! I was wondering why he would go over to the sink and the mirror! Very good point. Excellent point! He may not have seen the gun at all and wasn't sure what hit him.I don't know. I think they have tatave the gun to know if a bullet actually came out of that gun.Actually, I don't think he's doing much of anything, since the fruit isn't very good. I almost never go way back there (at least 150 feet! LOL), and if I do, they're usually past their prime and have been attacked by birds and other crazy wildlife. I'm an indoor girl. Mosquitoes and snakes and other critters are a huge deterrent to my being out there. DH doesn't even LIKE fruit, so he doesn't have much incentive to pick anything.

I know that they need the gun for that, but would the bullet match to the bullets in her grandmothers house? They never said bullets were taken from the home, only the gun.

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

All this talk of meeting-up to see the trial - don't you guys dare plan one without including me!

That's what I was thinking as well, that nothing was written in stone which made it easier for him to switch who he took.

Jodi seems to have worked her "magic" on so many men involved with this case it literally makes my head spin. It makes me wonder which direction her life would have taken and how many other men she would have ruined if she hadn't have been caught.

First person to win the lottery in the next two (or longer!) weeks treats the rest us to a trip to the Maricopa County Courthouse.

Can you imagine the relief those two guy camping "friends" of Jodi's have been feeling? They dodged a bullet...literally.

Back to gardening. One year, DH was determined to keep up with using the stuff from the garden, and he ended up making over 70 jars of pickles. Everyone who walking into our house left with a jar of pickles (forcibly, if necessary LOL)...even parents who picked up their kids from birthday parties. Party favors!

 

[Uncle Remus]

Is this the bank statement you were talking about UR?

It looks like the Priceline charge comes after the murder. Do we know where she went in the month following her arrest, or any mention of plans to go somewhere? (Besides camping with two guys she barely know and therefore needing another gun. )

Unless I've just got the wrong bank statement altogether.

No, that's the one and I couldn't remember whether that was before or after she killed him.

Oooooo...interesting! I was wondering why he would go over to the sink and the mirror! Very good point. Excellent point! He may not have seen the gun at all and wasn't sure what hit him.I don't know. I think they have to have the gun to know if a bullet actually came out of that gun.Actually, I don't think he's doing much of anything, since the fruit isn't very good. I almost never go way back there (at least 150 feet! LOL), and if I do, they're usually past their prime and have been attacked by birds and other crazy wildlife. I'm an indoor girl. Mosquitoes and snakes and other critters are a huge deterrent to my being out there. DH doesn't even LIKE fruit, so he doesn't have much incentive to pick anything.

LOL, bad thing about fruit is ya really have to get it at the right time. Needless to say, I've got plenty of drunk butterflies who love that stuff after it's fermented and lots of critters enjoying a feast. Best thing is my wife enjoys going out to gather fruit for some recipe that she's blogging.

I know that they need the gun for that, but would the bullet match to the bullets in her grandmothers house? They never said bullets were taken from the home, only the gun.

I know what you're saying and that might apply, but only to a certain degree given the probability of how many boxes of rounds that company manufactures versus how many people actually have those type of rounds in their household. In other words, it's not the best of evidence especially given that the State can only go so far (legally) in tying that theft to Jodi in court.

I think it was Brit who summed it up well, the rules of evidence really dictate this case.

Okay, help me now, I'm having flashbacks to all those classes from so many years ago, I'm gonna jump up and start singing a Janis Joplin song, my favorite reminder of my youth.

 

[Brit17]

Exactly!! If you look at the picture of Travis on the floor of the shower (during the supposed photo session), that's the point I think Jodi shot him abover the right eyebrow, slightly to the right. And Jodi not being too well versed in weapons didn't realize that little pea shooter wouldn't kill Travis right off and especially since she aimed downward which put the round thru his sinus cavity going to his cheek, may have tried to get off another round and the weapon jammed (letting her use some of the truth for her ninja story the gun jammed). I think Travis came up outta that shower, looked in the mirror to see what she'd done and ended up spitting blood all over the sink and she started the numerous stabbings to his back. He ran down that hallway and she followed. Struggling (crawling) down that hallway, she finally cut his throat at the end and that definitely was all he could take.

All in all, there's no way this wasn't premeditated to some degree, she took that .25 there with the intentions to use it. If she used it to threaten him, she intended to use it and she ended up using it to kill him and did kill him with all the injuries he suffered.

But when do you think she stabbed him in the chest if he had his back to her at the sink and his chest facing the ground as he crawled away? ... Maybe as he was getting out of the shower after she shot him, he was standing up enough so she could stab him in the chest, then he went to the sink, he was spitting up blood, she then started stabbing him in the back, then he started crawling away where she cut his throat, perhaps? ...

And MaryAnnDVC, I like your theory about JA picking up the camera with TA's dirty clothes and that's how it got into the washing machine ... And then she didn't have time to look for it before she left ... Very good possibility indeed ..

 

[Uncle Remus]

First person to win the lottery in the next two (or longer!) weeks treats the rest us to a trip to the Maricopa County Courthouse.

Can you imagine the relief those two guy camping "friends" of Jodi's have been feeling? They dodged a bullet...literally.

Back to gardening. One year, DH was determined to keep up with using the stuff from the garden, and he ended up making over 70 jars of pickles. Everyone who walking into our house left with a jar of pickles (forcibly, if necessary LOL)...even parents who picked up their kids from birthday parties. Party favors!

Oh hell, been there, done that.


And yeah, it's scary to think she went out and bought that 9 millimeter.

 

[Uncle Remus]

But when do you think she stabbed him in the chest if he had his back to her at the sink and his chest facing the ground as he crawled away? ... Maybe as he was getting out of the shower after she shot him, he was standing up enough so she could stab him in the chest, then he went to the sink, he was spitting up blood, she then started stabbing him in the back, then he started crawling away where she cut his throat, perhaps? ...

And MaryAnnDVC, I like your theory about JA picking up the camera with TA's dirty clothes and that's how it got into the washing machine ... And then she didn't have time to look for it before she left ... Very good possibility indeed ..

Oh, I think she went at him in a frenzy with that knife, scared ****less when the .25 didn't kill him like she thought it would. Hell, that's why she's claiming self defense, she was scared for her life after she shot him to kill him.

Anyway, I think she could have stabbed him a couple of times in the front as he was trying to get up and given there was not a bunch of room in that shower she couldn't get a good thrust with the knife until after he got outta the shower.

 

[PebblesMK]

First person to win the lottery in the next two (or longer!) weeks treats the rest us to a trip to the Maricopa County Courthouse.

Can you imagine the relief those two guy camping "friends" of Jodi's have been feeling? They dodged a bullet...literally.

Back to gardening. One year, DH was determined to keep up with using the stuff from the garden, and he ended up making over 70 jars of pickles. Everyone who walking into our house left with a jar of pickles (forcibly, if necessary LOL)...even parents who picked up their kids from birthday parties. Party favors!

Oh, that would be me, your next $320 million dollar powerball winner!

Pickle party favors! Wonderful!!

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

But when do you think she stabbed him in the chest if he had his back to her at the sink and his chest facing the ground as he crawled away? ... Maybe as he was getting out of the shower after she shot him, he was standing up enough so she could stab him in the chest, then he went to the sink, he was spitting up blood, she then started stabbing him in the back, then he started crawling away where she cut his throat, perhaps? ...

And MaryAnnDVC, I like your theory about JA picking up the camera with TA's dirty clothes and that's how it got into the washing machine ... And then she didn't have time to look for it before she left ... Very good possibility indeed ..

Thinking this through again...I forget exactly where all those stab wounds were. I just looked at the notations the ME made and I can't make heads or tails out of them...which wounds were the worst. Did he have a bad chest wound? Maybe he fell on his back from the sink, or really, at any time during the attack. I know he had a bad back wound.

They were saying ("they" meaning those people who say things LOL) that it was likely a torso wound (the one in the back) that lead to his spitting blood into the sink.

And "they" also said that that's how the camera might have ended up in the washing machine, so although I AM truly brilliant enough *ahem* to have eventually thought of that, someone else did first.

Another thing about Samuels...saying that the crime scene wouldn't have been so frenzied if it was a "planned" murder...that cleaning up would have been part of the plan. Well ****, no one is saying that Jodi was a professional hitman with experience and would've gotten it right every step of the way! But I swear that guy looks at Jodi with AWE. *insert puking smiley here*

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

Oh hell, been there, done that.


And yeah, it's scary to think she went out and bought that 9 millimeter.

And honestly, that's one of the things that would make me worry if I was a juror (or a man within a 1000 mile radius of JA)...that Jodi killed so freely, and was ready to do it again if, in HER mind, it was "necessary." Her crime was horrific enough to keep her in prison FOREVER, but the possibility of her killing again should be a real concern. Unless, of course, Samuels and his compassion for her can FIX her if she gets 2nd degree and gets out when she's in her 40s.

Oh, I think she went at him in a frenzy with that knife, scared ****less when the .25 didn't kill him like she thought it would. Hell, that's why she's claiming self defense, she was scared for her life after she shot him to kill him.

Anyway, I think she could have stabbed him a couple of times in the front as he was trying to get up and given there was not a bunch of room in that shower she couldn't get a good thrust with the knife until after he got outta the shower.

I should probably go and attempt to accomplish something today...IRL.

 

[usnuzuloose]

Priceline, could that be connected to Sac airport? I see she spent 28? The only thing that she could access there would be the arco station, or there is a cinnabon just inside that terminal before you go upstairs and hit security or car rental places.

 

[reelmom]

Priceline, could that be connected to Sac airport? I see she spent 28? The only thing that she could access there would be the arco station, or there is a cinnabon just inside that terminal before you go upstairs and hit security or car rental places.

I think the Priceline was her plane ticket to Travis' memorial service.

 

[Uncle Remus]

Priceline, could that be connected to Sac airport? I see she spent 28? The only thing that she could access there would be the arco station, or there is a cinnabon just inside that terminal before you go upstairs and hit security or car rental places.

Run out there and check it out for us, don't forget to keep your receipts and bill Maricopa County for the expense.

 

[usnuzuloose]

Run out there and check it out for us, don't forget to keep your receipts and bill Maricopa County for the expense.

What expense, I am a whole 5 minutes!

 

[Uncle Remus]

What expense, I am a whole 5 minutes!

Let's see, that's 5 mins x 2 (going and returning trips) and parking and going inside to investigate and you should gather evidence (a cinnabon ), I'm thinking at best speed, that's a half hour and that's worth at least $125.

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

I think the Priceline was her plane ticket to Travis' memorial service.

Oooohhh, that must be it. Yeah, it would be an awful long trip to drive TWICE so close together.

 

[Brit17]

Thinking this through again...I forget exactly where all those stab wounds were. I just looked at the notations the ME made and I can't make heads or tails out of them...which wounds were the worst. Did he have a bad chest wound? Maybe he fell on his back from the sink, or really, at any time during the attack. I know he had a bad back wound.

They were saying ("they" meaning those people who say things LOL) that it was likely a torso wound (the one in the back) that lead to his spitting blood into the sink.

And "they" also said that that's how the camera might have ended up in the washing machine, so although I AM truly brilliant enough *ahem* to have eventually thought of that, someone else did first.

Another thing about Samuels...saying that the crime scene wouldn't have been so frenzied if it was a "planned" murder...that cleaning up would have been part of the plan. Well ****, no one is saying that Jodi was a professional hitman with experience and would've gotten it right every step of the way! But I swear that guy looks at Jodi with AWE. *insert puking smiley here*

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/01/22/what-really-killed-travis-alexander

I just found this article that gives a good reference to what the ME said ... And it also gives another pathologist's opinion ... According to the ME, TA had a life threatening wound to his chest and heart ... However, it was the slash to his neck that killed him ...

I also found this part of the article to be worth noting ...

When the defense begins presenting its case January 29, one of the witnesses will likely be a pathologist who disagrees with Horn's opinion of how Alexander died -- did the bullet to the head kill him, or was it the stab wounds?

So what is the significance of the sequencing of Alexander's injuries?

There are two reasons why this is important to Arias' defense.

A defense attorney's job is to create as much doubt about the prosecution's case as possible. If the defense can show the prosecution is unsure about its theory of Alexander's death, it may erode the jury's confidence in the prosecution's case.

The sequencing also matters because this is a death penalty case. If the prosecution can get a guilty verdict and prove that Arias was cruel and caused Alexander to suffer, she may be sentenced to death. However, if the defense can show that Alexander was shot in the head first, attorneys can argue that all of Alexander's other wounds happened after he died, and so he didn't suffer -- and that could save Arias from the death penalty.

So if we are all here basically deliberating what the actual sequence of events were, I'm sure the Jury will too ... I just hope that it won't cause any reasonable doubt amongst the jurors ... IMO, no matter what the sequence was, I don't have any doubt that she committed 1st degree premeditated murder ... But then again, I have had the benefit of reading and hearing things that the jury may not have ...

 

[Uncle Remus]

Good picture of the court room from one of the Travis support FB sites:

 

[pigletgirl]

Good picture of the court room from one of the Travis support FB sites:

That gives a good perspective of the room.

 

[Uncle Remus]

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/01/22/what-really-killed-travis-alexander

I just found this article that gives a good reference to what the ME said ... And it also gives another pathologist's opinion ... According to the ME, TA had a life threatening wound to his chest and heart ... However, it was the slash to his neck that killed him ...

I also found this part of the article to be worth noting ...

The sequencing also matters because this is a death penalty case. If the prosecution can get a guilty verdict and prove that Arias was cruel and caused Alexander to suffer, she may be sentenced to death. However, if the defense can show that Alexander was shot in the head first, attorneys can argue that all of Alexander's other wounds happened after he died, and so he didn't suffer -- and that could save Arias from the death penalty.

So if we are all here basically deliberating what the actual sequence of events were, I'm sure the Jury will too ... I just hope that it won't cause any reasonable doubt amongst the jurors ... IMO, no matter what the sequence was, I don't have any doubt that she committed 1st degree premeditated murder ... But then again, I have had the benefit of reading and hearing things that the jury may not have ...

I clipped part of that article.

But that's only if one believes that Travis died from that gunshot wound (and the ME report doesn't state he did whenever it took place) and Gabby Giffords is evidence enough that gun shot wounds don't necessarily kill. And that doesn't take into context that Travis' gun shot didn't hit any part of the brain, hell, I've got a friend that put a .45 round into his right temple and *stood there for a moment after he did it. ME's reports are highly debatable in some instances, especially court cases.

Plus the 1st degree aggravating circumstances are covered by the premeditation factor filed in the charges which if found guilty could get Arias the death penalty. All those factors are laid out in one of the documents on the first page of the thread (I'm not gonna try to find it, but I've posted it before.)

And I'm not trying to be argumentative with you, Brit, I'm just saying all these media hounds and seekers have an opinion, we all got one.

*ETA: And yes, he's still alive.