Interesting Conversation

[MiaSRN62]

even when OKW opened the new buildings and the additional pts came on the market.

When we bought OKW in Aug '00, points had just opened up---probably due to the new buildings opening up. We were told they would go fast and they did. They were gone in less than 6 months. Also, I know for a fact that BWV was still selling that year in early summer '00 because our guide told us. Not 100% sure when they stopped.
This is already starting to turn into a debate and the bottom line is this. OKW did not sell like hotcakes, but sales were definitely good (this is a larger resort with more units to sell), otherwise Disney never would have considered adding to the DVC name. When DVC makes extra points for OKW available for sale, they sell quickly---my DVC rep told me this. This is where she owns. Same also happened when Disney made extra points available for BWV this time last year----and neither required passes to sell.
Noone is debating that BWV didn't sell quickly, but this I believe is partly due to the DVC name getting out there after so many years and a very good reputation for DVC resorts retaining their value and trading power in the timeshare industry. I just don't think people were as confident to buy when DVC first started. It was an unknown/untested road traveled by Disney.

 

[Mickmse2002]

Interesting discussion in this thread. One of the common themes I see is many people do not buy at their first exposure to DVC. We are no different. We first went on the tour in 1997 (or maybe it was 1998?) but the cynic in me thought there must be some "catch", I was very leery of any timeshare. It wasn't until the second time we went through the presentation that I more fully understood it and we bought in. Understanding the way the program works, combined with the low-key sales approach tends to slow individual purchases down a bit.

 

[Chuck S]

Originally posted by MiaSRN62
I just don't think people were as confident to buy when DVC first started. It was an unknown/untested road traveled by Disney.

And remember that "point based" timeshares were very new, most people did not understand the concept. Prior to DVC, Marriott and other upscale names, timeshare sales were always considered high pressure, poor "investments" of little real value. We still see the scams of "visit us and take a presentation for a chance to win some wonderful prize" type sales promotions in the industry. As bad a rep as timeshares had, and with Disney making basically no guarantees to the furture of DVC (early purchasers were made very aware that THE Disney Vacation Club resort (now known as OKW), could not always be run by Disney, and that an outside management company being brought in was a very real possibility if the concept didn't meet expectations.

It was also standard in the industry to offer purchasers very good "perks" for buying, hence the resort ticket program. By the time BWV came along in the market, it was evident that DVC would be a popular program, and the offer of free passes was discontinued on ALL new DVC contracts, including OKW. If OKW was "hard to sell" don't you think they would have continued the program for all OKW purchases and simply not offered it at BWV?

 

[Richyams]

BTW, Mr Yams, I certainly do not remember BWV sales not taking off until OKW sold out.

I do not feel responsible for your memory.

Isn't BWV like half the total points at OKW?

Didn't it take way more than half the time to sell out?

Didn't it have a HUGE advantage with OKW already giving DVC a good reputation?

When my sister bought her salesman(I refuse to call them guides) told her that they were selling OKW points three times faster than BWV points and if she wanted OKW, she better move fast.

 

[BWVDee]

Originally posted by Richyams
I do not feel responsible for your memory.

Isn't BWV like half the total points at OKW?

Didn't it take way more than half the time to sell out?

Didn't it have a HUGE advantage with OKW already giving DVC a good reputation?

When my sister bought her salesman(I refuse to call them guides) told her that they were selling OKW points three times faster than BWV points and if she wanted OKW, she better move fast.

And I do not feel responsible that you sister was given incorrect and false information by a DVC guide. You are always saying ad nausaum what liars they are, I guess this is proof of it!

BTW, since OKW does not have twice as many villas as BWV they also do not have twice the amount of points.

OKW's reputation had NOTHING to do with many people buying BWV. Matter of fact many people would not be members today if OKW was the only game in town.

 

[PamOKW]

What are we debating? The word hotcakes? DVC was an unknown when Disney started to sell. I think the name "Disney Vacation Club" was itself a little confusing. What was it and where was it? If you looked at prices to stay for cash they would knock you over. Obviously, it was some special place for the wealthy to stay at WDW. As time went on, people began to understand the program.

Disney did lower the price as well when BWV opened. Prior to that, the minimum purchase at the other resorts was alway over $10,000 ($11,730 in the early years for the minimum 230 points at $51 per point). When BWV opened, the minimum was dropped to 150 even though the price was up to $62.75 per point -- minimum buy-in could be done for $9,412. I kind of think they wanted to get to a single-digit number. Many more people could also "see" BWV while they were at Epcot or MGM. You also had the base of original DVC owners who had been told about the "possibility" of BWV for quite some time. I'm sure there was a pool of bueyrs waiting to add-on. And the rest, is history....now they just can't build them fast enough at WDW.

Yes, all DVC's originally included passes to be used when staying on points at OKW. That's why I always considered them a part of the program and not as a perk. When they discontinued them with purchases it was a little surprising to realize they weren't going to be permanent, even though that was covered in the fine print.

 

[dianeschlicht]

I think the supposed fact that DVC was originally supposed to be 600 resorts, might explain why Disney was supposedly buying property in central Minnesota with transportation options to the MOA. I had a friend who worked in an investment firm who had this information. She also learned about 2 years later that Disney had not purchased the property, and had scrapped whatever plan they had. Perhaps it was to be a timeshare resort amongst our 20,000 lakes!

 

[tjkraz]

I have to wonder what overall impact the Internet has had on DVC sales. I'm one of those people that would never have come within 1000 yards of a timeshare sales presentation--even one put-on by Disney.

Reading the trip planning boards in 2002 while preparing for a family vacation was my first introduction to DVC. And, in 2003 we became members.

In recent years, I wonder how many people have been turned-onto DVC via these boards or other Internet sites without ever stopping at one of the DVC booths or attending a presentation.

 

[timC]

What are we debating? The word hotcakes?

Hotcakes? If you're going to cook hotcakes at OKW, I'd recommend bringing a no-stick pan from home.

 

[MiaSRN62]

Reading the trip planning boards in 2002 while preparing for a family vacation was my first introduction to DVC. And, in 2003 we became members.

I'm with tjkraz on this. I came into the cyber world in the fall of '97 upon our first computer purchase. This is where I really got my DVC education---originally from the AOL Disney boards. THIS is when we, personally, came to understand what DVC was all about.
I also continue to disagree that OKW's reputation had "nothing" to do with BWV sales. I feel OKW pathed the way for DVC and was the pioneer in the program. How could it have nothing to do with the future of DVC (regardless of where people preferred to buy). Back in '91, timeshares weren't as much in the forefront as they are now---particularily point-based systems.

 

[jmminarik]

Originally posted by Mickmse2002
but the cynic in me thought there must be some "catch", I was very leery of any timeshare.

A lot of people were and still are leery of timeshares. A residual of this leeriness can easily be found in may state laws prohibiting 'incentives' to current owners for getting newbies to sign up thanks to the scum salespeople back in the 70's and 80's.

I have vague recollections of my sister talking about DVC back in the early/mid 90's when she would have been down there with my then young nephew. Since I was busy killing off braincells at the time the details are a bit fuzzy, but I do remember thinking how expensive it was, who would want to go to Disney every year, and egads, it was a timeshare...only idiots buy timeshares. Age has since brought wisdom. Or I've really become an idiot. Or both.

-Joe

 

[doubletrouble_vb]

I have to agree with BWVDee niether I nor any of my friends who DVC would own it if OKW or for that matter SSR were the only options.

 

[Chuck S]

But I'm sure there are also many who would not own if BWV were our only option. It is all a matter of personal preference, and personally, the Boardwalk area doesn't do a thing for me.

 

[tjkraz]

Originally posted by Chuck S
But I'm sure there are also many who would not own if BWV were our only option.

Agreed. It won't be too long before the combined OKW and SSR owners outnumber those at all of the other properties combined.

 

[Mickmse2002]

That's the beauty of DVC, someplace and something for everyone's needs/likes. I love BCV, don't care if I ever stay at BWV or VB. OKW is great and have never been to HHI. That is why we love DVC in general, a little bit of something for everyone.

 

[sgtdisney]

Originally posted by Chuck S
But I'm sure there are also many who would not own if BWV were our only option. It is all a matter of personal preference, and personally, the Boardwalk area doesn't do a thing for me.

I have to agree with this as well. If the DVC had started with BWV we may have never ended up as members. That resort does nothing for me personally. But that is the beauty of the DVC program, there seems to be something for almost everyone's tastes.

Hotcakes or not, we bought almost sight unseen in 1992 and have really not had any regrets. The pass program was a wonderful sales incentive and we were counting on the Disney name (which at the time had a little more cache than it does now if you ask me. ) We had vacationed a number of times at what was most recently known as the Disney Institute villas and liked that general area of the 'world' as well.

 

[BWVDee]

Originally posted by Chuck S
But I'm sure there are also many who would not own if BWV were our only option. It is all a matter of personal preference, and personally, the Boardwalk area doesn't do a thing for me.

I totally agree.
However to say OKW was a "HUGE" advantage towards BWV's brisk sales is not so. I was very familar with OKW from it's inception as the Disney Vacation Club. I had gone on the tours, talked to the reps, got the video etc and it did not do a thing for me. I think, and have always thought, that OKW is a very pretty resort and I have always loved the 1 BR. But other than that, it is not my idea of a resort on par with the WDW deluxe resorts in the least. Nor is it what I want or expect from a WDW premiere resort. I purposely waited to buy DVC until a resort was built that was in the same superior locations and with the same amenities that all the deluxe resorts have. When BWV was opened I could not have been more thrilled. I whole heartedly agree that it is all a matter of presonal preference. However to say OKW had a huge impact on BWV sales could not be further from the truth for many people. Unless you take it in the reverse of how the statement was intended, and say that for those that did not care for OKW, when BWV opened they could not wait to buy because it was NOT OKW. OKW also did not pave the way to my understanding of timeshares etc.. My problem from the very beginning was not misunderstanding the timeshare concept or of being afraid of a timeshare purchase; matter of fact I liked the DVC concept from the very beginning, it was the resort that was available to stay at that I did not like. Nor did I feel it was worth the cost of a DVC contract to stay in a resort that was a step down in regards to the location, amenities etc., that we were used to and enjoyed very much at the deluxe resorts.

 

[BWVDee]

Originally posted by tjkraz
....... It won't be too long before the combined OKW and SSR owners outnumber those at all of the other properties combined.

And your point is???????

 

[MiaSRN62]

that OKW is a very pretty resort and I have always loved the 1 BR. But other than that, it is not my idea of a resort on par with the WDW deluxe resorts in the least.

I should've known this comment was coming.......

 

[cheyita]

Originally posted by jmminarik
Age has since brought wisdom. Or I've really become an idiot. Or both.

-Joe

LOL

If you are an idiot - you are in good company!