If you've seen Fahrenheit 9/11, ask & discuss it here.

[tiggersmom2]

Originally posted by septbride2002
In other words maybe you should learn to not speak about things you know NOTHING about - and you obviously know nothing about me.


~Amanda

When you post on a public BB you have to expect people to critique your posts AND respond to them if they don't agree with it.

 

[ThreeCircles]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
WOW, struck a nerve did I? Why so sensitive?

And I didn't put ANY words in your mouth.

MM has a track record of presenting distorted facts and half truths. IMO, that would make anything he presents suspect at the least.

I'm glad you went to "see for yourself" but even in your review you stated that you were shocked by some of the "facts" MM presented which are known to be false or (just almost as bad) taken out of context. I can only assume that you were shocked because you believe them to be true.

For me, I don't need to waste (nor contribute) my money to someone like MM. But that doesn't mean that I don't inform myself on both sides of the subjects he presents. Just like you say you do.

FYI, It's Mr. Elwood Blues.

Hmmmm....

Am I having deja vu or do I know this character that goes by Mr. Elwood Blues? Yes, yes I do!

Speaking of the devil...

 

[septbride2002]

When you post on a public BB you have to expect people to critique your posts AND respond to them if they don't agree with it.

Agreeded - however one should not assume to know everything about the person when responding. If he wanted to state an opinion on what I said - that would be fine. But to assume that I thought everything Michael Moore showed was the "truth" was an error in judgement considering not once in my post did I say that.



~Amanda

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by ThreeCircles
Hmmmm....

Am I having deja vu or do I know this character that goes by Mr. Elwood Blues? Yes, yes I do!

Speaking of the devil...

No, that would be Vuja De.

You know, like this has never happened to you before.

 

[dmadman43]

For your reading pleasure. Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 911

http://www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htm

 

[jason]

Originally posted by AirForceRocks
kbev asked "jason" a question, and you said "he already answered that". So why were you answering kbev at all? Was "jason" unable to tell kbev "I already answered that" or did he need your help to do so?

Sorry I'm a few days late on this, but just to clarify. Kbev asked me a question I belive 4 or 5 times. Kbev just refused to take my honest answer as the truth I guess. ThreeCircles was just trying to help get my point across.

 

[RNMOM]

I don't understand why the conservative right can't look at this film themselves and make their own minds up. It seems to me they all parrot the same crap about a film none/very few have seen. How can that be? Do they always allow others to make up their minds for them?

I see the information from Washington day after day and I take it for face value. I don't go spouting off at every sentence/statement that it is lies and deceits. I don't go nuts at the newscasters or networks. I make my own mind up about it and discuss it with my family and friends as I see necessary.

MM produced an informative film about something he is passionate about. He has some very interesting information in it that I had not heard. Everyone I know who has seen it finds it quiet fascinating. The two showings the members of our family viewed had thunderous applause at the end. Okay, so they are all bleeding heart liberals, right. But that is their RIGHT. We liberal democrats are allowed to express our opinions. No one is shoving it down anyone's throats. If you did not see the film or don't like the film, then don't post on a topic about the film...okay?? Is that clear enough?

 

[AirForceRocks]

We liberal democrats are allowed to express our opinions.

Who in the world said that you couldn't?

If you did not see the film or don't like the film, then don't post on a topic about the film...okay?? Is that clear enough?

So let me get this straight - you are allowed to express your opinion, but those with differing opinions are not?

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by AirForceRocks


So let me get this straight - you are allowed to express your opinion, but those with differing opinions are not?

Apparently.

 

[Eeyore1954]

Originally posted by AirForceRocks
So let me get this straight - you are allowed to express your opinion, but those with differing opinions are not?

So much for the defense of freedom of speech!

I was almost on the commuter train this morning as people were discussing how the gov't. is trying stifle this film -- this after it managed to nearly double the number of theatres it was being shown in. Must be that vast right wing conspiracy!

 

[septbride2002]

How can you form an opinion on something that you haven't even seen?

~Amanda

 

[Eeyore1954]

Originally posted by septbride2002
How can you inform an opinion on something that you haven't even seen?

~Amanda

You are quite correct. I've never been able to "inform an opinion" about anything.

OTOH, I don't have to wallow in a mud puddle to know I'll get dirty doing so.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by septbride2002
How can you inform an opinion on something that you haven't even seen?

~Amanda

Easy. That is unless you are completely unaware of MM's previous attempts at "documentaries".

Someone else said they don't need to SEE a porn movie to have the opinion that they don't care for it and don't want to see it.

 

[Eeyore1954]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Easy. That is unless you are completely unaware of MM's previous attempts at "documentaries".

Someone else said they don't need to SEE a porn movie to have the opinion that they don't care for it and don't want to see it.

That was me! The argument that one has to experience something in order to have a valid opinion is absurd. The very nature of an opinion is that it is not necessarily based on absolute knowledge of the subject in question. An opinion may be a generally held view, shared by many people who have similar beliefs, ideals, values and convictions. It may be a something one believes all by themselves. The validity of an opinion does not rest in the individual's intelligence, experience, knowledge or ability to persuade others.

 

[septbride2002]

Thank you so much for pointing out the error in my post - it has been editted.

I'm sorry but I find the reasons for your ability to form an opinion without seeing the movie weak and unconvincing.

I will admit that no I have not seen previous Michael Moore documentaries - why because I didn't care - but I also did not go around preaching about a movie that I had not even bothered to see. I find that people who attack a movie/song/etc without actually having listen or seen it for themselves don't really have anything valid to add to the conversation. In my honest opinion your opinion is not valid therefore I find no need to continue to "talk" with you on the subject.

Mr. Blues I asked you earlier to provide facts for your opinions and you have ignored the request - I take it from your lack of response you have nothing further to add.

~Amanda

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by septbride2002

I'm sorry but I find the reasons for your ability to form an opinion without seeing the movie weak and unconvincing.

So, when are you going to try crack cocaine?

I will admit that no I have not seen previous Michael Moore documentaries - why because I didn't care - but I also did not go around preaching about a movie that I had not even bothered to see. I find that people who attack a movie/song/etc without actually having listen or seen it for themselves don't really have anything valid to add to the conversation. In my honest opinion your opinion is not valid therefore I find no need to continue to "talk" with you on the subject.

Preach? Who's preaching? You've never seen any other MM film but you can dismiss the fact that his previous movies are full of half-truths, lies, and misreprsentations and conclude that his current film is different?

Mr. Blues I asked you earlier to provide facts for your opinions and you have ignored the request - I take it from your lack of response you have nothing further to add.

~Amanda

Sorry, I missed that request.

Here's two to get you started.

www.moorelies.com

www.moorewatch.com

 

[Eeyore1954]

Originally posted by septbride2002
I'm sorry but I find the reasons for your ability to form an opinion without seeing the movie weak and unconvincing.

So, according to your logic, I must wallow in the mud puddle before I can offer my opinion that doing so will make my clothes dirty? Or I must subject myself to watching every porn movie that comes out to form the opinion that such movies are offensive, degrading to both sexes and inappropriate viewing for minors? Or I must watch every TV show that features gratuitious violence to form an opinion that gratuitious violence on TV is harmful?

I will admit that no I have not seen previous Michael Moore documentaries - why because I didn't care - but I also did not go around preaching about a movie that I had not even bothered to see. I find that people who attack a movie/song/etc without actually having listen or seen it for themselves don't really have anything valid to add to the conversation. In my honest opinion your opinion is not valid therefore I find no need to continue to "talk" with you on the subject.

That's a funny debate tactic -- the petulant dismissal. Well, you are certainly entitled to your opinion and I respect that. Too bad you are unable/unwilling to return the favor. BTW, many people form opinions on a variety of topics based on information gleaned from other than first-hand sources. If the only opinions you consider valid are those that come from first-hand sources alone, I wonder how many of your own opinions would fall into the dismissed category because you had no first-hand experience. That's an incredibly high standard to assert, let alone maintain.

 

[Joeblack]

Hey Eeyore1954

You laughed at me (talk about petulant dismissal) when I bet the movie would go past 100 milion after a month of opening. As of yesterday, its box office is 61 million after only 9 days of showing in 1000 theaters. With an average daily box office of 4 million, it will get there in just 10 more days. We will see how much the movie grosses on July 26th in its first month.

My other prediction, that the movie will go a long way in accomplishing its main goal..well....we will have to wait and see. I am also willing to make a bet with you this time....will red wine do?

Here is the link

http://boxofficemojo.com/daily/chart/?sortdate=2004-07-03&p=.htm

 

[septbride2002]

Preach? Who's preaching? You've never seen any other MM film but you can dismiss the fact that his previous movies are full of half-truths, lies, and misreprsentations and conclude that his current film is different?

Again you assume you know everything. No I never saw any other Michael Moore film - that does not mean that I cannot read and therefore didn't bother to read information on such films. I've also in previous post explained to you that I did not go into this film thinking everything out of Michael Moore's mouth is factually based - that I had read up on the subject, from both liberal and conservative views and went into this film with a grain of salt.

That's a funny debate tactic -- the petulant dismissal. Well, you are certainly entitled to your opinion and I respect that. Too bad you are unable/unwilling to return the favor. BTW, many people form opinions on a variety of topics based on information gleaned from other than first-hand sources. If the only opinions you consider valid are those that come from first-hand sources alone, I wonder how many of your own opinions would fall into the dismissed category because you had no first-hand experience. That's an incredibly high standard to assert, let alone maintain.

When did I say that you were not entilted to your opinion? Go ahead and have one - but that does not mean that I need to take your opinion as the final word. I try not to form an opinion on anything that I have not experienced first hand - do I have one, probably but I don't get into debate topics on them and claim to have the final answer. Again your examples of mud and porn are shallow - we are not discussing mud and porn but a politically motivated movie.

 

[septbride2002]

Here's two to get you started.

I asked you specifically to show that Bush did not elevate friends of his into positions of power. I do not have time to wade through the websites that you have linked at the moment - but will do so tonight when I am at home.

Most of the stuff on the main page is stuff I have read before - and again you will note in my original post none of these moments in the film are what left an impression on me.

~Amanda