I don't get Pete's complaints about lack of AP incentives

[MJ6987]

Hi,
I'll probably get stick for this but I don't understand Podcast Pete's constant complaints / rants about the lack of incentives and benefits for Annual Pass Holders. The primary benefit of having an AP is unlimited access to the Parks and that is what you are paying for - on this basis alone the AP is excellent value and anything more is pure goodwill on Disney's part.

Of course I can see why AP holders would like more incentives. Aside from this, from a business point of view it makes no sense for Disney to target incentives at AP holders as they have already "got" that business and any discounts, etc, would just reduce their margin.

Taking Pete's often referred to suggestion of a loyalty scheme as an example (i.e. stay x number of nights at Disney resorts and get a free night). AP holders are generally the Disney fans who will stay many nights onsite anyway so they don't need to offer anymore incentives. In fact AP holders are the last people I would target for discounts unless it a case of filling rooms that would otherwise remain empty.

The real target for Disney discounts should be (and is) families who either never go to Disney (to encourage them to try it) or those who go every few years (to try and increase this frequency) - these are not Disney "fans" as such and certainly not hardcore AP holders.

Am I missing something?

Matthew

 

[DaParkers]

It's plain and simple. Good business is keeping the customers you have. Why not give more incentives to those that spend more money?

 

[Royster83]

I don't believe you will or should get stick for this, they are your points of view and are put across as such.

I'm not an annual pass holder but I do feel that if I was I would like a little more for it. Although we all know Pete can certainly answer for himself, I believe he point is that it's more of a thankyou for the continued business you give to Disney. If I was making that kind of investment I would like a little thankyou! I compleatly understand your point that it's the discount on entry that the annual pass is all about, but you are still giving Disney a lot of money up front. Pretty much everywhere offers somekind of loyalty program.

I do agree with Pete though that a lot of it is down to Disney arrogance, that they will still come!

Roy

 

[Sphyrna]

I think offering discounts to AP's does make sense. Yes, they do have them as customers. They will spend money. Wouldn't you like to keep them as customers? Someone might get an AP this year but decide it's not worth it and not renew next year. Discounts would help AP holders feel they're getting more value from their AP. I also think Pete is comparing Disney's APs to other parks. They give more discounts and perks than Disney.

It reminds me of cell phone companies. They offer all these incentives to new customers. But they don't do much for existing customers. Then when you call to cancel they offer you deals. Uhm, if you had given that deal the entire time then they wouldn't be cancelling.

 

[scjo68]

I understand your point, and I agree with you from the perspective of what's going to get Disney the most dollars right now.

But, I think in the long-term big picture Pete's point makes a lot of sense.

I think there is a value in rewarding customer loyalty, making your frequent guests feel like they are part of something special. As a guest who feels that Disney values me and wants to keep my business, I will think of Disney first whenever I am looking to spend my vacation dollars. I will stay longer and maybe upgrade, which - long term- should be more profitable for them.

Now, I am only speaking for myself, and I don't even live in Fla., and have no Annual Pass to WDW.
But I can relate by using Kings Dominion as an analogy. Our family has had KD season passes for 7 years straight. With this season pass we had gotten free parking. When Cedar fair bought KD a few years ago, they tried to do away with free parking for all passholders by only including it in the higher, more expensive tier of passes. They quickly realized that was an error, and customers stopped buying the passes. So they offerred free upgrades to the next tier if you buy your passes early, which we always did. So we always gotten VIP passes just for buying early.

THis year, though, they offerred no such upgrade (at least to us) for buying early. So now it's April, and for the first time we have not bought passes. WE may eventually, but we are thinking harder about it. We don't have to go to KD, there are other parks locally that we are looking at more closely this year. After 7 years of being passholders, they have not even sent us so much as a survey to find out why we didn't get passes this year. It's their company and the can do what they want, but it does feel like they don't value our business very much. And we gave them a lot of business. Anything they lost in parking fees from us, we more than made up for in food purchases, etc.

So, I can't speak for Pete, but that's JMHO.

 

[disneyholic family]

Hi,


AP holders are generally the Disney fans who will stay many nights onsite anyway so they don't need to offer anymore incentives.

that's not necessarily true...
i've stayed offsite despite having APs....
one of the big incentives for getting me onsite are the AP room discounts...
without those discounts, it's not a given that i'll stay onsite....

 

[safetymom]

It costs less to keep a customer than get a new one.

 

[Metro West]

I didn't listen to the show so I didn't hear any comments about the Disney annual pass but here's my opinion...

Those of us who live in the Orlando area and have annual passes to the different parks see some of the additional discounts we get at Universal and Sea World and possibly see Disney as the "I don't play well with others" company. While I agree the passes are an excellent value...especially for locals, when you compare some of the discounts offered by the others and not by Disney, Disney is still lacking in some perks. The ones that are the most important to me are:

1.) Park discounts off food and merchandise...Universal & Sea World offer this but Disney does not. Yes...Disney was/is running a special for passholders but that's not a permanent thing and food still is not included.

2.) Monthly pay plan for AP's...Universal and Sea World offer this feature and have WAY more local passholders than Disney does. But maybe Disney doesn't really care about locals since that's not their target audience. Lots of people can't afford the $300/per AP for renewal especially if they need to be renewed at the same time.

3.) Discount tickets for friends/family...again...Universal and Sea World offer the passholder the opportunity to purchase additional tickets for their friends/families at a discount. Universal has offered as much as 50% off single day tickets during special times.

Those are my three main things that Disney is lacking in the passholder comparison. I don't care about hotel discounts since I live so close to the parks.

 

[ADP]

Hi,
I'll probably get stick for this but I don't understand Podcast Pete's constant complaints / rants about the lack of incentives and benefits for Annual Pass Holders. The primary benefit of having an AP is unlimited access to the Parks and that is what you are paying for - on this basis alone the AP is excellent value and anything more is pure goodwill on Disney's part.

Of course I can see why AP holders would like more incentives. Aside from this, from a business point of view it makes no sense for Disney to target incentives at AP holders as they have already "got" that business and any discounts, etc, would just reduce their margin.

Taking Pete's often referred to suggestion of a loyalty scheme as an example (i.e. stay x number of nights at Disney resorts and get a free night). AP holders are generally the Disney fans who will stay many nights onsite anyway so they don't need to offer anymore incentives. In fact AP holders are the last people I would target for discounts unless it a case of filling rooms that would otherwise remain empty.

The real target for Disney discounts should be (and is) families who either never go to Disney (to encourage them to try it) or those who go every few years (to try and increase this frequency) - these are not Disney "fans" as such and certainly not hardcore AP holders.

Am I missing something?

Matthew

I think the biggest thing is comparing it to other AP programs out there. Disney's AP program is lacking compared to Universal. Universal and Sea World have very good discounts with their AP program. Disney's AP program is lacking compared to the other theme park destinations in Orlando.

In other words Disney needs to step up their game and show some loyalty. Disney may not need to match other AP programs because of who they are, but they at least need to show some appreciation to their most loyal customers.

 

[MJ6987]

IPretty much everywhere offers somekind of loyalty program.

I do agree with Pete though that a lot of it is down to Disney arrogance, that they will still come!

Roy

That's not arrogance, its due to the fairly unique nature of the product. It is difficult to compare to other companies that offer loyalty schemes - if Marriot don't offer a loyalty scheme then even its "loyal" customers are fairly happy to switch to a competitor that does, e.g Hilton. The same with airlines. This is not the case with Disney - at least not for AP holders (aka "fans") - despite their protests Disney fans will not suddenly start going to Universal or Six Flags, because of their emotional attachment to Disney. The nearest analogy I can think of is fans of a certain sports team who will not usually switch to supporting a local rival team because their team does not offer sufficient financial incentives!

Airlines, hotels or indeed SeaWorld / Universal do not have this sort of hold over its loyal customer base

 

[disneyholic family]

That's not arrogance, its due to the fairly unique nature of the product. It is difficult to compare to other companies that offer loyalty schemes - if Marriot don't offer a loyalty scheme then even its "loyal" customers are fairly happy to switch to a competitor that does, e.g Hilton. The same with airlines. This is not the case with Disney - at least not for AP holders (aka "fans") - despite their protests Disney fans will not suddenly start going to Universal or Six Flags, because of their emotional attachment to Disney. The nearest analogy I can think of is fans of a certain sports team who will not usually switch to supporting a local rival team because their team does not offer sufficient financial incentives!

Airlines, hotels or indeed SeaWorld / Universal do not have this sort of hold over its loyal customer base

you're right that i won't go to universal (since i hate it), but just because i have an AP, doesn't mean i'll stay at the disney resort...
by giving me an AP room discount, they'll fill an otherwise empty room....

if i don't stay onsite, then the only money they're going to make on me is for a few frozen cokes here and there....when i stay offsite, i also eat offsite...
when we stay onsite, we're much less likely to go to the trouble of eating offsite...

 

[soupy11]

Look at season's tickets for a pro sports team....not many incentive's there.

I think loyalty program's are hogwash anyways, they build the "freebies" into the costs. Our local supermarkets that offer loyalty programs also cost a lot more to shop at when compared to the no-frills places. The national gas companies all offer loyalty programs, but you gotta pay a couple cents above what the non-reward companies charge.

Do you think a company will just give stuff away for free? It's all smoke and mirrors anyways.

Ah well, getting too cynical in my advancing years

 

[disneyholic family]

actually, i'd be happy to give up the discounts if they would bring back the AP holders lounges in the parks..
they had that in a few of the parks a few years back...
i really enjoyed them....
they haven't brought any back, have they?

 

[WaltD4Me]

It costs less to keep a customer than get a new one.

And once you lose a customer, it is even most costly to get them back.

 

[Metro West]

actually, i'd be happy to give up the discounts if they would bring back the AP holders lounges in the parks..
they had that in a few of the parks a few years back...
i really enjoyed them....
they haven't brought any back, have they?

Nope.

you're right that i won't go to universal (since i hate it)

 

[exwdwcm]

It costs less to keep a customer than get a new one.

ding ding ding.

sure they already us, but they can always lose us too. Retention is key. so keeping us happy and making us feel 'special' and 'appreciated' is part of that deal!! in the long term, it is a good business decision to take care of your most loyal customers or else they won't stay loyal for long.

 

[GraceLuvsWDW]

I'm with Pete on the rants on this one! What burns me is when Disney specifically issues a discount that AP holders can't use or how they block AP holders from using some of the more popular discounts-all by putting a length of stay ticket purchase requirement. Then I am always peeved when I go to DLR and don't get ANY discount for being a WDW passholder (come on-even AAA gets a discount!). I could go on and on... If they didn't give the 15 months for 12 I wouldn't have renewed. They need to find a way to keep their loyal fans happy!

Wake up Disney!

 

[dpuck1998]

It costs less to keep a customer than get a new one.

I think also, a lot of us AP holders will visit more often with incentive. They know we are always on edge waiting for a reason to go, sometimes we just need a little push.

 

[SamSam]

I think also, a lot of us AP holders will visit more often with incentive. They know we are always on edge waiting for a reason to go, sometimes we just need a little push.

Agreed!

 

[mjp12831]

Discounts are essentially targeted marketing campaigns. They are NOT loyalty rewards.

The AP is a discount if you are able to visit the parks enough to make it worthwhile. By virtue of you buying an AP, you are already saying to Disney that you see value in that discount and are intending to frequently visit their parks. From a business standpoint, why would they want to offer an additional discount to a group that has already informed them that they will use their product?

Seems that some feel that purchasing an AP makes them part of an exclusive club or group and that as a result they are entitled to get further discounts. This isnt the case though.

Disney doesnt OWE anyone anything - it's a corporation and a business with an objective to maximize profits and stock earnings.