I don't get Pete's complaints about lack of AP incentives

[Sphyrna]

Personally, I don't think there is much value in the AP's unless you are able to go there quite often. I'll be going for 9 days this summer. I'm thinking about doing a second trip this winter. When I was looking at rooms and ticket options it looks like it'd be cheaper for me to do 10 day tickets for both trips than for an AP. Perhaps my math was off but if you have to do more than 20 days for the AP to be worth it, then there should be additional perks, discounts, incentives for it.

 

[scjo68]

Discounts are essentially targeted marketing campaigns. They are NOT loyalty rewards.

The AP is a discount if you are able to visit the parks enough to make it worthwhile. By virtue of you buying an AP, you are already saying to Disney that you see value in that discount and are intending to frequently visit their parks. From a business standpoint, why would they want to offer an additional discount to a group that has already informed them that they will use their product?

Seems that some feel that purchasing an AP makes them part of an exclusive club or group and that as a result they are entitled to get further discounts. This isnt the case though.

Disney doesnt OWE anyone anything - it's a corporation and a business with an objective to maximize profits and stock earnings.

I agree Disney doesn't owe anyone anything. What I am talking about would, I think, maximize their profits. No, an AP doesn't make someone actually part of an exclusive club. But I think that AP holders will be more loyal customers if they are made to feel valued.

Your point about why shouldn't offer perks to a group that is already using their product would make perfect sense if they had bought a lifetime pass. Then, yes, Disney would have that person's money up front. But if the AP holder is not happy with what that AP entitles them to, then they may not renew. Especially when they are in a local area where there are plenty of other recreational options.

 

[aurorae]

The Disney parks aren't just competing against other theme parks. They are competing with all vacation destinations and travel.

Maybe a lot of Disney fans won't visit Universal, but many of them would spend a week in a National Park, or traveling to another country, or going on a cruise, or doing something else instead of going to Disney.

I'll be going on a non Disney cruise soon, to a region that Disney doesn't cover, and at about half the price of a Disney cruise. The cruise line I will be sailing on has a repeat traveler program, of course.

I sort of think that Disney thinks that DVC is their frequent traveler program, in addition to being a cash cow, so they focus more on that than on AP holders.

 

[doconeill]

Last time this came up I played a little devil's advocate (I am an "AP Holder of opportunity" - I have them when it makes sense, and would love more discounts)...

...but the AP itself is already a discount, and it can be a BIG one if you can go often enough. Why is it necessary to be accompanied by more and more other discounts? I know the thinking behind offering them, but should they be expected to be there all the time?

 

[allison k]

By offering discounts, you are enticing frequent visitors to spend money when they may not have done so otherwise. Disneyland has had the issue of having increased park attendance with decreased income. Why? A big chunk of those people going to DL are AP holders who don't spend what a typical non-AP park visitor would spend. I don't see the need to spend $$ every time I go on souvenirs or food, and I know I'm not the only one. So, what would be a good way to get me to spend money? Offering discounts on things like food. I know that I get AP discounts to most counter service restaurants, so I may decide to eat lunch or dinner there, when it's just as convenient and cheaper to pack food or hit fast food on the way home.

This is just my example of why it's good for Disney to offer discounts to passholders...

 

[GraceLuvsWDW]

From a business standpoint, why would they want to offer an additional discount to a group that has already informed them that they will use their product?

Seems that some feel that purchasing an AP makes them part of an exclusive club or group and that as a result they are entitled to get further discounts. This isnt the case though.

Disney doesnt OWE anyone anything - it's a corporation and a business with an objective to maximize profits and stock earnings.

It seems they would want to say "Thank You" and "I appreciate your business" to those who frequently use their product/services. The same way frequent renters get discounts on cars, frequent air travelers earn free miles, punch cards at local businesses give you something free when you fill up the punch card, etc. This keeps their currently happy customers happy, and ensures that they'll STAY loyal customers and recommend the product/service to their friends, etc. Disney doesn't owe anything to anybody, yes that's true, but with profits decreasing, competition increasing (and stepping it up a notch: WWoHP), wouldn't they want to reward their most loyal customers with something more than the same thing (and even LESS in some cases) than the general public gets?

In almost every travel segment you see frequent ______ rewards.

 

[PrincessBelle39]

Hi,
AP holders are generally the Disney fans who will stay many nights onsite anyway so they don't need to offer anymore incentives. In fact AP holders are the last people I would target for discounts unless it a case of filling rooms that would otherwise remain empty.

Matthew

Mmmm not always the case. Out of the 8 weeks we have spent at WDW as AP holders, only one of those weeks was spent at an on-site hotel. The rest were offsite.

 

[Cyrano]

It costs less to keep a customer than get a new one.

Here, here. Truely understood by customer centric companies.

If you compare the benefits that Disneyland Paris annual passport holders receive I think you can appreciate why WDW AP holders feel undervalued.

This is for a Dream AP that has no blockout days.

-50% of Halloween or other special night tickets
-10% of restaurants
-20% of shopping on merchandise
-35% of hotel bookings
-20% for family bookings (5 or more tickets)
free parking
-20% of one day tickets for family/friends
-15% of Buffalo Bill show
extra magic hour access regardless of off-site/on-site hotel
free apritif at table service restaurants
free stroller rental
free wheelchair rental
-10% of Disney golf
-10% of any Disney Store

 

[lablady]

I think that the lack of incentives may be even more obvious when you are aware of the incentives that have been offered in the past. The prices go up, yet the perks disappear. Who wins there? Not the AP holder!

 

[hookedonears]

It's plain and simple. Good business is keeping the customers you have. Why not give more incentives to those that spend more money?

The ones who spend more money are the people who fly to Orlando, stay in the Disney Hotels and eat all of their meals at Disney restaurants. The vast majority of those are not Florida residents and are not AP holders.

 

[hookedonears]

Disney needs what the Airlines have. A frequent flyer, or frequent stayer program. Something like this: every night that you stay at a Disney hotel, you earn points. Delux would receive the most points, Moderates less and so on. After X number of points, you would receive a free night stay. That's what a lot of people want and I think Pete has eluded to something like this in the past.

 

[mjp12831]

It seems they would want to say "Thank You" and "I appreciate your business" to those who frequently use their product/services. The same way frequent renters get discounts on cars, frequent air travelers earn free miles, punch cards at local businesses give you something free when you fill up the punch card, etc. This keeps their currently happy customers happy, and ensures that they'll STAY loyal customers and recommend the product/service to their friends, etc. Disney doesn't owe anything to anybody, yes that's true, but with profits decreasing, competition increasing (and stepping it up a notch: WWoHP), wouldn't they want to reward their most loyal customers with something more than the same thing (and even LESS in some cases) than the general public gets?

In almost every travel segment you see frequent ______ rewards.

I think this is the point of confusion though - AP holders seem to feel like they are entitled to additional discounts because they bought the AP.

The AP IS the discount they are giving to frequent park visitors - Disney is therefore rewarding these people. I dont necessarily think that an AP holder is the most loyal customer - a family that visits once per year, stays on property and uses a disney dining plan probably drops significanlty more business on them.

Someone also pointed out that the Paris gives AP holders significant discounts - this is just supply and demand - WDW is much more of a vacation destination than DP. It doesnt make busness sense to offer discounts for places that are already filled. When Disney doesnt anticipate filling WDW, they offer hotel and dining discounts to the general public which makes far more sense than offering discounts to AP holders.

 

[jimmaher69]

I don't really care why or what is ranting about...its always entertaining!!!!!!

 

[GraceLuvsWDW]

I dont necessarily think that an AP holder is the most loyal customer - a family that visits once per year, stays on property and uses a disney dining plan probably drops significanlty more business on them.

I don't understand this statement? How can you extrapolate that a non AP holder spends more money per person per year at Disney than an AP holder? The purchase of the AP cannot be justified without over 10+ days in the parks, more days in the parks = more $$$ spent.
AP holders fly in, stay at Disney hotels, and eat at Disney restaurants too.
I understand the statement that there are MORE non ap holder visitors per year but I'd be willing to guess that AP holders spend more money on Disney and Disney owned items per capita per annum than non AP holders.
I'm confused by your rationale...

 

[bkoehl]

I don't understand this statement? How can you extrapolate that a non AP holder spends more money per person per year at Disney than an AP holder? The purchase of the AP cannot be justified without over 10+ days in the parks, more days in the parks = more $$$ spent.
AP holders fly in, stay at Disney hotels, and eat at Disney restaurants too.
I understand the statement that there are MORE non ap holder visitors per year but I'd be willing to guess that AP holders spend more money on Disney and Disney owned items per capita per annum than non AP holders.
I'm confused by your rationale...

Ditto! As an AP holder who has flown in 4 times already in less than one year I would definitely say I have proved my loyalty, in cash, to the Mouse! And having the AP has definitely me think about making more trips than I usually would, which of course means more money spent. And don't forget Tables in Wonderland-means I have to keep eating at all those restaurants. The argument that AP holders don't need incentives as they are already loyal customers makes MUCH more sense than AP holders spending less money than non-AP guests. I would guess we spend at least as much if not (a lot) more!

I also think a loyalty program would be great. Wouldn't have to be just for AP holders either. DCL does it, why shouldn't the parks?

 

[BriarRosie]

I think I understand Pete's rant because I'm a WDW AP holder who has gone to DL. At Disneyland, I was constantly asked at every counter and table service restaurant if I was an AP holder (for Disneyland). They get discounts for everything there.

WDW doesn't provide equal AP discounts compared to Disneyland. That's why I think Pete was wondering why WDW didn't offer better discounts for its own AP holders.

 

[sanapunk]

I was an AP holder back in 08-09, and for that one year span, I went on more unnecessary Disney trips than I ever would have. Why? Because I was an AP holder and knowing I could go any time I wanted was extremely tempting.

I stayed onsite twice, off twice. I went during free dining, forcing me to pay for a one day park ticket and pay rack rate. I also had the Tables in Wonderland card, so I had to maximize the value of that and ate at a lot of Disney restaraunts when I wasn't on my free dining trip.

When I went on a trip in December, I didn't get a room discount from my AP, had to use my AAA card to get one. I don't understand why their isn't always an AP room discount, if at any time you can just say you have AAA and they give you a discount (I do have a card, but they have NEVER asked to see it)

So I can definitely say that Disney made a lot of money off of me, more when I was an AP holder. I cannot afford to renew, and with the price increase, find it not to be worth it. Instead of spending money on 4 trips a year, I'm saving it to move to FL.

 

[kaligal]

It's good to appreciate your fans. A little token of appreciation goes a long way.

It is arrogant and stupid (if the former can be separated from the latter) to take your fans for granted, especially when they pay your salary. But that's what Disney is doing.

Disney considers their fans suckers. It'll bite them in the butt one day.

 

[Disney Dad Canada]

Look at season's tickets for a pro sports team....not many incentive's there.

It depends on the team. Here in Toronto, where the Leafs are king, since there's such a long waiting list for season tickets, no incentives are given. For the Bluejays, who are a rebuilding (again), I bought a 10 pack of tickets, got about a 10% discount on the tickets, 2 NFL tickets (at about $150 each), a meet and greet with the players, and a bunch of food coupons.

 

[mjp12831]

I don't understand this statement? How can you extrapolate that a non AP holder spends more money per person per year at Disney than an AP holder? The purchase of the AP cannot be justified without over 10+ days in the parks, more days in the parks = more $$$ spent.
AP holders fly in, stay at Disney hotels, and eat at Disney restaurants too.
I understand the statement that there are MORE non ap holder visitors per year but I'd be willing to guess that AP holders spend more money on Disney and Disney owned items per capita per annum than non AP holders.
I'm confused by your rationale...

Neither of us have the facts, but by virtue of the fact that Disney (Corp) offers AP discounts at other Disney parks but NOT at WDW, it makes me believe that their information shows them that the WDW business model relies less on the AP visitor as compared to their other parks. WDW is a destination with much more than just the 4 parks - other Disney places mentioned that do offer discounts to AP holders are more just parks (less or no water attractions, resorts, golf, entertainment, ...). If you are pitching just a park, a business model probably relies on the same people to visit more and spend money on food and merchandise. If you are selling a destination vacation, my guess is that you are not nearly as reliant on that AP holder who visits more than once or twice a year.

It would be interesting to know, but probably most AP holders (at all Disney parks - not jsut WDW) are relatively local or close to the parks. These are generally people who are already going to spend less on resorts and dining.

There is a business reason why Disney doesnt give AP discounts at WDW. AP holders shouldnt take it personally. Disney offers plenty of incentives throghout the year to get people to visit WDW, and these are busness based decisions - they aren't done as rewards to their best customers or to make everyone feel like they are valued. You as the customer need to evaluate all of these on an ongoing basis and figure out what is best for you. You have to take the emotion and entitlement out of it and just look at Disney as a business.

Customer loyalty programs and discounts are targeted marketing campaigns aimed at improving the profit of the Corporation. The fact that Disney doesn't offer AP discounts has nothing to do with them not valuing the AP holder's business - it is more likely simply a fact that they feel they dont need to offer discounts. If you were running your own business would you give discounts that didnt support your business model or make an impact on your bottom line?