How much is the lack of AP sales affecting DVC?

[RoseGold]

Does Universal offer Home-Away-From-Home accomadations like how Disney does? Do they offer ownership interests like how Disney does? (Genuinely curious)

Yes, they have hotels.

Orlando, like Florida in general, has an insane amount of timeshares, fractional condos, and so on. This is not hard to come by.

 

[dsanner106]

Yes, they have hotels.

Orlando, like Florida in general, has an insane amount of timeshares, fractional condos, and so on. This is not hard to come by.

Universal does not offer fractional ownership in their hotels. AP members are offered discounts, but that is it. You can certainly own other timeshares, I do, but they never will offer AP discounts as a perk, in that DVC is unique.

 

[RoseGold]

Universal does not offer fractional ownership in their hotels. AP members are offered discounts, but that is it. You can certainly own other timeshares, I do, but they never will offer AP discounts as a perk, in that DVC is unique.

DVC hasn't had that perk for years at this point. Even when APs were offered for a few weeks, DVC couldn't bother to pony up a small discount.

 

[Brian Noble]

They don’t even usually scan your pass so there would be no way for them to know if you’ve already gone on a particular ride.

They scanned our passes Every. Single. Time. over the course of our six day visit. According to the web site, it is once-per-ride. Perhaps the web site is wrong! We never tried; I just took the web site on face value. (We didn't lack for things to do, either.)

From the T&Cs (emphasis added):

Valid Premier Annual Pass required for admission. Valid only after 4:00PM. Limit one (1) express ride access entry per participating attraction using the Uni¬versal Express™ queue. Not valid at Pteranodon Flyers™ at Universal’s Islands of Adventure, at Universal’s Volcano Bay, other select attractions, and separately ticketed events. Universal Express ride access at Universal Studios Florida and Islands of Adventure is a separate queue with a shorter wait time at participat¬ing attractions. Available during normal theme park operating hours only. Additional restrictions may apply and benefits are subject to change without notice.

 

[dsanner106]

DVC hasn't had that perk for years at this point. Even when APs were offered for a few weeks, DVC couldn't bother to pony up a small discount.

I still have my DVC AP, and will be renewing shortly. I originally purchased my first DVC contract specifically because of the AP discount, factoring in how many renewals at discount rate would pay back my purchase cost. It remains a factor.

 

[RoseGold]

I still have my DVC AP, and will be renewing shortly. I originally purchased my first DVC contract specifically because of the AP discount, factoring in how many renewals at discount rate would pay back my purchase cost. It remains a factor.

So, you are renewing a sorcerer pass. You didn't get a discount on it last time, and won't now. You were "allowed" to purchase it at full price, and new owners can't even do that.

 

[dsanner106]

So, you are renewing a sorcerer pass. You didn't get a discount on it last time, and won't now. You were "allowed" to purchase it at full price, and new owners can't even do that.

 

[dsanner106]

So, you are renewing a sorcerer pass. You didn't get a discount on it last time, and won't now. You were "allowed" to purchase it at full price, and new owners can't even do that.

Yes, I DID get a discounted renewal the last time, have called in and will be getting a discount again this year. I have no idea where you get your information but know that you don't have an AP. I have first-hand knowledge.

 

[zavandor]

Anyone hoping to get an AP: DLP has just suspended the sale of AP too. They're working on "new products" that will be revealed later this year.
Maybe it's unrelated, maybe not.

 

[Sandisw]

So, you are renewing a sorcerer pass. You didn't get a discount on it last time, and won't now. You were "allowed" to purchase it at full price, and new owners can't even do that.

Huh? DVC Sorcerer pass renewal is given a 15% discount off the full price of the pass. Not sure I understand your post.

 

[RoseGold]

Huh? DVC Sorcerer pass renewal is given a 15% discount off the full price of the pass. Not sure I understand your post.

There is no DVC discount. That's the renewal discount, which all APs get.

 

[Sandisw]

There is no DVC discount. That's the renewal discount, which all APs get.

Okay..but i think it was clear that is what the poster was referring to.

 

[fitnessmouse]

Anyone hoping to get an AP: DLP has just suspended the sale of AP too. They're working on "new products" that will be revealed later this year.
Maybe it's unrelated, maybe not.

Just to clarify; DLP stands for Disneyland Paris in this case. (I sometimes get confused and think it’s Disneyland Park)

I think the new Paris AP program will be similar to Anaheims Magic Keys

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

They scanned our passes Every. Single. Time. over the course of our six day visit. According to the web site, it is once-per-ride. Perhaps the web site is wrong! We never tried; I just took the web site on face value. (We didn't lack for things to do, either.)

From the T&Cs (emphasis added):

That’s crazy, so you have the premier annual pass and they scanned you? I think we were scanned one out of every ten times. I didn’t really think about it- like whether or not we should be scanned. They just always looked at your pass and waved you through.
It seems like they scanned on the men in black ride pretty regularly but not always. We never had an issue with riding rides more than once. I wonder if that is a very recent rule? We also did the mummy 2x in a row with the express pass. But mostly, we just took rides once per day.

 

[zavandor]

Just to clarify; DLP stands for Disneyland Paris in this case. (I sometimes get confused and think it’s Disneyland Park)

I think the new Paris AP program will be similar to Anaheims Magic Keys

They already are similar. In Paris they have a reservation system and a limited amount of days bookable in advance depending on tier.

 

[Brian Noble]

That’s crazy, so you have the premier annual pass and they scanned you? I think we were scanned one out of every ten times. I didn’t really think about it- like whether or not we should be scanned. They just always looked at your pass and waved you through.

Yes. The entrance to the express queue would wave us in taking a quick look at the Premiere AP, but there was a TM later in the line that would scan it. Usually that was close to merge, but not always. Every single time.

It might be when we've gone. We went during one of the four or five busiest weeks in the past year and a half per thrill-data. During a quieter time, they might not bother with the second TM, figuring that it doesn't really matter.

 

[E2ME2]

I just booked a stay for mid May. My plan this time is to buy the Universal ticket they are currently selling where you pay for 3 days and get 2 free. I have one day left from my WDW ticket that was extended due to the Hurricane last September and I may purchase a ticket to the after hours event at DHS that falls during my stay. I also still have an old one day non expiring ticket that I need to find as well as one day left on a really old pre AK ticket from my first ever visit to WDW which I know they would only give me money toward a new ticket for. I'm sick of the Disney money grab and have really wanted to go back to Universal to fully immerse in all the Harry Potter stuff as well as visit the original Universal Park as I've only ever visited Islands of Adventure 2 times and Universal Hollywood once. I couldn't believe how much cheaper a Universal ticket is compared to a Disney one. I just need to figure out how I'll be going back and forth to Universal from SSR. I think the Mears shuttle may work out better for me as a solo rather than renting a car and paying for parking at Universal. Last time I checked car rental prices they were beyond crazy. The only reason I booked this trip was because I still had some banked points to burn off before the end of my use year.

It’s an easy drive to USO from SSR, but not sure what Parking is like if you’re not staying in a USO resort. We visited USO in 2021 for the first time, and were surprised that USO resort guests had to pay a daily parking fee! Also surprised at how small USO is compared to WDW - so I’m not surprised that the USO tix are considerably cheaper.

 

[BroganMc]

I have an annual pass. I let it go in 2020 but when they reopen sales in 2021 I bought a new one. With a DVC discount. Yes they were still offering it at the time. They shut down annual past sales in October but after my brother, my nephew and a friend of mine got there annual passes. My sister chose to pass on it at the time, a decision she regrets to this day.

We've all been renewing our annual passes and waiting anxiously for the sales to come back again. I will get my sister annual pass as soon as they do. And I've heard all the blogs and followed all the theories on when we might actually see an annual pasd sale again. I do think they will come back. The fact that Disneyland is offering it is a good sign.

As far as how it affects DVC sales, I absolutely believe the lack of an annual pass has contributed to the market. It's not just the economy. It takes time for these things to take place. Remember annual past sales were active for 2 and 1/2 months in 2021. If anyone purchased one then, it would cover them for a year. And if it didn't, a lot of people were not traveling yet until the end of 2021. Usually sales for real estate take a year or so before you see the trickle down effect.

I also don't believe the poppycock that annual passholders don't spend money compared to day ticket holders. That theory is based entirely on the presumption than an annual pass holder is a local who lives within half an hour of the parks. It does not consider annual passholders who are DVC members. These guests visit several times a year from out of state. And because they're only in town for a limited amount of time, they want to get the most out of their trip as possible. That means meals, souvenirs, tours and other special experiences. They are the ones spending the money! Not the day ticket holders who came for 5 days and have spent all of their finances on tickets.

Disney has yet to prove me wrong on this.

I know for my family, those who have annual passes make multiple trips to Disney and spend more money. Those who don't, limit the amount of time they visit Orlando and spend very little money. They're too busy reeling from the sticker shock of park tickets.

 

[mz-s]

I have an annual pass. I let it go in 2020 but when they reopen sales in 2021 I bought a new one. With a DVC discount. Yes they were still offering it at the time. They shut down annual past sales in October but after my brother, my nephew and a friend of mine got there annual passes. My sister chose to pass on it at the time, a decision she regrets to this day.

We've all been renewing our annual passes and waiting anxiously for the sales to come back again. I will get my sister annual pass as soon as they do. And I've heard all the blogs and followed all the theories on when we might actually see an annual pasd sale again. I do think they will come back. The fact that Disneyland is offering it is a good sign.

As far as how it affects DVC sales, I absolutely believe the lack of an annual pass has contributed to the market. It's not just the economy. It takes time for these things to take place. Remember annual past sales were active for 2 and 1/2 months in 2021. If anyone purchased one then, it would cover them for a year. And if it didn't, a lot of people were not traveling yet until the end of 2021. Usually sales for real estate take a year or so before you see the trickle down effect.

I also don't believe the poppycock that annual passholders don't spend money compared to day ticket holders. That theory is based entirely on the presumption than an annual pass holder is a local who lives within half an hour of the parks. It does not consider annual passholders who are DVC members. These guests visit several times a year from out of state. And because they're only in town for a limited amount of time, they want to get the most out of their trip as possible. That means meals, souvenirs, tours and other special experiences. They are the ones spending the money! Not the day ticket holders who came for 5 days and have spent all of their finances on tickets.

Disney has yet to prove me wrong on this.

I know for my family, those who have annual passes make multiple trips to Disney and spend more money. Those who don't, limit the amount of time they visit Orlando and spend very little money. They're too busy reeling from the sticker shock of park tickets.

I agree, but have nothing to offer except anecdotal evidence as well. I am sure Disney has all the hard data. I think the main reason they don't offer new APs right now is just that they get way more money in ticket sales - not just in-park spend but ticket media itself (obviously) and don't need to dangle the AP carrot to fill the parks.

 

[Brian Noble]

I also don't believe the poppycock that annual passholders don't spend money compared to day ticket holders. That theory is based entirely on the presumption than an annual pass holder is a local who lives within half an hour of the parks.

No, it isn't. It's based on Disney's direct observations: When X% of the guests in the park are AP holders, they make $M in revenue per guest. When Y% of the guests in the park are AP holders, they make $N in revenue per guest. Y is less than X, but N is more than M.

Disney has yet to prove me wrong on this.

They are saying as much during their earnings reports. Those are required, by law, to be accurate. So either Disney is incompetent at basic math, or they are lying and risking legal penalties for no good reason. I don't think either is likely.

I suppose if you really want the proof, you're going to have to join Disney's accounting unit. They have the data you'd need to either prove or disprove the statement.

I think the main reason they don't offer new APs right now is just that they get way more money in ticket sales - not just in-park spend but ticket media itself (obviously) and don't need to dangle the AP carrot to fill the parks.

That's exactly right. The two primary measures of amusement park performance are attendance, and something called "per-capita spending." Per-capita spending is based on how much admission revenue was attributed to guests that day, plus the total in-park spending. In park spending is easy to measure--what do the cash registers read at the end of the day. Admission revenue is a little more subtle, because you have to spread the cost of the admission media over the number of admissions for each guest. But there are well-known ways of doing that for passholders.

This doesn't mean that there aren't some APers who contribute more to the per-captia number than the average day guest. I'm sure there are! But the spending by individuals does not matter, except in how it contributes to the overall picture. And on average Passholders are less profitable than day guests. So on average Disney is better off restricting the flow of AP guests, unless and until they can no longer meet their attendance targets by doing so.