How long before this attitude from Disney devalues DVC.

[Maistre Gracey]

versus pre-pandemic local AP holders who visit constantly but spend $0 to de minimis on many visits.

This line of thought has always puzzled me.
I assure you that I constantly spend more than most while at WDW, as do other local folks I know.

 

[jbh275]

I'm definitely more worried about flooding the market with DVC rooms. As they continue to build properties, the overall value could drop. Also, everything posted here makes a big difference. Could really bring the value down. But I still love going!

 

[RivShore]

This line of thought has always puzzled me.
I assure you that I constantly spend more than most while at WDW, as do other local folks I know.

I agree, the local WDW AP's that we know spend money regularly on food and product and Disney has to know that.
I think Disney looks at DL AP's much differently, from their point of view, they just clog up an already tight park and don't spend a lot.

 

[mgarbowski]

This line of thought has always puzzled me.
I assure you that I constantly spend more than most while at WDW, as do other local folks I know.

Your claim is that you often spend more per day than many people who stay at Disney hotels, eat 3 meals on property and buy all of their souvenirs over the course of a single 4-7 day visit?
OK.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

Your claim is that you often spend more per day than many people who stay at Disney hotels, eat 3 meals on property and buy all of their souvenirs over the course of a single 4-7 day visit?
OK.

Well one day vs seven days is not a fair comparison, but per day, absolutely.

 

[RivShore]

Your claim is that you often spend more per day than many people who stay at Disney hotels, eat 3 meals on property and buy all of their souvenirs over the course of a single 4-7 day visit?
OK.

For a local who goes a few times a week, I could possibly see total spend approaching a single 4-7 day visit. Heck one meal a week means the AP bought twice as many meals as the 7 day visitor buying 3 meals a day.

 

[mgarbowski]

If the average daily spend of local AP visitors were more than that of the average annual-or-less visitors, Disney would not be restricting AP access and we would not be having this discussion.

 

[MJJME]

D'Amaro said it a few weeks ago..........The success of the parks and the demand has allowed them to make cuts and increase pricing......So it's all the people paying more and more while getting less and less every year...

Mr. D’Amaro has claimed that he’s aware of the tension and anger caused by rising prices at the Parks, especially for annual pass holders and the whole Disneyland Magic Key renewal fiasco, but describes rising prices as the “inevitable result of progress and insists that every change Disney has implemented at the parks is in service of improving visitors’ trips.



We wont be part of it, we have moved on and wont be back

 

[RivShore]

If the average daily spend of local AP visitors were more than that of the average annual-or-less visitors, Disney would not be restricting AP access and we would not be having this discussion.

If they are looking at average daily spend for AP vs. average daily spend for a once annual visitor then yes, the once annual will always be spending more. But if they took the long term view (I know, no way a corp is looking at the long term), the full annual spend of a local AP could easily excede that of a once a year visitor's spend.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

If the average daily spend of local AP visitors were more than that of the average annual-or-less visitors, Disney would not be restricting AP access and we would not be having this discussion.

Can’t speak for average, but you you said “constantly spend $0”.

I assure you, many local folks are far from that category.
We are heading to F&W next weekend. Do you think we are going to aimlessly walk around and buy no food or drink? We will literally spend hundreds on food & drink alone between my wife and I.
Plus, because we will be imbibing, we got a hotel for one night. We have reservations the following day for lunch at HoB after some shopping at Springs.

 

[keishashadow]

I think Disney looks at DL AP's much differently, from their point of view, they just clog up an already tight park and don't spend a lot.

The housing market in Orlando is exploding. Not quite as dense as Anaheim - yet. I’m sure WDW will do everything they can manage to avoid what they consider similar DL day guest/local issues forming in Orlando

Decades ago, I remember being stunned seeing blankets on the curbs pop up in the late AM at DL. It was usually manned by an older woman with a picnic basket. It was explained to me as a legacy tradition of sorts that would hold down turf for their family & friends for the parade & FW.

They’ve put a stop to that and instituted many other changes that haven’t exactly gone over well both in CA & FL. While I do think the WSJ article was rattling the saber a bit, do think they will push the envelope as far as they can.

My personal concerns are mostly two fold:

the possibility of losing the DVC AP discount (we are still able to renew, phew) &

To a much lesser degree, a disney Prime/reward program that would not credit DVC members earning points on their stays.

YMMV, we all have our triggers.

appears it’s time to update the definition of Legacy:

Disney guests who have been superseded but, are difficult to replace due to wide use.

when the worm inevitably does turn, and the next recession hits, it will be the legacy guests…the locals & the DVC members who again keep the disney boat afloat.

 

[CraigInPA]

when the worm inevitably does turn, and the next recession hits, it will be the legacy guests…the locals & the DVC members who again keep the disney boat afloat.

Agreed. Disney is riding the wave of pandemic-delayed vacations and excess funds from pandemic incentives. We're seeing that wave come in to shore with slower traffic to the parks (pictures of last week look like the days of old, where you can actually see pavement between people!) and more room availability. That wave is about to crash. When it does, those "high value" one visit guests are going to stay home, and we'll be back to seeing 25-35% off deluxe resort room discounts and Disney doing everything they can to get people back. AP's will return, because Disney is dependent upon "gate counts". They report them as a key performance indicator. When there are no "high value" one visit guests coming, they fill the gap with AP holders and locals. After 9/11, they offered Floridians a $99 for "any 4 days" deal, while charging about $50 a day to non-Floridians. I expect we'll see similar deals offered when they get desperate for bodies to pass through the gates. But, the question is whether people will want to come back after the many mis-steps by Disney, including the "cheapening" of the experiences that were WDW and DL (as boasted to by the Disney executives to the shareholders).

 

[bobbiwoz]

Many of the CMs we talked to last week told us the lower crowds were typical of the time of year and crowds will pick up at the end of September. I wouldn’t read to much about current lower crowds.

We (DVC) and our guests ( Florida, but not locals) have AP’s, and our expectations and experiences were satisfied during our visit. Now, because of lower crowds we were able to make ADRs for Beaches and Cream same day, and Chefs de France next day, and meals were excellent!

 

[AdamsMum]

Many of the CMs we talked to last week told us the lower crowds were typical of the time of year and crowds will pick up at the end of September. I wouldn’t read to much about current lower crowds.

We (DVC) and our guests ( Florida, but not locals) have AP’s, and our expectations and experiences were satisfied during our visit. Now, because of lower crowds we were able to make ADRs for Beaches and Cream same day, and Chefs de France next day, and meals were excellent!

Yeah, but September heat! I've considered a trip at this time with the kids back in school and pre F&W madness, but the heat...I always backed off. I guess I'm just not made of the right stuff. LOL Glad you were able to get those air conditioned ADRs though. Sounds like you had a great time.

 

[RivShore]

Many of the CMs we talked to last week told us the lower crowds were typical of the time of year and crowds will pick up at the end of September. I wouldn’t read to much about current lower crowds.

We (DVC) and our guests ( Florida, but not locals) have AP’s, and our expectations and experiences were satisfied during our visit. Now, because of lower crowds we were able to make ADRs for Beaches and Cream same day, and Chefs de France next day, and meals were excellent!

True, late August thru late September were always one of the slowest periods. In fact when the kids were young, we used to do a late August trip just before their school started, for the low crowds.

The question will be, when it picks up again in a month, will it pick back up to the crazy crowds of earlier this year or will it be more normal crowds? More normal crowds makes for a much better experience (as we had last week) and speaks to Disney trying to keep the crowds manageable with price increases and AP restrictions.

 

[bobbiwoz]

Yeah, but September heat! I've considered a trip at this time with the kids back in school and pre F&W madness, but the heat...I always backed off. I guess I'm just not made of the right stuff. LOL Glad you were able to get those air conditioned ADRs though. Sounds like you had a great time.

The rain did prevent me from seeing the night show at DHS. It’s been years since we’ve seen the projections, and it was something I definitely wanted to do, but not enough to go out in pouring rain.

It was hot.

I absolutely thought the MNSSHP had the best parade and fireworks ever!! At $99, a buy!! Even the treat bags were special for the 50th celebration!

 

[AvidDisReader]

Many of the CMs we talked to last week told us the lower crowds were typical of the time of year and crowds will pick up at the end of September. I wouldn’t read to much about current lower crowds.

We (DVC) and our guests ( Florida, but not locals) have AP’s, and our expectations and experiences were satisfied during our visit. Now, because of lower crowds we were able to make ADRs for Beaches and Cream same day, and Chefs de France next day, and meals were excellent!

It is important to remember that much of the surge in October comes from Foreign vactioners. They traditionally have a 4 to 6 week holiday during this time period. With all the economic issues going on around the world, will there be the same number of Foreign travelers? Stay tuned.

 

[RivShore]

It is important to remember that much of the surge in October comes from Foreign vactioners. They traditionally have a 4 to 6 week holiday during this time period. With all the economic issues going on around the world, will there be the same number of Foreign travelers? Stay tuned.

Good point. Do you know if the oversees visitors are mostly from Europe, South America, and or Asia? I could see European travel slowing down greatly due to the weakened Euro and all the energy cost increases. Asia might still come, other than China with their continuing ridiculous lockdowns. And SA I would imagine would still vacation.

 

[AvidDisReader]

Good point. Do you know if the oversees visitors are mostly from Europe, South America, and or Asia? I could see European travel slowing down greatly due to the weakened Euro and all the energy cost increases. Asia might still come, other than China with their continuing ridiculous lockdowns. And SA I would imagine would still vacation

My wife and I love going this time of year. We run into most from Great Britain and Brazil.

 

[SL6827]

To a much lesser degree, a disney Prime/reward program that would not credit DVC members earning points on their stays.

I believe you are onto a very possible sceniro that could get very, very ugly!