How do you handle the Holidays when...

[NewRVLady]

Although this is a discussion board, we can offer suggestions, but she is not obligated to answer these personal questions. There have been several posters that have offered helpful suggestions without prying and targeting the OP. Those responses are part of what makes the DIS such a great forum. Posts that badger the OP and become argumentative take away from any constructive discussion.

Thank you for saying this

We are constantly refuguring holidays....in the future thanksgiving with my Northern son( we can drive- but don't want to face snow at Christmas) and small Christmas here- new DIL has a huge family and so far we have managed to see them on Christmas/ but she is an ER nurse and often has to work holidays( ugh!)

 

[pryncess527]

And whirlwind was fly down one day, relax in the evening, do DHS the next day, then fly home the following day. .

That's exactly what I pictured -- and sounds like a nightmare to me! I do this for a handful of football games, because football is practically my life in the fall, but travelling like that in a short time period takes a lot out of me, it's not something I'm eager to do. I only say that to suggest that perhaps him saying No to the trip isn't as personal as you are taking it, not everyone finds a whirlwind trip like that to be relaxing or enjoyable. Even if you know your son doesn't feel that way about whirlwind trips, if his partner does then he may have been taking that into consideration.

 

[pat fan]

Then set up a time beforehand to meet up with him. have lunch together, dinner, a couple of drinks or whatever. I don't understand why that does not seem to be a solution.

You say this as if we've never tried to get together. Hopefully we can.

 

[Nancyg56]

Where did she say she had problems with her son's bf or her son's lifestyle? She, in fact, said that she felt it was outside influences and that those influences were NOT the bf. So actually she did say she has her suspensions of where this is coming from.

Why must it always be assumed that it is the parents?

She never did, but when people are comfortable with sexual orientation they generally can use pronouns. The OP cannot.

I am a parent, I get that there are just some circumstances that suck and there are times it is not you , it is the kid. I have one of those kids. I love him to the moon and back, would do anything for him, but Holy Difficult! But he comes to everything. I mean EVERYTHING! Except vacations Then he is very vocal about not joining us. At that point I want to say GOOD! But I don't. So I know it is not always the parents btu in this case, there is a lot more going on.

Actually, I was extremely upset that he didn't want to go see the lights. And I don't know the reason other than he said he was not interested in going on a vacation with us. fair enough, but it was not a money or time thing, he is on a two week vacation now and said he's trying to use more vacation time up between now and the first of the year. And whirlwind was fly down one day, relax in the evening, do DHS the next day, then fly home the following day. I may have replied to him in a non-plussed way, or said it that way here, but trust me, on top of the comments this summer, it hurt. A lot. And is also why I probably got more hurt than I normally would have over the no Thanksgiving time and less on Christmas. It was cumulative.

I may have misspoke about college loans, did I say college loans? It was credit card debt. And we just gave him quite a bit of money down on it this summer. He does have college loans but those are fine.

I didn't mean to imply at all the a Christmas visit was "too long" just that a big holiday like that is not my ideal first real meeting with someone! I'm not very good in social settings, have a hard time talking to people I don't know, ANYONE regardless of the situation, so I wish we knew him better, or at all really, before Christmas! And I am not determined to have anything my way. I think it would be better for everyone's Christmas day schedule to have it another day, but Christmas in shifts it is because that seems to be what will work for THEIR schedules, not mine.

Two things. My son would never join us on a vacation like this whirlwind Osbourn Lights trip. I cannot even get him to come on a relaxing 6, 7, 8, 9, 10...day trip. Nothing. And he is so socially awkward he tells me exactly why he will not go. I won't leave him and his wife out, but I know he is not joining us. Your trip? I would rather chew glass and die then do that. And I love Disney.

OP- I say this in the kindest way I can. Let this go. Call your son and invite him and his SO for every gathering. If he can come be happy. If he he says he cannot, tell him you will miss him, and will see him when they have time. If he can only come for a few hours, enjoy his visit.

If you all are vacationing, invite them. If they decline be gracious. If they come, treat them the same you treat your other son and his wife.
Whatever you do, stop talking. My husband gave me this advice when my youngest brought home the most awful girl on the face of the Earth. She was the poster child of nasty. He finally told me to stop. Just stop. Not to say one word that was not nice. You do the same, it makes all the difference in theworld

 

[quandrea]

We vacation as a family--dh, me and the kids. Full stop. I would NEVER vacation with my parents, the in laws, my sisters, dh's siblings. That's our time and we want to be completely free. We love dh's family to death but it would never happen. We are all adults and the dynamic is different than when we were kids. We are very close with dh's sister, her husband and their kids. We get along great, but we would never travel with them. We just have a different way of doing things. This happens as you launch into adulthood. I wouldn't take your son's refusal to travel with you personally. Again, he has shifted gears. Vacationing with the parents is probably no longer his idea of a good time.

This is the kind of thing that used to anger my parents. They wanted us there in the way we were as kids. The thing is, we aren't kids any more. I read your post pan fan and I just hear alarm bells going off in my head. You guys are headed down a bad road. As others have said, step back, let it go. Just take the holiday as it comes. Be loving and gracious in the moment and let go of the bitterness.

 

[Nancyg56]

We vacation as a family--dh, me and the kids. Full stop. I would NEVER vacation with my parents, the in laws, my sisters, dh's siblings. That's our time and we want to be completely free. We love dh's family to death but it would never happen. We are all adults and the dynamic is different than when we were kids. We are very close with dh's sister, her husband and their kids. We get along great, but we would never travel with them. We just have a different way of doing things. This happens as you launch into adulthood. I wouldn't take your son's refusal to travel with you personally. Again, he has shifted gears. Vacationing with the parents is probably no longer his idea of a good time.

This is the kind of thing that used to anger my parents. They wanted us there in the way we were as kids. The thing is, we aren't kids any more. I read your post pan fan and I just hear alarm bells going off in my head. You guys are headed down a bad road. As others have said, step back, let it go. Just take the holiday as it comes. Be living and gracious in the moment and let go of the bitterness.

My DD and my DS and their spouses like to vacation with us, and they invites us, we invite them. But.....we know how to give each other space. My oldest, the one who refuses to join us, has command performances with his wife's family, and both agree it is a living Hell. They cannot have one minte free from the group, not one second. Now their vacations are always spend with her family because they live clea across the country and that is when they visit. ANna says it is nto a cvacaion but a visit, and both she and my son want desperately to go off on their own. They come home more stressed than when tey left, and when the parents visit them it is even worse.

I think tha it is neve a good idea to have my way o the high way paenting, all it does is cause stress. You see, I prefer that I not hear he does nto want to join us, but I get it, and I respect this. I think more parents should as well.

 

[sonnyjane]

She never did, but when people are comfortable with sexual orientation they generally can use pronouns. The OP cannot.

I am a parent, I get that there are just some circumstances that suck and there are times it is not you , it is the kid. I have one of those kids. I love him to the moon and back, would do anything for him, but Holy Difficult! But he comes to everything. I mean EVERYTHING! Except vacations Then he is very vocal about not joining us. At that point I want to say GOOD! But I don't. So I know it is not always the parents btu in this case, there is a lot more going on.



Two things. My son would never join us on a vacation like this whirlwind Osbourn Lights trip. I cannot even get him to come on a relaxing 6, 7, 8, 9, 10...day trip. Nothing. And he is so socially awkward he tells me exactly why he will not go. I won't leave him and his wife out, but I know he is not joining us. Your trip? I would rather chew glass and die then do that. And I love Disney.

OP- I say this in the kindest way I can. Let this go. Call your son and invite him and his SO for every gathering. If he can come be happy. If he he says he cannot, tell him you will miss him, and will see him when they have time. If he can only come for a few hours, enjoy his visit.

If you all are vacationing, invite them. If they decline be gracious. If they come, treat them the same you treat your other son and his wife.
Whatever you do, stop talking. My husband gave me this advice when my youngest brought home the most awful girl on the face of the Earth. She was the poster child of nasty. He finally told me to stop. Just stop. Not to say one word that was not nice. You do the same, it makes all the difference in theworld

How did my quote about "she goes or you go?" From the other thread end up here?

 

[phorsenuf]

How did my quote about "she goes or you go?" From the other thread end up here?

Must have still been in the quote box when you quoted the new post here.

 

[phorsenuf]

You say this as if we've never tried to get together. Hopefully we can.

Well, it had been mentioned several times and no response had ever had an indication that you have tried in the past.

 

[TLSnell1981]

If you're suggesting that you would give the exact same advice in each of those situations, I personally don't think your advice would be very useful.

Meh. I doubt you'd think, my advice would be useful under most circumstances. No worries, I'm not offended.

 

[Nancyg56]

How did my quote about "she goes or you go?" From the other thread end up here?

I start to post on something and then think better and move on. This must have gotten stuck in the quotes and I missed it.

So sorry!

 

[Nancyg56]

Must have still been in the quote box when you quoted the new post here.

That is exact;y what happened. I need to edit it out!

 

[Nancyg56]

How did my quote about "she goes or you go?" From the other thread end up here?

I foxed it. I am so sorry!

 

[lizzi6692]

Where did she say she had problems with her son's bf or her son's lifestyle? She, in fact, said that she felt it was outside influences and that those influences were NOT the bf. So actually she did say she has her suspensions of where this is coming from.

Why must it always be assumed that it is the parents?

She has mentioned in other threads that she felt college "indoctrinated" her son. That definitely doesn't sound like something someone would say that agrees with her son's "lifestyle".

 

[gotomu212]

I haven't posted yet because some of this feels very close to home but I really think the OP is trying to do the right thing so I wanted to add my experience.

My MIL did not like me in the beginning- at all, almost didn't come to our wedding. Her attitude really caused my husband to pull away and I was accused of breaking up the family, etc. It hurt a lot and I hurt most for my husband who was missing out on this relationship but he kept saying he was done with her thinking she could dictate his choices and I was his life now.

Fast forward three years of almost no contact. We asked if we could come see them for thanksgiving and agreed to stop by for 3 hours. I'll be honest, I was dreading it. No one likes to go somewhere that they know someone isn't a fan and what if my husband and she argued, etc. To my surprise MIL was SO nice and everyone was trying SO hard to make this work (FIL also kept offering wine I think to grease the skids at 11 am). She was so welcoming that it was clear we were letting the past go, and we ended up staying over 10 hours.

I share this to say, even though your son is only coming for a few hours on Christmas, this is really your chance. A chance to show him and his boyfriend that you acknowledge they are adults and want to get to know the boyfriend so you feel the same way about him that you do your daughter in law (who is one of the family to you). This can be the first step towards rebuilding a relationship that's off track and starting on a new path as adults.

 

[littleblackegg]

Where did she say she had problems with her son's bf or her son's lifestyle? She, in fact, said that she felt it was outside influences and that those influences were NOT the bf. So actually she did say she has her suspensions of where this is coming from.

Why must it always be assumed that it is the parents?

It is my experience from working with mental health patients that avoidance, or, being unwilling to discuss any details of a situation, obscuring the gender of a person with use of gender-neutral phrases and gender-neutral pronouns, and referring to a single person in a discussion by a vague term such as "so" when everyone else is referred to as he, she, daughter-in-law, son, husband, etc is attempting to hide or deny this person for some reason. It's common. So, she let everyone know with her word choices that she was/is uncomfortable. As for those outside influences? People are born gay or lesbian. Other people do not "turn" them that way. Her son is gay because he is gay. He was made that way, and that is 100% fine.

 

[littleblackegg]

She has mentioned in other threads that she felt college "indoctrinated" her son. That definitely doesn't sound like something someone would say that agrees with her son's "lifestyle".

Rubbish. That's terrible. We are born with the sexual preferences we are going to have. It may get honed or tweaked a little, but we get what we get.

 

[lizzi6692]

Rubbish. That's terrible. We are born with the sexual preferences we are going to have. It may get honed or tweaked a little, but we get what we get.

I completely agree, but based on past posts I don't think the OP thinks so.

 

[cabanafrau]

Actually, I was extremely upset that he didn't want to go see the lights. And I don't know the reason other than he said he was not interested in going on a vacation with us. fair enough, but it was not a money or time thing, he is on a two week vacation now and said he's trying to use more vacation time up between now and the first of the year. And whirlwind was fly down one day, relax in the evening, do DHS the next day, then fly home the following day. I may have replied to him in a non-plussed way, or said it that way here, but trust me, on top of the comments this summer, it hurt. A lot. And is also why I probably got more hurt than I normally would have over the no Thanksgiving time and less on Christmas. It was cumulative.

I may have misspoke about college loans, did I say college loans? It was credit card debt. And we just gave him quite a bit of money down on it this summer. He does have college loans but those are fine.

I didn't mean to imply at all the a Christmas visit was "too long" just that a big holiday like that is not my ideal first real meeting with someone! I'm not very good in social settings, have a hard time talking to people I don't know, ANYONE regardless of the situation, so I wish we knew him better, or at all really, before Christmas! And I am not determined to have anything my way. I think it would be better for everyone's Christmas day schedule to have it another day, but Christmas in shifts it is because that seems to be what will work for THEIR schedules, not mine.

I'm going to ask this question here but I don't necessarily mean it as something I want you to answer me, but answer for your own self because I think it is very important. Why were you "extremely upset" that he didn't want to go see the lights? I think the honest answer to that will be very helpful for you to admit to yourself. Like I said, I'm not asking for you to answer and feed any drama here, but to be bluntly honest with yourself if you have not done so.

I'll say this as respectfully as I can, this is a control issue with you. It is the same reason you're dancing a jig around why the timing and length of the Christmas visit doesn't suit, and why you'd prefer not to have the first real meeting be on Christmas. This doesn't mean you're a bad person or a bad mom, but it is presenting an obstacle to something you desire very much, a close relationship with your son. You're going to have to make a choice, will it be more a priority for you to be in the driver's seat or will you sit in the backseat (and bite your tongue if necessary to avoid backseat driving) and enjoy the leisurely drive to wherever if it means you spend some quality time with your son, hopefully on a relatively frequent basis?

Since you've been pretty beaten up here and probably would like to wring my neck, I'll give you a bit of a breather and give you some entirely different types of questions to consider. Does your son share some of your personality traits? Is it his way or the highway? Did the apple fall beneath your tree? Possibly you haven't even considered that if things at home ran on your master plan, he went off to college and then out on his own and began falling into the behaviors he grew up with. You may need to put some more thought into exactly who this grown man is. You may need to consider getting to know both your son as full fledged adult AND his SO.

I sincerely hope your holidays are wonderful and you enjoy the time you spend with your son and his SO, and vice versa. Maybe by next Christmas you'll all be ready to start some new traditions everyone will look forward to.

 

[luvsJack]

It is my experience from working with mental health patients that avoidance, or, being unwilling to discuss any details of a situation, obscuring the gender of a person with use of gender-neutral phrases and gender-neutral pronouns, and referring to a single person in a discussion by a vague term such as "so" when everyone else is referred to as he, she, daughter-in-law, son, husband, etc is attempting to hide or deny this person for some reason. It's common. So, she let everyone know with her word choices that she was/is uncomfortable. As for those outside influences? People are born gay or lesbian. Other people do not "turn" them that way. Her son is gay because he is gay. He was made that way, and that is 100% fine.

I don't think that is what she meant by outside influences. I took it to mean the reason her son is not wanting to come home not influencing him to choose to be gay. (And no I do not think anyone chooses)