Hotel Prom Death

[cabanafrau]

There really is no way to know that but since we are all speculating about what we think happened and why I'll give an example.
There are many parents who would rather their children do what they are going to do in a safe environment. Assuming she knew they were going to party, maybe she thought since they had a room at the hotel they wouldn't be out wandering the streets or getting to cars of other kid's who have been drinking.
Assuming she got the room for other purposes, maybe her and her ds were open about sex and she knew about their plans and it didn't bother her.

I was checking for updates and saw what I had missed before, the girl was on the phone with her mother asking if they could go eat, I thought the boy's mom informed the girl's mom that they were going to eat. We don't know the answer she got but I'll assume "yes" since after the mom talked to the boys mom she said "I gave them a couple hours" and then they didn't show up. Anyway, who knows what the girl told the boy's mom, maybe she told her that her mom was okay with her hanging out in a hotel room. There is way too much info missing, for all we know the boy and girl called his mom and said "I called my mom and she's okay with me spending the night in the hotel". Some of you seem to be under the impression that a teen can't be so devious as to cook up a plan to stay out all night partying. You don't need an adult to aid and abet you to do that.

I wouldn't check up on that would any of you?

This is precisely why the hotel room was a key factor in the end result. Left to their own devices the kids were unlikely to come up with an option that provided the opportunity for things to take place longterm without discovery -- which may have resulted in property owners or the police coming up on them to move along, probably minimizing the partying or at least increasing the odds someone would discover the girl was in medical distress & obtaining emergency care to possibly have saved her life. This is the legal dilemma the mother now faces for renting that hotel room.

 

[mrsklamc]

I can't put myself in his shoes because for this generation it didn't happen if it's not online, but it's so foreign to me to think he was posting selfies crying on instagram...

 

[4luv2cdisney]

Appalling on the part of boyfriend's mom, if true.


Maybe local folks know - was there a search going on during the night?

I'm assuming not. It wouldn't have taken much of a search if the mom knew the boys last name. The hotel she was found in was the hotel the prom was held at and the room was booked in the boyfriends name.

 

[EMode]

This is precisely why the hotel room was a key factor in the end result. Left to their own devices the kids were unlikely to come up with an option that provided the opportunity for things to take place longterm without discovery -- which may have resulted in property owners or the police coming up on them to move along, probably minimizing the partying or at least increasing the odds someone would discover the girl was in medical distress & obtaining emergency care to possibly have saved her life. This is the legal dilemma the mother now faces for renting that hotel room.

Maybe but it was The Prom and that does change things IMO. This wasn't a random weekend where kids are looking for something to do or somewhere to party, there were probably many things planned as far as parties, weekend getaways, all the typical things that go on after Senior Prom.

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm sure she is in for alot of legal trouble. My opinion is just that it really doesn't matter where they were, especially since it sounds like she already had the drugs in her system while at the prom.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Maybe but it was The Prom and that does change things IMO. This wasn't a random weekend where kids are looking for something to do or somewhere to party, there were probably many things planned as far as parties, weekend getaways, all the typical things that go on after Senior Prom.

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm sure she is in for alot of legal trouble. My opinion is just that it really doesn't matter where they were, especially since it sounds like she already had the drugs in her system while at the prom.

That's another issue I have. Were there no chaperons? Did no one think to question why she was acting off? Not her friends? Not teachers or other parents who were chaperoning? Not the boy's mother who would have noticed a difference in how she was acting before prom versus after prom? This story keeps seem to taking more bizarre turns.

 

[luvsJack]

Since there were already signs that she had taken something at the prom and the phone call to the mom was after the prom; I wonder if the whole reasoning in the boy's mom going against the girl's moms request was to cover up whatever was wrong with the girl.

I don't mean that the boy's mom was ok with her taking drugs or gave her the drugs but maybe she just thought the girl had been drinking and figured forgiveness after the fact would be better than the girl getting in trouble for coming home intoxicated or high or whatever.

I can't help but wonder if something was given to her in the prom. She was showing signs of taking something, he was not. It might not have been him, it could have been someone else.

 

[dennis99ss]

I fully expect to be flamed here, but, I really think you all are putting your values, socio-economic status, etc., into this, when, I would really really bet, those same thought processes do not apply here. Pretty simple, Boy is older than girl by a couple years and not in high school. Didn't have enough money for a hotel room for the weekend to take his date to the prom and get a room. Boy Mom says sure son, go have fun and pays for it. Girl mom after the fact starts raising a fuss, but she never raised a fuss when it was time to. And, that is if you believe the girl mom. Because of the questions raised, above as to mom reactions, you have to question the credibility of the entire conversation. Sounds to me that HPD has figured out that both parents didn't seem to give a hoot that the kids were bumping in the night and have chalked it up to accidental overdose.

 

[cabanafrau]

Maybe but it was The Prom and that does change things IMO. This wasn't a random weekend where kids are looking for something to do or somewhere to party, there were probably many things planned as far as parties, weekend getaways, all the typical things that go on after Senior Prom.

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm sure she is in for alot of legal trouble. My opinion is just that it really doesn't matter where they were, especially since it sounds like she already had the drugs in her system while at the prom.

IMO it absolutely matters where they were because I definitely believe the sanctuary of the hotel room from onlookers contributed to her death in that the kids weren't discovered until it was too late. As I said, left to their own devices they probably wouldn't have come up with many options that would have allowed them to party undisturbed, fall asleep undisturbed, sleep many hours undisturbed, resulting in this girl slipping into unconsciousness & probably losing respiratory function and dying.

 

[Hannathy]

I can't help but wonder if something was given to her in the prom. She was showing signs of taking something, he was not. It might not have been him, it could have been someone else.

How about not given to her but SHE took something. Why must it always be given to them? Somewhere someone said she was talking about having pills, maybe she just took them herself.

 

[EMode]

IMO it absolutely matters where they were because I definitely believe the sanctuary of the hotel room from onlookers contributed to her death in that the kids weren't discovered until it was too late. As I said, left to their own devices they probably wouldn't have come up with many options that would have allowed them to party undisturbed, fall asleep undisturbed, sleep many hours undisturbed, resulting in this girl slipping into unconsciousness & probably losing respiratory function and dying.

Yes you stated that, but that does not make it a fact, it makes your opinion. Which of course you are absolutely entitled too. Legally speaking I'm sure you are onto something, someone is going to want to hold someone other than a dead teen girl responsible for said teen girl's death.
My opinion is that if these 2 were out drinking and using drugs it is still very possible that she would have died. It is very possible that her condition would go unnoticed especially if surrounded by teens who were under the influence of alcohol and/or drugs themselves.
Teens can be very crafty about partying when left to their own devices. If they weren't, underage drinking and drug use/abuse wouldn't be such a problem

 

[Hannathy]

IMO it absolutely matters where they were because I definitely believe the sanctuary of the hotel room from onlookers contributed to her death in that the kids weren't discovered until it was too late. As I said, left to their own devices they probably wouldn't have come up with many options that would have allowed them to party undisturbed, fall asleep undisturbed, sleep many hours undisturbed, resulting in this girl slipping into unconsciousness & probably losing respiratory function and dying.

Oh I don't know about that! Many kids live in houses that the parents don't check on them the way you might. If the parents are Type A's who are at work 12 hours a day as long as they are alseep in the basement no one is going to check on them until that evening. Or if the parent is themselves having a "fun" life they may not even be around. My DD had one friend in high school whose Mother would go stay at her boyfriends for days at a time, no one checked on anyone that stayed there. The kids came and went and took care of themselves.

In some ways they would have been discovered sooner at the hotel than in a lot of private residences.

 

[cabanafrau]

I fully expect to be flamed here, but, I really think you all are putting your values, socio-economic status, etc., into this, when, I would really really bet, those same thought processes do not apply here. Pretty simple, Boy is older than girl by a couple years and not in high school. Didn't have enough money for a hotel room for the weekend to take his date to the prom and get a room. Boy Mom says sure son, go have fun and pays for it. Girl mom after the fact starts raising a fuss, but she never raised a fuss when it was time to. And, that is if you believe the girl mom. Because of the questions raised, above as to mom reactions, you have to question the credibility of the entire conversation. Sounds to me that HPD has figured out that both parents didn't seem to give a hoot that the kids were bumping in the night and have chalked it up to accidental overdose.

Attitudes about teen sex cross socio economic lines. One of the most affluent districts in our metro area had to receive dress guidelines from their prom venue because they weren't forthcoming from either the school district or the parents. The economy in Michigan sucked before the economic crisis and an establishment decides to possibly jeopardize a major account with well bankrolled customers who can have their pick of venues by telling them they've got to cover up their bait and tackle if they want to continue holding their prom there?

 

[mom2AidanAndEli]

I think the "well, they're going to do it anyway" line of thinking is how you end up with moms renting rooms for their kids on prom night. I've never had a problem telling my kids "I don't care if everyone is doing it".

I'm also perplexed on why the mom let it go as long as she did. That is really a missing bit of info here. Maybe she's just pushover and never follows through on what she says, which could be why the girl thought she could get away with a last minute plan of staying over at the BF's house. I can't get over leaving a huge piece of the planning until the last minute, which leads me to believe the girl thought she stood a better chance at the last minute. But I do think if the mother had gone looking or called the police, her daughter might be alive today.

As for the boy not calling..... I'd imagine he was hung over and didn't wake up until then.

I totally agree with this. But really I was trying to make the point that it wasn't until 11:00 the next morning and the mom still wasn't calling everyone she knew to find out what was going on????? Something just doesn't add up.

Another poster mentioned maybe she fell asleep. But, I'm sorry, if my 17-year-old daughter is out all night and I have no idea where she is, I'm not falling sound asleep for 8 hours!

 

[luvsJack]

How about not given to her but SHE took something. Why must it always be given to them? Somewhere someone said she was talking about having pills, maybe she just took them herself.

And maybe she did. I didn't say she didn't. The possibility is that she decided prom was the perfect time to try something and she did with tragic results.

He could have given her the pills, she could have gotten them from somewhere, someone in the prom could have given them to her, anything could have happened.

 

[EMode]

Since there were already signs that she had taken something at the prom and the phone call to the mom was after the prom; I wonder if the whole reasoning in the boy's mom going against the girl's moms request was to cover up whatever was wrong with the girl.

I don't mean that the boy's mom was ok with her taking drugs or gave her the drugs but maybe she just thought the girl had been drinking and figured forgiveness after the fact would be better than the girl getting in trouble for coming home intoxicated or high or whatever.

I can't help but wonder if something was given to her in the prom. She was showing signs of taking something, he was not. It might not have been him, it could have been someone else.

I could totally see that. I know there was a thread recently where we were talking about picking up our teens from a party and I think you and I and a few others had said something along the lines of picking up our kid's friends too. I'd rather them stay at my house than be out driving because they were afraid to go home and get caught.
This situation sure makes me feel differently, knowing if I ever let one of kid's friends crash on my couch and they turn out to have an overdose that I'd be held responsible and could face jail.

 

[cabanafrau]

Yes you stated that, but that does not make it a fact, it makes your opinion. Which of course you are absolutely entitled too. Legally speaking I'm sure you are onto something, someone is going to want to hold someone other than a dead teen girl responsible for said teen girl's death.
My opinion is that if these 2 were out drinking and using drugs it is still very possible that she would have died. It is very possible that her condition would go unnoticed especially if surrounded by teens who were under the influence of alcohol and/or drugs themselves.
Teens can be very crafty about partying when left to their own devices. If they weren't, underage drinking and drug use/abuse wouldn't be such a problem

If they're out drinking and doing drugs it's absolutely possible that she would have died, no question about it. Happens every day unfortunately. My point is simply that the hotel room provided by the mother handed them the opportunity on a silver platter, without any teenaged craftiness necessary. It also provided a key component of the drinking + drugs + unconciousness & lack of respiratory function = death equation. The more potential witnesses ups the odds of someone discovering an unconscous person in distress & seeking medical assistance. Doesn't guarantee it by a longshot. I am well aware of that via not only my work in the court sytem but personal experience as well, which I can assure you is definitely not something to wink at.

As for the legal culpability of the mother she will be fortunate if she faces no criminal charges. She absolutely will face them in the civil arena.

 

[cabanafrau]

I could totally see that. I know there was a thread recently where we were talking about picking up our teens from a party and I think you and I and a few others had said something along the lines of picking up our kid's friends too. I'd rather them stay at my house than be out driving because they were afraid to go home and get caught.
This situation sure makes me feel differently, knowing if I ever let one of kid's friends crash on my couch and they turn out to have an overdose that I'd be held responsible and could face jail.

Not likely you would be held responsible in that scenario, unless there was evidence of extreme intoxication that would have led a reasonable person in your situation to have determined the individual required medical intervention which you disregarded.

Exactly the reason why I, you and I'm sure countless other parents have pounded it into our kids' heads from the time they were little, tell me the truth always, come to me if you have a problem you cannot solve, even if you think I will be mad or you will get in trouble. Hopefully by the time they're of an age to face the drinking, drugs, etc. they know whatever the problem it's always better to face the music with mom and dad because at the end of the day they love and care about you.

 

[mom2rtk]

Since there were already signs that she had taken something at the prom and the phone call to the mom was after the prom; I wonder if the whole reasoning in the boy's mom going against the girl's moms request was to cover up whatever was wrong with the girl.

I don't mean that the boy's mom was ok with her taking drugs or gave her the drugs but maybe she just thought the girl had been drinking and figured forgiveness after the fact would be better than the girl getting in trouble for coming home intoxicated or high or whatever.

I can't help but wonder if something was given to her in the prom. She was showing signs of taking something, he was not. It might not have been him, it could have been someone else.

That is why one should never do the thinking for someone else's child.

Yes you stated that, but that does not make it a fact, it makes your opinion. Which of course you are absolutely entitled too. Legally speaking I'm sure you are onto something, someone is going to want to hold someone other than a dead teen girl responsible for said teen girl's death.
My opinion is that if these 2 were out drinking and using drugs it is still very possible that she would have died. It is very possible that her condition would go unnoticed especially if surrounded by teens who were under the influence of alcohol and/or drugs themselves.
Teens can be very crafty about partying when left to their own devices. If they weren't, underage drinking and drug use/abuse wouldn't be such a problem

I'm sorry, but I've never bought into the "they're going to find a way, so I might as well......" line of thinking. Especially when it involves someone else's kid.

I totally agree with this. But really I was trying to make the point that it wasn't until 11:00 the next morning and the mom still wasn't calling everyone she knew to find out what was going on????? Something just doesn't add up.

Another poster mentioned maybe she fell asleep. But, I'm sorry, if my 17-year-old daughter is out all night and I have no idea where she is, I'm not falling sound asleep for 8 hours!

I agree there's something way off. I would be one of those parents who would fall asleep. After a certain hour, I just can't stay awake. But I would have set an alarm for maybe an hour or 2 our to check and see if she was home. And no way on EARTH would I have slept until 11. There's more to this story.

 

[mrsklamc]

Somewhere it said he awoke around 9:20 to her not breathing so it wasn't that he didn't wake up til 11.

 

[Colleen27]

IMO it comes down to the "if everyone was jumping off the bridge would you?" scenario a parent drums into their child from the time they are 2 until we leave this world.

As parents the only person we can influence is our own child. Doesn't matter what the rest of the group was doing the girl is the only one responsible for doing what HER Mother wanted her to do. If she was dropped off where she didn't want to be she should have called her mother or left, it isn't anyone else's problem to deal with. As I've always told my kids if who you went to a party with someone and they drink don't get in the car on the way home, call, walk or take a taxi. But if they don't follow those rules and get in and an accident happens then they chose to ride with that person. (and 17 is old enough that you usually aren't making the plans with the parents, the kids do their own planning, I"m not clearing things with parents with teens this old)

My son is 16, and his friends are mostly within a year older/year younger than him. It is fairly unusual for us to talk to other parents when the kids make plans. Practically every weekend the kids are either camped out here or at one particular friend's home and I don't speak to every parent of the kids who are staying over, nor do I touch base with DS's friend's mom every time they stay there. We have each other's phone numbers and addresses, of course, so if I was expecting DS home and he didn't show up (and wasn't answering his own phone) they'd be one of the first calls I made, and vice versa I'm sure. But we don't talk every time the boys make plans.