Here's An Idea!!

[kdawg8762]

I agree that it is a little of both. I don't know your friend but I am going to go out on a limb and assume that he is not an idiot, and does not make a habit of throwing money out the window. And yet he ended up paying for a meal that he should not have paid for. Did anyone on the phone ask him if he was on the DDP when he phoned in his order the way servers ask guests at restaurants if they are on a plan? There is clearly blame on both sides.

But the bottom line is that Disney does not publish the price of the plans. You have to come here, or allears, or other places to find it. You have to ask yourself why that is. What possible motivation could there be for disguising the price? There really is only one answer. They want to make it as hard as possible for customers to do an even-up analysis. It can't be any other reason. And why would they want to discourage even-up comparisons? The question answers itself.

What??? You and Havoc, geeezzz....In this case, its the guys fault. He was given a brochure, he didn't read it, he screwed himself. Is it Disney's job to baby us? This is what is wrong in society today, we expect everyone to hold our hands and keep us from ever making a mistake. The guys was told, via documented proof, what was included, he didn't take advantage of it.

 

[kdawg8762]

Wouldn't make sense business wise for Disney to open to the TIW. The point of that is obviously to try and encourage multiple visits with dining on site. Locals and AP holders are the folks who will do that, not the family of 4 from Michigan.

 

[DisneyFive]

Wouldn't make sense business wise for Disney to open to the TIW. The point of that is obviously to try and encourage multiple visits with dining on site. Locals and AP holders are the folks who will do that, not the family of 4 from Michigan.

Agreed, but it sure would be nice!

Dan

 

[havoc315]

That defeats the whole purpose of the dining plan- convenience. With the gift card every single night you would have to figure out how much you have left and how much you can use at each meal to break even at the end of the week. With the disney dining plan credits you can break even at the end of th week. You plan your meals with the credits so you can make it 0 at the end of the week.

With that gift card idea you would constanly need to be aware of your daily limits whereas the dining plan you know your daily limits and you can plan your needs to suit that exactly!

While it might be nice to order either an appetizer or dessert that gift card is not practical in the Disney world.

Though I see your point, I think the gift card is far far more convenient than the DDP. I simply need to keep track of 1 thing -- a dollar total.
But with the DDP, I need to keep track of 3 different types of credits -- snack credits, CS credits, and TS credits. Should I use a snack credit to get cereal in the morning? Or better to use a CS credit, to get cereal, juice and a pastry? We shared 3 CS meals for 4 people, so now we have an odd number of CS meals remaining. That was a signature meal, so now I'm a TS short, where should I eat? Oh, I have too many ADRs booked, which should I pay OOP? Since I don't want dessert, should I get fruit for dessert and bring it back to the room as breakfast?

And of course, if I'm concerned about whether I'm getting value out of the DDP, then there are a ton more considerations! Which restaurant gives value, which entrees. etc, etc.


With a gift card -- just 1 thing to track. A dollar amount total. When you run out, then you start paying OOP. You want to use it to pay tips, go ahead. You want to skip dessert and have an appetizer instead, go ahead. You want a signature restaurant, but the cheapest entree (making it similar in price to a 1-credit meal), go right ahead. You want to do an odd combo of TS/CS.. go right ahead. No worry about whether you can use a TS for CS or vice versa.

In terms of "convenience" -- simple discount dining dollars, is far easier and more convenient than the convoluted DDP.

Yes, the DDP is pretty convenient if every member of your party is going to keep it super simple -- use a snack credit for breakfast, have a CS lunch, have a 1 credit TS dinner every night. But if you are going to mess with this formula too much, it gets pretty confusing and inconvenient.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

I agree that it is a little of both. I don't know your friend but I am going to go out on a limb and assume that he is not an idiot, and does not make a habit of throwing money out the window. And yet he ended up paying for a meal that he should not have paid for. Did anyone on the phone ask him if he was on the DDP when he phoned in his order the way servers ask guests at restaurants if they are on a plan? There is clearly blame on both sides.

But the bottom line is that Disney does not publish the price of the plans. You have to come here, or allears, or other places to find it. You have to ask yourself why that is. What possible motivation could there be for disguising the price? There really is only one answer. They want to make it as hard as possible for customers to do an even-up analysis. It can't be any other reason. And why would they want to discourage even-up comparisons? The question answers itself.

I agree that finding the price is hard to do if you look on Disney's site, but they make what is included well advertised.

What??? You and Havoc, geeezzz....In this case, its the guys fault. He was given a brochure, he didn't read it, he screwed himself. Is it Disney's job to baby us? This is what is wrong in society today, we expect everyone to hold our hands and keep us from ever making a mistake. The guys was told, via documented proof, what was included, he didn't take advantage of it.

This. And not just with my friend, but a lot of people seem to spend money without really knowing what they're spending it on. People need to take some personal responsibility and do some research for their trips.

Yes, the DDP is pretty convenient if every member of your party is going to keep it super simple -- use a snack credit for breakfast, have a CS lunch, have a 1 credit TS dinner every night. But if you are going to mess with this formula too much, it gets pretty confusing and inconvenient.

I would think most families of four would be eating the same meals at the same time, at least TS meals. When it was me and my mom we ate every meal together, and used our credits at the same time.

 

[havoc315]

Wouldn't make sense business wise for Disney to open to the TIW. The point of that is obviously to try and encourage multiple visits with dining on site. Locals and AP holders are the folks who will do that, not the family of 4 from Michigan.

It makes the most sense for those frequent visitors.

But, it could boost Disney profits for all guests -- by encouraging them to spend more on-site dining. In fact, from Disney's perspective, it would be more profitable to sell these cards to people who are just staying a short time. (Though, I suspect not as profitable as the DDP).

Afterall -- if the card costs $100 --- Then the break even point is $500.
A family staying 3-4 days and spending exactly $500.. would just break even on the card. No loss to Disney (and no incentive for the family to buy the card).
But a family who is staying 6-7 days, with lots of fine dining, etc.... Maybe they spent $1,000 on food. With the savings and the card, with the 20% discount... They actually spent $800 on dining, plus $100 on the card. Total spending = $900. Got a real savings of 10%. I would easily take that option over the DDP!

But a local AP holding, who theoretically may utilize Disney dining frequently.... Let's say they spend $2,000 on Disney dining -- After discount, they spent $1600 on dining, plus $100 on the card. So they realized 15% savings. And Disney had to fork over a 15% discount.

Thus, Disney is actually better off selling the TiW card to the short term guest, then then long term AP holder.

Why don't they? Because I suspect they have found the DDP to be even more profitable. Especially as I don't think they are really giving customers any true discount on the DDP (Just discounting the high mark up items like soda).

 

[kdawg8762]

I disagree but see the logic behind it. The reasons you give it to locals and Ap'ers is that they are more likely to be cheaper guests, especially the locals. The come in, maybe have lunch, and that's about it. The AP folks are very commando like in their trips, from what i've seen, so a lot of CS and snack type meals. Those who have come 2,000 miles, have flown, are staying at WL, etc...are more likely to have several grand and be eating at much nicer places and character buffets (i.e. places with higher overhead)

 

[havoc315]

I would think most families of four would be eating the same meals at the same time, at least TS meals. When it was me and my mom we ate every meal together, and used our credits at the same time.

With all the diverse dining options at Disney, including signature dining, dinner shows, dinner packages... Plus, being in different locations each day... If not squeezing into a dining plan, you think most families would eat the exact same way each day?

I can only speak for my family. But some days, we may want a hot breakfast. Some days, some cold cereal. Some days, just a snack on the run for breakfast. Some days and locations, we may want a sit down lunch. Some days and locations, perhaps a counter service lunch. Some days, just grab a turkey leg and eat while on line. For dinner, some days we may want a signature meal, or a princess meal, or a dinner show. Some days, maybe a quick bite at the resort CS location. Some days, maybe we are so tired and stuffed, that we want to cancel an ADR and skip dinner.
Some days, we may want a table service restaurant, but just want a salad or appetizer as our meal. Some days, we may want to sit down in a regular restaurant, but just have coffee and dessert. Heck, some days we want to go to 1 restaurant for our main course, and a different restaurant for dessert.

I know plenty of Disney guests plan the exact 1 TS/1CS per day.... but how many people would eat exactly that way, if they weren't trying to conform to a plan?

 

[rachel09985]

Though I see your point, I think the gift card is far far more convenient than the DDP. I simply need to keep track of 1 thing -- a dollar total.
But with the DDP, I need to keep track of 3 different types of credits -- snack credits, CS credits, and TS credits. Should I use a snack credit to get cereal in the morning? Or better to use a CS credit, to get cereal, juice and a pastry? We shared 3 CS meals for 4 people, so now we have an odd number of CS meals remaining. That was a signature meal, so now I'm a TS short, where should I eat? Oh, I have too many ADRs booked, which should I pay OOP? Since I don't want dessert, should I get fruit for dessert and bring it back to the room as breakfast?

And of course, if I'm concerned about whether I'm getting value out of the DDP, then there are a ton more considerations! Which restaurant gives value, which entrees. etc, etc.


With a gift card -- just 1 thing to track. A dollar amount total. When you run out, then you start paying OOP. You want to use it to pay tips, go ahead. You want to skip dessert and have an appetizer instead, go ahead. You want a signature restaurant, but the cheapest entree (making it similar in price to a 1-credit meal), go right ahead. You want to do an odd combo of TS/CS.. go right ahead. No worry about whether you can use a TS for CS or vice versa.

In terms of "convenience" -- simple discount dining dollars, is far easier and more convenient than the convoluted DDP.

Yes, the DDP is pretty convenient if every member of your party is going to keep it super simple -- use a snack credit for breakfast, have a CS lunch, have a 1 credit TS dinner every night. But if you are going to mess with this formula too much, it gets pretty confusing and inconvenient.

I can definitely see your point too! I ran into that a little bit on my last trip! I still think it is much easier for the dining plan credits though rather than a set amount.

I went to college at Ohio State University and we had a "swipe" system. At each place there was a certain amount of things we could get with a swipe. I think Disney should do something like that that.

I can understand how the card would be good for some people but than you will need to worry about the prices of entrees at the restaurants and then you get worried about not having anough money on the gift card at the end of the trip and then you realize you are going to have to pay more out of pocket and you didn't budget for that. Theres a lot of options to go around this but for me the regular dining plan is the best.

Although I wish they would do a mid level between the Dining Plan and Deluxe Dining Plan! I would like to try a couple Signatures but would never want to use two credits. I also think three meals a day is way too much for me.

What if Disney had a package set up of those "swipes" and you bought a set amount of swipes based on your dining preference. In example, 10 swipes is a set price, 20 swipes is a set price and so on...You can still save money but won't have to worry about running out of dollars on your gift card.

I do think they should allow an appetizer OR dessert though! And they do need to be honest about the dining plan price!! I don't get why the price isn't published.

Just an idea

 

[havoc315]

I can definitely see your point too! I ran into that a little bit on my last trip! I still think it is much easier for the dining plan credits though rather than a set amount.

I went to college at Ohio State University and we had a "swipe" system. At each place there was a certain amount of things we could get with a swipe. I think Disney should do something like that that.

I can understand how the card would be good for some people but than you will need to worry about the prices of entrees at the restaurants and then you get worried about not having anough money on the gift card at the end of the trip and then you realize you are going to have to pay more out of pocket and you didn't budget for that. Theres a lot of options to go around this but for me the regular dining plan is the best.

Although I wish they would do a mid level between the Dining Plan and Deluxe Dining Plan! I would like to try a couple Signatures but would never want to use two credits. I also think three meals a day is way too much for me.

What if Disney had a package set up of those "swipes" and you bought a set amount of swipes based on your dining preference. In example, 10 swipes is a set price, 20 swipes is a set price and so on...You can still save money but won't have to worry about running out of dollars on your gift card.

I do think they should allow an appetizer OR dessert though! And they do need to be honest about the dining plan price!! I don't get why the price isn't published.

Just an idea

There are obviously LOTS of different ways they could design a plan. Yes, you could buy a certain amount of credits or swipes. Instead of having an allotment determined your number of nights.
And there are lots of other possible plans as well.

1 of my problems with the current plan -- and with a swipe system -- is that people will get such widely divergent values out of the plan.
Dining as Disney is very diverse (which is a good thing).
But if you are dining under the plan -- or under your swipe system -- Then the price of these 2 meals is the same:
- The vegetarian club at Plaza restaurant, with water to drink and skip dessert. (Total OOP, about $11)
- At Tutto Italia, the Tagliata di Manzo - with roasted potatoes and vegetables $36, with Espresso Coffee $3.50 and Copetta Sotto Bosco - berries, zabaglione cream gelato and chocolate sauce $14.00 -- Total meal -- About $54.

Under the DDP and under the swipe system -- The big eater at Tutto Italia got a great deal. But the Plaza restaurant diner got ripped off.
The DDP kind of, sort of, tries to find an "average" for how most diners realistically eat. But the reality is, some diners will get a great value. And for other types of eaters, the plan doesn't work at all.

Under the "gift card" system --- Every guest could benefit, no matter how they eat.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

With all the diverse dining options at Disney, including signature dining, dinner shows, dinner packages... Plus, being in different locations each day... If not squeezing into a dining plan, you think most families would eat the exact same way each day?

I can only speak for my family. But some days, we may want a hot breakfast. Some days, some cold cereal. Some days, just a snack on the run for breakfast. Some days and locations, we may want a sit down lunch. Some days and locations, perhaps a counter service lunch. Some days, just grab a turkey leg and eat while on line. For dinner, some days we may want a signature meal, or a princess meal, or a dinner show. Some days, maybe a quick bite at the resort CS location. Some days, maybe we are so tired and stuffed, that we want to cancel an ADR and skip dinner.
Some days, we may want a table service restaurant, but just want a salad or appetizer as our meal. Some days, we may want to sit down in a regular restaurant, but just have coffee and dessert. Heck, some days we want to go to 1 restaurant for our main course, and a different restaurant for dessert.

I know plenty of Disney guests plan the exact 1 TS/1CS per day.... but how many people would eat exactly that way, if they weren't trying to conform to a plan?

I don't mean using the credits the same way every day, I mean using the same credits per person at the same time. I don't see families splitting up to do seperate TS meals.

 

[rachel09985]

There are obviously LOTS of different ways they could design a plan. Yes, you could buy a certain amount of credits or swipes. Instead of having an allotment determined your number of nights.
And there are lots of other possible plans as well.

1 of my problems with the current plan -- and with a swipe system -- is that people will get such widely divergent values out of the plan.
Dining as Disney is very diverse (which is a good thing).
But if you are dining under the plan -- or under your swipe system -- Then the price of these 2 meals is the same:
- The vegetarian club at Plaza restaurant, with water to drink and skip dessert. (Total OOP, about $11)
- At Tutto Italia, the Tagliata di Manzo - with roasted potatoes and vegetables $36, with Espresso Coffee $3.50 and Copetta Sotto Bosco - berries, zabaglione cream gelato and chocolate sauce $14.00 -- Total meal -- About $54.

Under the DDP and under the swipe system -- The big eater at Tutto Italia got a great deal. But the Plaza restaurant diner got ripped off.
The DDP kind of, sort of, tries to find an "average" for how most diners realistically eat. But the reality is, some diners will get a great value. And for other types of eaters, the plan doesn't work at all.

Under the "gift card" system --- Every guest could benefit, no matter how they eat.

True, which is why I would never eat at the Plaza using the dining plan. LOL. But if the guest doesn't know they are getting ripped off then there isn't a problem.

Is this why Disney doesn't give the price of the dining plan straight up? Because then people will figure out what they are spending per day and try to match it? If they don't know then they may be more likely to order whatever without checking the price? Us Dissers do know because we are anal with coming out on top but other people might not know!

 

[havoc315]

I don't mean using the credits the same way every day, I mean using the same credits per person at the same time. I don't see families splitting up to do seperate TS meals.

In the "real world" -- we've done it on occasion. That is, we may feed the kids first someplace (think CS), and then we may have them share a dessert while the grown-ups get to eat a real dinner in real restaurant.

And in the real world of CS (such as a mall food court), it's not unusual for the 4 of us to eat in 3 or 4 different places, perhaps even at different times.

 

[havoc315]

True, which is why I would never eat at the Plaza using the dining plan. LOL. But if the guest doesn't know they are getting ripped off then there isn't a problem.

Is this why Disney doesn't give the price of the dining plan straight up? Because then people will figure out what they are spending per day and try to match it? If they don't know then they may be more likely to order whatever without checking the price? Us Dissers do know because we are anal with coming out on top but other people might not know!

That might be the reason. But I think it's even simpler than that. And may be seen as more nefarious or less nefarious ---
I think Disney knows that "$53 per person per day" SOUNDS high, and would turn people off. Even people for whom the plan might be a good idea, the price might just sound too high, and they would reject it.

So Disney is hoping that since the price just gets folded into the total price... You won't really notice the exact cost of the meal plan. So the cost won't be a turnoff, so you will add it.

I'm sure there are thousands and thousands of people who add the dining plan without even considering what the cost is. They just look at the grand total, and if it fits their budget, they complete the reservation. "Let's see.... pick my hotel.... click this button for 6 day tickets.... click the button that says "do you want to save 20% on dining"... sure... let's click that button...... Total price is $2,900.... OK..... sounds good, where is my credit card.."


On the other hand, if instead of a button that said "save 20% on Dining Plan" -- If instead it said, "Add a pre-paid dining plan for $53 per day that might save you money".... I think a lot of people would say... $53 per day? Nah, I'm sure I can do better than that.

 

[kdawg8762]

Maybe Havoc, but I think when i run the total with my room first, then add a dining plan, lets just say that is a bigger sticker shock than 53 bucks a day.....We come out on top with DxDP, but i wish there was something in the middle with maybe 1 snack, 1 qs, and 2 TS per day. Then again, I hate QS, so it would simply be a math thing. It might be nice to have a big breakfast, nice dinner and a very small lunch as an option. Then again, we generally eat before 8 AM, eat lunch around 1:30 and have an 8 PM dinner unless we are doing TS, then we have an early dinner and catch either wishes or illuminations.

 

[kdawg8762]

I'll add this to, the DxDP works for us because we generally have expensive tastes but are overly cheap, when we splurge, its nice to have it pre-paid, because if i was reaching in my pocket, i would not spend it.

 

[JimmyV]

I can understand how the card would be good for some people but than you will need to worry about the prices of entrees at the restaurants and then you get worried about not having anough money on the gift card at the end of the trip and then you realize you are going to have to pay more out of pocket and you didn't budget for that.

People needn't "worry" about anything. The goal of a discount card is not to create some sort of puzzle that has to be solved such that you spend exactly what you have on your card, no more and no less. Look at it this way. Suppose you were only going to have one meal at WDW and you knew that it was going to be a CS at Flame Tree. Let's suppose you bought a card with $10 value on it and paid $8. When you go to Flame Tree, you wouldn't have to "worry" about spending exactly $10. You just order what you want, knowing that the first $10 of food is already paid for. If your bill comes to $12.50, you hand in your card plus another $2.50. What's to worry about? Your total OOP for the meal was $8 for the card plus the extra $2.50 for a total of $10.50. You saved $2.00.

At some point in their lives, everyone reading this thread has received a gift card. Maybe from a department store. Maybe from i-Tunes. Maybe for MacDonalds or Dunkin Donuts. When you go to use the card, you don't roam around the store worrying about hitting the number on the head. You buy what you want knowing that the first "$x.xx" of costs is already paid for. If you have money left over, you keep the card. If you use up the whole card, you pay OOP. I don't hear anyone saying that Macy's should change its gift card procedures so that instead of getting $50 on a card, a recipient must pick out one item from footwear, one item from accessories, one item from household goods, and one item from electronics, but if used in the electronics department, the credit counts double such that you can no longer get anything from household goods... Simply using a $50 gift card to shop as you want is easier. So too with dining.

 

[kdawg8762]

Jimmy, her point is she would still be on a budget then, with DP she feels she is not. For example, the only difference between a gift card and cash is that the gift card is only good for a specific place. She, or he oops, enjoys knowing that he/she can order most anything off the restaurant menu and its fine. She doesn't have to look at the price.

 

[havoc315]

Jimmy, her point is she would still be on a budget then, with DP she feels she is not. For example, the only difference between a gift card and cash is that the gift card is only good for a specific place. She, or he oops, enjoys knowing that he/she can order most anything off the restaurant menu and its fine. She doesn't have to look at the price.

While I understand that reasoning, it simply isn't necessarily rational.

If I can pay $25 for a steak, at the time of ordering the steak... Or... I can prepay $50, and get the $25 steak....

So I over-pay before the vacation, so that I don't have to worry about the price during the vacation?

Mind you, any person, at any time, can *choose* whether to look at the prices or not. When going to a nice dinner in the "real world", I never look at the price. I have a general sense of the restaurant pricing before I get there. (So I know it's within my means). But I'm not going to let the pricing effect my decision whether to have the $22 pasta, or the $27 lamb. I get what I want, I don't look at the prices.
Whether you are on a dining plan or not.... either way, it's your decision whether you choose to look at the prices.

 

[Tricia1972]

Personally, and this may be just me, I worry when I am on the DDP or DxDDP that I am getting my full value. So I still look at the prices and make sure I maximize my dollars so I at least break even with the plan. Often I am ordering something that wouldn't be my first choice if I went in and ordered whatever I want.

For me personally, and again it may be just me, I would do better with a discount card. I get what I want when I want and don't think another thing about it.

For our next trip we plan on figuring out what the DxDDP would cost our family and we're going to load that $$ onto a gift card. We'll have APs, so we plan on buying the TiW card. We'll use the TiW card for the discount and the gift card to pay the bill. If we run out, so be it, failed experiment.

However, I have a hunch that we'll have a few dollars left over and will be able to buy some trinkets on the last day.