Has Environmentality gone too far?

[AurumPunzel]

This is how our city has been for awhile. Residents have to pay more for larger trash cans, but recycling cans are free. We live in a newer home (built in 2015) and it has low flow toilets also. There was a county incentive if you purchased a low water use HE washing machine too...$250.

I have a ‘greened’ house with push-button flushing toilets and solar panels that were bought under a previous government scheme before it was controversially scrapped. And my area now only issues slimmer general waste bins to all new builds and replacements, unless the household has a need for the older standard-sized bins. I’m a compulsive recycler and my rubbish bin is hardly full, and before you ask, no, it doesn’t get exported to developing countries. My area is also phasing out landfills in favour of waste-to-energy incineration with filters that eliminate harmful emissions from the incineration plants, which is similar to what Scandinavian countries already use to ensure near-zero landfilling.

 

[AurumPunzel]

I wouldn’t travel with reusable straws as there is no way to sanitize them in the hotel room. I can sanitize my toothbrush by pouring boiling water over the brush end (and I do sanitize my toothbrush daily before use), but there’s too much risk of getting a serious burn to try that with a straw, if you are going to get it sanitized inside and out. I am OK with paper straws, but have had several close calls with spilling without a lid to stabilize the paper cups.

I have been sticking a plastic Disney bag in my handbag in case I come across a situation where they won’t give me a bag. I will never buy a bag. Ever. Even if it means carrying the merchandise in my hands or canceling the sale at the last moment. I will reuse a free bag, but I will never buy one.

This also links into another concern I have about reusable bags and other reusable items, but mainly the bags. If everyone ends up being forced to either take their own or purchase them, and especially when Disney have jacked up the prices of the reusable bags, there's the risk that the odd person will take a reusable bag that's previously been used to handle raw meat and hasn't been sanitised, then the guest either leaves it in a room or the bag comes into contact with a CM or another guest, there's the potential for people to be struck down with norovirus or any other food-borne illness that could end up getting nasty, and for it to happen in a WDW resort or even onboard the Disney Cruise ships is definitely a ruined vacation waiting to happen.

 

[MrsPete]

Two answers /two perspectives, but not at odds with one another -- then my own conclusion:

First answer: No, protection of the environment has not gone too far. Not at all.

Case in point: We're doing some remodeling on our house, and we went to the dump earlier this week to get rid of some tile and other old stuff that we ripped out. Seeing all that stuff that we as a society have dumped was not a pretty site: pallets and pallets of old stoves ... huge hills with stuff like the tile I was dumping. How can this continue? How many years will my tile lie under the earth? It was sobering, and (even though the products we were dumping were 49 years old and were falling apart) I was ashamed to add to the problem.

You say, "Oh, but recycling!" What does that really mean? It means we sell the plastic to another country, where a fairly small percentage of it is chipped up another product. I think most of us kinda think -- if we think at all, "My water bottle gets cleaned and goes right back to the shelf" -- no, not at all. So much energy and time goes into making it usable again. And a whole lot of it ends up in the landfill.

We as a planet cannot afford to continue to use single-use disposable plastic items. Yogurt cups, disposable cutlery, K-cups and more -- we cannot afford them. Think about it: every plastic fork your grandfather ever used is still in a landfill. It's kind of "invisible" to us in America, but we are the ones causing the problem, and we are the ones who need to improve our wasteful ways. Something I read earlier this week: If the Pilgrims who came over on the Mayflower had used plastic like we do, all that stuff would still be rattling around today, and America would be covered in plastic waste. That's what we are imposing on future America. And why? For a few minutes of convenience. We can't continue.

Second answer: We're focusing on the wrong things.

Plastic straws and cup lids aren't the main culprits. Yes, they're a problem, but they're small and not nearly so problematic as all those water bottles and plastic food packaging. Changing out perfectly good things because we've grown tired of the colors or we just want something new is a real problem. We need to focus on the big-deal items first.

My conclusion: We each need to do what we can.

What does that mean? Bringing plastic bags to the grocery stores is easy. Carrying your own reusable water bottle is easy. Refusing to buy foods in individual plastic packaging (fruit cups, puddings) is easy. Earlier this week -- after my trip to the dump -- I read that 40% of all plastic goes into one -use items, and practically none of it actually ends up being made into something else.

Carrying a YETI cup and silverware /refusing plastic forks at coffee places or fast food restaurants is more work, but not really hard. Searching for second-hand clothing takes more effort than going to the mall, but it also isn't really hard. Committing to keeping your old countertops even though HGTV says they're "dated" is actually easier than replacing them.

On the other hand, finding a new way to bring meat home from the grocery store is hard, as is buying shampoo without a plastic bottle.

If we each do the easy things, it will make a difference in the problem. If we don't, it's just going to continue to grow and grow and grow.

 

[DISNEYSQUIRRELS]

We humans invented the plastic lids & straws.
I like a lid & a straw.

 

[AurumPunzel]

Two answers /two perspectives, but not at odds with one another -- then my own conclusion:

First answer: No, protection of the environment has not gone too far. Not at all.

Case in point: We're doing some remodeling on our house, and we went to the dump earlier this week to get rid of some tile and other old stuff that we ripped out. Seeing all that stuff that we as a society have dumped was not a pretty site: pallets and pallets of old stoves ... huge hills with stuff like the tile I was dumping. How can this continue? How many years will my tile lie under the earth? It was sobering, and (even though the products we were dumping were 49 years old and were falling apart) I was ashamed to add to the problem.

You say, "Oh, but recycling!" What does that really mean? It means we sell the plastic to another country, where a fairly small percentage of it is chipped up another product. I think most of us kinda think -- if we think at all, "My water bottle gets cleaned and goes right back to the shelf" -- no, not at all. So much energy and time goes into making it usable again. And a whole lot of it ends up in the landfill.

We as a planet cannot afford to continue to use single-use disposable plastic items. Yogurt cups, disposable cutlery, K-cups and more -- we cannot afford them. Think about it: every plastic fork your grandfather ever used is still in a landfill. It's kind of "invisible" to us in America, but we are the ones causing the problem, and we are the ones who need to improve our wasteful ways. Something I read earlier this week: If the Pilgrims who came over on the Mayflower had used plastic like we do, all that stuff would still be rattling around today, and America would be covered in plastic waste. That's what we are imposing on future America. And why? For a few minutes of convenience. We can't continue.

Second answer: We're focusing on the wrong things.

Plastic straws and cup lids aren't the main culprits. Yes, they're a problem, but they're small and not nearly so problematic as all those water bottles and plastic food packaging. Changing out perfectly good things because we've grown tired of the colors or we just want something new is a real problem. We need to focus on the big-deal items first.

My conclusion: We each need to do what we can.

What does that mean? Bringing plastic bags to the grocery stores is easy. Carrying your own reusable water bottle is easy. Refusing to buy foods in individual plastic packaging (fruit cups, puddings) is easy. Earlier this week -- after my trip to the dump -- I read that 40% of all plastic goes into one -use items, and practically none of it actually ends up being made into something else.

Carrying a YETI cup and silverware /refusing plastic forks at coffee places or fast food restaurants is more work, but not really hard. Searching for second-hand clothing takes more effort than going to the mall, but it also isn't really hard. Committing to keeping your old countertops even though HGTV says they're "dated" is actually easier than replacing them.

On the other hand, finding a new way to bring meat home from the grocery store is hard, as is buying shampoo without a plastic bottle.

If we each do the easy things, it will make a difference in the problem. If we don't, it's just going to continue to grow and grow and grow.

I'm not denying that global plastic waste is an issue, and that we all have a duty to do whatever we can to mitigate it, but I do agree that it's become massively misguided, particularly with the more benign plastics such as straws and lids, and although the plastic bags are debated as well, I disagree that they are 'single-use' because the vast majority of people in here (or at least what I can gather) do reuse them for many things, and especially in the Parks with water rides, they do serve an auxiliary purpose for keeping articles dry. Although some do argue that they're a much bigger issue, the issue with plastic bags can easily be fixed by encouraging reuse, imposing fees instead of banning, which often leads to perverse unintended consequences, and of course, improving recycling. As for food packaging, it's a Catch-22: while I agree that excess packaging should be cut down and fruit and veg aisles should be encouraged to go naked, the issue is that there also has to be a solution to avoid increased food waste that results from the phasing-out of plastic packaging. As much as plastics have made a positive contribution to ensuring the high quality of life the Western World enjoys, it's a unanimous consensus that the way we consume plastics and then dispose of them after use cannot continue in its current form, but at the same time, there are far better solutions to dealing with the problem than solutions that result in a degradation of living standards, quality of service, and most of all, leading to increased carbon emissions through the production of alternatives that aren't on par with petroplastics in terms of quality and carbon footprint, since global warming is an even greater environmental issue that we all need to be weary of.

 

[jo-jo]

Two answers /two perspectives, but not at odds with one another -- then my own conclusion:

First answer: No, protection of the environment has not gone too far. Not at all.

Case in point: We're doing some remodeling on our house, and we went to the dump earlier this week to get rid of some tile and other old stuff that we ripped out. Seeing all that stuff that we as a society have dumped was not a pretty site: pallets and pallets of old stoves ... huge hills with stuff like the tile I was dumping. How can this continue? How many years will my tile lie under the earth? It was sobering, and (even though the products we were dumping were 49 years old and were falling apart) I was ashamed to add to the problem.

You say, "Oh, but recycling!" What does that really mean? It means we sell the plastic to another country, where a fairly small percentage of it is chipped up another product. I think most of us kinda think -- if we think at all, "My water bottle gets cleaned and goes right back to the shelf" -- no, not at all. So much energy and time goes into making it usable again. And a whole lot of it ends up in the landfill.

We as a planet cannot afford to continue to use single-use disposable plastic items. Yogurt cups, disposable cutlery, K-cups and more -- we cannot afford them. Think about it: every plastic fork your grandfather ever used is still in a landfill. It's kind of "invisible" to us in America, but we are the ones causing the problem, and we are the ones who need to improve our wasteful ways. Something I read earlier this week: If the Pilgrims who came over on the Mayflower had used plastic like we do, all that stuff would still be rattling around today, and America would be covered in plastic waste. That's what we are imposing on future America. And why? For a few minutes of convenience. We can't continue.

Second answer: We're focusing on the wrong things.

Plastic straws and cup lids aren't the main culprits. Yes, they're a problem, but they're small and not nearly so problematic as all those water bottles and plastic food packaging. Changing out perfectly good things because we've grown tired of the colors or we just want something new is a real problem. We need to focus on the big-deal items first.

My conclusion: We each need to do what we can.

What does that mean? Bringing plastic bags to the grocery stores is easy. Carrying your own reusable water bottle is easy. Refusing to buy foods in individual plastic packaging (fruit cups, puddings) is easy. Earlier this week -- after my trip to the dump -- I read that 40% of all plastic goes into one -use items, and practically none of it actually ends up being made into something else.

Carrying a YETI cup and silverware /refusing plastic forks at coffee places or fast food restaurants is more work, but not really hard. Searching for second-hand clothing takes more effort than going to the mall, but it also isn't really hard. Committing to keeping your old countertops even though HGTV says they're "dated" is actually easier than replacing them.

On the other hand, finding a new way to bring meat home from the grocery store is hard, as is buying shampoo without a plastic bottle.

If we each do the easy things, it will make a difference in the problem. If we don't, it's just going to continue to grow and grow and grow.

I sort of agree with you.....how's that for commitment?

At home we bring bags to grocery store, we have a stash in each car. We did buy some about 35 years ago. Heavy canvas ones , maybe when Earth day was young. Those are still my favorite for heavy items. The other million or so we have, we've gotten from XYZ group. Donate to some cause and before you can blink, bags, pens, note cards, throws and tshirts show up in the mail. I share the wealth with family, but the bags usually are somewhat cheap (good for bread but not can goods) , the pens have about 12 drops of ink in them, etc.

I had mentioned on another thread, how many of us made fun of grandma for saving those plastic containers to use again. It seems to be the invention of the water bottle opened the flood gates to one use items. When my kids were young to get a pudding cup or some other single serve item was a treat like for a class trip, not a just stock the pantry for an after school snack. Just like going out to fast food. 30- 40 years, it was a treat, now it's almost daily.

What was that saying....Use It up, Wear it out, Make it Do, or Do Without .

We have become a nation of we need the newest model. Doesn't matter if it's a toaster, car or phone, if there is an extra button or new color , we want it.

Now saying all that, I do want a lid and plastic straw on vacation. I go on vacation to enjoy myself, not worry about spilling soda on myself. I can spill soda on myself at home for much cheaper.

 

[AurumPunzel]

I sort of agree with you.....how's that for commitment?

At home we bring bags to grocery store, we have a stash in each car. We did buy some about 35 years ago. Heavy canvas ones , maybe when Earth day was young. Those are still my favorite for heavy items. The other million or so we have, we've gotten from XYZ group. Donate to some cause and before you can blink, bags, pens, note cards, throws and tshirts show up in the mail. I share the wealth with family, but the bags usually are somewhat cheap (good for bread but not can goods) , the pens have about 12 drops of ink in them, etc.

I had mentioned on another thread, how many of us made fun of grandma for saving those plastic containers to use again. It seems to be the invention of the water bottle opened the flood gates to one use items. When my kids were young to get a pudding cup or some other single serve item was a treat like for a class trip, not a just stock the pantry for an after school snack. Just like going out to fast food. 30- 40 years, it was a treat, now it's almost daily.

What was that saying....Use It up, Wear it out, Make it Do, or Do Without .

We have become a nation of we need the newest model. Doesn't matter if it's a toaster, car or phone, if there is an extra button or new color , we want it.

Now saying all that, I do want a lid and plastic straw on vacation. I go on vacation to enjoy myself, not worry about spilling soda on myself. I can spill soda on myself at home for much cheaper.

At least those who have been doing it for decades know exactly what they're doing. My dad's been hoarding plastic takeaway containers for years to use for leftover chilis, and even before our bag tax came into force, we were reusing bags we got from various stores, but mainly supermarket ones for small binliners. The issue I have with modern day environmentalism is the profusion of so-called 'eco' products that are now flooding the market, and are still feeding into rampant consumerism, which isn't healthy, particularly since a lot of those products are still imported, and thus have environmental ills. Even the reusable tote bags have nothing on the totes that were made many decades ago, and long before outsourcing to Asia to the lowest bidder became common.

 

[MrsPete]

I disagree that they are 'single-use' because the vast majority of people in here (or at least what I can gather) do reuse them for many things,

I hear what you're saying: plastic bags are reusable. Yes, they're useful for keeping things dry in the parks, and I suspect most of us use them as garbage can liners at home. This is definitely BETTER than a single use ... but we're probably talking about two uses, which is far from BEST.

it's a unanimous consensus that the way we consume plastics and then dispose of them after use cannot continue in its current form, but at the same time, there are far better solutions to dealing with the problem than solutions that result in a degradation of living standards ...

I agree that food packaging probably makes up the majority of the average family's plastic consumption, and it's pretty hard to change. I do buy spices "in bulk", which means I spoon them out into a thin plastic bag and decant them into my own containers at home. Ditto for dried beans, granola, and more ... but it's hard to buy milk or meat without some plastic and/or styrofoam.

On the other hand, some things could absolutely be better; for example, I bought a bottle of vitamins today, and they took up maybe 1/4 of the bottle ... the company could either sell a larger quantity of vitamins OR downsize the bottle so it'd require less plastic.

I'm not sure it can't be done without a "degredation of living standards". I think it would definitely be less convenient /more work than bringing your own reusable grocery bags.

I sort of agree with you.....how's that for commitment?

I don't have answers either -- so I can't say I'm completely committed either, but I know that when I personally visited the dump last week, I felt ashamed to add to the problem. Seeing it is a motivator.

When my kids were young to get a pudding cup or some other single serve item was a treat like for a class trip, not a just stock the pantry for an after school snack. Just like going out to fast food. 30- 40 years, it was a treat, now it's almost daily.

I agree.

Now saying all that, I do want a lid and plastic straw on vacation. I go on vacation to enjoy myself, not worry about spilling soda on myself. I can spill soda on myself at home for much cheaper.

I try to carry a large YETI cup with me when I go out to Chick-fillet (or similar) -- I can't say it's a fully ingrained habit just yet -- and I ask for my drink in that cup. I have never been a bag carrier at Disney (well, not since the kids outgrew strollers), but I may start bringing a bag so I can carry such a cup in the parks.

The issue I have with modern day environmentalism is the profusion of so-called 'eco' products that are now flooding the market, and are still feeding into rampant consumerism, which isn't healthy ...

I can't argue with your logic.

 

[AurumPunzel]

I hear what you're saying: plastic bags are reusable. Yes, they're useful for keeping things dry in the parks, and I suspect most of us use them as garbage can liners at home. This is definitely BETTER than a single use ... but we're probably talking about two uses, which is far from BEST.

Depending on the thickness and quality, plastic bags can be reused beyond just two reuses. I have a few Disney ones that are already being reused beyond those two reuses, and that's often for carrying things around in.

I agree that food packaging probably makes up the majority of the average family's plastic consumption, and it's pretty hard to change. I do buy spices "in bulk", which means I spoon them out into a thin plastic bag and decant them into my own containers at home. Ditto for dried beans, granola, and more ... but it's hard to buy milk or meat without some plastic and/or styrofoam.

On the other hand, some things could absolutely be better; for example, I bought a bottle of vitamins today, and they took up maybe 1/4 of the bottle ... the company could either sell a larger quantity of vitamins OR downsize the bottle so it'd require less plastic.

I'm not sure it can't be done without a "degredation of living standards". I think it would definitely be less convenient /more work than bringing your own reusable grocery bags.

The issue is how for decades, Western economies have been built around availability and convenience, and to force reusable bags really is like stepping back to the days of the Soviet Union, where everyone had to carry around those net bags because there were rarely any plastic or even paper bags available, and was often difficult. Even as the plastic bags started to become more widely available, particularly during the days of Gorbachev, people reused the plastic bags like the 'avoskas', with the added benefit of portability, particularly as avoskas often had rigid handles that would protrude too much in one's pocket, so even the Russians had the 3 Rs right from the start, before of course the collapse of the Soviet Union and the introduction of a liberalised market economy free of state control. Imagine trying to do that around the Disney Parks with their reusable bags.

I can't argue with your logic.

Especially since a lot are made in China (especially the merch we all buy; yes, I'll admit), and we all know that imports add to the world's global warming problem. As much as it's hard to avoid it, the best way is to try to buy locally where there's a locally-made alternative.

 

[North of Mouse]

Yes, they've gone way too far - especially, with Disney's money grabbing reputation, they aren't concerned with the environment as much as they're concerned with what it will 'save' them not to offer the afore mentioned amenities.
I, for one, have no intention of buying anything that needs a bag. Will not purchase open cup (no lids) drinks with no good straws (hate flimsy paper) -
Will not carry around a reusuable bag at a park - will not buy one (have enough at home that I chose to buy), nor purchase anything without them supplying me with a bag.

 

[TropicalDIS]

Straws are an easy switch. AK has been using the paper ones for a while and they are fine. Going without a lid is a bit of a pain if you are walking around the park with your drink, but if you are sitting down then it’s a bit easier. With any luck someone will come up with an alternative to a plastic lid.

 

[AurumPunzel]

Yes, they've gone way too far - especially, with Disney's money grabbing reputation, they aren't concerned with the environment as much as they're concerned with what it will 'save' them not to offer the afore mentioned amenities.
I, for one, have no intention of buying anything that needs a bag. Will not purchase open cup (no lids) drinks with no good straws (hate flimsy paper) -
Will not carry around a reusuable bag at a park - will not buy one (have enough at home that I chose to buy), nor purchase anything without them supplying me with a bag.

I saw someone spilling a tray of lidless drinks at MK, and that could have easily been prevented if Disney just simply switched to bioplastic lids that can be composted. The technology is there, and Disney makes lots of money, so why can't they? And I'd hate to imagine all the parks forcing the reusables like the Stores already have done, since they'd be losing a lot of merch revenue. They've already had another onslaught of store closures.

Straws are an easy switch. AK has been using the paper ones for a while and they are fine. Going without a lid is a bit of a pain if you are walking around the park with your drink, but if you are sitting down then it’s a bit easier. With any luck someone will come up with an alternative to a plastic lid.

There's already bioplastic, but the problem is that, despite Disney clearly being able to adopt it, they still haven't, and that's another thing that annoys me about Environmentality. They can easily balance convenience and conservation simply by adopting seamless alternatives that pleases both sides. Even I've noticed the promotion of reusing the renewable disposable bioplastic cutlery at the Epcot Flower and Garden Festival back in March, with Environmentality clearly being mentioned on the cutlery dispensers.

 

[Simba's Mom]

I was grumbling about the discontinuing of plastic straws and lids, until I went to the Grand Canyon in April. Not only do they have those bans, they've also banned selling bottled water. They will sell you a refillable metal bottle and have free bottle refill stations all over. But no plastic bottled water. And no availability of paper straws.

 

[GirlDreamer]

I don't mind bringing my own bags to the parks. The annoying part would be of I'd go there without knowing that I needed to and having to buy a reusable bag, but I'd still get it. Regarding the the drinks being sold without a drink and a straw, that could easily be solved if they do what they're doing with the refillable hotel and waterpark mugs. If you pay for the mug, you just pay either a daily charge to refill it as much as you want, or just pay a small amount for each refill.

 

[AurumPunzel]

I don't mind bringing my own bags to the parks. The annoying part would be of I'd go there without knowing that I needed to and having to buy a reusable bag, but I'd still get it. Regarding the the drinks being sold without a drink and a straw, that could easily be solved if they do what they're doing with the refillable hotel and waterpark mugs. If you pay for the mug, you just pay either a daily charge to refill it as much as you want, or just pay a small amount for each refill.

The trouble is when it does come to the point they force the reusables in the Parks, and especially at the higher prices, it'll cause a lot of backlash, and even if people don't mind purchasing them, the cost of the reusable bags will add up a lot quickly, even more so than bag taxes that are in force in some areas/countries such as the UK, not to mention the practicality concerns of carrying around empty reusable bags around all day in anticipation of possible purchases. As for the mugs, I definitely agree they should become a WDW-wide programme and not just a resorts/water parks thing.

 

[Glenn]

ive been away from the board for a bit but here are some questions about the subject.
Paying for bags, First how much? Second was this required by some government agency or is Disney doing this to save the environment?
If required by local or state government you are stuck with it. If Disney is doing this I think its a money grab that sounds nice. Either they save by not giving bags out or cover their cost for bags plus some to raise profits.
Cup lids, what a mess. Disney is saving on the cost & thats their goal. And if people spill drinks or a bug takes a dive into your cut they end up buying more drinks. Chaching Disney takes in more money. They can cut down on trash by saying you eat in no lid, If youre doing carry out you get a lid. I hate when a company starts fibbing to squeeze more out of folks.
Paper straws, Im all for it if they are good ones. I was in the UK last money & used a paper straw at McD. Pretty heavey duty. It didnt fall apart in my large size drink.

 

[AurumPunzel]

Paying for bags, First how much? Second was this required by some government agency or is Disney doing this to save the environment?
If required by local or state government you are stuck with it. If Disney is doing this I think its a money grab that sounds nice. Either they save by not giving bags out or cover their cost for bags plus some to raise profits.

It's a combination, but even Anaheim still allows lightweight plastic as long as the store isn't a supermarket or pharmacy, and in any event of the bag laws in California and France, they still allow thicker plastic bags as long as they're at least of compliant thickness (2.25mil/57.15mu for California, or 50mu/1.96mil for France). However, the way Disney are doing it, albeit they're still optional in the US Parks for now, is more of an excuse to milk more money out of guests, and it isn't right, especially because the US Parks now charge between $2-3 for reusable bags, and to force them at such a price when it does come to that is going to alienate guests even more, and harm merchandise sales to the extent that Disney will have to rethink it all. Because Disney isn't IKEA or Costco, and the fact the majority of purchases done in Disney Parks and Stores are always done on a spur of the moment, it's impractical to force reusable bags on guests or make them take their own, and the latter is especially going to be a problem for those trying to travel light. A small charge for plastic bags is IMO a far better solution, since in the UK, it's still made a huge difference and yet doesn't force people into a costly option or a Catch-22.

 

[dominiondad]

Not sure it's too far, but I do fear there is always the danger of unintended consequences. In DC, they implemented a 5 cent bag tax for plastic bags. The rational provided was that the money would be used to clean up the many plastic bags that find their way into the environment, most specifically the Potomac River. It sounds good, but ...... on more than one occasion I witnessed a bag get away from somebody and start to blow away. In both cases, the person made no effort to catch it and instead said something along the lines of "Oh well, I already paid for somebody to clean that up".

Also, one of the best recycling efforts I've seen is unfortunately rarely duplicated. I am from a small town. The town set aside an area where people can leave things they no longer want. Not trash, but old toys, suitcases, garden tools, sports equipment, etc... Rather that throw out this old stuff, what is somebody's garbage becomes new to somebody else. It keeps truckloads of stuff out of landfills. The biggest issue is keeping out the people who are intent on ruining it - those who simply hang around and collect the good stuff so they can resell it.

 

[AurumPunzel]

Not sure it's too far, but I do fear there is always the danger of unintended consequences. In DC, they implemented a 5 cent bag tax for plastic bags. The rational provided was that the money would be used to clean up the many plastic bags that find their way into the environment, most specifically the Potomac River. It sounds good, but ...... on more than one occasion I witnessed a bag get away from somebody and start to blow away. In both cases, the person made no effort to catch it and instead said something along the lines of "Oh well, I already paid for somebody to clean that up".

Also, one of the best recycling efforts I've seen is unfortunately rarely duplicated. I am from a small town. The town set aside an area where people can leave things they no longer want. Not trash, but old toys, suitcases, garden tools, sports equipment, etc... Rather that throw out this old stuff, what is somebody's garbage becomes new to somebody else. It keeps truckloads of stuff out of landfills. The biggest issue is keeping out the people who are intent on ruining it - those who simply hang around and collect the good stuff so they can resell it.

Only an uneducated fool would think that they can carry on irresponsibly disposing of bags because their bag tax paid for such a cleanup, since it's supposed to be for cleaning up existing plastic bags that ended up there in the first place, and also to encourage fewer bags while still providing the convenience should one need it. Phaseouts and bans, on the other hand, lead to even worse unintended consequences such as increased plastic usage stemming from thicker bags and more substantial bags, increased plastic waste as a result of varying levels of quality of tote-type reusable bags (as witnessed with accounts of Disney's reusable bags getting damaged prematurely as a result of the aforementioned quality issues), paper consumption, and even health issues from undisinfected reusable bags used to handle certain food products that require cooking prior to eating, such as raw meat.

As for having a 'freecycling' area, it's a great idea, but the issue of vultures using them as an opportunity to make money from certain goods being deposited there is no different to prowling charity shops/thrift stores looking for rare items and then selling them on for a profit. I've seen that happen a lot with certain vintage Disneyana I've seen.

 

[DisLiss]

None of that really bothers me in the least. I can bring my own bag to use----not that I buy much to begin with (The first of the 3 "R"s is "Reduce". So I view buying less as the first place for to make improvements.)

We already opt for many reusable vs. single use items as home, so I don't really feel any of these things are hardships, myself. I can bring a reusable straw, drink without a straw, or simply bring my own lidded cup. They make collapsible cups that are small and light to toss into the bag I'm already carrying. Yes, I'll still be wasting the cup they give me the drink in, but it does still reduce the lid & straw.

I've packed my own toiletries for years, so that I wouldn't risk using something that I wasn't use to and that might bother me in some way, so I certainly don't care that Disney isn't providing me little soaps and shampoos to take home with me.

I figure if you leave your house, you're going to run into things that aren't exactly as you'd like to them to be because you're not fully in charge of your environment once you step out of your home. But I don't want to stay home all my life, so I will learn to adapt to any changes the vacationing world throws at me.