Has Disney dropped the magic ball?

This is provably false, at least insofar as other major entertainment/travel companies are concerned. I participate on Cruise Critic, which is, to the cruise industry, what the Dis is to WDW. There was a certain cruise line that decided to start charging a $2 surcharge for room service delivery that had previously been free of charge. The Cruise Critic Board lit up. The charge was reversed within two weeks. Another cruise line decided to change its corkage policy from $15 per bottle with unlimited bottles to $20 per bottle with a limit of one bottle per person per cruise. The change was to go into effect in two months time so as to provide some transition period. The Cruise Critic Board lit up. The policy was reversed without ever being implemented. Don't for a second think that a company like Disney does not react to the single biggest comments board that addresses its business.



But you can see, (I hope), how the things that you refer to in your second paragraph would cause many other people to report that Disney is dropping the ball. As you state, "for you" the magic is still there. For others, the things that you noted are clear manifestations of a lack of care on the part of a company that used to care. There is certainly no requirement that all people interpret what they see in the same manner. But for some of the cheerleaders on this Board who insist that nothing has changed and that the parks are every bit as clean as they have ever been, I would hope that they would read your post and take notice. (And take notice of what our hosts here on this Board have said on podcasts over and over and over again about cleanliness). It is one thing to notice that the parks are different, (read as "dirtier"), but not allow that to ruin your trip. It is quite another thing to pretend that nothing has changed.



I think too many people are looking at this as a black and white proposition. Or, as a "go or don't go" proposition. But consider this. Let's say that in the past, on a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the very best, WDW was a 10 and its closest competition was a 6. Now, WDW is an 8, and its closest competition is a 6.5. People are still going to go to WDW. They are still going to book one more trip. It is still going to be their vacation of choice. It is still the best in the business. But it just isn't what it used to be. There is room for this type of thinking. Which leads to...



This....



...and this.

When people vote with their wallets and come back time and time again, they are not necessarily saying that everything is perfect. They are saying that things are still worth paying for. But, at the same time, they can say that things aren't what they used to be.

You are misrepresenting what I said. I said exactly that they are not going to make wholesale (broad, sweeping) changes based on a few complaints on an Internet message board. The examples you used of a widespread media outpouring on a relatively small issue is not even close to what I was talking about. I stand by what I said. If you can make a case for one time it happened in regards to Disney, I would be interested in hearing it.

Number two, I don't think anyone said that just because people come back they think everything is perfect. What was said was IMO the perception of Disney when people keep returning is that they are doing enough for a guest to return and they do not see a very good ROI on fixing issues that do not make a significant impact on that.
 
You are misrepresenting what I said. I said exactly that they are not going to make wholesale (broad, sweeping) changes based on a few complaints on an Internet message board. The examples you used of a widespread media outpouring on a relatively small issue is not even close to what I was talking about. I stand by what I said. If you can make a case for one time it happened in regards to Disney, I would be interested in hearing it.

Number two, I don't think anyone said that just because people come back they think everything is perfect. What was said was IMO the perception of Disney when people keep returning is that they are doing enough for a guest to return and they do not see a very good ROI on fixing issues that do not make a significant impact on that.
I won't address the first point because everything can be so easily twisted. My citation to a chat board reaction all of a sudden became "widespread media outpouring" and the issues addressed became "relatively small" when I can assure you that they were anything but to the people cruising on those lines.

As to the second point, there is a trap laid that enough is being done such that there is no ROI in addressing the issues complained of. But it is a moving curve as I noted above. Maybe Disney has moved from a "10" to an "8" and still leads the pack. But sitting on one's hands and relying on ROI to dictate changes ignores that the gap is narrowing and will continue to do so unless something is done to alter the momentum. And yes, throughout these 17 pages, there are comments that suggest that everything is perfect.
 
The towel animals are a red herring, and that one complaint is giving people license to marginalize the OP.

Part of what I love about Disney and Disney World is attention to detail. I am just a sucker for little things that make something more special. Gosh, what a double edged sword! If I complain about the loss of details, then I'm chastised for complaining about minor things. Minor things are one of the things that set Disney apart from its competition. Attention to food, drink, maintenance, customer service, cleanliness, hidden Mickeys, etc. I know the broad strokes are still there, but isn't some of the magic in the details?
Well said!!!! Totally agree!!! :thumbsup2
 
Indeed. If I'm going to do that, I expect a "Make My Own Magic" discount off the admission prices. At $105 for a one-day ticket, I expect them to make all the magic for me.

Maybe we define magic as something different then. For me a non working water cannon that I only notice isn't working because of all of my previous trips doesn't take away the magic from my vacation. I still laugh and giggle and have a great time on that ride. The non working water cannon doesn't cast a pall on the rest of my vacation.
 

We are halfway through our 10 day trip and I'm disappointed in the Little details that are missing in the parks and the cast members, I.e., no towel animals in our room (at a deluxe resort), we've encountered more than one rude castmember in the parks, the bathrooms are filthy.... It just seems the little things are missing.... I realize it's hot and crowded here so I expect other guests to be rude but so far in this trip the Disney "magic" is missing. Has anyone else noticed this or am i expecting too much based on previous vacations here?

Off the parks shortly, maybe today will have a little bit of magic....

My thoughts come from visiting the parks since we started going in 1978. Everything has changed, from the good to the not so good. You really just have to roll with the punches. Yes some days the CM's seem to be having a bad day, some a really bad day. But its like when you are with a group of people, everyone can be very polite, except that one person, and it's always that one person you remember.
 
I won't address the first point because everything can be so easily twisted. My citation to a chat board reaction all of a sudden became "widespread media outpouring" and the issues addressed became "relatively small" when I can assure you that they were anything but to the people cruising on those lines.

As to the second point, there is a trap laid that enough is being done such that there is no ROI in addressing the issues complained of. But it is a moving curve as I noted above. Maybe Disney has moved from a "10" to an "8" and still leads the pack. But sitting on one's hands and relying on ROI to dictate changes ignores that the gap is narrowing and will continue to do so unless something is done to alter the momentum. And yes, throughout these 17 pages, there are comments that suggest that everything is perfect.

Disney is giving less and a lot of people are okay with it so why should they change? It's very disappointing though to many who are veteran WDW fans because we know what fantastic service this company once provided. If guests never experienced this level of service, then it's easier to understand how they can be so complacent with the lack of Disney "magic". Yes, I said magic because it was. Always smiling CMs, absolutely spotless parks, great Mousekeeping, delicious food... These started going bye bye for the most part around 2005 and it's been on a steady decline since. Disney used to be the pinnacle of guest enjoyment. For those of us old enough to remember the 70's, Disney service has become what Six Flags service was at that time plus resorts- very good but definitely not the best.
 
Here now and my biggest complaint is FP+ being so difficult to work with and the $10 ADR fee which has caused me to not make several ADRs for fear I might miss them e.g., want to eat at Sanaa today for lunch, we are at Kidani, but not 100% sure. Instead of making the ADR we just drive off site to eat a much cheaper meal.

What I find is a Disney trip is no longer easy and relaxing due to the many policies put in place.
 
At the end of the day, each of us has our own personal "This is no longer worth it to me" point. For some, it's issues like the ones the OP mentioned. For others, it's the increase in prices beyond a particular point, or the change to FP+, or any one of a million other things that mean that a vacation destination no longer meets our particular desires.

Each of us has to determine what's important to OUR own enjoyment of a long awaited vacation.

If and when you get to the point where WDW no longer does it for you, there's a whole wide world out there waiting to be discovered.

My family is still wildly in love with WDW. So for us it's still a great vacation destination. There are so many things about the parks and the resorts and the restaurants that still give each of the 5 of us joy, that make a WDW vacation "worth it" for us. Based on what I read here, I expected to hate FP+. Instead, I found that, while it had its ups and downs, it provided some great perks-- like getting right onto headliner rides the afternoon of our arrival in WDW, something that was never a reasonable expectation before.

That doesn't mean that we're right and that my sister (who tried WDW once and really didn't get what we loved about it) wrong. "Different" doesn't mean "Wrong"-- it means "different."

So we're allowed to disagree on this. It's not a math test, where x=3 is the correct answer and all other answers are incorrect. It's a question of how to best provide a vacation that will give each individual family time together and happy memories.

So the Magic Ball is in the eye of the beholder.
 
We were there 8/3 through 8/9 and had a great time. Felt a little rushed with ADR's and FP+, but that was partly my fault and partly circumstantial since I had to replan our entire trip a week out due to financial issues. Didn't encounter any rude CM's or dirty bathrooms or rude guests (for the most part). We only go every 3-5 years, so each time the magic is new for us. Seeing the look on my DD's face when she was the first to meet A&E in the morning was priceless. Overconsumption of anything will diminish the shine....would love to overconsume Disney, but hey....c'est la vie....
 
I think Drusilla has a right to "expect" some kind of Magic! Disney advertises that WDW is "Magical"!! So the expectation is not unreasonable. Yes, there is magic inside everyone that we can create..... but I don't think that is her point.
As for the bathroom..... believe me..... it CAN be avoided and there is NO reason for a dirty bathroom! Anytime I've come across a bad one I will let them know! There are some very busy restrooms at WDW but those should be the ones that someone is cleaning constantly.

On our trip over July 4th..... we experienced what seemed to be some of the best moments and worst moments regarding Magic. What was strange was the difference between parks! Animal Kingdom was phenomenal!!! We just kept saying to each other..... "WOW! Everyone is so friendly and helpful and just plain great!!" Everywhere throughout the park!
Then over at Studios..... complete opposite!!! Most (not all) of them seemed so unhappy! Some borderline rude! Very few greeted us! No one really even helped us. The CM's in the shops ignored us even when we walked up to the counter. It was pretty UN-Magical!
At MK we had both depending on the attraction or restaurant. Over-all.... the food-service people were 75% borderline rude! The only pleasant food service people were at Casey's and Columbia House. Even Crystal Palace was not at all friendly!
At Epcot it was pretty "meh"! Nothing magical... but no one really rude either.

And.... this was not just someone maybe "having a bad day" ... we noticed this every day we visited each of the parks. And we were there 9 days.

It seemed very Park-specific as to whether we would be dealing with friendly, magic, happy cast members.... or miserable crabby ones!!!
You are 100% right that she has the right to expect the magic as this is what Disney has advertised and provided for years; OP was feeling a bit down so I was just offering some pointers so the trip wouldn't feel like a total dissapointment. Agreed on the park variances too, it's really strange how things can change from one park to the next.
 
We'll just have to agree to disagree.
Fair enough.

For what it's worth, I am genuinely interested in seeing an example of a positive Disney thread spinning wildly out of control for 17 pages, so please feel free to shoot me a link if you see one. The last time I remember it happening was when Epcot changed their entertainment lineup and everyone lost their collective poop. Believe it or not, I was on the side defending Disney ;)
 
Fair enough.

For what it's worth, I am genuinely interested in seeing an example of a positive Disney thread spinning wildly out of control for 17 pages, so please feel free to shoot me a link if you see one. The last time I remember it happening was when Epcot changed their entertainment lineup and everyone lost their collective poop. Believe it or not, I was on the side defending Disney ;)

I suspect if someone created a thread praising FP+ as the greatest invention since sliced bread, it would be quite an interesting discussion, lol.
 
Maybe we define magic as something different then. For me a non working water cannon that I only notice isn't working because of all of my previous trips doesn't take away the magic from my vacation. I still laugh and giggle and have a great time on that ride. The non working water cannon doesn't cast a pall on the rest of my vacation.

I get it -- one little thing doesn't ruin my day, either.

But take the water cannon. Add it to overflowing trash cans, sloppy bathrooms, mediocre food at haute cuisine prices, burned-out light bulbs, broken escalators, grease pit smells, delays on getting into your room, finicky MagicBands™, late or non-existent park buses, broken-down (or constantly breaking) rides, rubbed and scratched paint on multiple surfaces, whole sections of parks walled off, etc., all on the same visit, and one begins to wonder why they pay the premium price Disney commands...

Sometimes I wonder if there isn't a condition called Battered Tourist Syndrome... that's when we're overcharged for mediocre amusement, but we've actually convinced ourselves we love it.
 
Fair enough.

For what it's worth, I am genuinely interested in seeing an example of a positive Disney thread spinning wildly out of control for 17 pages, so please feel free to shoot me a link if you see one. The last time I remember it happening was when Epcot changed their entertainment lineup and everyone lost their collective poop. Believe it or not, I was on the side defending Disney ;)

Sorry, most of them were either closed ( not a good idea to link to a thread closed because of posting violations) or deleted entirely. Guess you just had to be there.

I don't see this thread as being wildly out of control though. In Dis terms, it's pretty well behaved.
 
I didn't say they didn't monitor social media. Of course they do. I said they don't make wholesale changes based on a few complaints on an Internet message board. They understand the type of users that are most vocal on this board and recognize that they already have those people. Even if they are complaining, they are still buying tickets and making vacation plans.

I've been on these (and other) boards for several years, and I wish I had taken note of the many times I saw message board complaints that subsequently got addressed in the parks. The biggest one I can think of is their reversal of direction on New Fantasyland. The backlash was very strong, and largely on these kinds of boards, when Disney announced that NFL would all be based on princesses. Disney got the message fast, and that is why they scrambled to add 7DMT to NFL.

Message boards provide free feedback for Disney, from many paying customers. They would have to be crazy not to listen to what we're saying, and often take that into consideration.
 
I've been on these (and other) boards for several years, and I wish I had taken note of the many times I saw message board complaints that subsequently got addressed in the parks. The biggest one I can think of is their reversal of direction on New Fantasyland. The backlash was very strong, and largely on these kinds of boards, when Disney announced that NFL would all be based on princesses. Disney got the message fast, and that is why they scrambled to add 7DMT to NFL.

Message boards provide free feedback for Disney, from many paying customers. They would have to be crazy not to listen to what we're saying, and often take that into consideration.
// insert standard "we're only a small subset of Disney customers" response here //
 
I've been on these (and other) boards for several years, and I wish I had taken note of the many times I saw message board complaints that subsequently got addressed in the parks. The biggest one I can think of is their reversal of direction on New Fantasyland. The backlash was very strong, and largely on these kinds of boards, when Disney announced that NFL would all be based on princesses. Disney got the message fast, and that is why they scrambled to add 7DMT to NFL.

Message boards provide free feedback for Disney, from many paying customers. They would have to be crazy not to listen to what we're saying, and often take that into consideration.

But Davey us Disers are only a small subset of Disney customers.
 
I think a pp hit the nail on the head when they said that those that know the Disney of the 70's-the 90's expect more because they experience the magic of that era. A truly wonderful time when Disney was not crowded, the staff was exceptional, and it was very clean. No need for fast passes, ADR's, or high-level planning. If you visited then, it is hard to say that the Disney of today is a top notch place. Regardless, there are those who will accept the Disney of today as the best.

Some will defend Disney no matter what you say, one poster said something a couple of weeks ago that was funny and true. He or she said something like, "If Disney decided to whack every fifth guest through the turnstile in the knee with a lead pipe, some people would defend Disney and tell you it's your fault for being one of the fifth customers in line."
 
I was just there for the week and to me, the place doesn't seem quite as clean or "magical" as Disneyland. The bathrooms were okay but not terribly clean. The monorail system was a mess. Broke down almost daily. Took 2 hours to get from Epcot to the contemporary once. The biggest letdown was FP+. I say we average about 7-10 fast passes a day at DL. Also, we tend to fast pass the same ride multiple times. Being limited to selecting different rides and by tiers was kinda a bummer.

I know a lot of people are comparing the past WDW to the present WDW but comparing it to DL in terms of the little things is also interesting. DL to me seems cleaner. The Bay Lake Resort was pretty run down especially compared to the Grand California. I found multiple roaches in my room which I've never seen in the Disneyland hotel or Grand.

Even with that said, I don't think it will ever preclude me from taking another vacation here but I for sure will make DL my preferred destination.

Edit: I thought the CMs were fine. They acted the same as DL on a typical day. What's amazing is that they could be polite in that weather. A hot Anaheim day has nothing on a brutal Florida August afternoon.
 
Somebody earlier in this thread mentioned trash in the loading area of Haunted Mansion, and I noticed that myself. It wasn't just one item either, but quite a bit. No way it had accumulated there in just one day.
 




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