Has anyone else had enough of this Paula Dean buisness?

And that in itself is very dangerous because generally when an entertainer does it as a stick in order to keep him/herself relevant they have to ramp it up.

My other concern is that when we call each other these things as entertainment we say that they are acceptable.


I tell my sons all the time, no way in heckdom am I going to give you money for you to buy a song where some guy is calling me a "B*&%tch" just not gonna happen. So when the "coolness" of those lyrics get old what does a rapper do next to sell a record?

I agree with you on all points. The use of words and sexual exploitation in entertainment has power to capture people's attention for all the wrong reasons and desensitizes youth. That is a dangerous combination.

ETA: The bolded is exactly what I was talking about.
 
It very much seems like a double standard but what you have to remember OA is that it's very much steep in history and that historical aspect is hard to separate.


WARNING!! lol, remember guys this is just one black persons take on the topic. I am not an authority on any thing (as my children seem fond of telling me;).

first there is the fear factory. Remember for much of this country's history, a white person calling you a N-word could have deadly consequences. I'm not talking just getting into a fight, I'm talking about simply not stepping off the sidewalk when a white women passed could get you killed. Now lot's of folks think this is long ago history but look at it this way. My mom was a civil rights attorney, I remember it and thus share these stories with my sons. So to my sons, this isn't ancient history.

The supreme court just threw out the voter right act. Now many white folk say "times have changed" we don't need it anymore. let me say for most black folks we see this as an attempt to simply get our vote discounted and to turn back the hands of time to the 1950's We view it as another attempt to make sure we (blacks) never again get empowered to vote. Remember almost all the strides made in civil rights were made through the courts and through voting. Many specifically believe it is so another African american will never get elected again as president.. We remember and we remember well the abuse we took just to get to vote now.

Now there was a backlash against many rappers especially the gangster rappers against their lyrics and especially against those god awful videos. Don't even get me started on the fights in my house because it's banned. A women named C. Delaros Tucker (fascinating women guys, go google.) spent most of her life fighting the entertainment industry. most mainstream R & B stations will bleep out the word. So basically rappers get a pass because in the realm of how they are perceived they don't have much power. there is not that fear that underneath the words is some one who will try to resinstate Jim crow all over again. May not be a rational fear but it is a very real fear.

look at it this way, if you have a son and he gets pulled over by the police the worst you worry about is him getting a ticket. I have to teach my son that saying the wrong thing to a police officer in 2013 can get him killed. My sons when they were taught to drive also took a class on what not to do and how to answer the police. Because paranoid or not, in this country an African American kid driving a lexus is often equated with a drug dealer. I can't take the chance that I'm over blowing it. I have no choice but to teach my son's these things.


I don't think most of white America understands that the bolded part is still true. I know well that it is. Although both me and ds are white, his best friend is black as well as three other very close friends of his. So many times ds would be out and about town and the car would include one white and two or three black boys. For whatever reason, that seem to mean either drugs or gang related to cops.

He and his best friend were stopped one time and asked to get out of the car, because of the colors each one was wearing they were asked if they were each part of rival gangs. Really? Because this kind of stuff drove ds crazy, he came back with "yep, we are working on a peace treaty". ;) After the cop growled at him and then let them go, his friend had to explain to ds why his comment had him (the friend) scared to death. He was seriously afraid that he would get arrested or worse.

Its sad that its still that way. And to this day it makes ds see red when he gets pulled over for some stupid excuse and he knows its because he just drove over and picked up his friend.
 
To me, the whole blending in with the blackboard is no different from the picture below that was all over Facebook. Why hasn't anyone had an issue with this? Because the person is white?


fPUUf.jpg

Haha, see, that is funny. I just think people need to be able to laugh at stereotypes about their race, religion, nationality, ect and not take them so personal or themselves so seriously.

Im a Dago Polack myself and can laugh at stuff like the Jersey Shore. I dont care if someone makes a dumb Pollack joke. I dont care if Dave Chappelle does a satirical bit on white people. I dont care when men are portrayed as dumb oafs in television shows. I grew up Catholic and Im all for any Catholic joke you have. I just dont take entertainment or comedy or satire so seriously. I have not once, in my entire life, heard a joke or some word and got offended. Not ever.

There is a big difference between something done in humor or satire and something done out of hate. If more people would just laugh at the caricatures of themselves and the people who are living representatives of those caricatures theyd spend much less time angry. It has to be exhausting trying to find a way for everything to be offensive.

Just my opinion of course.
 
I have a black male friend who rides his bike everywhere. He does not own a car and I live in the hills of East TN. This is not a bike friendly place.

In 2012, he is riding his bike home from a game and is "pulled over" by the police. There's been a report about a home burglary and a big screen TV was taken. He was pulled over as a suspect. HE'S ON A BIKE--like, where is he going to put a big screen TV??!

But, he's black. So they search him. It is ridiculous. In a few minutes it comes in that the man is white. But, let's stop a black man on a bike because...why? Because he's black.

I've seen white people pin this guy to the curb on his bike with their vehicles. He's been hit, bumped, really--because he's a black man on a bike. It makes me furious--it breaks my heart.
I remember a black student of my sister's (in SC) telling her that she does not not know how it feels to be walking down the side and hear the door locks being clicked--because you are black. It is a horrible thing. A horrible thing...

Like I've said before...I dropped Smithfield and their family of meats long before they dropped Paula Deen. I think that one is something Paula Deen is better off w/o.
 

ARGH. Now I see that Target has dropped her as well.

I think this whole thing is unfortunate and getting blown out of proportion daily. Yes, she was wrong. However, as she stated in her apology, very few of us can say we never said something off color or offensive. She just happens to be in the public eye and was truthful in stating she used the N word in a conversation.

Yes, I've read the other accusations as well and don't think that her comments were meant in a mean or degrading manner. I think she is a product of how, where and when she was raised. Does it make it right? No, but it makes one understand a little better. Just as these rappers today use the N word all the time and sing/rap about offending ideas. Until they stop, it will always be out there.

By these companies dropping her, they are not only hurting her, they are hurting those who worked for her. There are many people who will now be out of a job because of this fiasco.

Just my 2 cents.



I agree. She could have lied and everything would have stayed the same. She respected the oath, admitted the truth and apologized. As a young adult, I used the "N" word myself. I was probably the least racist amongst my family and friends, but the word was everywhere. I used it as a joke with family members on multiple occasions.

I can't imagine saying the word today. I'm a better person and I live in a different world. My faith would never allow me to feel that anybody is any different on the inside or that I should ever say an unkind word about other people. Woe to all of us if we're penalized for things we said 10-40 years ago! Its a crazy upside down world.
 
Forgive me. I'm feeling "blonde" today. Or maybe I'm just a dumb Mic. I don't know. But they were still persecuted, correct? Thats what you said above. A stereotype about the Irish meant they were discriminated against. Do people think that ALL Irish are/were perpetually drunk, Catholic and had hordes of kids?

If you mean by my use of "were" instead of is, I was thinking about the late 1800's to the early 1900's. In the United States, I don't honestly know how much Irish discrimination still occurs in the United States. I know I don't see it myself.

But my entire point was that Irish people aren't being singled out because they are "allergic to the sun". The pale skin Facebook joke isn't offensive (at least to me), because it's not something the culture is sensitive about. The Irish were certainly mistreated; they were even sold by the British to the colonies as slaves. But it wasn't because of the color of their skin.
 
/
To me, the whole blending in with the blackboard is no different from the picture below that was all over Facebook. Why hasn't anyone had an issue with this? Because the person is white?


fPUUf.jpg

I think that pic is hysterical. :lmao: For the record, I'm a pale, auburn haired, American of Irish(50%) & Polish(50%) decent.:thumbsup2
 
Haha, see, that is funny. I just think people need to be able to laugh at stereotypes about their race, religion, nationality, ect and not take them so personal or themselves so seriously.

Im a Dago Polack myself and can laugh at stuff like the Jersey Shore. I dont care if someone makes a dumb Pollack joke. I dont care if Dave Chappelle does a satirical bit on white people. I dont care when men are portrayed as dumb oafs in television shows. I grew up Catholic and Im all for any Catholic joke you have. I just dont take entertainment or comedy or satire so seriously. I have not once, in my entire life, heard a joke or some word and got offended. Not ever.

There is a big difference between something done in humor or satire and something done out of hate. If more people would just laugh at the caricatures of themselves and the people who are living representatives of those caricatures theyd spend much less time angry. It has to be exhausting trying to find a way for everything to be offensive.

Just my opinion of course.

ITA :thumbsup2
 
I just read this NPR piece on the matter. I thought it summed up what I was thinking very well.


"Why Paula Deen Can't Be A 'Food Network Star'

June 27, 201310:59 AM

Will Paula Deen's admission of using a racial slur crumble her empire?
As a new documentary shows, a plate of soul food is loaded with questions about history, identity and health.

It's not the least bit surprising that Paula Deen lost her gig on The Food Network — and you don't have to believe she's a terrible person to know it. All you have to do is watch Food Network Star, the competition show that seeks a new network personality and sometimes finds one.

That's where they got Aarti Sequeira, who now hosts the Indian food show Aarti Party. It's where they got Aaron McCargo, Jr., who hosts Big Daddy's House. And Melissa d'Arabian, who hosts Ten Dollar Dinners, and Jeff Mauro, who calls himself "The Sandwich King."

Oh, and it's also where they got a guy named Guy Fieri. You might have seen him in shorts, running around and yelling.

In other words, the show isn't a stunt like The Apprentice where the prize is a fake job with Donald Trump. The prize is an actual job; you have a decent shot at walking away from it as a person with a show on the Food Network, and in some cases as a big star who makes a lot of money and is successfully transformed into a brand. And if you've ever watched Food Network Star, the reasons they parted company with Paula Deen are entirely obvious.

Contestants are told from the beginning that they have to sell a concept, and it has to be pretty specific: sandwiches, cheap dinners ... or, you know, yelling in shorts. It's nowhere near enough to be a good cook, or a great cook, or a great teacher. The specific objective, as it's explained over and over again, is to create a sense of constructed familiarity that will get viewers to like you, to invite you in, to listen to you, and to care what you say. You have to cook good food, but it's enormously more important to look good on camera and to be engaging.

That applies to the existing chefs as well. They've all got a thing they at least allegedly are there to do and be: Bobby Flay is noisy but high-energy, Ina Garten is warm and nurturing, Rachael Ray splits the difference between cooking well and cooking fast, and Sandra Lee makes weird things out of canned things.

Paula Deen was Your Southern Granny, especially for people who didn't have a southern granny. She pushed mind-bendingly fattening foods for the vast majority of her career — that's where I saw bread pudding made from Krispy Kreme donuts — but at least she was nice and funny and had a lot of great stories about loving her family.

On Food Network Star, they make you talk about your family a lot. The attitude is that if you can't tell a personal story about a recipe, there's essentially no reason to make it on television, which is a pretty high bar as far as coming up with reasons why you totally care deeply about those turkey burgers.

Paula Deen built her entire Food Network brand on people's positive reactions to stereotypes about the south: the warm embrace of a southern woman, making nutritionally reckless food while telling you great stories. (PBS's Independent Lens series ran a terrific documentary called that's wonderfully thoughtful about the social aspects and health ramifications of soul food, which of course overlaps with but is not synonymous with southern food as Paula Deen understands it — seek out the film if you get the chance.)

Her first big bump came she hadn't disclosed that she had Type 2 diabetes until several years after her diagnosis when she was working with the drug company Novo Nordisk. Her failure to disclose isn't the most compelling reason in the world to be resentful of her, since there's plenty of evidence for the connection between eating and diabetes without Paula Deen personally having it — in fact, if she didn't personally have it, that would be a pretty terrible anecdotal argument for the proposition that her style of cooking can't contribute to it. But it dinged her public image, for sure.

And then last week, Deen's deposition came to light in a case where she was accused of creating a discriminatory work environment, and while the biggest publicity boom surrounded her confession that she'd employed racial slurs in the past, she probably got herself in almost as much hot water for saying some other curious things about her opinions in the present, including the idea that "most jokes are about Jewish people, rednecks, black folks."

You could sort of hear the brows furrow: They are? Most jokes are?

When she showed up on the Today show to talk to Matt Lauer and was asked whether she would have fired herself in the position of her business partners, she said no — she would not fire herself, knowing herself. In other words, in the position of a business partner who knows Paula Deen's heart, she wouldn't fire Paula Deen.

But if you've watched more than five minutes of Food Network Star, you know that they only care what's in your heart to the extent it happens to be congruent with what people think is in your heart. You can be the nicest person on the planet, and if it's not coming across, you're out. It's not about who you are, but about who you seem to be, because cooking is personal and touches people's families in all the most constant and important ways, so, you know. You'd better be able to make the sale.

None of this is to defend Deen as someone who would, as she claims, be found to have a good heart if we could only peer into it. It's only to say they don't, in fact, peer into it. Food Network is a sandcastle of manufactured intimacy, and your ability to convincingly maintain that intimacy is your most important job skill.

These revelations didn't only hurt Deen with a certain number of people who don't consider themselves part of a southern tradition, who may have recoiled from things like her recitation of her dreamed wedding that sounded very much like a plantation fantasy. They also hurt her with a segment of southerners who know that every time this happens, every time a southern lady acts like everybody knows most jokes are about black people and Jewish people and rednecks, they have to listen to an avalanche of obnoxious Yankee generalizing about how no one should expect anything else from a southern lady of a certain age, which is, of course, false.

As James Poniewozik , "Deen made a pile of money off a certain idea of old-school southern culture. In return, she had an obligation to that culture — an obligation not to embody its worst, most shameful history and attitudes. Instead, in one swoop, fairly or not, she single-handedly affirmed people's worst suspicions of people who talk and eat like her."

It's not being a bad person that gets you fired from Food Network, any more than it's being a bad person that gets you kicked off their competition show. It's being ineffective at making people want to hang out with you and watch you make food and tell stories.

Some of the commentary on Deen and her fans has been nasty, classist and unfair — there are plenty of high- and low-end restaurants outside the south where the desserts are as decadent as hers, and where the dinners are as caloric, and where plenty of the food would not be recommended by any doctor. The sneering is unfortunate, but more importantly for television, the sneering simply is.

One of the things she told Lauer was that it was a terrible feeling to think that supposedly "people I have never heard of are experts on who I am." But that's exactly what she made the money for. People she never heard of felt like they could tell you what she was like, what her personality was like, what it would be like to eat dinner with her. That's why they liked her. They were experts in who she was, and that was okay as long as they came to agreeable conclusions to her. Now, those conclusions aren't so agreeable, but they're no less based on reality.

Cooking TV is a personality-hawking business. They tell you that when you're angling for the job."
 
Note I am talking specific about the United States.

Irish are Caucasians. Other Caucasians are also white. Irish were not discriminated against because they were pale. You wouldn't necessarily know if someone was Irish specifically by how pale their skin was.

Irish were recognized more by accent, last name, religion, "number of children". They were persecuted because of the perception of being perpetually drunk, Catholic, and "takin' yer jobs!"

Make all the pale jokes you want. You're just as white. That doesn't phase me. You are also likely American. American history with Irish persecution pales in comparison to Africans.
THAT's the difference.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Irish_sentimen

I wouldn't want to say anything that makes light of slavery or civil rights abuses African Americans have faced, and I'm not on Paula Deen's side here at all.... but you really need to check your history.

Irish were considered lower than black slaves and given the jobs that were beneath the black slaves or too dangerous for a valuable slave to do. There were also Irish slaves.
 
I wouldn't want to say anything that makes light of slavery or civil rights abuses African Americans have faced, and I'm not on Paula Deen's side here at all.... but you really need to check your history.

Actually, I did just that. :)
 
I wouldn't want to say anything that makes light of slavery or civil rights abuses African Americans have faced, and I'm not on Paula Deen's side here at all.... but you really need to check your history.

Irish were considered lower than black slaves and given the jobs that were beneath the black slaves or too dangerous for a valuable slave to do. There were also Irish slaves.

This is true. I took a diversity class and found that most Americans do not know a thing about this disgraceful time in our history. The majority of the class also had no idea about the treatment of Japanese Americans during WWII. AS I said earlier, if one takes the time to study our history, perhaps how we tolerate certain words, phrases, and jokes might be different.
 
This is true. I took a diversity class and found that most Americans do not know a thing about this disgraceful time in our history. The majority of the class also had no idea about the treatment of Japanese Americans during WWII. AS I said earlier, if one takes the time to study our history, perhaps how we tolerate certain words, phrases, and jokes might be different.

you know, I didn't know anything about the treatment of the Japanese Americans during that time until I read a book by Danielle Steel. I was in my 30's!!!

My hs history teacher was a wwII buff and we thought we heard enough about that war to cover every piece and part and yet we never heard one word about this.
 
you know, I didn't know anything about the treatment of the Japanese Americans during that time until I read a book by Danielle Steel. I was in my 30's!!!

My hs history teacher was a wwII buff and we thought we heard enough about that war to cover every piece and part and yet we never heard one word about this.


I think that as Americans, we tend to turn a blind eye on things that we are ashamed about. I was lucky to learn something about WWII when I was in HS, only becasue we had a student teacher who decided that we should not go over the Revolutionary War yet again, and never get to learn about a "modern" war. My parents never talked about Irish Americans being treated badly, nor did they ever talk about the Japanese internment. There were things my Dad was pretty vocal about though, and one was wearing orange on St Patrick's day. Another was calling an Irishman a Mick.

I think that threads like this are interesting because it gives people a chance to discuss how words and actions mean different things to different people in part because of their own history or experience. If we don't talk about it, then we cannot make changes.

For instance, Firestarter made a comment about being a "dago pollack". Perhaps that is not offensive to that person, but what about other people? Is it okay for him to call names because he is not offended? Dago is another word that was not meant to be "cute". It was a very derogatory way of referring to someone, and was used to hurt a group of people, but maybe knowing how and why it was used would change Firestarter's opinion. I don't know. :confused3

Personally, I do not get my bloomers in a bunch over most jokes, but I very rarely tell them either. ( I can never remember them if you want to know the truth)
 
I think that as Americans, we tend to turn a blind eye on things that we are ashamed about. I was lucky to learn something about WWII when I was in HS, only becasue we had a student teacher who decided that we should not go over the Revolutionary War yet again, and never get to learn about a "modern" war. My parents never talked about Irish Americans being treated badly, nor did they ever talk about the Japanese internment. There were things my Dad was pretty vocal about though, and one was wearing orange on St Patrick's day. Another was calling an Irishman a Mick.

I think that threads like this are interesting because it gives people a chance to discuss how words and actions mean different things to different people in part because of their own history or experience. If we don't talk about it, then we cannot make changes.

For instance, Firestarter made a comment about being a "dago pollack". Perhaps that is not offensive to that person, but what about other people? Is it okay for him to call names because he is not offended? Dago is another word that was not meant to be "cute". It was a very derogatory way of referring to someone, and was used to hurt a group of people, but maybe knowing how and why it was used would change Firestarter's opinion. I don't know. :confused3

Personally, I do not get my bloomers in a bunch over most jokes, but I very rarely tell them either. ( I can never remember them if you want to know the truth)

Ok, dumb question coming: What is the significance of wearing orange on St. Patrick's Day.
 
I don't know enough Paula D to defend her so I won't. I grew up in Baltimore during the desegregation era and it was tough. I went to a religious elementary school where everyone were brothers. Attending junior high I was sent to a school that was 50 percent white and black for desegregation. I found out real quickly that everyone was not my brother. Three days in a row I got the devil beat out of me by groups of blacks. Did I use the n world you better believe I did. The fourth day I brought a sawed off baseball bat and I didn't get beat up that day. The entire time at junior high was full of fights and divisions between the races.

High school was so different we learned to get along we like the same music (soul music). We went to dances and played sports together the world was changing but we weren't there yet.

My career path depended on working with and trusting the people we worked with. I gained respect and became friends with the black people that I worked with. We went to dances, cookout, and to each other's houses we were lime family. One of my black friends came to my house every Christmas morning to watch my kids open their presents eat breakfast and he than went back to work.

My friend died way to young and I still miss him and think of him all the time. Yes the young kid that used the n word years ago helped carry his best black friends body to his final resting place. I stood there and shed a tear for a man who happened to be black who I loved as a brother.

If I was ever asked if I ever used the n word I would have to say yes during a different time and place in my life. Should I be thrown under the bus for doing so I don't think so. People and times change we can only hope for the best.
 
Ok, dumb question coming: What is the significance of wearing orange on St. Patrick's Day.

I know that it had something to do with Orange/Protestant; Green/Catholic. Now I am just speculating because my Dad never gave reasons, but I think it had a lot to do with the persecution in Ireland of the Irish Catholics by the English. It was definitely a statement back when I was a kid, and one my Dad did not like.

True story...my first husband was Polish and French. His sister was.....let's say vocal......about her disdain if my Irish heritage and the fact that my children were taught to embrace their Irish background. She would loudly wear her Orange, not caring that she was disrespecting people. Well, year and years and many anti Irish comments later, she married an card carrying ( I kid you not, he has a card) Irish fellow, and has more shamrocks floating around than I do :rotfl:
My personal smile was when they played bagpipes at the wedding :goodvibes
 












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