Gratuity to be removed from DDP!!

[Tinkerchele]

I may definitely reconsider the DDP in the future

Besides the value of the plan, wasn't the purpose convenience?? Knowing that my meals have already been paid for was a huge convenience to me. How is it convenient now if I have remember to bring tips with me to every meal?

 

[Marshay]

Add my name to those who won't be purchasing DDP in '08 if they don't include tip and taxes. We'll enjoy it this fall...hope Disney reconsiders...

 

[ColleenS]

this is the first including the Dining Plan. We are a party of 5...all adults(at least in price!). Guess this will be the first and last time for the Dining Plan...don't think I'd bother again if it wasn't including the gratuity. On a table of 5 adults...may as well just pay out of pocket.

We're a party of six, but otherwise in exactly the same position. We're doing the DDP this June, but would NOT do it if gratuity was not included.

 

[travelgirl06]

I think this will backfire on Disney. The current DDP is seen as a "good deal" by many, and is a great way for Disney to entice many guests to stay on-site (vs. more affordable hotels off-site). Making guests add tips (and possibly tax) turns this into a fair deal, but deffinately not enough to entice me (or many others probably) to pay more to stay on-site AND pay more for DDP.

Disney currently has a ton of unsold hotel rooms (hence the need to offer free DDP, huge room discounts, etc.), and DDP (free or paid) is a great way for them to get guests to stay on-site. On-site guests are a huge source of revenue, since they eat, play, shop, and seek entertainment on-site (read: all their money is going back to Disney). Look at their recent marketing tactics: offer a dining plan to keep guest's meals on-site, provide a free shuttle service (meaning guests don't have cars so they have to eat/shop/etc. on site).

It just doesn't seem logical that Disney would exclude tips to increase revenues; it will probably just lead to more people staying off site, or not going to the restaurants, or cutting their vacations shorter. Increasing the cost of DDP (or hotel nights for that matter), seems like a much more covert (and equally successful) way of doing this, while still making the guests feel like they are on a somewhat all-inclusive vacation and like they are getting a good value vacation.

 

[SnowWitch]

Add us to the list of people who will not participate in the DDP if tips are seperated. We are going in June and Dec, we will use the DDP on these trips but if Disney sees fit to add more expense we will go back to our old routine. We never ordered an app or dessert for everyone. Maybe one or two and we often split an entree between myself and youngest son. With our older kids getting close to college age and our younger two still in diapers we may join the group of people who decend on Disney during free dining if I'm not paying for the dining I won't mind paying the tips.

 

[bicker]

True, although I believe Disney always knew it would be flushing some money down the drain with the DDP, i.e. as a loss leader to increase on-site hotel occupancy (and consequently theme park attendance, merchandise sales, etc.). It just amazes me that apparently they miscalculated the cost of this loss leader so badly that they feel it necessary to increase the effective price by as much as 20% (or more, depending on how one uses the DDP) in one fell swoop. What business raises its prices by 20-25% all at once? That is not fine-tuning to find the sweet spot; that's a radical change.

Remember, often fine-tuning is needed due to changes in the customer-base, not because of any earlier "miscalculation". The economy is much better now than even last year -- I finally got my salary restored (after having taken pay cuts during the economic downturn after 9/11). Now that we have more disposable income, every discretionary expense will go up in price, precipitously. Airfares have gone up in price too.

Also, the first three years could have been considered a "getting to know you" period -- get people hooked on the idea of included dining. Now that people are hooked, they can begin making profit on the offering itself.

Furthermore, Disney has added services, expanding DME. Now it can be the loss-leader while the Dining Plan makes more profit.

However, I think the real reason is because the cheap-o Dining Plan has run its course, and there is now a better path through a higher-priced Dining Plan. It's just part of a natural cycle, up and down. 20% is not really a big change in that context.

 

[bicker]

This could just be union banter to show the members that it is working for them when they don't remove gratuities from the DDP.

Excellent point. We all (CMs and guests getting wind of this online) could indeed just being jerked around by union leaders.

 

[bicker]

Welll since this just rumor.. what we don't know is if the PRICE of the DDP will CHANGE as a result of this proposed change.

To me.. all this agitata over this is pointless until an official announcement is made. We can't know what the proposed change will mean for the price of the DDP.. because nothing has been officially announced.

Until it is.. getting upset over this seems rather pointless.

Knox

 

[bicker]

I think this will backfire on Disney.

Many people say that the Dining Plan has backfired on Disney, and therefore this is a remedy to that.

The current DDP is seen as a "good deal" by many, and is a great way for Disney to entice many guests to stay on-site (vs. more affordable hotels off-site).

Many folks feel strongly that a few too many guests are patronizing the plan than is optimal, given the capacity available. Disney can entice guests to stay on-site "a little less" using Dining Plan, and "a little more" other ways, like Magical Express, and come out ahead, both for themselves and for those guests who have expressed concerns about the effect of the Dining Plan all along.

Making guests add tips (and possibly tax) turns this into a fair deal, but deffinately not enough to entice me (or many others probably) to pay more to stay on-site AND pay more for DDP.

Disney's almost surely got better information than we do about just how many guests will be affected and in which direction.

Disney currently has a ton of unsold hotel rooms

Much less than competitors, and much less than a couple of years ago. Disney's load-levels are the envy of the industry, so that's not a quarter that they really need worry about. Indeed, their numbers there have been so good that they could stand to trade off some of that advantage for a different advantage, if the opportunity afforded itself.

 

[WendyisDarling]

... The economy is much better now than even last year -- ...Now that we have more disposable income, every discretionary expense will go up in price, precipitously...

Also, the first three years could have been considered a "getting to know you" period -- get people hooked on the idea of included dining. Now that people are hooked, they can begin making profit on the offering itself...
.

ITA with these statements. I have thought from the beginning that DDP was in part a strategy to change the way many think about the Disney experience. It is easier to stay on site has become the mantra for many. Now, many think one TS a day is just the way it should be. Etc. It was a good business plan using that logic.

Yes, prices are on the move. Partly due to the economy doing well and now because of fuel costs, which will eventually affect everything.
If the gratuity is not included, odds of our family using the DP will decrease. Main selling point for DH is convenience. As I wrote before, we would not order that much food and our bill would lower making OOP cost a bit less than the DP. However, if the overall price of DP had a small increase with gratuity still included, we would be OK paying a little more for the convenience. Key there is a little more...

 

[Nancyg56]

ITA with these statements. I have thought from the beginning that DDP was in part a strategy to change the way many think about the Disney experience. It is easier to stay on site has become the mantra for many. Now, many think one TS a day is just the way it should be. Etc. It was a good business plan using that logic.

Yes, prices are on the move. Partly due to the economy doing well and now because of fuel costs, which will eventually affect everything.
If the gratuity is not included, odds of our family using the DP will decrease. Main selling point for DH is convenience. As I wrote before, we would not order that much food and our bill would lower making OOP cost a bit less than the DP. However, if the overall price of DP had a small increase with gratuity still included, we would be OK paying a little more for the convenience. Key there is a little more...

I am in the same boat that you are in. DH is on the fence about the DDP because he feels trapped in Disney. The marketing worked with us because I wanted the convenience and the assurance that my food bill was paid. Anything I added was entirely up to me. If the cost increases and the convenience decreases, it will not be hard to change how I visit Disney because I was able to experience Disney during their "getting to know you" period and can try something different without feeling as though I am missing something.

I know that the DDP is one of the main reasons some families choose to stay on Disney property. I am not sure that ME will be enough to sway those who are on the fence.

 

[goofy4tink]

This is how DDP would break down for me....I normally would have a counter service lunch ($9.00), a character meal ($28.00) and a Dolewhip or creamcheese pretzel ($4.00)..total of $41.00 (vs $38 for DDP).If I change my dinner to one at a regular TS spot (LeCellier for instance), my cost goes up..dinner would be in the area of $40.00, making my total for the day about $53 (vs $38 for DDP). Now, the dining plan is really making money for me.

If I add the 'not included tip' to the DDP price......$38 plus $5 for my character meal scenario..total of $43. Add the LeCellier tip of $9.00 to my DDP $38..total of $47. A great difference? No, but it's still a savings. Better than nothing and you still have the 'convenience' of not having to pay for each meal.

For those of you who go more often, consider getting an AP and then buying the DDE card. It saves you 20% on most table service meals. I like to think of it as just paying for my tip!

 

[wilde_oscar]

This is great in theory, but what about the posters that say they would never tip over $10 no matter what. I have had many tables where my service is great, but something was wrong with the way their food was cooked and it was reflected in my tip. This isn't fair, but you deal with it. Unfortunately many people do not understand the restaurant business and don't appreciate what servers do for them. Servers aren't as low on the food chain as people like to put them and it is too bad that many people don't appreciate the hard work that they do for them.

Also, if you were lousy at your job, you would still get your base rate which I imagine must be more than the $2.35 we get.

No tip is the risk you take in response to the reward of a possible large tip. Notice that in most of the rest of the world, the tip is part of the bill. But since we pretty much invented capitalism, in the U.S. the tip is based on the interaction between customer and server... you accept those conditions by accepting the job. And yes, I make more then $2.35, however I have friends that work in up scale joints that live a very, very nice lifestyle. Lemme tell the tale of two very different experiences on our last trip, I remember it as if…
**********fade to dream sequence**************

At Boma we waited 15min for water (I sat and waited as I had pills to take, and yes I made it clear that I needed a glass of water to take medication). The server did not clear plates once, filled drinks once as part of bringing the check, and 10 min. after we were done eating, disappeared with my card for 45min before bringing the bill to sign. Knowing what I know now, I would have called over a manager and had the tip removed. But I signed the bill and she got her DDP 18% (9pm ADR DDP).

Measure this against Breakfastasouras... our server Mikeasourous did some slight of hand magic tricks, our coffee and oj was never less that half full, we watched as he greeted every guest as they were seated, his timing was perfect to take our pics as the characters came around, the bill was presented as we were getting to the end of the meal and I barely had time to blink and he was back with the paper work for me to sign. (8am ADR OOP)

Guess which one got the $40, 100% tip? Guess which we are going out of our way to see twice this year? Guess which one we recommend to everyone that is going to WDW? I’d be willing to bet that Mike makes a decent living, as the tables on either side of us commented what a great server, make sure he gets a good tip. It's the singer, not the song... Go figure! I don't wanna hear one excuse for the bad server... if you went to see Festival of the Lion King and the monkeys were rude, showed no interest, and basicly looked like they were going though the motions... wait take that to the next step if you went to see the broadway production of Lion King (which was just here in Cincinnati again, great show, go see it when it comes to your town) and the cast was ho hum about the whole thing, would ya think ya got your monies worth? Would ya take the cast out for drinks after? Man that was a large bar tab, what was I thinking!

 

[Bubbley4Disney]

There seems to be 2 threads going on with this same topic, here is what is being said over there:

~~~~And BTW Loved loved loved The Lion King (in Houston) Wish I coulda gone out for drinks with Y'all!!!! ~~~~



Quote:
Originally Posted by FayeW
I am not missing anything. Certainly a person's attitude while doing their job is very important, especially when working with the general public. The ambiance they help create will set the tone for the dining experience. I get it.

What I think you are missing is that patrons are not obligated to tip. Leaving a tip, and how much you choose to leave, is entirely voluntary. As I have seen many, many references over the years to exceptional or "above and beyond" service I wanted to get an understanding for exactly what that means to the people who have experienced it. What I am suggesting is that people have become used to indifferent service, and have become used to tipping 15-20% for it. Then when someone gives attentive service they consider it to be exceptional. I disagree, and say that attentive service should be the minimum we expect.

I still think it is ridiculous that the waiter who brings a plate of salad gets tipped $4 less than the waiter who brought out a plate with steak on it. They've done the same job. Provided the same service. However, that is the way the tipping system currently works so there you go.

I have always thought this exact same thing! I have found the service at Tony's in MK to be horrible on all occasions (about 4) and finally we have decided to never eat there again. The Hosts are busy and rude and the wait staff as soon as we told them we were on the DDP never even bothered bringing us bread or water or were very fast paced about anything. Then DDP tipped them 18%!!! If it were up to me they would have got 0%. Now the service at Sci Fi is always great! and the DDP tips them 18% but for a lower cost meal~~~ Tipping should not be based on the cost of the meal rather the service provided and whether or not they enhanced the meal or ruined it with bad attitudes, that expect a tip whether they are friendly and helpful or not. I am so glad Disney is considering removing the tip from DDP. The servers who are upset about it, are the ones who need an attitude adjustment. Obviously from reading this thread there are many people who would tip over the top when called for, including me.
__________________

 

[Jenniww]

TIP- stands for To Insure Prompt service.

I waited tables for eight years and dazzled many tables and got great tips. Then there were a few days I was overly tired and had a hard time keeping up and and tips reflected it. Every great server as a few rough days.

I used the DDP on our last visit. Seven TS meals and never felt like I had bad service not once. I thought they all should have 20 %

Now as for how I feel about the DDP changing. I will use it again if the price of the adult plan is reduced by a few dollars. I would love to choose the amount of tip and still feel the value of the plan. I might be dreamig on the price going down

 

[DiRTyBuNNy]

TIP- stands for To Insure Prompt service.

I waited tables for eight years and dazzled many tables and got great tips. Then there were a few days I was overly tired and had a hard time keeping up and and tips reflected it. Every great server as a few rough days.

I used the DDP on our last visit. Seven TS meals and never felt like I had bad service not once. I thought they all should have 20 %

Now as for how I feel about the DDP changing. I will use it again if the price of the adult plan is reduced by a few dollars. I would love to choose the amount of tip and still feel the value of the plan. I might be dreamig on the price going down

I doubt it would go down so we're both dreaming I guess...

--Mr. DB

 

[LurrrvtheDuck]

Wow that would suck and might actually have a negative effect on the DDP. I know I really like that part of the DDP. Unless they lower the cost of the DDP to balance out the gratuity not being included then it might work. Otherwise I think a lot of people will just opt out of the DDP.

 

[MommyBoo!]

This is great in theory, but what about the posters that say they would never tip over $10 no matter what. I have had many tables where my service is great, but something was wrong with the way their food was cooked and it was reflected in my tip. This isn't fair, but you deal with it. Unfortunately many people do not understand the restaurant business and don't appreciate what servers do for them. Servers aren't as low on the food chain as people like to put them and it is too bad that many people don't appreciate the hard work that they do for them.

Also, if you were lousy at your job, you would still get your base rate which I imagine must be more than the $2.35 we get.

If I was lousy at my job, I'd get fired. That said, we always base our server's tip on their performance and nothing else. I'm sorry that others don't do this.

 

[TheDisneyClan]

**********fade to dream sequence**************

Knowing what I know now, I would have called over a manager and had the tip removed. But I signed the bill and she got her DDP 18% (9pm ADR DDP).

Are you saying that a tip can be reduced from the imposed 18% on the DDP if you feel the service is horrible?

Has anyone heard of or done this?

 

[WendyisDarling]

OT -- Just a question, no agenda...
I have been told that even if service is bad (not beyond belief bad, but very poor), you should tip at least 10% because that is the assumption and what servers pay as minimum tax. Further, 10% tip is a well-known signal to the server that the service you received was poor.
Maybe I talk to people who don't know what they are talking about?

Still, I have never left less than 10% and when I have done so on the rare occassion, I thought I was giving the server a thumbs down.

So, is the 10% "rule" correct?