Free Dining, why do some NOT like it?

[Honeystar120608]

Yes, money wise I think it would be cheapest to have the free dining, based on all my calculations.

We actually had decided 2 months back to drop down to QS instead of the DP but apparently the discount that I have I am not able to change anything in the package or I will be bumped up to rack rates.

I am not complaining, I enjoy the sit down meals. Last year we did the QS and it was a lot of food, but not much we can do now. I'd rather save money and enjoy the restaurants.

In the parks, with the lack of free Dining the first few days we are there, will we see a difference in crowds, or dining even? I am just curious because so many say that free dining affects the restaurants and food... is this as a whole or just during free dining periods?

 

[fitzperry]

I can see how the free dining would work well for families with children, or if you're staying at a Value resort. For me, who is staying at the Poly CL (just me and my husband), the room only discount far outweighs the free dining.

I am excited for those of you with a lot of children, because I can't imagine having to pay for rooms, tickets AND food for all those people. That can get to be VERY expensive and I can see how the free dining is a great benefit.

We only have 2 kids (one over 10) and are staying at Poly this time. I would prefer a big room discount (friends going at the same time had a 40% off pin--where's mine?), but fd is a pretty good deal too. We have a 12yo who is a very light eater but not a fan of the typical WDW kids meal so fd will help avoid the aggravation and expense of paying out the yin yang for a bunch of meals she won't be able to finish. That said, I'll be keeping my eyes peeled for a room discount.

Also, for the most part, I find the food at WDW to be overpriced and mediocre. So, while I might not be thrilled about the crowds fd will no doubt cause in the restaurants, I'm happy not to think about the price.

 

[TwoAtDisney]

Princess Tiffany, thank you for responding to my post. Your figures are a great example of what is confusing me. How did free dining reduce the price of your 2 rooms from $5000 to $3800 (which I assume is how you computed $1200 savings)? Free dining just gives free food, not room reduction.

We are a family of 6 and we always get 2 connecting rooms at a value resort for 8 nights with 7 day tickets. Rack rate/full price for us for a vacation of this type at WDW is roughly $5,000.00. With a FD discount it is about $3,800.00. Ever before there was a Disney Dining Plan, let alone free dining, we always at at least 1 table service/character meal per day - yes, even dessert, gasp! And, also, I'm one of those women that isn't going to cook on vacation - I'm a stay at home mom and cooking and cleaning is my full time job and WDW is my vacation from that. So . . . .

Free Dining saves us around $1,200.00
4/3 deal saves us around $740.00
Room only discount saves us around $650.00.

Seems to me that free dining costs you about $300 more in room rack rates for 2 value rooms for 8 nites (I picked random dates in October) rather than a special offer on room reduction. Not a lot of savings for a family of 6 vs free dining.

So, it appears to me that your $1200 is what you are counting as OOP food costs if you did not have free dining - is that how you are computing the $1200?

Actually, the computation would require subtracting the $300 higher room costs due to free dining, which reduces your "savings" to $900, which if divided by 8 days = $112.50 per day food costs for OOP, divided by 6 people = about $20 per person per day (I rounded up for easy division!). $20 a day per person for food is easily done, but I agree, not what I would want. So, I can see that free dining is the best value for your family. However, I still can't get to the $1200 savings?

 

[TwoAtDisney]

kelma, sorry but I wasn't questioning the "accuracy" of your math. I agree with you that with a large family staying in a value resort, you could not feed your family as cheaply OOP as you can by paying more for your rooms & taking free dining.

My thought was the large $ amounts of savings being posted on many of the threads. I don't think the extra cost for the room(s) (by not taking the special offer for rooms) is being deducted from the "savings". I also think the large savings $s are computing the very expensive meals obtained via free dining, while most families don't really eat that way, & would not really spend that much OOP.

However, although I don't agree with the savings figures being given, I now see that free dining is definitely a good value for families staying in value resorts - no question about it. So even if folks are not getting as much a savings as they think, they are still saving - which is always a good thing!

Now what I wonder is do the families realize they can expose their children to different cultures & expose them to great history (& even fun & excitement) by taking the same money & going to Europe? Or, maybe a cruise to the disappearing glaciers of Alaska? When we were raising our children, we definitely included some trips to WDW, but we also liked to give them travel variety. As adults they have often expressed gratitude for that. Oh well, just a thought I had.

 

[EPCOTatNight]

Princess Tiffany, thank you for responding to my post. Your figures are a great example of what is confusing me. How did free dining reduce the price of your 2 rooms from $5000 to $3800 (which I assume is how you computed $1200 savings)? Free dining just gives free food, not room reduction.

We are a family of 6 and we always get 2 connecting rooms at a value resort for 8 nights with 7 day tickets. Rack rate/full price for us for a vacation of this type at WDW is roughly $5,000.00. With a FD discount it is about $3,800.00. Ever before there was a Disney Dining Plan, let alone free dining, we always at at least 1 table service/character meal per day - yes, even dessert, gasp! And, also, I'm one of those women that isn't going to cook on vacation - I'm a stay at home mom and cooking and cleaning is my full time job and WDW is my vacation from that. So . . . .

Free Dining saves us around $1,200.00

4/3 deal saves us around $740.00
Room only discount saves us around $650.00.

Seems to me that free dining costs you about $300 more in room rack rates for 2 value rooms for 8 nites (I picked random dates in October) rather than a special offer on room reduction. Not a lot of savings for a family of 6 vs free dining.

So, it appears to me that your $1200 is what you are counting as OOP food costs if you did not have free dining - is that how you are computing the $1200?

Actually, the computation would require subtracting the $300 higher room costs due to free dining, which reduces your "savings" to $900, which if divided by 8 days = $112.50 per day food costs for OOP, divided by 6 people = about $20 per person per day (I rounded up for easy division!). $20 a day per person for food is easily done, but I agree, not what I would want. So, I can see that free dining is the best value for your family. However, I still can't get to the $1200 savings?

Obviously, I am not the poster you were quoting, but I noticed something. You bolded Rack rate/full price for us for a vacation of this type at WDW is roughly $5,000.00. With a FD discount it is about $3,800.00. Notice the word in red. She said her vacation costs $5000, not her room. Also, there isn't always a room discount available when free dining is going on. Even with a solo traveler, free dining is almost always financially better than a room discount at a value resort. At 20% off of $100 a night, that's just $20. That means that you would have to eat for less than $20 a day for it to be a better deal. Most people would not enjoy themselves if they had to do that.

My thought was the large $ amounts of savings being posted on many of the threads. I don't think the extra cost for the room(s) (by not taking the special offer for rooms) is being deducted from the "savings". I also think the large savings $s are computing the very expensive meals obtained via free dining, while most families don't really eat that way, & would not really spend that much OOP.

I understand your point, but most families would not eat that way BECAUSE they have to pay OOP. While it may be true that they would spend less on entrees, it doesn't always reflect what they truly want. Even those who have a lot of money usually factor in price and sometimes order differently based on it. I know I do.

 

[kelma]

Now what I wonder is do the families realize they can expose their children to different cultures & expose them to great history (& even fun & excitement) by taking the same money & going to Europe? Or, maybe a cruise to the disappearing glaciers of Alaska? When we were raising our children, we definitely included some trips to WDW, but we also liked to give them travel variety. As adults they have often expressed gratitude for that. Oh well, just a thought I had.

Firstly, it's time to check your math. I could not take my entire family to Europe on the $3200 the my Disney vacation is costing. Airfare alone for the 6 of us would be FAR more than that. Factor in renting a place large enough for the 6 of us (at least 2 hotel rooms in Europe) and the cost of food and transportation for a week? Plus the not so great exchange rate? We could easily triple what we spend on a Disney Vacation.

Secondly, why in the world would you assume that Disney is the only vacation we (or anyone else on this board) take as a family? I can't speak for everyone else, but I know that just because we probably won't take everyone to Europe until our youngest is quite a bit older (at least 12), we are fortunate to be able to take our children on a few other, less expensive vacations every year.

I think it's great your children had the opportunity to travel to many different places . I just don't understand why you would assume that the rest of us aren't offering our children some of the same opportunities?

Kelma - mom to 2 princes and 2 princesses

 

[justanothermark]

Free dining certainly makes the disney experience much better for us. As a family of 6 that stays at a value resort (ASMu Family suite, 2 adults and 4 kids 11,11,9,7), free dining saves us about $1300. (After the $352 upgrading to DDP from QsDP.) We tend to be at the park at rope drop and stay until they kick us out and would rather spend the time in the park than leaving to eat. Of course we could pay OOP for dining but then we are always worried about the cost of everything which takes away from the experience and being on vacation. The cost certainty of the dining plan is nice and being able to get that discount entices us to go back to Disney. Has free dining devalued the food experience, most likely, but it is what is and have to figure out the best solution for what is there.

And do we eat more than we would usually at home. Certainly, we wouldn't order dessert after each TS and QS meal but we are vacation and I don't want to worry about it. Do I really have to worry about gaining weight from all that extra food, not really due to all the walking (last time on DDP, family ended up breaking even on weight gain/loss). For us, eating breakfast in the room or using a snack credit, doing a CS for lunch, and then typically a TS for dinner fits well in the way we want to have vacation. I know now what the cost is going to be and don't have to worry later.

 

[TwoAtDisney]

kelma, I agree with you that a family of 6 cannot do a European trip for the price of a WDW trip in a value resort. I also agree with you that I would prefer not taking younger children; about 10yo & above is good.

However, most people think a trip to Europe is very expensive; it is not if one looks for the deals. Last spring I was emailing all of my friends about 2 weeks in Italy for $2500 (dollars, not Euros) a couple including air & hotel. I know the hotels mentioned & they were good ones - not luxury, but average American standards, clean, & well located. I'm on many lists for many travel specials & the sales are amazing. Granted, I would have to work a little harder to find that for a family of 4, but I'm sure I can match the prices of a WDW trip that I have seen on this board (I'm not a travel agent, just a wise trip purchaser).

A cruise to Alaska is easily doable for a WDW trip price.....not sure, I'd have to research, but maybe even for a family of 6, I bet. Now kelma, I'm not assuming anything about you & your family.

I sense that you felt insulted by my post. I am very sorry. I did not direct the paragraph you quoted at you & your family. I should have used my brain & not included those thoughts in a post that directed some comments to you personally. If I had directed those thoughts at you, I would understand you being insulted; that would be awful of me. I was just commenting because I see such large $ amounts being spent on WDW trips year after year by many families. And I do still wonder, not assume, if people realize they can also go to some other wonderful & exiting places for the same money. I also did not assume that other trips were not being taken - I said "I wonder". That is a question, not a statement. Sorry you misunderstood my intent; happens a lot on message boards. But, anyone wanting some good prices on Alaskan cruises and/or European/UK travel can let me know & I'll do what I can to find something.

Whew, I better think before I post - it can get warm in here!

ps. edit - I know the following does not refer to families, but just as an indicator on some good prices - DH & I just cancelled a 2 week transatlantic cruise from Ft. Lauderdale to Southhampton, England - balcony cabin, $1000 per person; many exciting ports in Europe; we've gotten this price often & one time even got $700. Had to cancel because of my husband's "back" issue, which will soon be resolved. We've cruised on the Queen Mary transatlantic for $1000 & less pp (1 week cruise). I've found business class airfare, NY to Paris for $600. Good prices are out there for those interested in spending some research time. Happy travels everyone.

 

[dhardawa]

My daughter and I are going to Disney in November for a "girls trip". We're doing 7 nights at Pop Century. I originally booked the trip with a PIN code for a room discount. When I changed that to free dining, my trip went up $115. There is no way we could have eaten for 7 days in Disney World for $115. So, it is a very good deal for us.

 

[TwoAtDisney]

EpcotatNight - thanks for pointing that out to me. I couldn't figure out how the free DDP reduced the "room" rate. "vacation" is a horse of a different color!

 

[fitzperry]

kelma, I agree with you that a family of 6 cannot do a European trip for the price of a WDW trip, but a family of 4 can (& many of the people posted are less than 6). I also agree with you that I would prefer not taking younger children; about 10yo & above is good.

I'm a pretty savvy travel consumer too, and I just don't think that's accurate, at least not for us. My entire family of 4 can fly to Orlando for the cost of a single ticket to Paris during the time of our upcoming WDW trip (about $1,000). As for packages, the best deals always require you to fly out of either NY or a hub city, and we don't live in one. For instance, I just did a quick search and found a 6 day Paris/Rome trip for about $1,100, except to fly out of my hometown, it's $1,600 per person. That's an extra $2,000, and would put us way beyond the cost of our longer WDW vacation. Also, I know cruises are quite a bargain right now, but I hate them--just not how I like to travel. We've been to Europe and plan to return with our kids, but not until they're a bit older (they're 12 and 8 now) and we can really make the most of it.

Similarly, when I booked the Poly for this trip and was choking on the cost, I thought that it might make sense just to go to Hawaii instead. Nope, $1,200 per person for the flight. Flights to the Caribbean are also fairly cost prohibitive at the moment. I have found a few Hawaiian packages that seem reasonable, but the hotel and airfare alone would cost as much as our WDW trip. Again, we plan to do it when they're a bit older, but given the ages of my kids, WDW just makes sense this year.

 

[TwoAtDisney]

Jen, I can't say whether international travel costs would match your family's trip to WDW or not, because I don't know how much you spend at WDW. I made my statement based on some of the WDW trip costs I have seen on this board. For instance, here is what I found without taking too much time & effort. I'm sure with more time & effort & booking farther in advance, could do as well or better & come up with more dates, cities, & itinerary; didn't even check for packages which are usually cheaper. Hope my math is right; I hurried & I rounded some! -

#1 - London for below $4,000 included total air & hotel for 2 adults, 2 children -
Air - depart Boston on 11/5/11; depart London on 11/13/11.
Icelandair (found on Travel Zoo & then went to Icelandair site to verify) = $600 per person round trip coach x 4 = $2,400 total air for a family of 4
Hotel - Holiday Inn Bloomsbury in London = $208 nite for 4 people x 7 nites = $1,456. On xe.com, I converted the hotel from GBP to $. I'm sure there are more hotels just as nice & well located for a cheaper price, but we always stay in the Holiday Inn Crowne Plaza in Kensington, so I just checked the HI site. Note the hotel price is not from a discounter site - deal directly with the hotel - that's the way I like it.
The Icelandair has a good schedule for kids - just a 2 hour layover; gives time to stretch & unwind. I'm sure air prices are cheaper the farther out one buys. As for getting from your city to Boston or wherever (NY is usually a lot cheaper for flights to UK/Europe, except for this Boston special), I always book that round trip air separately - it's always been cheaper for my trips rather than adding it onto the international flight.

#2 -ROME - this example is higher $, but would compare to London above if booked year in advance & selected cheaper hotel (I listed ours, but there are lots of cheaper good ones in Rome). With our bed & breakfast right in the heart of things & with a kitchen (we don't use for cooking; use for fridge & microwave) = about $6,000 for RT air & 7 nites for 2 adults, 2 children 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 (need to book further out for good price).
Air = Kayak.com for leads & checked Delta website - abt $1000 RT pp w/taxes & fees x 4 people = $4000; see note below.
Our bed & breakfast = NavonaGardenSuites.com - Rafello Suite $2,000 for 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 = 7 nites.
NavonaGallerySuites - Bernini Suite $2000; same dates

#3 - Alaskan Cruise - RT Seattle and/or Vancouver (30min - 1 hr inexpensive tourist bus ride between the 2 cities, if necessary for cheapest air fare); 2 adults; 2 children; 1 inside cabin.
Royal Caribbean (our favorite) - $2,236 total for the family of 4.
Air - don't know your city so can't find a good price.
Separately try RT to/from your city to the hub city for a better total air cost.

Food Costs - On the cruise it is obviously covered. In London & Rome, we spent very little. But we don't eat much, we don't eat at expensive sit down restaurants. There are American fast food places, which I know is not preferred while on vacation, but I'll give up great food to stand under the Sistine Chapel or in the Colloseum!

Siteseeing Costs - more on the cruise - whale watching; kayaking, etc., but many days when doing your own tours won't be much. In Rome, the sites are inexpensive & there is so much to see. Little more in London, but still not a big expense like in the U.S.

IMO, if these trips are $1000 or $2000 above WDW, I would just save for a little longer in order to share these exciting wonders with my family & to have the memories, before my kids decide they no longer want my company!

I think 12 & 10 are good ages. So your 8yo may be ok; depends on the child.

Whether you stay with WDW or elsewhere, enjoy those younguns while you can!

Julie

 

[Deealee]

It doesn't work for my family, but to each their own.

 

[carebee21]

Jen, I can't say whether international travel costs would match your family's trip to WDW or not, because I don't know how much you spend at WDW. I made my statement based on some of the WDW trip costs I have seen on this board. For instance, here is what I found without taking too much time & effort. I'm sure with more time & effort & booking farther in advance, could do as well or better & come up with more dates, cities, & itinerary; didn't even check for packages which are usually cheaper. Hope my math is right; I hurried & I rounded some! -

#1 - London for below $4,000 included total air & hotel for 2 adults, 2 children -
Air - depart Boston on 11/5/11; depart London on 11/13/11.
Icelandair (found on Travel Zoo & then went to Icelandair site to verify) = $600 per person round trip coach x 4 = $2,400 total air for a family of 4
Hotel - Holiday Inn Bloomsbury in London = $208 nite for 4 people x 7 nites = $1,456. On xe.com, I converted the hotel from GBP to $. I'm sure there are more hotels just as nice & well located for a cheaper price, but we always stay in the Holiday Inn Crowne Plaza in Kensington, so I just checked the HI site. Note the hotel price is not from a discounter site - deal directly with the hotel - that's the way I like it.
The Icelandair has a good schedule for kids - just a 2 hour layover; gives time to stretch & unwind. I'm sure air prices are cheaper the farther out one buys. As for getting from your city to Boston or wherever (NY is usually a lot cheaper for flights to UK/Europe, except for this Boston special), I always book that round trip air separately - it's always been cheaper for my trips rather than adding it onto the international flight.

#2 -ROME - this example is higher $, but would compare to London above if booked year in advance & selected cheaper hotel (I listed ours, but there are lots of cheaper good ones in Rome). With our bed & breakfast right in the heart of things & with a kitchen (we don't use for cooking; use for fridge & microwave) = about $6,000 for RT air & 7 nites for 2 adults, 2 children 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 (need to book further out for good price).
Air = Kayak.com for leads & checked Delta website - abt $1000 RT pp w/taxes & fees x 4 people = $4000; see note below.
Our bed & breakfast = NavonaGardenSuites.com - Rafello Suite $2,000 for 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 = 7 nites.
NavonaGallerySuites - Bernini Suite $2000; same dates

#3 - Alaskan Cruise - RT Seattle and/or Vancouver (30min - 1 hr inexpensive tourist bus ride between the 2 cities, if necessary for cheapest air fare); 2 adults; 2 children; 1 inside cabin.
Royal Caribbean (our favorite) - $2,236 total for the family of 4.
Air - don't know your city so can't find a good price.
Separately try RT to/from your city to the hub city for a better total air cost.

Food Costs - On the cruise it is obviously covered. In London & Rome, we spent very little. But we don't eat much, we don't eat at expensive sit down restaurants. There are American fast food places, which I know is not preferred while on vacation, but I'll give up great food to stand under the Sistine Chapel or in the Colloseum!

Siteseeing Costs - more on the cruise - whale watching; kayaking, etc., but many days when doing your own tours won't be much. In Rome, the sites are inexpensive & there is so much to see. Little more in London, but still not a big expense like in the U.S.

IMO, if these trips are $1000 or $2000 above WDW, I would just save for a little longer in order to share these exciting wonders with my family & to have the memories, before my kids decide they no longer want my company!

I think 12 & 10 are good ages. So your 8yo may be ok; depends on the child.

Whether you stay with WDW or elsewhere, enjoy those younguns while you can!

Julie

Seriously, I don't know what your agenda is but your are coming across as someone who is looking to pick a fight and put down people who constantly decide to travel to Disney. You do realize that you're on a Disney related website, not just a traveling website, right?

People on here aren't stupid. If they wanted to price out an international vacation or a cruise, they know how. If it was something they were interested in and it offered a comparitive price, they know how to book it.

I know for the same price that I'm paying for my Disney vacation I could be going somewhere else. But guess what? We don't want to! And I don't think I'm a bad parent or am damaging my child by not going elsewhere either. My son has traveled to several places in the US and he continually asks to go back to Disneyworld. I'm happy to oblige as it's a fun vacation that we all enjoy and we create wonderful family memories.

 

[Dorisk3]

Jen, I can't say whether international travel costs would match your family's trip to WDW or not, because I don't know how much you spend at WDW. I made my statement based on some of the WDW trip costs I have seen on this board. For instance, here is what I found without taking too much time & effort. I'm sure with more time & effort & booking farther in advance, could do as well or better & come up with more dates, cities, & itinerary; didn't even check for packages which are usually cheaper. Hope my math is right; I hurried & I rounded some! -

#1 - London for below $4,000 included total air & hotel for 2 adults, 2 children -
Air - depart Boston on 11/5/11; depart London on 11/13/11.
Icelandair (found on Travel Zoo & then went to Icelandair site to verify) = $600 per person round trip coach x 4 = $2,400 total air for a family of 4
Hotel - Holiday Inn Bloomsbury in London = $208 nite for 4 people x 7 nites = $1,456. On xe.com, I converted the hotel from GBP to $. I'm sure there are more hotels just as nice & well located for a cheaper price, but we always stay in the Holiday Inn Crowne Plaza in Kensington, so I just checked the HI site. Note the hotel price is not from a discounter site - deal directly with the hotel - that's the way I like it.
The Icelandair has a good schedule for kids - just a 2 hour layover; gives time to stretch & unwind. I'm sure air prices are cheaper the farther out one buys. As for getting from your city to Boston or wherever (NY is usually a lot cheaper for flights to UK/Europe, except for this Boston special), I always book that round trip air separately - it's always been cheaper for my trips rather than adding it onto the international flight.

#2 -ROME - this example is higher $, but would compare to London above if booked year in advance & selected cheaper hotel (I listed ours, but there are lots of cheaper good ones in Rome). With our bed & breakfast right in the heart of things & with a kitchen (we don't use for cooking; use for fridge & microwave) = about $6,000 for RT air & 7 nites for 2 adults, 2 children 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 (need to book further out for good price).
Air = Kayak.com for leads & checked Delta website - abt $1000 RT pp w/taxes & fees x 4 people = $4000; see note below.
Our bed & breakfast = NavonaGardenSuites.com - Rafello Suite $2,000 for 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 = 7 nites.
NavonaGallerySuites - Bernini Suite $2000; same dates

#3 - Alaskan Cruise - RT Seattle and/or Vancouver (30min - 1 hr inexpensive tourist bus ride between the 2 cities, if necessary for cheapest air fare); 2 adults; 2 children; 1 inside cabin.
Royal Caribbean (our favorite) - $2,236 total for the family of 4.
Air - don't know your city so can't find a good price.
Separately try RT to/from your city to the hub city for a better total air cost.

Food Costs - On the cruise it is obviously covered. In London & Rome, we spent very little. But we don't eat much, we don't eat at expensive sit down restaurants. There are American fast food places, which I know is not preferred while on vacation, but I'll give up great food to stand under the Sistine Chapel or in the Colloseum!

Siteseeing Costs - more on the cruise - whale watching; kayaking, etc., but many days when doing your own tours won't be much. In Rome, the sites are inexpensive & there is so much to see. Little more in London, but still not a big expense like in the U.S.

IMO, if these trips are $1000 or $2000 above WDW, I would just save for a little longer in order to share these exciting wonders with my family & to have the memories, before my kids decide they no longer want my company!

I think 12 & 10 are good ages. So your 8yo may be ok; depends on the child.

Whether you stay with WDW or elsewhere, enjoy those younguns while you can!

Julie

OH, you silly thing, don't you know dissers can see all that at Epcot- you're offending those that go to disney to educate their children!

 

[KB24]

We have had free dining the past 2 trips we have gone (the past 2 years) However, this year we are in a black out period (sept 27) and are not able to get free dining. It would have saved us $317 more than the discount we have now, so not the END of the world. Would have been nice to save some more money. Regardless, we are going. But why is it some don't like free dining? Are there any perks between sept 27-Oct 2 when fd starts that we will see around the parks (less of a crowd perhaps?)

I have a list of reasons why FD currently - isn't for me:

1) I have no children so it's just me and the fiance when we go. So at 2 people FD isn't saving me anywhere near what the AP discount saves me.

2) We stay at the deluxe resorts when we go. Same reason as above. We save more with the room only discount.

3) Dining locations are just OK. We have a hard time eating out and such heavy meals that many times in a row/days in a row so we like to eat lighter which makes the DP less valuable. For our eating style, paying for club actually makes more sense.

4) We found the DP restrictive when we did it. There are a lot of snack carts and things we wanted to get that just did not take DP which irked us.

 

[fitzperry]

Jen, I can't say whether international travel costs would match your family's trip to WDW or not, because I don't know how much you spend at WDW. I made my statement based on some of the WDW trip costs I have seen on this board. For instance, here is what I found without taking too much time & effort. I'm sure with more time & effort & booking farther in advance, could do as well or better & come up with more dates, cities, & itinerary; didn't even check for packages which are usually cheaper. Hope my math is right; I hurried & I rounded some! -

#1 - London for below $4,000 included total air & hotel for 2 adults, 2 children -
Air - depart Boston on 11/5/11; depart London on 11/13/11.
Icelandair (found on Travel Zoo & then went to Icelandair site to verify) = $600 per person round trip coach x 4 = $2,400 total air for a family of 4
Hotel - Holiday Inn Bloomsbury in London = $208 nite for 4 people x 7 nites = $1,456. On xe.com, I converted the hotel from GBP to $. I'm sure there are more hotels just as nice & well located for a cheaper price, but we always stay in the Holiday Inn Crowne Plaza in Kensington, so I just checked the HI site. Note the hotel price is not from a discounter site - deal directly with the hotel - that's the way I like it.
The Icelandair has a good schedule for kids - just a 2 hour layover; gives time to stretch & unwind. I'm sure air prices are cheaper the farther out one buys. As for getting from your city to Boston or wherever (NY is usually a lot cheaper for flights to UK/Europe, except for this Boston special), I always book that round trip air separately - it's always been cheaper for my trips rather than adding it onto the international flight.

#2 -ROME - this example is higher $, but would compare to London above if booked year in advance & selected cheaper hotel (I listed ours, but there are lots of cheaper good ones in Rome). With our bed & breakfast right in the heart of things & with a kitchen (we don't use for cooking; use for fridge & microwave) = about $6,000 for RT air & 7 nites for 2 adults, 2 children 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 (need to book further out for good price).
Air = Kayak.com for leads & checked Delta website - abt $1000 RT pp w/taxes & fees x 4 people = $4000; see note below.
Our bed & breakfast = NavonaGardenSuites.com - Rafello Suite $2,000 for 11/10/11 - 11/17/11 = 7 nites.
NavonaGallerySuites - Bernini Suite $2000; same dates

#3 - Alaskan Cruise - RT Seattle and/or Vancouver (30min - 1 hr inexpensive tourist bus ride between the 2 cities, if necessary for cheapest air fare); 2 adults; 2 children; 1 inside cabin.
Royal Caribbean (our favorite) - $2,236 total for the family of 4.
Air - don't know your city so can't find a good price.
Separately try RT to/from your city to the hub city for a better total air cost.

Food Costs - On the cruise it is obviously covered. In London & Rome, we spent very little. But we don't eat much, we don't eat at expensive sit down restaurants. There are American fast food places, which I know is not preferred while on vacation, but I'll give up great food to stand under the Sistine Chapel or in the Colloseum!

Siteseeing Costs - more on the cruise - whale watching; kayaking, etc., but many days when doing your own tours won't be much. In Rome, the sites are inexpensive & there is so much to see. Little more in London, but still not a big expense like in the U.S.

IMO, if these trips are $1000 or $2000 above WDW, I would just save for a little longer in order to share these exciting wonders with my family & to have the memories, before my kids decide they no longer want my company!

I think 12 & 10 are good ages. So your 8yo may be ok; depends on the child.

Whether you stay with WDW or elsewhere, enjoy those younguns while you can!

Julie

Well, we're spending more on this WDW trip than we have before (staying at Poly, whereas in the past we've done a moderate resort or rented DVC points for about the same price as a mod). Decided to splurge this time for several reasons, including: we haven't been there for 5 years and likely won't go back for a few more because we do like to vacation in other places; no rooms available on points at the DVC resort we wanted (should've started planning sooner!); and we have friends/family who will be at the Poly at the same time. FD will cover most of our food expenses, and we have enough reward dollars on our Disney Visa that we won't be spending anything on souvenirs, etc., so it's not exactly a bargain, but not terribly expensive either. The thing I enjoy most about WDW is that it's one of the few places where all 4 of us are equally happy doing the same thing--it's just easy--and that helps us to enjoy the younguns! The time we've spent in local museums and on a recent trip to Chicago confirms that the 8yo is not ready to appreciate the capitals of Europe, and her not-readiness seems to rub off on the older one.

Funny you should mention Seattle/Vancouver. I was pricing flights to those cities a few weeks ago. Thinking about either that or Banff for next summer.

 

[ElizabethB]

We don't like Free Dining because it is Disney canabalizing what had been really nice dining experiences in order to fill rooms.

It used to be, for example, that Hagen-Daz ice cream bars were offered at quick service places as a dessert option. When has anyone seen that since free dining and DDP started? The only dessert option at any quick service place is a gross cake in a cup. Even if one wanted to pay for a Hagen-Daz ice cream bar, one can't. Why? Because then Disney would be offering things for OOP payment that can't be had on DDP and Free Dining.

Because of all the free snack credits, the chocolate chip cookies have almost no chocolate in them anymore.

Because of free dining and DDP, what used to be a lovely and romantic dining experience at CG is now a joke with yokels in cargo shorts and flip flops and misbehaving kids everywhere.

The list goes on.

 

[Colleen27]

2 - How FD is the best discount for MY family:
This year, our family will be 4 Disney adults and 2 children. We're staying in 2 rooms at Pop. FD saves us $208. We have opted to upgrade to Regular Dining so, $208 minus the $44 we pay to upgrade ($11/adult) means we actually save $164/night.

Each room is about $100/night. So, assuming that we would have purchased the DP anyway, FD gives us a savings of $80/room. 80% off the $100 room. There is NO offer out there that can beat 80%.

I know it would not work well for some, but FD can be the best discount out there for certain families including mine

That's about it for us too. We're 5 adults, 1 child by Disney rules, and we're staying in an All Star Music suite.

As I see it, there are two pieces of math that are relevant - the actual discount relative to rack rate and the decision of whether or not the dining plan (and which dining plan) works for you.

First, the resort math. That's pretty straightforward. Because free dining can only be compared to room discounts, that's where I track those savings in my spreadsheet. At a value resort free dining saves us $186.94. The rack rate of our room is $215 weekdays/$235 weekends, so that works out to an 87% discount on weeknights and 79% on weekends. No other discount will even come close to that.

Second, and less clear, is the dining math. Personally I do this based on the full cost of the plans because as I said I account for free dining as a room discount, so the dining comparison is simply OOP vs TiW vs DDP (DxDDP for us because it best suits our habits; we don't do park counter service). It is a lot of numbers and I won't go into the details, but OOP comes out to be cheapest by about $200, but that is for less food and less convenience than the DxDDP. Spending the extra $200 gets us about 50 extra snacks (nice to have during Food & Wine), refillable mugs for everyone instead of 4 to share between the 6 of us, a few extra meals, and the intangible of knowing it is all pre-paid and never even being tempted to make dining decisions based on price rather than taste. Coming from a generally frugal lifestyle in the low-cost midwest, I place significant value on that last so we opt for the dining plan whether it is upgraded from free or paid at rack rate.

 

[Colleen27]

Now what I wonder is do the families realize they can expose their children to different cultures & expose them to great history (& even fun & excitement) by taking the same money & going to Europe? Or, maybe a cruise to the disappearing glaciers of Alaska? When we were raising our children, we definitely included some trips to WDW, but we also liked to give them travel variety. As adults they have often expressed gratitude for that. Oh well, just a thought I had.

For us that comes down to several things - First, we can't do it for the same money. We spend about $6000 altogether on a week at Disney for the 5 of us; airfare to Europe runs about $3000 if I catch a good sale, leaving $3000 for accommodations, ground travel, food, attractions, and spending money. That really doesn't go far for 5 people. I wouldn't want to do that sort of trip with less than $10,000 to spend.

Second, my DH isn't currently in a position to be leaving our business during the summer. The recession/housing crisis has hit us too hard for us to close up shop for a family vacation during the working season (he does mainly roofing & siding, so summer is busy and winter is largely idle). So Alaska, for example, is impossible right now unless we leave him home, and a lot of other destinations are doable but much less desirable during the slow winter months when he can travel freely.

And finally, our youngest is a toddler. I know that Europe, Alaska, Hawaii and the like will probably be a once-in-a-childhood experience for my kids because of the expense, and I'd rather hold off on that until they can all appreciate it. Plus I don't want to visit those places to take them at toddler pace. Disney is a fun, relaxing vacation for all of us, from my 60-something mother who often joins us all the way down down to the kids (ages 13, 9 and 3), and it leaves room in the travel budget for several smaller trips around Michigan, Ontario and the eastern half of the US each year. The big, 'burn the year's travel budget in one fell swoop' trips can wait until she's a bit older and we can enjoy those places more fully.