For you smokers out there......

[DVCconvert]

JimMIA:

No, I was actually pointing out that more than 70% agree with my "putrid stench" of an opinion.

I'm sorry -- I didn't see that phrasing in the poll - can you provide a link??

 

[JimMIA]

Which maybe another example of a faulty thought process.

"may be" -- two words.

 

[DVCconvert]

"may be" -- two words.

So too argue your POV - you are reduced to pointing out this???

 

[JimMIA]

Goodnight, everyone. Gotta work tomorrow.

 

[DVCconvert]

Goodnight, everyone. Gotta work tomorrow.

Sleep well!

 

[JimMIA]

So too argue your POV - you are reduced to pointing out this???

No. But, your literary challenges go to the difficulty you have understanding plain English, like the wording in the statute. You're too emotionally involved in your own pro-smoking posture to just read language you don't like.

I don't have any issue with you presenting your point of view...and I'm neither surprised or offended by the fact that we disagree. You'd just be a better advocate if you slowed down and focused on whatever facts you have which support your position instead of lashing out at anyone who disagrees with you.

 

[bavaria]

What I find interesting is that 70% voted for non-smoking; 30% did not.

When Westin moved to all non-smoking, they determined that 92% of their guests preferred non-smoking rooms.

That's a big difference (understanding that this poll does not necessarily represent the overall DVC population)

 

[DVCconvert]

JimMIA:

But, your literary challenges go to the difficulty you have understanding plain English, like the wording in the statute. You're too emotionally involved in your own pro-smoking posture to just read language you don't like....
You'd just be a better advocate if you slowed down and focused on whatever facts you have which support your position instead of lashing out at anyone who disagrees with you.

That's odd -- I was thinking the same about you!

 

[mwehttam]

I don't have any issue with you presenting your point of view...and I'm neither surprised or offended by the fact that we disagree. You'd just be a better advocate if you slowed down and focused on whatever facts you have which support your position instead of lashing out at anyone who disagrees with you.

The problem is that they have no facts to support their position. If they were to rely on facts they would lose the argument. Smoking and second hand smoke kills. Fact. End of story.

-Matthew

 

[elijahpep]

No. But, your literary challenges go to the difficulty you have understanding plain English, like the wording in the statute. You're too emotionally involved in your own pro-smoking posture to just read language you don't like.

I don't have any issue with you presenting your point of view...and I'm neither surprised or offended by the fact that we disagree. You'd just be a better advocate if you slowed down and focused on whatever facts you have which support your position instead of lashing out at anyone who disagrees with you.

I hate to jump into the middle of your and DVCconvert's heated debate, but I read what you posted and for the life of me can't figure out how certain DVC balconies fit into part "b" of the law. I believe restaurants and bars are covered under a different section than that of hotel/motels, correct? Anyway, do you have any cases where this has been to court with a ruling? Can you cite the cases? I would be curious to read them. All of the balconies I have had at DVC have had open space, or railings, which make the sides open. Granted they are covered from rain.

~Eli

 

[DVCconvert]

Smoking and second hand smoke kills. Fact. End of story.

As can:
Driving, flying, walking, sky diving, swiming, eating, taking drugs (prescrip & other wise) drinking alcohol, riding a train, working, etc., etc., etc..

The "fact. End of story" is that there's little to nothing that we do that cannot kill us (fact, end of story - we WILL all die). The fundamental question is how many personal choices do we as a society remove from the individual in an attempt to 'control' this. Selt belts yes/no?...Protein sources with more than 20% fat? yes/no?...Sports? yes/no?....Drinking more than 1 oz of alcohol in a day? yes/no?....Flying? yes/no? on, and on, and on.

 

[mwehttam]

As can:
Driving, flying, walking, sky diving, swiming, eating, taking drugs (prescrip & other wise) drinking alcohol, riding a train, working, etc., etc., etc..

The "fact. End of story" is that there's little to nothing that we do that cannot kill us (fact, end of story - we WILL all die). The fundamental question is how many personal choices do we as a society remove from the individual in an attempt to 'control' this. Selt belts yes/no?...Protein sources with more than 20% fat? yes/no?...Sports? yes/no?....Drinking more than 1 oz of alcohol in a day? yes/no?....Flying? yes/no? on, and on, and on.

Thats all well and good. And if that is the extents of your "facts"...

Fact: Smoking is the leading cause of preventable death in the country accounting for just under 20% of deaths. From the CDC (Center of Disease Control in case you didn't know).

And since this whole thread is based on smoking and it's relation to DVC, those "examples" you bring up of pointless and useless.

-Matthew

 

[elijahpep]

No, I was actually pointing out that more than 70% agree with my "putrid stench" of an opinion.

If you want to consider 29% some kind of moral victory, go right ahead...but don't run for political office.

As a side note, internet polls are in no way close to being scientific. On an internet poll the surveyor has no way in knowing if the people voting are the true population in which the surveyor intended, which means that a true sample set can't be achieved.

But, in my opinion there are probably more people who would agree with Jim's opinion than vice versa. But this is just an opinion as I have no way of knowing what the true outcome would be.

~Eli

 

[elijahpep]

...Drinking more than 1 oz of alcohol in a day?...

What fun would it be to only drink 1 oz of alcohol a day? Please don't get that debate started........

~Eli

 

[Dean]

Unfortunately this would not apply to NS villas, but it would apply to public and work places. I suspect we'll see a NS law about hotels within the next 3-5 years in FL and/or that Disney will go all NS during that time. There will likely be some outs much as the rules associated with restaurants and hopefully they will be just as hard to overcome to allow smoking. It's actually easier with timeshares than hotels to implement and enforce NS.

 

[DisneyDVCdad]

For about 10 years my job would take me out of town almost every other week. During that time at least every other month due to full capacity or just bad luck I would up in a smoking room! On these nights I would always coughing all night long and have problems sleeping! Not to mention the smell! The thing with smoking is that not only does it effect the smoker him or herself but, everything and everyone around them! I have smoker friends that won't even smoke in their own houses because the tar sticks to the walls! Just think about that stuff in your lungs! Yuck!

 

[DisneyDVCdad]

As can:
Driving, flying, walking, sky diving, swiming, eating, taking drugs (prescrip & other wise) drinking alcohol, riding a train, working, etc., etc., etc..

The "fact. End of story" is that there's little to nothing that we do that cannot kill us (fact, end of story - we WILL all die). The fundamental question is how many personal choices do we as a society remove from the individual in an attempt to 'control' this. Selt belts yes/no?...Protein sources with more than 20% fat? yes/no?...Sports? yes/no?....Drinking more than 1 oz of alcohol in a day? yes/no?....Flying? yes/no? on, and on, and on.

Isn't it more about how your personal choices affect others? That's why DUI exists because too many people made the wrong choices and people died because of it!

 

[alldiz]

I hate to jump into the middle of your and DVCconvert's heated debate, but I read what you posted and for the life of me can't figure out how certain DVC balconies fit into part "b" of the law. I believe restaurants and bars are covered under a different section than that of hotel/motels, correct? Anyway, do you have any cases where this has been to court with a ruling? Can you cite the cases? I would be curious to read them. All of the balconies I have had at DVC have had open space, or railings, which make the sides open. Granted they are covered from rain.

~Eli

Glad you jumped in first....

I was just thinking....WL...hotel...balconies are much more
enclosed.....up,down,both sides...

Looks like most DVC balconies...only have railings and a roof...
open on all sides front, and sides to wave at my
dvc neighbors....

Anyway...I couldnt help myself
peace
Kerri

 

[UConnJack]

I have watched this discussion through the years, but stayed out of it as I can't seem to formulate an opinion squarely on either side. I am a non-smoker who can't stand second hand smoke and will refuse a smoking room. However, until the hypocrites in Washington ban tobacco, I can't in good conscience say we should ban smoking everywhere. Restaurants and other public places, sure, because I do believe it is enough of a nuisance (and hazard if concentrated) to other people. But as annoyed as I can get when smoking rooms are all that's left, I don't think they should be eliminated. I do, however, believe the different rooms should be 100% guaranteed, and if your preference isn't available at reservation time, suck it up and find alternative plans (and for smokers, DO NOT take the N/S and smoke anyway.) I still have no idea why this isn't a guarantee with DVC, it is with most hotels! DVC must have some statistics that show percentage of smoking requests so that they can allot an appropriate number of rooms.

As for smoking on balconies, I think (and no I am not a doctor, so this is my opinion/gut feeling) that second hand smoke is not as dangerous as they say and is more political than anything. Being trapped in a car or room with a smoker or somewhere where its concentrated with no ventilation, yes, I can believe the health detriment. Catching a whiff of smoke outside on a balcony, while annoying, I can't imagine poses any significant health risk. I would be willing to bet the benzene, toluene, ethyl benzene, and xylene exposure on gets every time they pump gas is FAR more detrimental than the occasional whiff of second hand smoke. Same goes for the formaldehyde in carpeting, volatile organics in paint, or half of the household cleaners out there, etc. If they keep the smoking rooms somewhat blocked in one area, floor, side, etc. I'm sure they could minimize the disturbance on the balconies.

 

[2Princes2Princesses]

Okay, I am going to be a little nitpicker here. SMOKING is the leading cause of preventable death. Not secondhand smoke.

Do I think secondhand smoke is dangerous? YES YES AND A BIG OLD YES. But when stating that statistic, I feel it is important to differentiate, since the study that the statistic is based on was on Smokers themselves.

Should Disney ban smoking and have all NS rooms? Probably.

I am not sure that will happen though. The second leading cause of preventable death is obesity, according to the CDC. And we all saw on the Restaurants board what happened when Disney attempted to change the kids menus to low fat, healthy choices. All heck broke loose.

Smoking stinks. Second hand smoke is a danger to those around you. Many smokers know that. I am one. I know that. I have tried to quit. Many times. The National Institute for drug addiction reports that half of all smokers try to quit each year and only 5% are successful for more than 3 months. Many smokers wish they could do it, quit, and be done. Almost everyone I know who smokes has been trying.

Villianizing the people who smoke in n/s rooms and in non-designated areas I can accept. But as someone who makes a conscious effort not to do that, I would appreciate not being treated as some kind of monster, out to kill you all. I know it stinks. I know it is bad for me. I know I will die from it if I cannot quit. I wish I had never started. I once told my 14 yr old that is the only thing I would change about my life if I could.

However, it seems that saying anything other than smokers are horrible human beings who should all be shot is like being a pariah in these parts.