Food for Thought - Political Thread

[septbride2002]

MSNBC

“I wish we would stop opening wounds from a war of more than 30 years ago and talk about the war we’re fighting now,” McCain told The Associated Press on Tuesday. “I believe they both served honorably.”

St. Louis Post Dispatch


I have to agree with Senator McCain and Bill McClellan it is time to focus on real issues and not on a war that happened 30 years ago.

~Amanda

 

[WillyJ]

And I agree with you Septbride2002. . .

The problem is, this election is about Iraq and they were both wrong on it so they are trying to avoid the subject. . .


I will say that MoveOn.org put out a pretty brutal commercial concerning Bush's National Guard service the other day, and Kerry came out (aolong with McCain) and immediately condemned it, so they pulled it off the air.

Yet Bush has yet to condemn the "Swift Boat Vets" ad which one of the most dishonest attacks against against a candidate I've ever seen. . .

The two candidate'ss stated policies so similar it's hard to find any significant differences; but in my opinion things like this show a fundamental difference in their character. .

 

[beattyfamily]

IMHO, it was brought to the front burner yet again by Kerry at the DNC. That was his main focus at the DNC, his military service and experience.

I don't remember him talking about anything else like maybe his experience as a Senator??

I do agree, though, let's all let it go and move on to the real issues. Enough already.

Edited to add that his (Kerry's) side was the first this election year to bring up military records when accusing Bush of being AWOL.

 

[Bobbles]

Originally posted by beattyfamily
IMHO, it was brought to the front burner yet again by Kerry at the DNC. That was his main focus at the DNC, his military service and experience.

I don't remember him talking about anything else.

I do agree, though, let's all let it go and move on to the real issues. Enough already.

Perhaps President Bush will follow Senator Kerry's lead and condemn the Swiftboats commercials?


NAHHHHH!

 

[beattyfamily]

Originally posted by Bobbles
Perhaps President Bush will follow Senator Kerry's lead and condemn the Swiftboats commercials?


NAHHHHH!

My vacation to Disney World is just too close for me to bother with debating. I gave my opinion, why don't you just give yours?

Have fun!

 

[AllyandJack]

President Bush DID condemn the commercial and challenged Kerry to stand with him in putting a ban on those types of independent ads. I don't know if they can do that, but that was his response to the ad. He did stop short of saying anything about the PEOPLE behind the ad, but did say that those types of ads shouldn't be tolerated.

I don't know if they can ban them since if people are willing to pay for the air time, they can probably get the air time. Bush did condemn the ad's message. Of course, it doesn't make front page news...it gets a minor blurb in the newscast during a story about the ad.

I'll see if I can find an actual written story, but I know I heard this on the news. I never did hear any response from Kerry about banning the ads. Then again, I could have missed that story.

 

[auntpolly]

Here is what my thought process was concerning this.

In past elections, Republicans have made a very big deal about military service, so this time, we've got somebody we can be proud of in that area and they don't want to hear about it?

So we shouldn't be talking about military service. This time. When it's not in their favor.

Whether or not and how someone served has never been the most important issue for me, but it sure has been in the past for many Republicans! When Kerry entered the race I thought, "Well here's a guy that they can't complain about or make fun of!" Instead, they've decided it's rude to bring it up????

 

[AllyandJack]

When Clinton was running and everyone was calling him a draft-dodger, Kerry spoke up and said that a person's military service shouldn't be the focal point of an election. So, it's both parties that play that card.

But, that's what politicans do.

 

[auntpolly]

Originally posted by AllyandJack
When Clinton was running and everyone was calling him a draft-dodger, Kerry spoke up and said that a person's military service shouldn't be the focal point of an election. So, it's both parties that play that card.

But, that's what politicans do.

You're kind of making my point for me. In almost every election I can remember a military record has been so important to the Republicans. It's always been fair game before. Kerry was right to speak up in defense of Clinton; it shouldn't be the focal point.
But it's an issue -- and it's an issue because Republicans have made it that way.

 

[AllyandJack]

The point I was TRYING to make is that each party is going to skew the issues their way in an election year. What was important in one year becomes unimportant in another when it suits them.

It's not a partisan thing, it's a politican thing. Kerry did have every right to stand up for Clinton. He also has every right to stand on what he feels is his strong point. It might impress some, it might not. But, Democrats and Repulicans alike will criticize people for something and then make it out to be something fabulous when it suits them. It's just the nature of politics.

 

[peachgirl]

President Bush DID condemn the commercial

No, he didn't. His campaign said that they wouldn't challenge Kerry's military record. That's not a condemnation of the ad.

IMHO, it was brought to the front burner yet again by Kerry at the DNC.

Kerry was a decorated Vietnam veteran who served his country honorably. This is a plus and one he has every right to speak about and be proud of.

Because the Bush side couldn't stand toe to toe with Kerry on his record, their only option was to try and destroy Kerry's reputation just exactly like they tried to do (and succeeded to a point) with John McCain.

I'm perfectly willing to stop questioning Bush's military record, but as long as some insist on trashing Kerry's service to this country, I'll keep bringing up the facts about Bush's less than glorious record.

No matter, Kerry is entitled to use his the sacrifices he made for his country as a part of his campaign. I think the fact that he has experienced war first hand is an important assest, especially in the times we live in.

That doesn't entitle anyone to lie and sling mud just because their guy's record doesn't match up to it. You can bet that had Bush done what Kerry did, the Republicans would be making it a huge part of their campaign. They certainly did when Bush Sr ran.


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[septbride2002]

In past elections, Republicans have made a very big deal about military service, so this time, we've got somebody we can be proud of in that area and they don't want to hear about it?

Aunt Polly - I totally agree with you! Republicans always made a big deal out of someone's military service and now they are trying to down play it.

I guess I am just tired of hearing about it and would like to see both canidates move on to the issues that are really imporant. Since I am a Kerry supporter I hope he is the one that does this first.

IMHO, it was brought to the front burner yet again by Kerry at the DNC. That was his main focus at the DNC, his military service and experience.

Your right is was brought up a lot at the DNC - but then again he is trying to sell himself to the people. He is a Vietnam Veteran and no one can dispute that - but now with November not far away I wish we could move on and focus on the issues.

~Amanda

 

[auntpolly]

I'm just incredibly annoyed that after having to hear that Mondale....and then Dukakis.....and then Clinton.....and then Gore didn't have good enough service records -- weren't <i>tough guys</i> (remember them making fun of Dukakis????) -- that this time we're being big meanies??? Take your medicine, GWB. Your own party made this batch of it themselves!!

 

[peachgirl]

He is a Vietnam Veteran and no one can dispute that - but now with November not far away I wish we could move on and focus on the issues.

I don't think Kerry is making it such a focus point now. He does mention it in speeches from time to time when addressing the war on terror, but I think that's still appropriate. It is certainly not the central focus of his campaign.

The military service issue is staying on the front burner because of those who have chosed to take this opportunity to get their 15 minutes of fame. Bush refuses to condemn it and Kerry simply cannot ignore their attacks.

We can all complain about negative campaigning all we want, but the fact is that it works. Polls have shown that this attack on Kerry has been effective enough that it has to be challenged and shown to be the lie that it is.

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[AllyandJack]

"We will not and have not questioned Sen. Kerry's service record in Vietnam," he said. "This is another example of the problem of unregulated soft money."

The president, he said, "thought he got rid of all of this when he signed the McCain-Feingold bill [regulating campaign financing] into law," adding, "This should all be stopped. It does nothing to elevate the discourse."

The Bush press secretary said he "hopes the Kerry campaign will join us in calling for an end to all unregulated ads."

Asked whether the campaign will demand the ad be pulled from the air, he said, "We are calling for a cessation of all unregulated ads and hope the Kerry campaign will join us."




This was CNN.com. Bush stopped short of condemning the people who made the ad and their message, but agreed that such ads should be stopped. What's he supposed to say? Is he supposed to insult the Vietman Veterans who created the ad and diminish their message?? He said what he could without insulting the veterans and condemned such unregulated ads.

I guess this place is too partisan for me. I don't look at things as "The Democrats" or "The Republicans." Both parties are guilty of talking out of both sides of their mouth. But, if you're stuck on "Democrats" and "Republicans" you can only see what the other side does wrong. Oh, well.....

 

[auntpolly]

Originally posted by AllyandJack

I guess this place is too partisan for me. I don't look at things as "The Democrats" or "The Republicans." Both parties are guilty of talking out of both sides of their mouth. But, if you're stuck on "Democrats" and "Republicans" you can only see what the other side does wrong. Oh, well.....

So you don't think that a good service record has been hugely important to Republicans in the past?

 

[jrydberg]

Jumping in here, but I don't think it's been hugely important for anyone since Eisenhower.

 

[beattyfamily]

Originally posted by peachgirl
I don't think Kerry is making it such a focus point now. He does mention it in speeches from time to time when addressing the war on terror, but I think that's still appropriate. It is certainly not the central focus of his campaign.

I respectfully disagree. IMHO, his military record IS the central focus of his campaign. This is how I see it. That's his main platform for why we should vote for him.

The first to bring up military records this election year were the Demos, when they accused Bush of being AWOL yet again. They did it in 2000 and now again it reared it's ugly head.

 

[auntpolly]

Originally posted by jrydberg
Jumping in here, but I don't think it's been hugely important for anyone since Eisenhower.

Then why did we have to talk about it so much in these past years?

 

[jrydberg]

Because we talk endlessly about political candidates until there's nothing left to talk about?