Flags at half mast today at the World

[Designer Rose]

I think it's more the president is only allowed to say that ALL flags be flown at half staff. I don't think it would be illegal for one place to decide to fly their flags at half staff. I know I attended a Christian school and for certain things we would put our flag at half staff.

 

[mickeysmyboy]

From what I read in the link provided earlier, the law spells out when the president can order the lowering of the flag. But it never specifically states that these are the only times a flag can be lowered.

I know the FAQ on that US History site says this to be true, but I can't find anything in the code that specifically says it. Can someone point it out?

The only thing I can find is this: "In the event of the death of other officials or foreign dignitaries, the flag is to be displayed at half-staff according to Presidential instructions or orders, or in accordance with recognized customs or practices not inconsistent with law." (bolding mine)

To me, that means the flag can be lowered as long as it's not inconsistent with the law describing the protocol for the lowering of the flag to half staff.

In any case, I think it was a classy and fitting tribute to a great American -- we should all be proud of what he accomplished, and all mourn his loss.

Flags being flown at half staff can be by presidential order. In that case all flags must be flown at half staff.

That doesn't mean that others can't chose to fly their flags at half staff at other times! I've seen local flags flown at half staff to honor the passing of an important local official or figurer.

No matter, Disney is doing the right thing by honoring and amazing man who contributed so much to the world and the Disney Company. The world we live in would be a different place if not for Steve Jobs.

He as a true genius and innovator. I must say, that to me, he was very similar to Walt Disney. I think, Walt would want his company to honor Steve Jobs.

Respect for someone like Steve Jobs isn't something to bicker over. All the people around here who constantly need to be right need to get a grip!

 

[larryz]

I've been married to an LEO for 20 years and when we lost a fellow LEO all the local flags were flown at half mast. I'm pretty sure it was done without a presidential order.

Did you bother to read the material at the links I posted? (no, of course not...)

"In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States, or the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory, or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be flown at half-staff, and the same authority is provided to the Mayor of the District of Columbia with respect to present or former officials of the District of Columbia and members of the Armed Forces from the District of Columbia."

Read the bolded parts -- an LEO could conceivably be considered a state official (especially where peace officers have to be state certified, but it's a logical stretch).

I have no problem with US flags at half staff for deceased LEOs. But as far as I know, Steve Jobs was not an LEO, nor was he a state official -- certainly not of Florida.

The only thing I can find is this: "In the event of the death of other officials or foreign dignitaries, the flag is to be displayed at half-staff according to Presidential instructions or orders, or in accordance with recognized customs or practices not inconsistent with law."

Bolding mine. Steve Jobs was neither an American official nor a foreign dignitary. This clause does not apply.

Like I said, I'm sorry he's gone. But let Disney lower the Disney flag to half-staff; Bob Iger might be President of Disney, but he is NOT President of the united states.

Yet.

I know some of you don't like to think about this, but there IS a higher power in this country than Disney...

 

[quirty30]

Never mind.

 

[mking624]

Did you bother to read the material at the links I posted? (no, of course not...)

"In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States, or the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory, or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be flown at half-staff, and the same authority is provided to the Mayor of the District of Columbia with respect to present or former officials of the District of Columbia and members of the Armed Forces from the District of Columbia."

Read the bolded parts -- an LEO could conceivably be considered a state official (especially where peace officers have to be state certified, but it's a logical stretch).

I have no problem with US flags at half staff for deceased LEOs. But as far as I know, Steve Jobs was not an LEO, nor was he a state official -- certainly not of Florida.



Bolding mine. Steve Jobs was neither an American official nor a foreign dignitary. This clause does not apply.

Like I said, I'm sorry he's gone. But let Disney lower the Disney flag to half-staff; Bob Iger might be President of Disney, but he is NOT President of the united states.

Yet.

I know some of you don't like to think about this, but there IS a higher power in this country than Disney...

I guess I fail to see where it says it is restricted to those people. I also fail to see where the law forbids it being lowered for anyone else, or where the law forbids anyone "ordering" the flag at half staff for said "anyone else." All you pointed out were regulations for the specific groups of people and who may proclaim it for them.

That said, a big part of the company died. Hopefully we're all mature enough to drop the debating for just ONE thread and respect the fact that the company he was a part of wants to honor him, regardless of any DISer's approval or lack of it.

 

[suemom2kay]

Amazing what turns into an argument around here.

What about half staff to honor other citizens?

Only the president of the United States or the governor of the state may order the flag to be at half-staff to honor the death of a national or state figure.

In addition to the traditional half-staff salutes when proclaimed by the President, the Flag Code mentions the use of our Flag for honoring citizens who have died, especially government officials and prominent citizens. However, the Flag Code does not exclude any citizen, whether they belong to an organization or not, whether they are recognized very locally or regionally. Examples of deceased citizens that might be honored with by lowering the Flag to half-staff include local religious leaders, youth leaders, honored teachers or sports coaches, local politicians, or a local hero. There need be no authorization from the government for the private sector (non-government) to use the Flag to honor any citizen. It is important to note that the Flag Code is a code, it is intended to provide guidance and is not obligatory. It carries no civil or criminal penalties for "misuse" of the Flag. Individual are not acting illegally when using the Flag according to their own usage. Only on government / public building is the flag code required to be followed.

All font attributes mine.
Source Link: http://www.gettysburgflag.com/flyflaghalfmast.php

 

[suemom2kay]

I guess I fail to see where it says it is restricted to those people. I also fail to see where the law forbids it being lowered for anyone else, or where the law forbids anyone "ordering" the flag at half staff for said "anyone else." All you pointed out were regulations for the specific groups of people and who may proclaim it for them.

That said, a big part of the company died. Hopefully we're all mature enough to drop the debating for just ONE thread and respect the fact that the company he was a part of wants to honor him, regardless of any DISer's approval or lack of it.

Well said Mary.

 

[phyllis1966]

What about half staff to honor other citizens?

Only the president of the United States or the governor of the state may order the flag to be at half-staff to honor the death of a national or state figure.

In addition to the traditional half-staff salutes when proclaimed by the President, the Flag Code mentions the use of our Flag for honoring citizens who have died, especially government officials and prominent citizens. However, the Flag Code does not exclude any citizen, whether they belong to an organization or not, whether they are recognized very locally or regionally. Examples of deceased citizens that might be honored with by lowering the Flag to half-staff include local religious leaders, youth leaders, honored teachers or sports coaches, local politicians, or a local hero. There need be no authorization from the government for the private sector (non-government) to use the Flag to honor any citizen. It is important to note that the Flag Code is a code, it is intended to provide guidance and is not obligatory. It carries no civil or criminal penalties for "misuse" of the Flag. Individual are not acting illegally when using the Flag according to their own usage. Only on government / public building is the flag code required to be followed.

All font attributes mine.
Source Link: http://www.gettysburgflag.com/flyflaghalfmast.php

Now, this makes sense to me - thanks for finding and posting it.

 

[larryz]

I'll stand by my strict constructionist reading of the Flag Code, thanks, but I'll accept that the US Code, Title 4, is more of a guideline than a punitive statute -- just like the Pirate's Code, I guess.

I don't agree with him doing it, but I guess Mr Iger has the right to do whatever he wants with his American flags...

 

[crashbb]

I'll stand by my strict constructionist reading of the Flag Code, thanks, but I'll accept that the US Code, Title 4, is more of a guideline than a punitive statute -- just like the Pirate's Code, I guess.

I don't agree with him doing it, but I guess Mr Iger has the right to do whatever he wants with his American flags...

I read that as "COMMUNIST" reading of the Flag Code.

And, no, I have no idea how a Communist reading is any different than any other reading.

 

[nytimez]

I'll stand by my strict constructionist reading of the Flag Code, thanks, but I'll accept that the US Code, Title 4, is more of a guideline than a punitive statute -- just like the Pirate's Code, I guess.

I don't agree with him doing it, but I guess Mr Iger has the right to do whatever he wants with his American flags...

Actually, the link you posted says the flag code is "only advisory" -- but regarding the quote you bolded, it says "official" not "American official." A strict constructionist reading allows that to apply to nearly anyone.

And again, it doesn't specifically forbid other instances of flag lowering, only that it be done -- when done -- in accordance to the code, as also described in the Gettysburg link another user posted.

So... I still think the company did the right thing here.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Well done, Disney.

 

[Mama_Dis]

Amazing what turns into an argument around here.

What about half staff to honor other citizens?

Only the president of the United States or the governor of the state may order the flag to be at half-staff to honor the death of a national or state figure.

In addition to the traditional half-staff salutes when proclaimed by the President, the Flag Code mentions the use of our Flag for honoring citizens who have died, especially government officials and prominent citizens. However, the Flag Code does not exclude any citizen, whether they belong to an organization or not, whether they are recognized very locally or regionally. Examples of deceased citizens that might be honored with by lowering the Flag to half-staff include local religious leaders, youth leaders, honored teachers or sports coaches, local politicians, or a local hero. There need be no authorization from the government for the private sector (non-government) to use the Flag to honor any citizen. It is important to note that the Flag Code is a code, it is intended to provide guidance and is not obligatory. It carries no civil or criminal penalties for "misuse" of the Flag. Individual are not acting illegally when using the Flag according to their own usage. Only on government / public building is the flag code required to be followed.

All font attributes mine.
Source Link: http://www.gettysburgflag.com/flyflaghalfmast.php

 

[CindeBella]

I'm PRETTY sure it probably had something to do with Jobs involvement with the up and rising of Pixar. He is most likely being celebrated for his innovated thinking, not his money.
Which he deserves FULL recognition for. That man was a genius.

Agree

 

[Deb & Bill]

...He as a true genius and innovator....

But once you read his biography, you find out he was one odd duck. Maybe at technical genius, but really, really odd.

 

[Cheshire Figment]

1. The difference between Crazy and Eccentric is how much money a person has.

2. The President (of the Walt Disney Company) made the determination that all flags in his jurisdiction will fly at half-staff. It is his prerogative as President.

 

[lizzi6692]

I don't understand why some people always have to find something to argue about. My husband and I were just talking about this the other day, the flag code is one of the least enforced in the United States, so really its a non-issue.

Steve Jobs was an extraordinary individual who is responsible for many of the technological advances in the last 30 years. He and his influence will never forgotten. I'm glad Disney is honoring him in this way, because he was quintessential to the current success of Disney(the films at least).

 

[budmonster]

Did you bother to read the material at the links I posted? (no, of course not...)

"In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States, or the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory, or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be flown at half-staff, and the same authority is provided to the Mayor of the District of Columbia with respect to present or former officials of the District of Columbia and members of the Armed Forces from the District of Columbia."

Read the bolded parts -- an LEO could conceivably be considered a state official (especially where peace officers have to be state certified, but it's a logical stretch).

I have no problem with US flags at half staff for deceased LEOs. But as far as I know, Steve Jobs was not an LEO, nor was he a state official -- certainly not of Florida.


I know some of you don't like to think about this, but there IS a higher power in this country than Disney...

Of course I didn't read it why would I waste my time. Also, what you posted state it is a code is not law, all it does is provide guidance for the proper display of our national symbol. You should really do a little research before you post.

I think this is the least Disney could have done for Steve Jobs considering all he has done for Disney. You seen to be the only person posting on this thread that has a problem with it. While the rest of us seen to think that it is an honor given that is well deserved.



Update with some info after a little research:

There need be no authorization from the government for the private sector (non-government) to use the Flag to honor any citizen. It is important to note that the Flag Code is a code, it is intended to provide guidance and is not obligatory. It carries no civil or criminal penalties for "misuse" of the Flag. Individual are not acting illegally when using the Flag according to their own usage. Only on government / public building is the flag code required to be followed.

Taken from this website...

http://www.gettysburgflag.com/flyflaghalfmast.php

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

The flags were at half mast because Jobs was on the board of directors. Were he not heavily involved with Disney in any way, the flags would have been at full staff. As far as flag etiquette goes, flying the flag at half staff is a symbol of mourning. Jobs was one of Disney's own. Therefore, it is not in any way a breach of flag etiquette for them to fly it at half staff.

 

[Dan Murphy]

But once you read his biography, you find out he was one odd duck. Maybe at technical genius, but really, really odd.

Most geniuses tend to be odd, as judged by the non-geniuses.