FD plan discrepencies and rack rates. Please solve the mystery!

[Dizneydawn]

Please help me!!!

I am not a novice to WDW at all but this is our first time having AP's and worrying about difference in room rates with free dining vs. any room discount alone. There is huge discrepencies and no matter which way we add, subtract, multiply or divide, we cannot sem to figure out Disney math.

I will give you all a bit o' background and then would love some help in choosing the path that financially will make the most sense.

One thing that I do not like is the evasive manuever by Disney in their lack of a printout or specific ability to give me numbers over the phone or reasons why their numbers do not align with what they are telling you. I hate not having breakdowns of what I am being charged.

We are a party of 6 heading to Disney for 6 nights in Dec. Free dining was offered during our stay but the stickler is we also would need to purchase a 2 day base ticket pp to benefit from the free dining and we do not need the tickets. It did not make sense to spend $1,073.92 (cost of the 6 2day base tickets) now if I do not need to.

We originally booked FD at the Cabins at FW. Then the math was not adding up.

The price I was quoted was $4,870.02 This was for free dining, 6- 2 day base tickets and 6 nights in one cabin. Booked this and started wndering why it was so high.

Then last night when I called to ask about room only discounts for the cabins for AP's. I was told it by one person it was considered a mod and would be 25%, then when I called back, the man I spoke to said that he could not quote me exactly the room discount. He gave me a price of $1,738.10 for 6 nights! Seemed much bigger than the 25%!!

Adding the Plus dining oop would bring the total to $3,223.54 for 6 ppl.

Nothing add's up and nobody seems to be able to explain why.

Dining cost is $1,872.00 for 6 people at $52 pp for 6 nights. (BTW - dining reservations could only give me this number and not specifically tell me if it included tax or not, even after they spoke with supervisor because WDW only gives them the price of "Just under $52" to tell people according to who I spoke with this morning.)

If I add $1,738.10 (cabin only with AP discount) + $1,872.00 (OOP Plus dining for 6) I get a total of $3,610.10.

Yet they gave me a price of $3,223.54 for my total.

Don't get me wrong, saving $386.56 is fine on the dining but I do not understand how I got the saving?

Do AP's get a discount on dining plans???

Then there still is the discrepency with the original amount for free dining room rates!

Again:

$4,870.02 for free dining, 6 -2 day base tickets and 6 night stay with rack rate.

That should mean in theory that if I deduct the value of the tickets, I should have the rack rate of the room.

$ 4,870.02
- 1,073.92 (tickets)
___________
$3,796.10 including tax

Again, I was told a room that has 25% off is $1,738.10 for the same 6 nights.


So if I add the 25% back in to the $1,738.10 we are at $2,317.47 for 6 nights only room with no discount vs the $3,796.10 they quoted me for the free dining room after taking off tickets which is a set price.

That is a difference of $1,478.63.

How is there that big of a discrepency on room rates for the free dining rooms vs. no free dining?

The only other option is the discount we got on the room only portion was much bigger than the 25% mod AP discount we were originally told.

If anyone has any ideas that would be great!!!

Also, since this is a dining thread....does anyone here take advantage of the dining plans plus the TIW card? Am I better doing one or the other or both? First time AP people here!

 

[sukhakuli]

That does seem high, we have the cabins booked for 5 people, 8 day tickets, and free dining for 4200.

What I did was, I went on the Disney World site, and checked out just the room. that gives you the cost of the room per night. So you know exactly what the room costs per night, rack rate. Then figure out how much the dining plan is going to cost you. It should be about 46 per adult and 12 per kid. Add that up for your stay, and you know what the tickets cost, so add all that up and see what you get.

If you have tickets, I would probably not go with the dining plan.

 

[sharonabe]

Are your 6 people all considered Disney adults? If any of them are children, that might account for the $386 difference.

As for the room, I don't remember if it's true for the cabins, but all other "mod" category rooms are for 2 (real) adults and then children. Any additional adults over 18 is an extra cost. That's still not going to get you to the $1400 difference, but might be part of it.

 

[Cafeen]

Disney math is it's own monster.

However, one discrepancy sticks out, the cost for DDP is ~$46 per adult (non peak) in 2011. So the quoted "Just under $52" is incorrect.

Let's pull the constant numbers out here.

DDP: 6 nights, 6 adults = $1656 in 2011
2 day base Tix: $168 ea. x 6 = 1008 + 6.5% tax (65.52) = 1073.52

FD "offer": 4,870.02
RD + DDP: 3,223.54
RD: $1,738.10

I'd call again and see the full rack rate prices without any discount, just as another constant, alternatively, which dates were you booking for? You can see the nightly rate breakdown if you book room only on the site.

But, let's move on

4870 - 1074 = 3796. This should theoretically be rack rate + tax.
3796 is 112.5% of x = 3796 = 1.125 * x = 3796/1.125 = x = 3374.22 = Room Rate before tax

For the Room Discount, do the same.
1738.10 is 112.5% of y = 1544.98
1544.98 is 75% of z = 2058.67 This should be the rack rate before discount and tax.

Now, subtracting DDP from the "FD Offer" gave me
3374.22 - 1656 = 1718.22

The only thing I can think of at this point is the "extra adult fee", which I wouldn't think would apply to the cabins, but factoring that in is:
$15 (for mods) * 4 = 60, or 360 over 6 nights
This brings it up to $2078.22

As a note, on the website, this extra adult fee is NOT charged...

Of course, this could be far off from what's actually happening, but the results are close. /shrug.

Another note, I did a FD booking at the Cabins for 6 adults with 2 day base between 12/10 and 12/16 and the total was $3,112.14.

This is making me think the first quote was incorrect. Which is further shown by my paid DDP quote (lowering to 2day base tix) for the same trip @ $4,767.78, which is quite close to what you were originally quoted.

Edit3: Another thought is trip insurance, perhaps they were including that in the quote? That would roughly be the same as the "extra adult" fee that I included above, as it's about $60 per person, so those numbers may just coincidentally be close for that reason.

(Edit: by "I did a booking" I mean that I priced it, I didn't book it )
(Edit2: not a bad post for #2.5k )

 

[sharonabe]

I just went online to see what the quote would be for this Dec for 2 adults and 4 Disney adult children in the cabins getting free dining with 2-day tickets. The price is $3123.32. I don't know why they quoted you what they did, but I think I'd do it online.

Two things, the 2011 DDP price is still $46 per adult, not $52 which IS the 2012 price.

Remember, you don't have to use any of your 2-day tickets. Just hold on to them and use them to upgrade for next year's AP.

 

[Dizneydawn]

Just spoke with reservations again and verified the cost and that I had exactly all I wanted.

Then I asked the CM why there is such a huge money difference and she assured me that the dining plan is a set price for me as an AP holder or my neighbor who is not. There is no additional discount.

When I told her the room only rate and the "set" dining rate did not add up to what I am being charged and instead added up to an amount that was actually $386.56 less than what is quoted independently, she seemed stumped.

All she could say is the computer plops in the info and shoots out the package deal and the package is not broken down.

My impression is that there is no rhyme or reason as to what you can do to maximise your best rates besides giving them a ton of scenarios and see what gives you the best deal.

Keep adding and subtracting because nothing is set in stone. If what she says is true and dining is never discounted, then my cabin rate dropped from $1,738.10 with AP discount and after adding dining, it dropped to $1,351.54.

Sticking with that $52 price I was given by Dining Reservations, one person for 6 days is approx $312. That means I am getting free dining for over one person by packaging it at the start!!!

If I would have added dining later, the room rate would have been established right away and no discount.

In fact, when I wanted room only, because it was not a package last night, the CM I worked with said he had to cancel the existing and refund deposit to re-book the room only and needed a new deposit. Then I said we might decide to add dining, the whole scenario changed and he could just alter the existing reservations, deduct tickets and free dining, add OOp dining and voila....same res number and bigger room discount since now it is a package discount plus the AP discount.

So do not trust the best deal is just a room discount if you are an AP holder. It's like double dipping if you add something to make it a package, in our experience.

The CM this morning said it is plausible it fell into a different discount window/code by moving from room only to room plus dining.

 

[Cafeen]

Another thing about the math, is that the room rates are different on Fri and Sat night, so there will be minor discrepancies (see Sharonabe's quote compared to mine) based on the actual dates picked as well. I believe that room rates are about $10 higher for Fri and Sat at mods (I'm pretty sure the room only check I did was $305 Sun-Thu, $315 Fri/Sat).

 

[Dizneydawn]

If you have tickets, I would probably not go with the dining plan.

You mean do the FD right??

Are your 6 people all considered Disney adults? If any of them are children, that might account for the $386 difference.
One is 15 but all others are 18 and older.
As for the room, I don't remember if it's true for the cabins, but all other "mod" category rooms are for 2 (real) adults and then children. Any additional adults over 18 is an extra cost. That's still not going to get you to the $1400 difference, but might be part of it.

There is no extra charge for adults in the cabins!!!

Disney math is it's own monster.

Amen to that!

I could not even begin to higlight a certain area you mentioned because your numbers and rapid speed to which you got them...is impressive and scary to a person whose 10th grade Algebra teacher begged her to shut up and never ask another question again and he would happily pass her with a D!

My husband however was right there with you and his numbers were about dead even with yours and all I could say to act smart was...

"So I am not crazy that these do not add up?"

Social Work major here who could write you an English paper on a subject I never read and get you an A+ but sweet martha, I stink at anything more than a basic calculater can help me handle!!!

I think that first number was wrong but even this morning, the looked at it and said it was quoted right. This makes me feel sorry for "Steve and Suzie Novice" taking their first trip to Disney and just accepting the first piece of info a reservations person gives them.

I just went online to see what the quote would be for this Dec for 2 adults and 4 Disney adult children in the cabins getting free dining with 2-day tickets. The price is $3123.32. I don't know why they quoted you what they did, but I think I'd do it online.
Oh nooo...seriously! ugh now I need to start over!!!
Two things, the 2011 DDP price is still $46 per adult, not $52 which IS the 2012 price.

Remember, you don't have to use any of your 2-day tickets. Just hold on to them and use them to upgrade for next year's AP.

I will need a medical transport by the end of all this!!!

 

[Dizneydawn]

Good gravy.

After all that, sucking the life out of me for two days and trying to decipher Davinci Code of Disney, 8 CM's later telling me the numbers were accurate for that $4870.02 , I finally found a person willing to listen.

Guess what???

The original CM forgot to punch in the code for the free dining so we were being charged for it and every ya hoo I spoke with since, would not spend the time to break down the pieces manually because the system just spits it out, so all they would do is assure me it could not be a mistake.

2 minutes with the CM I just spoke to and she had to the penny the same amount by adding manually the cost of the dining plan, tickets and rack rate.

So thank you to those here who told me to look again and not give up on the fact free dining for 6 would be a better option if done right.

New price $ 3,123.48 for 6 days of stay, 6 days of food, 6- 2 day base tickets and a partridge in a pear tree.

Price for OOP dining plus package rate for the AP discount was going to be: $3,223.54

Just saved myself $100.06 and have 12 days of tickets to boot!

THANK YOU ALLLLLLL!!!!!!!


I still believe if the free dining was not available, anyone with an AP discount should look into the packaging because it was such a good deal vs. room rate only.