Fast Pass + is terrible.

[wendybeth75]

I don't think FP+ is regressive, but there are things I don't care for and things I really like. I really like the concept and it has been fun to pick our rides and "plan" our trips. I don't like the tiered system, though I understand they have to do it that way or FP would run out for the headliners. I think the OP had some fabulous ideas about attractions to add. I can't imagine having to stand in line at a Kiosk and go through all of that trouble. For us it is just one more "perk" of staying onsite.

 

[*disgal*]

A few comments to get my 2c in ...

I haven't been since FP+ started, but I see the reason so many on these boards are complaining about it.

Disney has made adjustments to the FP system based on the "average" patron.

WE are not average. The people on these boards are the most informed. We learned from each other how to best use (abuse) the system...gathering FP- as quickly as we could, hoarding them for later in the day (prior to the time enforcement). We were spoiled.

The FP+ systems merely caps the ability to abuse the system. It levels the playing field so everyone can now have at least an opportunity to ride a couple of headliners, get a good spot for a parade or show.

If Disney chooses to offer a greater perk to on-site guest, that's their prerogative. After all, they own the parks and resorts. Universal does it!

Adding more attractions will not alleviate the crowds. It will just draw more people. If you think adding a new attraction will reduce waits at another ride, then extrapolating that analogy, we would be waiting much less now than we did in 2000, 1990, 1980...
New attractions draw more crowds, so you need more food venues, stores, parking, transportation, resorts, bathrooms, water fountains, trash cans...you can't just expand attractions without expanding all other resources, or the waits and prices go up.

Lastly, I remember how excited we were in the mid 1980s when we could arrive at EPCOT and book our dinner reservation in THE MORNING. Wow! technology sure is cool. Imagine, we won't have to wait in line for dinner (like those second class patrons) because we knew to reserve a table at the dining kiosk hours before our meal.

Again, like most on these boards, I prefer the old system...the one I could abuse at the expense of the less informed...but we were in the minority and Disney knew it. They made an adjustment to even things out.

I get what you're saying but....

1) I don't know if I would call it abuse. Abuse has a very negative meaning. If it was so negative, why would WDW turn the other way even knowing that PAID DISNEY PLANNERS were giving the advise? heck, the CM's never did anything but smile at me when we did it. I don't think that was abusing...maybe, tweaking?

2) the field was always level. Everyone had the same ability to get a fp. In fact, I would say onsiters had an advantage over my family(being that most of our trips have been offsite now) because they could get in there earlier than me to start getting fps. But just because someone doesn't want to get there at RD doesn't mean Disney is giving them any less of a chance than me, who IS at RD.

3) Totally agree that WDW can do whatever they want for onsite guests. I actually thought in the beginning that this is what was happening. But I don't think it is. This will be offered to offsite people too. What, if any park perks (other than EMH), they will create for onsite guests, who knows? I do think there should be something. jmo

 

[jc2003]

I am currently planning our family's first Disney trip and all of these negative FP+ threads are making me nervous! I hope they can work out some of the kinks in then next couple of months before we go!

 

[Mickey & Minnie Mom]

First comment before I begin: You get what you pay for. If you wanted FP+, you should have booked onsite.

1) It won't be this way for long. They will roll out FP+ booking to offsite guests eventually. They are testing this now with select guests.

2) According to Disney, 3 FastPass+ rides in a day is more than what guests averaged with FastPass-, which was 2. So unless you are a super planner with FP (which it sounds like you are) then this is an improvement for most causal guests.

3) Again, if/when offsite gets FP+ advanced booking, this need goes away.

4) There are a LOT of problems FP+ is designed to fix, the biggest one being rope-drop-runs to FP machines. It gives guests an opportunity to go on Tier 1 (E-Ticket) rides that they may usually miss out on. I'm not saying FP+ is perfect, but it's not created "just because".

5) Change is hard for most people to deal with. That is why old people long of the "good old days" when "everything was simply". It's not true, it just feels that way because change is hard.

6) It was always supposed to be strict. You were never really supposed to come after your hour window, but people ignored it and so did Disney. Now it's enforced and I personally think this is great.

7) True. Disney's answer is "book a longer stay if you want FP+ for all the tier 1 rides". Personally I think this is a business decision on Disney's part to get people to stay longer.

8) True. Technical issues are one of the downsides. What happens though is that you are automatically sent an email when a ride is down and you get a free FP+ for any time the rest of the day for a number of other rides listed in the email. This has happened to me twice. One night Barnstormer went down and we got an email saying we could use it on 7 other rides, including Peter Pan's Flight, which had a 75 minute wait. We said OK! and walked right on that ride. The bonus is that it acted as a FORTH FP+.... our Barnstormer FP+ also still worked when the ride opened back up.

Curious why you would be such fan of the strictly enforced return times now (versus when guests "abused" the system and came late when allowed by Disney) but then find no problem using a 4th FP+?

I realize you were allowed through and on to Barnstormer by Disney, but as pointed out in the email you received if you used your FP on another attraction, you would lose the right to use the FP for the original ride.

FP+ in its current incarnation is ONLY for 3 attractions, yes?

 

[*disgal*]

There was a post yesterday saying they are starting to test it for offsite.

6 rides with no restrictions. How would there be enough to go around? If TSM is gone within minutes at park opening, with 6 they would be gone long in advance.

where was this posted? I must have missed that.

Also what about using the common strategy of riding the most popular rides at RD even in high season? I know this does not help those that can not make RP or like to ride the most popular attraction multiple times during the day - but was that even possible without long lines during high season before FP+?

We will be doing just that our next trip...riding SB at RD. But to answer your question about was it possible to ride popular attractions multiple times during high seasons?....sure was. At least for us. I would consider the sat before Easter at MK high season, right? Maybe we were just lucky? But it's never not happened for us.

FP+ prebooking for now is a on-site perk. If you don't like it than stay on-site. I will never understand how someone does not understand Disney is pushing for on site occupancy. Look at all their TV ads, print ads, and even a new documentary on Destination America solely on the resorts.

For what they charge for rooms they need to give even more perks IMO. Do I Iike everything about the new FP system, hell no. Do I expect certain benefits because I pay higher rates for their hotels? You better believe it.

Oh, I understand it. But I don't think FP+ is about that. It's already started to be offered to offsite guests.

And yes, when I stayed there and paid those rates I expected certain benefits. And yes, I think there should be more benefits now. Totally agree. I just don't know what they would be.

There was no advantage for staying on-site with paper FPs and guest still stayed on-site. Why would Disney believe they needed to make FP+ an on-site perk to get guest to stay on-site? All those other perks are still there. Yes, it has been a perk up to now but that is changing.

agree.

But to answer the point of what problem is this fixing while you may have loved the old system it didn't work very well for us.

With 3 young kids and a double stroller to push it was a huge pain to run across a park to pull FP for a ride only to find the return time hours later so we'd have to come back and forth multiple times to get our FP and ride the rides. Then you never know when one of the kids will have a meltdown or get sick or need a break so if it happened before our window too bad they couldn't be changed. Now I at least have that opportunity to move things around when we need. And we did that in the fall which was awesome. Never wasted a FP because we just moved our times and picked something else.

We also didn't get to do Soarin or TSM on past trips because we aren't morning people and they would be gone before we got to the parks. One hour plus waits are not going to happen with our boys so we missed them. Now we make those FP in advance.

It's not perfect for sure, but it does actually work well for some people while the old system really never worked well for some too. Sorry you found it not to your liking but I'm sure this isn't the way it will be in the end.

Please don't take this the wrong way (and I do agree for people like you the new system is better...totally agree and can see that)...but we were in exactly your situation years ago and the old system worked great for us. Three kids, onsite (or off), double stroller. Once we even rented 2 of WDW strollers. There is not a morning person among us! Getting up for Disney just about kills us every time, even now that my kids are older. Ugh! But because it is Disney and we wanted to ride rides, we got there at RD. Just different touring, I guess. I would say, even though we don't tour the way you do, this is the one huge perk of fp+ and I'm glad families have that now. I'm just not very interested if it stays like it is now.

 

[Planogirl]

Universal offering a fastpass perk to guests that stay at the top tier resorts is NOT the same. You are looking at only 3 resorts spread between 2 parks. I believe that someone said that Disney has 24 resorts and those guests would be spread between 4 parks. This is a lot different.

We always made it to rope drop too but DS is an only child and a bundle of energy. He was always glad to move quickly (I don't sprint) across the park with me. I can only imagine what a pain that was for larger families.

 

[2Tiggies]

We always made it to rope drop too but DS is an only child and a bundle of energy. He was always glad to move quickly (I don't sprint) across the park with me. I can only imagine what a pain that was for larger families.

Agreed. And DD and I have expanded on our usual 'party of two' to include friends, we have felt the dip in pace, significantly.

The challenge now is that when that rope drops and you enter the park at opening time, people now already have FP's booked and are in that FP line. So it begs the question: Is the standby line at 9 am (assuming that is the time your park of choice opens) still going to be a walk on, or is it going to be an automatic 10+ minute wait as you let all the 9 -10 am FP+ holders go through ahead of you?!

 

[bcrook]

Because studies showed that on average, guests used 2.5 FPs per day. I'm glad they rounded up.

I have read this too, I do appreciate your joke.

But what is interesting in those reports about guests only using 2 FP or 2.5 in MK... That is all Disney had to offer! On an average day at MK, 50,000 - 60,000 people were in the park but there was only 120,000 total FP available before Disney expanded the offerings to rides that didn't need them.

So the reason people only used 2 a day, is because that is all there was.

 

[*disgal*]

The challenge now is that when that rope drops and you enter the park at opening time, people now already have FP's booked and are in that FP line. So it begs the question: Is the standby line at 9 am (assuming that is the time your park of choice opens) still going to be a walk on, or is it going to be an automatic 10+ minute wait as you let all the 9 -10 am FP+ holders go through ahead of you?!

Oh, my word I totally forgot about that. ugh! This really should be interesting.

 

[mamabear0222]

I haven't read the replies but we are here now and have been for 2 weeks. We have had no issues with fp+ and we are offsite. Today we fp soarin. Rode test track. Went right on soarin after that. Rode mission space 3 times...spaceship earth a few times. ..it worked out well.

We have been fine with it. For TSMM we walked right to the ride....waited 20 mins (posted said 40)..got off. Went and made fp for TOT etc. We haven't had issues at all. Then again we do everything in the morning and home by 3

 

[MrInfinity]

OP, pretty much all your points have been answered, quite well, by others... I'll add my 2c on the oversimplification that is "just add more rides".

First off, WDW is adding more rides. They're adding a whole new Land with rides, restaurants, and shops.

Now why don't they add 20 new rides? 50? Why not take the MK from the 30'ish rides they have to 100? Because rides are expensive. They have a huge up front cost and a huge maintenance cost. Rides don't pay the bills, people pay the bills. Rides are merely the carrot to bring the people -- then have the ppl spend money doing stuff other than riding those rides they came for.

So Disney wants to have just enough rides to fill their parks to capacity. Their parks are now filled to capacity, so they need no more rides. More rides (costing Disney) would simply allow you to ride more (costing Disney more) and spend less (costing Disney more). AK is filling the least to capacity, so they're adding Avatarland. It will probly have fewer rides than you like, but it will have enough that for the next 10 years after that, AK will be insanely full again. Simple.

If at some point you feel you can get better rides, better experience at some other park, then feel free to go there. But there really is no other park that even comes close to the magic that is Disney. They know this. The world knows this. Ppl come to Disney from the entire world over because it really is that great even with the number of rides they have.

So in conclusion... there is 0 incentive for Disney to add more rides at their own expense so that you can stay offsite and pay your whopping $100 (oh sorry you offered another $50 if Disney will let you stay in a value when the rest of the world is willing to pay $150) and ride more rides at Disney's expense.

On top of that, you seem mad that you you can't get on the rides more than the next guy. The guy who *is* willing to pay $250/day or even $700/day.

It is just not profitable, even tho you used to get away w it, for Disney to have you, paying just your admission, riding the rides that they want to be available to resort-staying casual spending vacationers.

"Disney should give me more rides cuz I'm a paying customer" is such flawed logic... because you, and I, and millions of other people are all willing to go given the number of rides they already have. Which, I happen to think is awesome. I feel there are so many rides that I can't do the MK in 2 days but I could do my local Six Flags in less than a day. Sure my Six Flags may have 5 roller coasters... the MK has 3, plus so many other rides that BLOW AWAY anything else at SF like Small World, Peter Pan, Tea Cups, POTC, Jungle Cruise, Splash Mtn, and so on.

 

[2Tiggies]

This is good news and thank you. Now, I'm not going to lay down bets that that happens for us being that's it's Easter week but I'm going to "keep hope alive!!"

Oh boy, you guys are the ones I am watching closely (Easter week). We've done a couple of Easters before reverting to calm, quiet Septembers for a few years but this year we are there for Independence Day. Yeah, I know, I really picked my year to try it out I am watching to see how this is all going to work when the parks are near capacity.

mamabear0222, I'm glad it's worked well for you and hope your girls have had a good birthday trip

 

[DisneyAllyC]

sorry, what's the reason why you need to stay on property? Again, sorry, I'm not sure what you are referring to....is it so you can get fp+ scheduled ahead of time? Or do you mean staying at Universal for the FOTLP? or something like that?

If it's WDW, pretty sure that perk is not going to be an onsite-only perk much longer. But not sure that is what you were talking about.

Staying on property allows you to pick your FP times 60 days early. It gives you an idea of what you want to do.

 

[2Tiggies]

Staying on property allows you to pick your FP times 60 days early. It gives you an idea of what you want to do.

That looks all set to change. Testing has begun for offsite guests to pre book too now. It's only a matter of time.

 

[JanaDee]

Staying on property allows you to pick your FP times 60 days early. It gives you an idea of what you want to do.

By all indications, off site will soon be able to pre-book.

 

[*disgal*]

Now why don't they add 20 new rides? 50? Why not take the MK from the 30'ish rides they have to 100? Because rides are expensive. They have a huge up front cost and a huge maintenance cost. Rides don't pay the bills, people pay the bills. Rides are merely the carrot to bring the people -- then have the ppl spend money doing stuff other than riding those rides they came for.

So Disney wants to have just enough rides to fill their parks to capacity. Their parks are now filled to capacity, so they need no more rides. More rides (costing Disney) would simply allow you to ride more (costing Disney more) and spend less (costing Disney more). AK is filling the least to capacity, so they're adding Avatarland. It will probly have fewer rides than you like, but it will have enough that for the next 10 years after that, AK will be insanely full again. Simple.

If at some point you feel you can get better rides, better experience at some other park, then feel free to go there. But there really is no other park that even comes close to the magic that is Disney. They know this. The world knows this. Ppl come to Disney from the entire world over because it really is that great even with the number of rides they have.

So in conclusion... there is 0 incentive for Disney to add more rides at their own expense so that you can stay offsite and pay your whopping $100 (oh sorry you offered another $50 if Disney will let you stay in a value when the rest of the world is willing to pay $150) and ride more rides at Disney's expense.

On top of that, you seem mad that you you can't get on the rides more than the next guy. The guy who *is* willing to pay $250/day or even $700/day.

It is just not profitable, even tho you used to get away w it, for Disney to have you, paying just your admission, riding the rides that they want to be available to resort-staying casual spending vacationers.

"Disney should give me more rides cuz I'm a paying customer" is such flawed logic... because you, and I, and millions of other people are all willing to go given the number of rides they already have. Which, I happen to think is awesome. I feel there are so many rides that I can't do the MK in 2 days but I could do my local Six Flags in less than a day. Sure my Six Flags may have 5 roller coasters... the MK has 3, plus so many other rides that BLOW AWAY anything else at SF like Small World, Peter Pan, Tea Cups, POTC, Jungle Cruise, Splash Mtn, and so on.

That all might be true and heaven knows DHS and AK are busy. But it's funny. My family hasn't been to either one of those parks on our last 4 trips. Just not enough "for our family" to do.

But as far as the bolded above, correct me if I'm wrong, but EMH are the only thing I can think of as far as the PARKS go that Disney has given the onsite guest preferential treatment. Ok, temporarily fp+, but people think that one will be short lived. So say fp+ DOES get offered to offsite guests, just for arguements sake, what am I missing besides EMH? I'm not talking resort perks or even buses since if you are already in the park you don't need a bus. lol

Oh boy, you guys are the ones I am watching closely (Easter week). We've done a couple of Easters before reverting to calm, quiet Septembers for a few years but this year we are there for Independence Day. Yeah, I know, I really picked my year to try it out I am watching to see how this is all going to work when the parks are near capacity.

Hahaha I've always wanted to be a guinea pig! NOT!!!!!!!! Ok, I know I've said this time and again on other threads so if anyone has read this from me before, sorry, but honestly, with the previous fp system, even during those busy weeks, we were fine. Great, as a matter of fact. Now there were a lot of people in the parks, holy cow! but we got everything done ok.

We've done September's too..... can we say, hahaha

Independence day, huh? Well, hopefully all the bugs will be worked out and the only bugs you have to worry about are the ones flying in the air. heehee

 

[*disgal*]

Staying on property allows you to pick your FP times 60 days early. It gives you an idea of what you want to do.

Ok, that's what I thought but wanted to make sure. So if fp+ is eventually offered to offsite, which it looks like that.......then........ ??

eta: sorry, didn't see the above posters pretty much said the same thing. Any comments?

 

[2Tiggies]

Well, hopefully all the bugs will be worked out and the only bugs you have to worry about are the ones flying in the air. heehee

At least they make sprays for those

 

[smitch425]

Ok, that's what I thought but wanted to make sure. So if fp+ is eventually offered to offsite, which it looks like that.......then........ ??

eta: sorry, didn't see the above posters pretty much said the same thing. Any comments?

There is more to staying on property than just EMH, and actually, every guest can stay for EMH, but only Disney resort guests can ride attractions. Resort guests have the ability to charge purchases to their resort bill instead of physically paying for an item in the park, and you can also have purchased items sent from the parks directly to your resort for free. And of course the ability to use the dining plan in the parks is a huge plus.

 

[tamhugh]

Ethan, when were you there that they sent you the email about technical difficulties? We were at AK on 2/20 and Expedition Everest broke down during our FP+ time. We received no email, and since it wasn't fixed until after our time slot ended, we lost that FP. We couldn't add it back on MDE or at the kiosk. The Kiosk CMs said that they couldn't help.