Fast Pass Future? Predictions...

[TravelandLeisure]

One thing to bear in mind is that Universal EP is a bit of a different product than Disney FP. Several times on busy days we have waited over 45 minutes for Despicable Me and Gringotts in the Express line, and when I asked about this I was told that EP only guarantees 50% of the standby wait time. On Disney FP lines, though, it is very rare to have to wait for more than about 20 minutes.

This was far from our experience when we had express passes at Universal. I really don’t recall waiting over 20 minutes for anything(except for Kong when everyone poured into the queue during an afternoon thunderstorm).

On the other hand, I can recall several of Disney’s fast pass lines that were backed up, causing us to wait 20-30 minutes.

IMO Universal’s system is so stress free—if you feel like an express line is taking too long it’s easy to just come back later. You are under no time windows/restraints, unlike fast pass.

 

[beachdreamr1229]

I personally think it'll look like maxpass at Disneyland, which I actually really enjoy. When it first came, I thought the idea of paying extra for maxpass was ridiculous, but it turned out it's worth the money and works great. And I think it'd be nice at WDW to be able to get FP as they come up in a day without having to plan months ahead of time. It takes some of the pressure off.

 

[Disneylover99]

One thing to bear in mind is that Universal EP is a bit of a different product than Disney FP. Several times on busy days we have waited over 45 minutes for Despicable Me and Gringotts in the Express line, and when I asked about this I was told that EP only guarantees 50% of the standby wait time. On Disney FP lines, though, it is very rare to have to wait for more than about 20 minutes.

Longish waits for no particular reason have been my experience as well after using express on a number of trips at Universal.

FP waits are much quicker and more reliable in general.

 

[ghtx]

I think that it will basically be the same as it was before (i.e. the mechanics of getting a FP and using it will be the same), but it will be heavily tiered and cost extra.

E.g., perhaps all guests with tickets will get one FP per day included, and guests staying on property will get 2 FP per day, maybe 3 for the deluxe resorts, and there will be packages that you can buy that will allow you to have more than 3.

 

[GoingSince1990]

But let's just use your $75 FP example for FOP. If the ride has a 150 min wait, the FP line is probably at least 30 min. A family of 4 would have to pay $300 to enter that line on an impulse buy. I can see people just completely turned off by this.

Disney will never, ever, be crassly in-your-face enough to say to people "hey, want to dodge the 150 minute wait for FoP by paying $75 per person right now"? However, they have and will continue to be perfectly happy to monetize FP access, while being clever and subtle enough that even now people are wondering on the internet whether Disney will ever decide to monetize FP access. Take the AK Ultimate Nights of Adventure tour, which we did a few years ago at a cost of $250 per person and included FP access to both the Pandora rides, along with KS, EE, Dinosaur and Rivers of Light, and also a light meal. Hint: people are not paying $250 for a light meal and the chance to make small-talk with a friendly tour guide. Let's say the meal is worth $10, in which case everyone on this tour is effectively stumping up $40 per Fastpass. Disney just loves the positive PR of benevolently dispensing "free" Fastpasses while cashing in on FP access via tours, EMM, the Frozen dessert party, and so on. In particular now that EMH has been abolished I wouldn't be at all surprised to see paid EMM being ramped up in the future.

 

[snoopboop]

I really hope it doesn't become a "if you can pay more" for what we used to get for free. This is why I despise Universal. If you don't pay for their Express Pass - which can be QUITE expensive - you are a second class citizen - very, very obviously. Yes - Disney has add-ons now for those who can pay - but with the exception of VIP tours - those extras happen outside of regular park hours.

I'm always baffled when people vilify Universal and/or claim that Disney is the great equalizer of theme parks. The reality is that pre-Covid there absolutely were already tiered benefits to Disney's resorts, including not just the obvious ones like resort amenities being different based on resort tier but also perks like transportation methods (e.g. a monorail resort costs more at least in part because of the perk of having access to the monorail).

At Universal, similarly, guests are able to choose their resort tier based on their vacation preferences. I LOVE Universal's option of booking at a hotel that includes Unlimited EP with your resort stay - I think it's brilliant and an excellent perk. I absolutely hope that WDW does something similar - it will definitely prompt me to book my first ever stay at a WDW Deluxe resort.

 

[JakeAZ]

Disney will never, ever, be crassly in-your-face enough to say to people "hey, want to dodge the 150 minute wait for FoP by paying $75 per person right now"? However, they have and will continue to be perfectly happy to monetize FP access, while being clever and subtle enough that even now people are wondering on the internet whether Disney will ever decide to monetize FP access. Take the AK Ultimate Nights of Adventure tour, which we did a few years ago at a cost of $250 per person and included FP access to both the Pandora rides, along with KS, EE, Dinosaur and Rivers of Light, and also a light meal. Hint: people are not paying $250 for a light meal and the chance to make small-talk with a friendly tour guide. Let's say the meal is worth $10, in which case everyone on this tour is effectively stumping up $40 per Fastpass. Disney just loves the positive PR of benevolently dispensing "free" Fastpasses while cashing in on FP access via tours, EMM, the Frozen dessert party, and so on. In particular now that EMH has been abolished I wouldn't be at all surprised to see paid EMM being ramped up in the future.

I'm with you 100%! All of those extras and tours are offered in advance. They are absolutely "money grabs" poorly disguised as "enchanting extras".

I'm OK with them saying "here's what it costs and here's what you get". I can then decide if it's worth it.

I don't think they would offer impulse FP either, but time will tell.

 

[JakeAZ]

I personally think it'll look like maxpass at Disneyland, which I actually really enjoy. When it first came, I thought the idea of paying extra for maxpass was ridiculous, but it turned out it's worth the money and works great. And I think it'd be nice at WDW to be able to get FP as they come up in a day without having to plan months ahead of time. It takes some of the pressure off.

You could be right, but I just don't see them going to a system that rewards people for getting into the parks first thing in the morning. For some people, that's how they love to visit WDW, but for others, they prefer to arrive later and stay until closing.

If the "arrive later" crowd finds themselves only having access to FP for lower tier rides or only much later in the day access, they are going to be pretty angry that they had to pay for that "luxury".

I see them keeping the ability to pre-schedule some rides OR offering packages of FP (similar to Paris).

 

[vacationer1954]

Random thought: Disney doesn’t want us standing in lines. I think their goal will be to figure out how to create a system that can capitalize on FP’s but minimizes excessively long lines. People cannot spend money when standing in line.

They've tried that though. It seems to me that most of us just used the time we weren't standing in line for an attraction for which we had a FP to wait on line for another attraction instead.

 

[kwdw]

I'm always baffled when people vilify Universal and/or claim that Disney is the great equalizer of theme parks. The reality is that pre-Covid there absolutely were already tiered benefits to Disney's resorts, including not just the obvious ones like resort amenities being different based on resort tier but also perks like transportation methods (e.g. a monorail resort costs more at least in part because of the perk of having access to the monorail).

At Universal, similarly, guests are able to choose their resort tier based on their vacation preferences. I LOVE Universal's option of booking at a hotel that includes Unlimited EP with your resort stay - I think it's brilliant and an excellent perk. I absolutely hope that WDW does something similar - it will definitely prompt me to book my first ever stay at a WDW Deluxe resort.

I don't like Universal's approach to ride access because of the experience in the PARKS themselves. At Disney - in terms of the in-the-park experience - all resort guests are treated equal. Everyone gets 3 FP's for free - value through deluxe. I could be standing in lines next to folks staying at a DVC grand villa (vs me at a value) and not know it. Yes - I totally understand the resorts have different amenities and access to transportation (I've stayed at all levels of them) - but that's all outside the park gates. Once inside the park - everyone gets 3 FP's for free. Disney has all kinds of extras folks who have more money can buy - but except for VIP tours - you don't visually see those differences inside the park during normal park hours. When I'm standing in a stand-by line at Universal and see the folks in the Express Pass line - I KNOW those folks have more money than me. I feel poor. They are paying more to be in the park that day than I can afford and it's a very visual distinction. It's clearly "rich" in Express lines and "poor" in standby lines.

 

[wdw&sonny]

They've tried that though. It seems to me that most of us just used the time we weren't standing in line for an attraction for which we had a FP to wait on line for another attraction instead.

Agree.
Just thinking out loud here...

What if everything becomes a virtual queue? Just like RotR boarding groups.

You select three queues when you arrive, based on posted wait times. You are notified by app when you can enter the queue. You enter the queue and wait the standard 10-15 min- as controlled by Disney.

Meanwhile, instead of being in line, you are free to roam the park, but not enter another line. You are waiting for the 3 rides of your choice, you are just not waiting in a line. You can choose to shop, snack, or just sit on a bench. You can choose to cancel and reschedule as you like (get out of line). No unfair advantage for those who know how to work the FP system. No added costs. Equal for all.

You can hold three VQ at a time. Finish one ride, quickly get the next, just like running to the next line. If a popular attraction shows a 6 hour wait, you can still choose it, just like the old days of actually standing in a 6 hour line, or more recently picking up a late afternoon FP time. You still have two other VQs to work with throughout the day.

The hidden revenue for Disney is that we will spend money while waiting for our MB to vibrate and tell us we can enter the queue.
The positive PR for Disney is an experience that doesn't copy what the "other guys" are doing: a happy customer, not disgruntled by waiting in line:
"We have improved our guest experience by letting them roam the park, while waiting for an attraction. No more standing in line."
"We chose not to ask our guests to pay extra for this enhanced experience."
"We want all of our guests to be able to share the benefits of visiting a Disney park."

 

[vacationer1954]

Everyone gets 3 FP's for free - value through deluxe.

Except for club level folks who pay for the extra 3 FP's.

 

[kwdw]

Agree.
Just thinking out loud here...

What if everything becomes a virtual queue? Just like RotR boarding groups.

You select three queues when you arrive, based on posted wait times. You are notified by app when you can enter the queue. You enter the queue and wait the standard 10-15 min- as controlled by Disney.

Meanwhile, instead of being in line, you are free to roam the park, but not enter another line. You are waiting for the 3 rides of your choice, you are just not waiting in a line. You can choose to shop, snack, or just sit on a bench. You can choose to cancel and reschedule as you like (get out of line). No unfair advantage for those who know how to work the FP system. No added costs. Equal for all.

You can hold three VQ at a time. Finish one ride, quickly get the next, just like running to the next line. If a popular attraction shows a 6 hour wait, you can still choose it, just like the old days of actually standing in a 6 hour line, or more recently picking up a late afternoon FP time. You still have two other VQs to work with throughout the day.

The hidden revenue for Disney is that we will spend money while waiting for our MB to vibrate and tell us we can enter the queue.
The positive PR for Disney is an experience that doesn't copy what the "other guys" are doing: a happy customer, not disgruntled by waiting in line:
"We have improved our guest experience by letting them roam the park, while waiting for an attraction. No more standing in line."
"We chose not to ask our guests to pay extra for this enhanced experience."
"We want all of our guests to be able to share the benefits of visiting a Disney park."

I dislike this because it is phone dependent - and you can't schedule things in advance. This is a horrible way to approach a day for planners. What if the only "queue time" for a ride is during your ADR? Now what? I can avoid that by pre-planning. I do think if it was a combination - FP and queues - that might be okay.

But if folks aren't crammed into standby lines - that makes the rest of the common areas in the parks harder to walk through - less enjoyable. If folks aren't standing line when a park is at max capacity - then where are they standing? Can you even walk-through a store without being practically shoulder to shoulder? Most line queues allow you to escape the heat or the cool because they have temperature control. They don't have space to have everyone not in lines.

I really liked the paper FP system - I still think that might have been my favorite approach - but I admit to liking FP the way it is now. Could I adjust? Sure. But each step towards making me more dependent on a smart phone during the day is a step in the wrong direction for me. Vacation is about getting away from "using electronics" for me - not depending on them more!

 

[snoopboop]

When I'm standing in a stand-by line at Universal and see the folks in the Express Pass line - I KNOW those folks have more money than me.

They have more money than you? Says who? Maybe they saved up for months, or even YEARS, to be able to afford a single trip to the parks. If their preference is to wait until they can afford a trip that includes a stay at an EP resort, that’s their prerogative ... but it definitely doesn’t mean they’re richer than you.

 

[Brett Wyman]

90% of the rides are setup with FP kiosks and secondary lines dedicated to FP. FP isn't going anywhere, although the form and function is almost certain to change. Most seem to think a paid option like MP is more likely. Or maybe paid for X amount of FPs per day? But whatever form it takes its 99.9% guaranteed there will be another option that isn't the standby line..

 

[DCLMP]

I don't like Universal's approach to ride access because of the experience in the PARKS themselves. At Disney - in terms of the in-the-park experience - all resort guests are treated equal. Everyone gets 3 FP's for free - value through deluxe. I could be standing in lines next to folks staying at a DVC grand villa (vs me at a value) and not know it. Yes - I totally understand the resorts have different amenities and access to transportation (I've stayed at all levels of them) - but that's all outside the park gates. Once inside the park - everyone gets 3 FP's for free. Disney has all kinds of extras folks who have more money can buy - but except for VIP tours - you don't visually see those differences inside the park during normal park hours. When I'm standing in a stand-by line at Universal and see the folks in the Express Pass line - I KNOW those folks have more money than me. I feel poor. They are paying more to be in the park that day than I can afford and it's a very visual distinction. It's clearly "rich" in Express lines and "poor" in standby lines.

The price difference between a value resort and a deluxe resort at Universal isn't exactly earth shattering. So someone paid a few hundred more for their vacation then you did and that makes them wealthy? Huh? I've stayed deluxe at Universal many times and I'm no where close to being wealthy.

 

[GoingSince1990]

Agree.
Just thinking out loud here...

What if everything becomes a virtual queue? Just like RotR boarding groups.

You select three queues when you arrive, based on posted wait times. You are notified by app when you can enter the queue. You enter the queue and wait the standard 10-15 min- as controlled by Disney.

Meanwhile, instead of being in line, you are free to roam the park, but not enter another line. You are waiting for the 3 rides of your choice, you are just not waiting in a line. You can choose to shop, snack, or just sit on a bench. You can choose to cancel and reschedule as you like (get out of line). No unfair advantage for those who know how to work the FP system. No added costs. Equal for all.

You can hold three VQ at a time. Finish one ride, quickly get the next, just like running to the next line. If a popular attraction shows a 6 hour wait, you can still choose it, just like the old days of actually standing in a 6 hour line, or more recently picking up a late afternoon FP time. You still have two other VQs to work with throughout the day.

The hidden revenue for Disney is that we will spend money while waiting for our MB to vibrate and tell us we can enter the queue.
The positive PR for Disney is an experience that doesn't copy what the "other guys" are doing: a happy customer, not disgruntled by waiting in line:
"We have improved our guest experience by letting them roam the park, while waiting for an attraction. No more standing in line."
"We chose not to ask our guests to pay extra for this enhanced experience."
"We want all of our guests to be able to share the benefits of visiting a Disney park."

Then we would be back to rope-drop being essential to do the best rides. The VQs for the hottest and newest attractions would fill very quickly for the entire day, and those showing up to the park later in the day would have slim pickings. Also, the unpredictability of your VQ times would play absolute havoc with the ADR system. And finally, I’m not sure that the physical space exists in the parks for people to just hang around who would be otherwise waiting in lines.

 

[GoingSince1990]

They have more money than you? Says who? Maybe they saved up for months, or even YEARS, to be able to afford a single trip to the parks. If their preference is to wait until they can afford a trip that includes a stay at an EP resort, that’s their prerogative ... but it definitely doesn’t mean they’re richer than you.

Yep. Kind of like assuming that someone who drives a BMW is richer than someone who drives a Honda. Which is most definitely not always the case, and in my personal experience, quite often the opposite.

 

[Jonfw2]

Lines, like it or not, are here to stay. The fact is, they're a great place to put people. At any given time, if a third or half the people in the park are in a line, they're not in restaurants or walking around.

 

[JakeAZ]

They have more money than you? Says who? Maybe they saved up for months, or even YEARS, to be able to afford a single trip to the parks. If their preference is to wait until they can afford a trip that includes a stay at an EP resort, that’s their prerogative ... but it definitely doesn’t mean they’re richer than you.

Completely agree.

Also, I would not classify anyone who can "afford" to make a WDW trip as "poor". WDW priced out the lower end of the income scale a long time ago. Let's not forget, that was by design.

I understand people may feel this way if there are certain things that are priced out of their budget, but just getting in the gates takes quite a bit of money. A five day park hopper ticket, for one person, is roughly $675. Now multiply that in a family of 4. Now factor in lodging (any lodging) and food. etc, etc.