Family Vent....

[sunshinehighway]

I would, or rather I would sell them in the very active Facebook online yardsale I'm a member or, but I was saving them until we decided if we wanted another child. Here I am now 4 years later, 15 weeks pregnant, so I don't want to get rid of them. Although, DS was born in May in Florida so all of his baby clothes are summer clothes. This baby will be born in November, maybe in NH. This clothes will be totally different!



You're right. And that is something that my husband says. A few weeks ago my sister and I had back to back hair appointments at 6:30 and 7:00. DH was on call, but I knew I would only be 30 mins so I left DS with him. I got there right before 7 and my sister had the hairstylist cut my nephews hair too. When I got there at 7 for my appointment the stylist hadn't even started on my sister. So I texted my husband and let him know and then asked my sister and BIL if he got called out could they go get my son because I was going to be gone twice as long as I planned. She scoffed and told me to call my parents and BIL, who corrects her all the time, said of course we'll go get him, just tell DH to call us. So DH is annoyed because we don't balk at helping them if needed and honestly neither does BIL, but she does.



She is younger. I have posted more about her, but yes, being the baby definitely created who she is.



It's not about the money. I knowingly chose what to charge her. It's just one of the other things that adds to the things I do for her.



You are so right. It's so hard around here. While I grew up here, I went away to college and then we've been in FL for the past few years. People here have very established lives and networks and it is very hard to break into them.



My problem is that we moved back to be near family. I know what it is like to raise a child on our own with no network. So I really appreciate the family aspect because we didn't have it. She has never lived 2 miles from my parents so she takes it for granted.

It's hard but you will be happier and have a better relationship with her if you just treat her as she treats you and stop doing extras for her.
Talking to her will probably get you nowhere. If you try to explain to her how you feel and she'll just turn it around and say you're throwing things in her face or only do things for her to get credit for them. There probably won't be a lightbulb moment and she probably won"t understand what you are really feeling . it will end up leaving you more frustrated.
You can't change her or how she treats you so change how you treat her.

 

[ilovefh]

It might not be about the money.
My guess is it's more about the lack of thought the sister puts into the Op's feelings.
With some people it's just second nature to do things for the people they care about. When you're that type of person, it's hard to continually deal with someone who isn't and not end up feeling hurt or used by them.

You're right, it's not about the money. I chose what to charge her back in August. August-October I kept him later because she coaches. It worked out because after her season I was able to take a 2 hours, 3 days per week tutoring job at her school after school. This keeps me relevant and gets me noticed if I want to return to teaching. I bring both her son and mine to her at school and she watches them while I tutor. She mentioned to my mom, not me of course, that maybe she should get a discount because of this. I told my mom that since I was already charging less ($25/ week and providing everything) and kept him as long as she need that there would be no discount.

I would shut down the free clothing venue now. There are shelters that need these things and I'm sure that the gesture will be better appreciated by those who have need. Time to look at having your sister look at the real world. Child care is not cheap, and good child care is very hard to find. Sis needs a wake up call.

He'll be going to daycare next year. That was the agreement, that he would only come to me for a year. Then he would go to daycare where he could be around other kids his age. We've joked that it will be a wake up call. Packing diapers, paying more, paying during breaks, having to pay before the week starts and not when she feels like it, having to pick him up by 5 no matter what, it will be different. I am already thinking they will ask me to pick him up on Fridays because my sister goes from school to a part time job and BIL can't be there until 5:30.

I agree with the PP that said you should make a list of what you are providing for your sister's child's care and then come up with an appropriate amount she should be paying. Ask for it. If she refuses, then take on someone else's children and let her find other care. She should be supplying anything that her child/childen need while at your house. You should not be subsidizing her. No other person would do that for her. Treat your childcare as a business as much as possible. You are saving her a ton of money and you aren't getting anything but a small amount of money for it (and maybe some niece/nephew love).

And I would definitely stop giving her clothing. Time to have a yard sale or give to a charity.

It's not about the money. It's really the fact that she is so thoughtful and so thoughtless at the same time.

Is your frustration really about the sleeper or is it about feeling unappreciated about all you do for her?

Both? It represents pattern of behavior, a life long pattern, which is why I shouldn't be shocked at this point. It's like when we go on vacation. My parents and I take care of the room because we are DVC members and they pay for other things in return. She will do something so thoughtful, plan something fun, get the boys matching clothes, even offer to have DS ride with them on the plane, but then she thinks she and BIL should get the master bedroom. No, my parents get the master because they are the parents.

 

[ilovefh]

I'm curious about this part. Are the clothes originally from her child, that she gave you after she was done with them? Or were they your clothes from the start that you pass on to her child? My confusion is stemming from her comment about buying the clothing. If she purchased the clothing as gifts for your child, they are your clothes that she has no claim to. If she has passed on clothing for you to use with the expectation that she would get the clothing back after you were done, then I think she does have a claim if that were the prior arrangement. If she gave you the outgrown clothing with no expectation of return, then they are yours to do with as you wish.

Overall, it does sound like she's very self-centered and relies very heavily on you to not only provide material items, but also to care for her child. Is there a discrepancy between how much your family earns and theirs? I only ask because sometimes siblings, unjustly so IMHO, feel like the better-off sibling should be the provider to the ones who are not as well-off.

No, they're DS's clothes. She just had her first baby last year. She bought some clothes for DS when he was little and feels like she bought a lot of clothes, but truthfully she lived 1,300 miles away so she had no idea. She likes to tell people she bought 95% of his wardrobe. She is one of those people that has to feel like they are "the best." I don't know how to explain it, but she knows more about raising a toddler, even though she has a 1 year old. She is the one who took care of his needs, even though she was so far away. That type of person. I have written about it in other threads. Things like when DS started to cry when we were leaving a play place she tried to hand off her son to me so she could deal with my son. Things like this happen a lot.

Ironically they make more than we do. Probably double.

Ah, but that is where you are partly wrong. This post was about money.

If you charge her appropriately, you will feel less frustrated with her when she does stuff like this.

Really, it has nothing to do with money. I'm not mad about how much she pays me. It works for us. Even is she paid me double I would still be annoyed. It is about expectations. Her expectation is that she gets to pillage through DS's old stuff while she charges me for things. It's about how she expects that we can always watch her son and then she scoffs when we ask her to watch ours.

I kid you not when I say she called and said "Hey you'll need to watch my son on June 20 and June 27." She did not ask, just told me. Which I don't mind, because if I can't do it, I'll tell her. In fact we have plans to take DS to Monster Jam 2 hours away on one of the days, so I told her no. But she is just not as willing to watch our son.

This is my younger sister 100%. I consider myself a very thoughtful person. I am concerned about others. My sister, on the other hand, says all the time "this is who she is and if people don't like it then tough." The issue is that she doesn't care about other people. So she can come across as rude, *****y, and thoughtless. OP - unsure if this is your sister but sounds like she could use a wake up call. But it sounds like your BIL gets it better then your sister does. So I guess that is a good thing you have going for you.

It's hard but you will be happier and have a better relationship with her if you just treat her as she treats you and stop doing extras for her.
Talking to her will probably get you nowhere. If you try to explain to her how you feel and she'll just turn it around and say you're throwing things in her face or only do things for her to get credit for them. There probably won't be a lightbulb moment and she probably won"t understand what you are really feeling . it will end up leaving you more frustrated.
You can't change her or how she treats you so change how you treat her.

Both of the above quotes are right. BIL does get it, and gets my sister. The other night when she again tried to claim she bought 95% of DS's clothes he called her on it.

This is part of a life long issue and no one has ever been able to get through to her, so you're right, there will be no light bulb moment. If I change and treat her how she treats me I'll be labeled by her and my parents as a jerk. That's just the way it has been so I chose the high road. And it's part of why DH wants to move back to FL.

 

[sunshinehighway]

You're right, it's not about the money. I chose what to charge her back in August. August-October I kept him later because she coaches. It worked out because after her season I was able to take a 2 hours, 3 days per week tutoring job at her school after school. This keeps me relevant and gets me noticed if I want to return to teaching. I bring both her son and mine to her at school and she watches them while I tutor. She mentioned to my mom, not me of course, that maybe she should get a discount because of this. I told my mom that since I was already charging less ($25/ week and providing everything) and kept him as long as she need that there would be no discount.



He'll be going to daycare next year. That was the agreement, that he would only come to me for a year. Then he would go to daycare where he could be around other kids his age. We've joked that it will be a wake up call. Packing diapers, paying more, paying during breaks, having to pay before the week starts and not when she feels like it, having to pick him up by 5 no matter what, it will be different. I am already thinking they will ask me to pick him up on Fridays because my sister goes from school to a part time job and BIL can't be there until 5:30.



It's not about the money. It's really the fact that she is so thoughtful and so thoughtless at the same time.



Both? It represents pattern of behavior, a life long pattern, which is why I shouldn't be shocked at this point. It's like when we go on vacation. My parents and I take care of the room because we are DVC members and they pay for other things in return. She will do something so thoughtful, plan something fun, get the boys matching clothes, even offer to have DS ride with them on the plane, but then she thinks she and BIL should get the master bedroom. No, my parents get the master because they are the parents.

Do you think she does those things to get the master?
She wants something so she does nice things thinking she'll get what she wants in return?

 

[ilovefh]

Do you think she does those things to get the master?
She wants something so she does nice things thinking she'll get what she wants in return?

Not purposely, no. She doesn't think things out like that. She's very impulsive. Impulsively thoughtful and then impulsively thoughtless.

 

[cabanafrau]

Is she really that thoughtful, or are her thoughtful gestures focused around an ulterior motive that suits her in the end? Your examples look like that to me -- and then they come with strings attached as the kicker. It seems she expects something in return for everything she does. Whether her asks are out of proportion is not for me to say.

IMO talking to her will only open up ugliness and won't solve anything. Perhaps you need to make decisions in regard to her with more forethought, look for the potential for her to open up angles and decide where your limits are upfront.

 

[cabanafrau]

Not purposely, no. She doesn't think things out like that. She's very impulsive. Impulsively thoughtful and then impulsively thoughtless.

But is that really the case? No possibility the matching outfits weren't her way of insuring photo ops she was hoping for, and if she provided them she ended up with the look she wanted with no input? If your son sits with them on the plane and keeps hers entertained doesn't it make her life easier? So much the better if she can cash in on her "thoughtfulness" and get the master bedroom in return. Sounds about as impulsive as a tortoise to me.

 

[klo1335]

If I change and treat her how she treats me I'll be labeled by her and my parents as a jerk

It is like this with my mom and sister. My dad (parents are divorced) gets how she is. Since I am the "oldest" they have different expectation from me. However, with my 2 girls, my mom always says that I treat my oldest different then my youngest. I have called her out on how she is with me and my sister and she denies it I personally don't think I treat my girls any differently. Sure my 8 year old can do things my 4 year old can't but when my 4 year old is 8 she will have the same expectations. Now when they are both grown, I hope I don't treat them different. My sister is 4 years younger then me and has always been told she is the "baby." She never went away to college, she commuted from my mom's, and she lived with my mom right until she got married and her and her husband got an apartment. Like I said before I got over it and don't ask her to do anything for me.

 

[sets14]

Is she really that thoughtful, or are her thoughtful gestures focused around an ulterior motive that suits her in the end? Your examples look like that to me -- and then they come with strings attached as the kicker. It seems she expects something in return for everything she does. Whether her asks are out of proportion is not for me to say.

IMO talking to her will only open up ugliness and won't solve anything. Perhaps you need to make decisions in regard to her with more forethought, look for the potential for her to open up angles and decide where your limits are upfront.

1000x yes to this. When I was teaching, we often talked about "fences that free". Boundaries are your friend and will make life much smoother all around. It won't always be easy to stick to your guns, but the more you do it, the easier it is. I think you and your husband need to really think through your dealings with sister and make a list of non-negotiables in regards to what you will and will not deal with in your relationship with her. It doesn't benefit you and it really doesn't benefit her to give in to her demands and selfishness.

OP, I wish you luck! I know how hard it is to have to change some relationships and how frustrating it is to deal with self absorbed people.

 

[HM]

I think you are a bit delusional about your sister and her motives, given what you've told us.
She seems to be a taker and not a giver. Any giving she has done has not been without forethought about how it should make others feel about her.

You have to either decide just to keep giving with very little get, or change the way you handle her.

Good luck OP. You've got a lot of time to go in your parenting years and it doesn't get much easier than when they are babies and toddlers.

 

[sunshinehighway]

But is that really the case? No possibility the matching outfits weren't her way of insuring photo ops she was hoping for, and if she provided them she ended up with the look she wanted with no input? If your son sits with them on the plane and keeps hers entertained doesn't it make her life easier? So much the better if she can cash in on her "thoughtfulness" and get the master bedroom in return. Sounds about as impulsive as a tortoise to me.

Totally agree.
She's doing that stuff for herself.
What things does she do that she doesn't benefit from?

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Ask her to spend money on something you want to do (movies, dinner, etc) and she will claim that she doesn't have any money to do that. But when it involves something she wants to do, all of a sudden, she will find the money to do it. Not sure if that helped at all but I hope you stop letting her take those cloths for free. Is she your younger sister? My sister is younger and I have found her being the baby lends to how she acts sometimes.

I always thought that was just women vs men in general - guess it works with siblings too

 

[elaine amj]

My solution would be to ask BIL instead of your sister when you want some favor since he has more clue than she does

 

[TaylorEar]

It's a little difficult for me to relate to this situation because I am not somebody who buys in to the whole "they're family!" excuse when it comes to how people treat me. Personally, I would cut this person out of my life and if my parents didn't understand that, oh well! I don't have the time or the energy to deal with a-holes - family or not.

Even though you've said that it wouldn't do any good, that she would turn it around, etc... have you ever actually talked to her about this stuff and just told her how her behavior makes you feel? Even if it does nothing - at least you will know that you gave it an honest try.

If you believe that she truly is unaware of her behavior/thoughtlessness, why don't you just call her out on it, in the moment, EVERY time is happens? Not in a big dramatic way - but a "hey - that feels a little crappy" might go a long way towards making her aware of the fact that she does not exist in vacuum. It sounds like she is able to live her life without any consequences for her actions. Even if the "consequence" is being annoyed when people around her say "ouch! that hurt!", she might get sick enough of the constant feedback (drama/conflict/whatever she wants to view it as) to finally stop and address the issue.

 

[sunshinehighway]

No, they're DS's clothes. She just had her first baby last year. She bought some clothes for DS when he was little and feels like she bought a lot of clothes, but truthfully she lived 1,300 miles away so she had no idea. She likes to tell people she bought 95% of his wardrobe. She is one of those people that has to feel like they are "the best." I don't know how to explain it, but she knows more about raising a toddler, even though she has a 1 year old. She is the one who took care of his needs, even though she was so far away. That type of person. I have written about it in other threads. Things like when DS started to cry when we were leaving a play place she tried to hand off her son to me so she could deal with my son. Things like this happen a lot.

Ironically they make more than we do. Probably double.




Really, it has nothing to do with money. I'm not mad about how much she pays me. It works for us. Even is she paid me double I would still be annoyed. It is about expectations. Her expectation is that she gets to pillage through DS's old stuff while she charges me for things. It's about how she expects that we can always watch her son and then she scoffs when we ask her to watch ours.

I kid you not when I say she called and said "Hey you'll need to watch my son on June 20 and June 27." She did not ask, just told me. Which I don't mind, because if I can't do it, I'll tell her. In fact we have plans to take DS to Monster Jam 2 hours away on one of the days, so I told her no. But she is just not as willing to watch our son.





Both of the above quotes are right. BIL does get it, and gets my sister. The other night when she again tried to claim she bought 95% of DS's clothes he called her on it.

This is part of a life long issue and no one has ever been able to get through to her, so you're right, there will be no light bulb moment. If I change and treat her how she treats me I'll be labeled by her and my parents as a jerk. That's just the way it has been so I chose the high road. And it's part of why DH wants to move back to FL.

To the bolded, I do understand that. It was like that in my family too. My parents always saw how my sister was to a certain extent but they are her parents so they could put up with a lot more and didn't understand where I was coming from. They thought I was overly intolerant of her behavior because I was looking for reasons to make her the bad guy. Eventually she went too far with them also and they now understand I was right about her all along.
Of course things had to get really bad for that to happen and both my mother and I no longer speak to her.
I hope you find a way to solve this so your situation doesn't end up like mine.

 

[undertheradar]

You have to choose if you want to continue this pattern of being taken advantage of, or do you want it to stop. You cannot have it both ways. Looks like you either have to keep doing this and accept that your sister is using you, or end the special treatment and ignore any family wrath. Not an easy choice and nobody can make it for you. Probably time for you and your husband to decide what is best for your family, the one that resides within your home.

 

[luvsJack]

Both? It represents pattern of behavior, a life long pattern, which is why I shouldn't be shocked at this point. It's like when we go on vacation. My parents and I take care of the room because we are DVC members and they pay for other things in return. She will do something so thoughtful, plan something fun, get the boys matching clothes, even offer to have DS ride with them on the plane, but then she thinks she and BIL should get the master bedroom. No, my parents get the master because they are the parents.

Well, here's the way I see it and I can only speak from the experience of me and my siblings. First off, you have to either accept her as she is or walk away. Doesn't sound like you will want to walk away, so, imo, you just have to accept that this is who she is.

And I would do the following:

1. Not change anything about the clothes. This was your choice to always let her have the stuff and it doesn't sound like you really care if she gets them. Why cause problems over something you can't use anymore? Causing her to resent you isn't going to help your resentment toward her.

2. I would simply tell her that you don't want the sleeper. If you have to pay for it, you'll just buy one new. Let her decide what to do next, but don't pay for it. There are lots of second hand stores where you could buy one if a new one is too expensive.Even if she offers you a great "bargain", you will still resent having to pay her anything and that resentment is what you want to avoid.

3. Decide if you really want to continue keeping her child. If you do, then, if it was me, decide what you are spending on formula, diapers and food for him and tell her you are going to either have to charge her that much more or she can provide those things. Just say, "I am sorry but I can't do all this anymore". Even though its not about the money, it will be better if that issue isn't hanging over you and making you resent her.

You can only decide if you want to continue to do things for her, you can't decide how she should act towards you. You have to make the changes tso that YOU feel better about the whole situation. Make it about it how you feel not about how she acts.

 

[ilovefh]

I think you are a bit delusional about your sister and her motives, given what you've told us.
She seems to be a taker and not a giver. Any giving she has done has not been without forethought about how it should make others feel about her.

You have to either decide just to keep giving with very little get, or change the way you handle her.

Good luck OP. You've got a lot of time to go in your parenting years and it doesn't get much easier than when they are babies and toddlers.

You're right, she does have motivation. Unfortunately for her (and my dad, who is just like her), she is a genius surrounded by a sea of idiots. I have never heard her say anything nice about anyone. She makes it her goal to make everyone look like an idiot. The "I bought 95% of his clothes" statement is meant to reflect a meaning of "How would they have clothed him if I didn't buy so much for them? They're lucky I was there." And the "Let me take your tantrum having son and you take mine" is meant to say "look at how much better I am than you at dealing with your son. What would you do without me?"

The comment of "my son will never do that" when referencing something my son has done comes up quite often. Even BIL gets in on it sometimes, saying he'll spank it out of him. He said he'll get it right away and my mom said "or have a very red butt" which we all agreed will be the case. Kids test their boundaries and then they check to make sure you'll be consistent. That's how they work.

I know these things come from very low self esteem and low confidence. She needs to make others look like idiots to make herself feel good. She's always had low self confidence.

Well, here's the way I see it and I can only speak from the experience of me and my siblings. First off, you have to either accept her as she is or walk away. Doesn't sound like you will want to walk away, so, imo, you just have to accept that this is who she is.

And I would do the following:

1. Not change anything about the clothes. This was your choice to always let her have the stuff and it doesn't sound like you really care if she gets them. Why cause problems over something you can't use anymore? Causing her to resent you isn't going to help your resentment toward her.

2. I would simply tell her that you don't want the sleeper. If you have to pay for it, you'll just buy one new. Let her decide what to do next, but don't pay for it. There are lots of second hand stores where you could buy one if a new one is too expensive.Even if she offers you a great "bargain", you will still resent having to pay her anything and that resentment is what you want to avoid.

3. Decide if you really want to continue keeping her child. If you do, then, if it was me, decide what you are spending on formula, diapers and food for him and tell her you are going to either have to charge her that much more or she can provide those things. Just say, "I am sorry but I can't do all this anymore". Even though its not about the money, it will be better if that issue isn't hanging over you and making you resent her.

You can only decide if you want to continue to do things for her, you can't decide how she should act towards you. You have to make the changes tso that YOU feel better about the whole situation. Make it about it how you feel not about how she acts.

Your post is pretty spot on. That's actually what I did about the sleeper. She asked me for money and I reminded her about all the clothes. She of course replied with "I bought 95% of those" and I just said never mind, I don't want it.

Keeping her son is a moot point right now. We have less than 4 weeks of school left and after that we'll switch off for the summer. We both supervise a summer camp part time. The 2 days I work she has both boys, the 2 days she works I take both boys and the one day we work together my mom will take both. No money changes hands. She feeds my son, I feed hers. I provide diapers for her son and she provides for mine. (He's pretty delayed so he's still working on the whole potty thing.)

I do, for the most part, accept her behavior and don't allow it to bug me, especially because this is something I've dealt with forever. For example when she offered to have my son sit with her, BIL and nephew on the plane I took the offer. I figured who cares why she wanted to, I could sit back and relax for the 3 hour ride while they dealt with a 3 year old in a car seat and a 10 month old lap baby! Look for the positive, right? And when BIL took DS out of his car seat, because he looked uncomfortable, and then wouldn't go back in I said "Sorry, not much I can do from the window seat of another row on a full plane."

I do agree with DH though, it was easier to deal with her from 1,300 miles away.

 

[nugov2]

I wouldn't get into old stuff now. She showed you who she is so accept it. For the upcoming year when she asks you to do Friday or any other time, it is easy. No. I'm not saying never help, but don't be her doormat. You are not being appreciated b/c you don't make her. If it is too easy, then it makes it difficult to see how valuable you are. If you say something she will deny it, get defensive or angry and it will cause a divide. If she realized what you do for her and how helpful it is she wouldn't have made the comments she has and you won't change that by just telling her. If you start only helping when you want to instead of because you feel like you should she will see the reality of how important what you are doing is to her.

 

[ilovefh]

I wouldn't get into old stuff now. She showed you who she is so accept it. For the upcoming year when she asks you to do Friday or any other time, it is easy. No. I'm not saying never help, but don't be her doormat. You are not being appreciated b/c you don't make her. If it is too easy, then it makes it difficult to see how valuable you are. If you say something she will deny it, get defensive or angry and it will cause a divide. If she realized what you do for her and how helpful it is she wouldn't have made the comments she has and you won't change that by just telling her. If you start only helping when you want to instead of because you feel like you should she will see the reality of how important what you are doing is to her.

DH and I have already discussed what we'll say about Fridays. We decided to handle it on a week by week basis. While I don't mind watching him all week and honestly it works out nicely and I wouldn't want to watch other kids, I don't want to have to plan my Friday's around getting him by 5 and then staying around until BIL gets home between 5:30 and 6.