Family dog issues, wwyd?

[DisneyOma]

I have a friend who is so attached to her dog that she purchased all the service dog crap out there, got a fake training certificate, and pretends he's a service dog so he could fly in the cabin with her on vacations. he is barely basic trained, IMO.

Now, my grandpuppy - I'd pay extra for him to fly here for the holidays, but he's small enough to fit under the seat and will fly with DIL. I'm reminding myself that I must greet daughter and DIL properly before I roll around on the floor with the pup. But I would not think to take him to someone else's house without asking first!

 

[mom2grace]

I have a friend who is so attached to her dog that she purchased all the service dog crap out there, got a fake training certificate, and pretends he's a service dog so he could fly in the cabin with her on vacations. he is barely basic trained, IMO.

I could see SM doing this.

 

[AtlantaDisneyDreamer]

The people who think their dogs are on the same level as people and must be allowed to accompany them everywhere are nuts. If you think that way, YOU host the family dinners and let people decide whether to accept or not. But if you are invited to someone else's home, it does not mean your dog is automatically welcome. If I'd been at the gathering above, with all those dogs, I'd have just given up and walked out, driven to Cracker Barrel and called it a day.

Pets are not children. Period. There is no comparison.

You illustrate my point exactly. You don't think of pets as children. That is fine.

Some people, however, do. Denying that does not change a thing.

My point is that we all have to realize that not everyone thinks like we do. It is a lot easier to handle issues like the OP has when we understand and accept differing views on such things.

We have kids. Our kids are more important to us than anything in the world, including our dogs.

I have known people who do not have children who think of their dogs as children. Calling those people "stupid" or "nuts" or denying that they exist doesn't change the fact that they do exist -and some people who have posted here obviously have them in their family.

It isn't for you or anyone else to tell people what or whom should be important to them. If the dog is important to the OP's SM, then the OP's acceptance of that will go a long way toward happy holidays for all.

It seems like the OP and her sister have reached a solution with their SM. That is awesome. OP, I hope you have a wonderful Christmas and that this issue does not overshadow this very special time.

 

[North of Mouse]

You illustrate my point exactly. You don't think of pets as children. That is fine.

Some people, however, do. Denying that does not change a thing.
My point is that we all have to realize that not everyone thinks like we do.

It isn't for you or anyone else to tell people what or whom should be important to them.

You are so correct. 'Everyone' has the right to how they feel, 'but' anyone's rights ends when it impacts the 'rights' of others - ie. what 'any' of us decide what we do in our own homes. Some 'pet' owners tend to forget that their rights (in their homes) and other's rights (in their homes) are equal - each is 'king' of their own castle and can set their own rules. I respect theirs in their home - they respect mine!

 

[EMom]

Dogs are dogs. You may think of them as your children, but that is your issue and others may not share it. Lest you think I don't love pets, I do. I just spent a few thousand dollars in two months on one of mine because of a heart ailment which will shorten his life. But now that it is being treated, his quality of life is good, it will just not be as long as normal. Many people would have just euthanized him when the crisis hit, but he is family to us, so we found the money, will sacrifice something else and paid for his treatment. Pets are valued highly in our family. Just a hair under my child. But I don't confuse them with my child.

Even when it comes to my CHILD, I never took her everywhere. Take weddings, for example. If she wasn't on the invitation, I would have never taken her along. God knows I wouldn't have brought a dog. Some people say they'd stay away from a wedding if their child wasn't invited, and here's the enormous difference. There is some remote chance, albeit slight, that if your 7 year old Susie is not invited to her Cousin Emily's wedding, Susie will actually remember it for years and say, "I still can't believe Emily didn't invite me to her wedding. That really hurt me." YOUR DOG WILL NEVER THINK THAT! Your dog will never grieve over not being invited to Thanksgiving at your MIL's, Christmas at your DIL's or the 4th of July at your cousin's. Because it's a DOG.

So while I can understand that some people feel their dogs are their children and deserve to go every dang where, they need to respect that not everyone feels the same way and some people just consider them dogs who can stay home. If someone gives me an ultimatum that they will not attend if their dog cannot also attend, then yes, they fall into the "nut" category and I will have to tell them we'll miss them this year. If you cannot bear to be away from our dog for a few hours and are willing to forego seeing family because of this issue, you have a serious problem and need to seek professional help.

 

[tzolkin]

I do have children. Two of them. And when children aren't invited, we usually don't go. That is how I can understand if the OP's SM decides not to accept the invitation if the dogs are not invited.

I did not mean to say that everyone has a responsibility to accept other people's dogs. I don't feel that way at all. I just think that people have to understand that if they limit which family members are invited and which ones aren't, then the hosts have to understand when none of the family shows up.


I agree with you that we all have to be thoughtful. I include all of my family's family when I invite people to my home, including their dogs. On the other hand, I also agree that people with dogs should realize that not all people think of them as family. Therefore, we never imposed our dogs on anyone.

I think we just all need to consider how others feel and be open and willing to accept the consequences of our own choices. If the OP does not want dogs at her home, she has every right to ask people not to bring them. I just think she has to be willing to accept a declination of her invitation if she limits who is invited.

Reading your previous post, I had a different impression but I think we actually believe the same thing.

The OP really isn't bothered by dogs, she's bothered by the behavior. She should express clearly that certain behaviors are not acceptable in her home. It is then the SM's choice whether she wants to comply with the OP's house rules or not participate at all. I'm sure it would be unfortunate if SM missed out on the family gatherings, but it would probably be more pleasant for everyone else than dealing with the stress of her and her dog's poor behavior.


And, my comments about having children were not meant to imply that people whose dogs are their "children" are some crazy weirdos. I have plenty in my circle of friends and family whom I love and respect. There are a few, however, who have certain beliefs about being a human parent that are inaccurate that they try to carry over into their dog parenting. For example, in my post above I asked because some people genuinely don't know that human children are not welcome everywhere so they believe that their dog should be allowed everywhere as well. But that's simply not the case. Children are often excluded when their behavior or presence would be an issue for that particular event. The same goes for dogs (and even certain adults whose behavior is unpredictable).

 

[SparklePixie]

You illustrate my point exactly. You don't think of pets as children. That is fine.

Some people, however, do. Denying that does not change a thing.

My point is that we all have to realize that not everyone thinks like we do. It is a lot easier to handle issues like the OP has when we understand and accept differing views on such things.

We have kids. Our kids are more important to us than anything in the world, including our dogs.

I have known people who do not have children who think of their dogs as children. Calling those people "stupid" or "nuts" or denying that they exist doesn't change the fact that they do exist -and some people who have posted here obviously have them in their family.

It isn't for you or anyone else to tell people what or whom should be important to them. If the dog is important to the OP's SM, then the OP's acceptance of that will go a long way toward happy holidays for all.

It seems like the OP and her sister have reached a solution with their SM. That is awesome. OP, I hope you have a wonderful Christmas and that this issue does not overshadow this very special time.

I don't know how much simpler I can say it. Dogs are not children. Period. I don't care if some people believe having a pet is the same as having a child. To even make the comparison is laughable.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

I don't know how much simpler I can say it. Dogs are not children. Period. I don't care if some people believe having a pet is the same as having a child. To even make the comparison is laughable.

I pretty much agree.

I love my dog, he is a part of our family, but it really is nothing compared to my kids. If something were to happen to him it would be heartbreaking... My kids? SOUL CRUSHING.

Some animals are very difficult to care for though and I also understand that. It's a voluntary responsibility IMO though.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

And as others have said I would have no issue telling SM that the dog isn't welcome.

We don't allow doggie visitors in my home either. My dog is dog/dog aggressive. He's a jerk, but this is his home just like it's mine and we won't be made uncomfortable.

 

[threecrazykids]

Dogs are dogs. You may think of them as your children, but that is your issue and others may not share it. Lest you think I don't love pets, I do. I just spent a few thousand dollars in two months on one of mine because of a heart ailment which will shorten his life. But now that it is being treated, his quality of life is good, it will just not be as long as normal. Many people would have just euthanized him when the crisis hit, but he is family to us, so we found the money, will sacrifice something else and paid for his treatment. Pets are valued highly in our family. Just a hair under my child. But I don't confuse them with my child.

Even when it comes to my CHILD, I never took her everywhere. Take weddings, for example. If she wasn't on the invitation, I would have never taken her along. God knows I wouldn't have brought a dog. Some people say they'd stay away from a wedding if their child wasn't invited, and here's the enormous difference. There is some remote chance, albeit slight, that if your 7 year old Susie is not invited to her Cousin Emily's wedding, Susie will actually remember it for years and say, "I still can't believe Emily didn't invite me to her wedding. That really hurt me." YOUR DOG WILL NEVER THINK THAT! Your dog will never grieve over not being invited to Thanksgiving at your MIL's, Christmas at your DIL's or the 4th of July at your cousin's. Because it's a DOG.

So while I can understand that some people feel their dogs are their children and deserve to go every dang where, they need to respect that not everyone feels the same way and some people just consider them dogs who can stay home. If someone gives me an ultimatum that they will not attend if their dog cannot also attend, then yes, they fall into the "nut" category and I will have to tell them we'll miss them this year. If you cannot bear to be away from our dog for a few hours and are willing to forego seeing family because of this issue, you have a serious problem and need to seek professional help.

How dare you assume to know what a dog thinks, or feels! What...are you the dog whisperer? Have you ever sat down with your dog's therapist (like I have) and listened to him tell you how soul crushing it was that he had to miss Emily's wedding? Our pet therapist informed me he was perfectly ok missing out on the 4th of July because the firecrackers were scary, but the year that Tuffy got to go to Grandma's house and he didn't? Still upset over it and it's going to cost us a TON to work through that one.

Oh I kid, I kid...

Dogs are very forgiving - I think that's what us humans forget sometimes. They aren't wired to hold a grudge against someone who treats them well. And who knows, maybe they have big parties and do all sorts of crazy things when you're gone! Or maybe they ENJOY the peace and quiet of a long afternoon nap after a special Christmas meal...I know I sure do!

 

[luvsJack]

I don't know how much simpler I can say it. Dogs are not children. Period. I don't care if some people believe having a pet is the same as having a child. To even make the comparison is laughable.

And you are still not getting it. TO YOU dogs are not children, to others yes, they are.

NOT to me. We have 3 dogs that I love dearly but they are not my children. They are pets.

I have a girl that worked for me that will never have children (she is in her 20's) unless she decides to adopt but for some reason she doesn't feel that is an option. She had a small dog that died recently. She has mourned that dog very much much like a parent mourns a child. She posts on FB daily with pictures of that dog, memories of the dog, etc. That dog was/is her child. Whether YOU see it that way or I see it that way doesn't matter, its how SHE feels and how SHE views the dog.

Older people who have raised their children and no longer feel "needed" tend to do this a lot. They honestly view that dog or cat as one of their children. But again, its not about how much you think something is laughable, its how they feel about the animal.

None of this is said to make the OP feel she needs to accept the dog into her home. But, I could see approaching it in the same way I might approach someone about their child's behavior.

 

[mom2grace]

None of this is said to make the OP feel she needs to accept the dog into her home. But, I could see approaching it in the same way I might approach someone about their child's behavior.

We have discussed the dog's behavior and lack there of with my dad and SM in general terms over the past 6 months. The dog is out of control at it's own home as well. They went to training, but SM didn't do any follow through at home. I think they went to 2 different programs, I know one used a clicker. The dog is not trained.

I'm not asking for much, a simple down and sit would be enough for me. We have the same breed of dog and know how easy it is to train this breed. My 9 year old did the bulk of our training.

There is nothing we can do about the dog's behavior. SM is not going to tell the dog 'no'.

Yes, I don't let my children jump on their furniture, tear up their stuff, leave messes, etc.

 

[luvsJack]

OP, you have every right to say you don't want the dog in your house. You have more than tried.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think anyone, regardless of how they feel about their dog, should push their animal off on you. I just realize that for many, many people its not "just a dog".

 

[EMom]

And you are still not getting it. TO YOU dogs are not children, to others yes, they are.

NOT to me. We have 3 dogs that I love dearly but they are not my children. They are pets.

I have a girl that worked for me that will never have children (she is in her 20's) unless she decides to adopt but for some reason she doesn't feel that is an option. She had a small dog that died recently. She has mourned that dog very much much like a parent mourns a child. She posts on FB daily with pictures of that dog, memories of the dog, etc. That dog was/is her child. Whether YOU see it that way or I see it that way doesn't matter, its how SHE feels and how SHE views the dog.

Older people who have raised their children and no longer feel "needed" tend to do this a lot. They honestly view that dog or cat as one of their children. But again, its not about how much you think something is laughable, its how they feel about the animal.

None of this is said to make the OP feel she needs to accept the dog into her home. But, I could see approaching it in the same way I might approach someone about their child's behavior.

I think I get it just fine. Some people perceive their dogs to be their children. Okay. Now if they love their dogs as much as they would love a child, that impacts me not at all. But when they want to bring that dog (not an actual human child) to a party, a non-pet friendly hotel or restaurant, etc. it does impact me and I refuse to feed their delusion any longer. Because a dog is NOT a human child.

There is a difference between loving a pet as if it was a child and actually treating it/acting as if it was a child and expecting others to do the same. One borders on mental illness. You say how we see the dog doesn't matter and that only how the owner sees the dog matters. I disagree. I say our opinion matters plenty. There has been a trend over the past decade especially for more and more people to do this sort of thing. (bring pet to a party when pet is not welcome, pretend pet is service animal so pet can get into restaurant or hotel) It will get worse before it gets better. For my part, I won't go along with it. I have said this before. I long for the days when dogs were dogs and people were people and we all had enough sense to be able to tell the difference.

 

[mom2grace]

i don't think that SM thinks of the dog as her child. The dog is the most important thing in her life and she can't be away from the dog. And that to her, the dog can't be away from SM, it's too traumatic for the dog to be left alone.

 

[mom2grace]

expecting others to do the same.

This is the problem with SM. And it's tricky since we have exactly the same breed of dog and she loves our dog so much she wanted one. My sister does not have any pets and her husband is vocally anti-dog. They have willingly (we would use a kennel) kept our dog twice in 2 years. And that makes it even more complicated.

Except that the dog is out of control. That part is easy, even the 6 year old who is DYING for a dog doesn't want SM's dog around.

And I do think that we have been saying for several months to dad and SM that the behaviors are becoming a problem, so it's not like this is out of the blue. A few months ago my sister's husband told SM that he didn't like her dog and she didn't believe him. The next time I saw SM she said, BIL said he doesn't like dog. That can't be true. I confirmed that it was. She still didn't believe it.

 

[SparklePixie]

And you are still not getting it. TO YOU dogs are not children, to others yes, they are.

NOT to me. We have 3 dogs that I love dearly but they are not my children. They are pets.

I have a girl that worked for me that will never have children (she is in her 20's) unless she decides to adopt but for some reason she doesn't feel that is an option. She had a small dog that died recently. She has mourned that dog very much much like a parent mourns a child. She posts on FB daily with pictures of that dog, memories of the dog, etc. That dog was/is her child. Whether YOU see it that way or I see it that way doesn't matter, its how SHE feels and how SHE views the dog.

Older people who have raised their children and no longer feel "needed" tend to do this a lot. They honestly view that dog or cat as one of their children. But again, its not about how much you think something is laughable, its how they feel about the animal.

None of this is said to make the OP feel she needs to accept the dog into her home. But, I could see approaching it in the same way I might approach someone about their child's behavior.

I get it fine, thank you very much. I just refuse to buy into that way of thinking. YMMV

 

[SparklePixie]

I think I get it just fine. Some people perceive their dogs to be their children. Okay. Now if they love their dogs as much as they would love a child, that impacts me not at all. But when they want to bring that dog (not an actual human child) to a party, a non-pet friendly hotel or restaurant, etc. it does impact me and I refuse to feed their delusion any longer. Because a dog is NOT a human child.

There is a difference between loving a pet as if it was a child and actually treating it/acting as if it was a child and expecting others to do the same. One borders on mental illness. You say how we see the dog doesn't matter and that only how the owner sees the dog matters. I disagree. I say our opinion matters plenty. There has been a trend over the past decade especially for more and more people to do this sort of thing. (bring pet to a party when pet is not welcome, pretend pet is service animal so pet can get into restaurant or hotel) It will get worse before it gets better. For my part, I won't go along with it. I have said this before. I long for the days when dogs were dogs and people were people and we all had enough sense to be able to tell the difference.

Sorry, I posted before I saw this reply.

 

[EMom]

Is your SM like my aunt? Aunt's DD summed it up once like this: "That dog is like her baby. She loves it like a child. And she won't discipline it or train it at all. She equates training with 'being mean.' If you make it mind, you are being mean to it and God forbid you do that. So it's just the most ill behaved dog I've ever seen and she's completely to blame. I don't know why she thinks disciplining is being mean. Heaven knows she did it to me enough."

It boiled down to that. Training the dog and making it mind was as bad as being mean to it in her mind. She never put it into those words, but when you broke it down, that was it.

 

[mom2grace]

Is your SM like my aunt? Aunt's DD summed it up once like this: "That dog is like her baby. She loves it like a child. And she won't discipline it or train it at all. She equates training with 'being mean.' If you make it mind, you are being mean to it and God forbid you do that. So it's just the most ill behaved dog I've ever seen and she's completely to blame. I don't know why she thinks disciplining is being mean. Heaven knows she did it to me enough."

It boiled down to that. Training the dog and making it mind was as bad as being mean to it in her mind. She never put it into those words, but when you broke it down, that was it.

Yes, and I didn't know SM until I was an adult and her children were adults. Based on their life trajectories, I don't think that she disciplined her children either. One child is a disaster, one is very successful and has very little to do with SM. This child loves her but lives across the country and interacts very little. I don't know the disaster child. (They are both middle aged)