Factoring in School and Kids for your DVC decisions

[AvidDisReader]

Times certainly have changed. When my kids where in grade school in the 1980's, we every three years or so we would take the kids out during Thanksgiving week and there was no issue until---They hit highschool. Then missing 3 days of school became too much to make up and we stopped. Now, we take our grand kids, and if they miss even one day for a Disney Holiday, my kids get called into the Principal Office and get stern lectures about how going on vacations during the school year is unacceptable. So, not wanting to cause any problems, we pay close attention to the school year calendars before scheduling trips with the grand kids.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

For some insight I called my mom as she was a teacher for 35 years. Asked what she thought about us being "those parents" that have their kids out of school a week or 2 each year. She gave it a seal of approval and shared some ideas about how she would always make our trips educational when I was a kid.

I was half joking in my post above, but my family is full of educators and they all agree that missing some school is not really that big of a deal in the long run. I'm not suggesting to become snowbirds in Florida for 3 months of the year. But 4 or 5 missed days in a year shouldn't be that big of a deal. Life is about balance. Your kids will not become failures because you prioritize a little bit of family time over a science project. Taking a break from the real world is healthy for everyone. Spending vacation time with loved ones while they are still healthy is important. Perhaps there is a bit of cultural difference because unlike in the US, here in Canada employer paid vacation time is mandatory by law. It's important for kids to take a break from the pressures of school, and extra curriculars. 14 year olds are still kids. Let them be kids. Putting so much pressure on kids where they can't take a break without cracking is not healthy.

Another point that I haven't seen mentioned is that there are some soft skills to be developed when playing "catchup". There are plenty of days at work where I have meetings, or other things that take me away from my day to day job for a few days. It's important to be able to learn how to adapt. It's important to be able to learn how to learn on your own. Too many adults don't know how to do this.

Having said that, if it is reasonable to travel during school breaks, that makes it easier for everyone. For myself, because my wife is an educator, we can only travel during the summer months, so that is what my kids will do.

 

[lovin'fl]

Times certainly have changed. When my kids where in grade school in the 1980's, we every three years or so we would take the kids out during Thanksgiving week and there was no issue until---They hit highschool. Then missing 3 days of school became too much to make up and we stopped. Now, we take our grand kids, and if they miss even one day for a Disney Holiday, my kids get called into the Principal Office and get stern lectures about how going on vacations during the school year is unacceptable. So, not wanting to cause any problems, we pay close attention to the school year calendars before scheduling trips with the grand kids.

We always got some flack too when we took our kids out...in MD public schools. The one year (I mentioned in previous post) we had them miss 1 day before a 2 day winter break a teacher told my DD (age 12, who was an honor roll student and hadn't missed any other days and was NEVER in trouble for anything) that she'd get a failing grade for assignment that day that she would miss and it would bring her grade from an A to a B. It made me change our flights to a later flight so DD could attend this class (it was a half day we planned to miss and fly at like 9am but then changed to later flight so they could go for part of that half day). Cost me about $200 to change plus the snow flurries started as we were on runway. Man, I would have really been mad if that flight got delayed or cancelled because we could have been on earlier flight. DH's family is all teachers in MD too. And they are half and half with how they feel about missing school for trips.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

We always got some flack too when we took our kids out...in MD public schools. The one year (I mentioned in previous post) we had them miss 1 day before a 2 day winter break a teacher told my DD (age 12, who was an honor roll student and hadn't missed any other days and was NEVER in trouble for anything) that she'd get a failing grade for assignment that day that she would miss and it would bring her grade from an A to a B. It made me change our flights to a later flight so DD could attend this class (wanna say it was a half day we planned to miss and fly at like 9am but then changed to later flight so they could go for part of the half day). Cost me about $200 to change plus the snow flurries started as we were on runway. Man, I would have really been mad if that flight got delayed or cancelled because we could have been on earlier flight. DH's family is all teachers in MD too. And they are half and half with how they feel about missing school for trips.

Sometimes people need to try and justify their jobs......

 

[TexasChick123]

You really need to ask some friends with older kids who attend the school where you plan on sending your kids. Every school district or private school is different, and these friends need to let you know how the school handles unexcused absences. If we take our kids out for more than 3 days for vacation in their current school district, then we get a letter from the state as well as get brought into the principal's office where we have to have a meeting about it. I'm not joking. I am fortunate that my kids are smart, but even in kinder and more so in 2nd grade, there is a lot of material covered in a week now. It's a lot of work to catch up on. We try not to take our kids out for more than 2 days at a time for vacation and tack it onto other vacation times. It's not the same as when we were kids, that's for sure.

Some times of the year you can consider traveling which are busy but not as busy as major holidays like the week between Christmas and NY:

- Columbus Day
- MLK Day
- the days after New Year's
- spring break if it isn't over Easter
- SUMMER!!!

We get off days for these vacations with our school district, so we will tack on a day or so if need be. Also, find out your school's official attendance taking time if they will be in public school. This is important! The school gets money from the state based on whether your student is present during the official attendance time. If the official time is 9:30am, then even if you take your kid out at 10am, they are marked present for the day, and the school simply keeps track of the missed hours in their records, but it doesn't affect funding. It's a big deal. I know this is how they do it in Texas and am making a big assumption that it is the same elsewhere.

 

[crisi]

When my kids were in elementary school (they are in college now) we could pull them for three days and get a week - due to a school break. But by middle school, pulling them for three days, even at the start of the year, was impossible. They missed far too much - and the school didn't have resources to play catch up. School policy was grades and tests missed for vacation couldn't be made up. Giving makeup work in advance was at teachers discretion - and most didn't - it is a lot of work to create work packets for kids. Late work gets 0. When my kids were sick one year a lot we got visited by social services - they'd missed enough school for a mandatory check.

By high school we couldn't even get the family together for the Summer - athletics and drama, camp and jobs.....

And yes, it does depend on your aspirations for your kid. My son barely made it through high school - he got a little lost - and several of his friends didn't. With a few missed tests due to vacation, that really could have been the tipping point. (After a couple gap years, he's in trade school). My daughter got into her first choice school, a pretty selective one.....but again, a few points off her GPA and she wouldn't have made the cut - and she picked that school as a Freshman in high school - it would have been heartbreaking (and it has been an excellent fit for her). When my son was in school and before he decided to try and fail out, he played varsity sports - you don't make the team if you can't commit to every practice and game. And the sports kept him trying for two years past when he had really sort of given up. For my daughter, it was drama - again, if you can't commit, you don't get cast. If you say you can commit and you don't show up for practice - for either drama or sports - you don't make the team/cast again.

Middle school and high school move much faster for much higher stakes than they used to. College admittance is much more competitive - schools that were a cakewalk to get into when I was in high school have a less than 50% admittance rate. At the same time, the expectations to pass have increased - I know a bunch of people whose kids barely graduated or didn't graduate because they struggled through Algebra II - which is required in a lot of states for graduation. Scholarships are really competitive. Spots on sports teams or on stage - even in choir and marching band - are competitive. And schools pay a lot more attention to kids whose attendance is erratic - state law may have CPS showing up at your door.

 

[Soap_1984]

I wandered in here and I am surprised at some of what I have read. I'm a new parent I just assumed I'd take my son out for a week or so here and there for vacation. I'm in Canada so it may be a lot more stringent in some states in the US, I missed a ton of school for vacations and illness and had no issue at all being "behind" etc. Maybe the curriculum has become more intense.

 

[crisi]

Yes- this it is exactly! It gets to be beyond lessons and classwork, but other things too. The beginning of the school year is when there are orientation nights, back to school nights, tryouts and signups for things, etc. I know this is hard to imagine but your child may not want to miss school and may actually express disinterest in going to Disney if it means missing out on school things. Even the spring break is not a guarantee, sports teams, and clubs like Drama and Scouts still have practices or meets. You will have to take it year by year and see what he ends up getting involved in. It gets harder to take kids out of school honestly after 4th or 5th grade. Try mid June when school ends or August.

For our district, Spring Break was trip time. The baseball team did Spring Training in Florida. The Theatre kids went to NYC or London or Chicago. French students went to Paris, Spanish students to Madrid. Band and choir kids had trips.....some kids had to pick which trip to take each year.

 

[TexasChick123]

We don’t take as many trips on the weekends anymore because of sports, and my kids are young. We aren’t even the super intense sports parents, but the teams are counting on you being there, so you’re there. We try not to miss more than one game per season, and these are club sports. When I was in sports in high school, I couldn’t miss because of vacation. The only reason to miss was illness or a death in the family, and that was in the very early 2000’s.

 

[CJGamer]

I have never taken my kids out of school for more than 1 day for any trip that was "fun". Our kids are 20, 14, and 9.
That said- we go to Dis every other year for 10-12 years- literally the day school ends. This year that is June 11-22. We find that first week is relatively low crowds, and by the end of the trip crowds have picked up. That said- there is really no "down crowd time" at disney. Lower yes, but not down.

I've also been a coach for a long time at everything from the low elementary level up to the high school level. The period from december 22- January 1st is a time that a lot of parents take kids away. It's also a big time for extra practices and tournaments. When we were kids it didn't matter much. Sadly, today it does. It might not to us right now, but to our kid who gets passed over for a team spot the next year because he missed 10 days of practice or a tournament the previous year- it's an issue. Like it or not- it's there. The same things hold true for the second half of the summer. Junior high and High school coaches expect every kid there from mid july on in our district.....we are even told a year ahead to plan for it. So- in your case plan for it now. I know we are free to always plan vacations from the 2nd week of june until the week after 4th of july for the whole family. We actually do other stuff more spontaneously- but for big ones- that's it.

I know School Performance Bands have crazy schedules now too- worse than the sports. Same with Cheer. It's not just school- it's the extras that determine when you can travel- weather we like it or not.

 

[AnnaS]

My opinion only.

I took my son out once when he was in kindergarten. I had another 3 yr. old son then. I never took them out again. (3 kids). For me, school first.

We traveled end of school year (last week of June), first week of July but what worked best for us for many years was the end of August/the week before school started. As they got older, I could not take a chance in the middle of the summer. We always worried about summer school, Regents exams, Cheerleading camp, etc. It was hot and humid but we managed for many years.

Doesn't NJ have "Jersey week" (first week of November or something). Don't know much about it and if it is as busy as Easter week and President's week.

We have not followed a school schedule for many years now - many vacations are with my grown kids/grandchildren. It is now only a matter of time before I might have to give in and follow a school schedule if we want to vacation again with our grandchildren. We are going down in less than two weeks and it will be the last for one son - who has now three kids - eldest in Kindergarten. She is only missing three days. But moving forward - no more trips for them during the school year. He is also a DVC member as well as my other son.

Everyone has their own opinion and reasons. You will have to see what works best for you, the child and the school. Good luck with your decision.

 

[Madame]

I wandered in here and I am surprised at some of what I have read. I'm a new parent I just assumed I'd take my son out for a week or so here and there for vacation. I'm in Canada so it may be a lot more stringent in some states in the US, I missed a ton of school for vacations and illness and had no issue at all being "behind" etc. Maybe the curriculum has become more intense.

At the high school level in Ontario there used to be a mandatory minimum of hours - miss too many classes and your credit is forfeit. Now there is no mandatory minimum. This was done to increase pass rates.... It is now possible (and happens more than you'd think) to miss 50 plus days of a SEMESTER and still earn a credit....

 

[CanadaDisney05]

I wandered in here and I am surprised at some of what I have read. I'm a new parent I just assumed I'd take my son out for a week or so here and there for vacation. I'm in Canada so it may be a lot more stringent in some states in the US, I missed a ton of school for vacations and illness and had no issue at all being "behind" etc. Maybe the curriculum has become more intense.

I'm usually well aware of many of the cultural differences between Canada and the US, but this thread is opening up a few more to me.. I'm not that old, but I don't recall getting into University to be that difficult. If you really want to get in, you can find a way. School sports are also really not viewed the same way culturally. I mentioned it a in a previous post, but in many US States (possibly all), employer's are not required by law to provide paid vacation. I think these are all factors that influence opinions, and where your seeing some differing opinions. Neither is right or wrong.

 

[Soap_1984]

It doesn't even necessarily sound like it is opinion but it's mandated that kids attend a certain amount of time irrespective of their performance. I will worry about it when my son is older, but it is obvious even without this thread that high school sports in the states are viewed much differently in terms of commitment.

 

[SecondEventuality]

You guys have been so very helpful, thank you so much. We really had no idea. When we grew up in the 1980's, things were MUCH different. We had a feeling that we couldn't pull him out but I just wanted to see, just in case. So summertime, it is!

 

[crisi]

I'm usually well aware of many of the cultural differences between Canada and the US, but this thread is opening up a few more to me.. I'm not that old, but I don't recall getting into University to be that difficult. If you really want to get in, you can find a way. School sports are also really not viewed the same way culturally. I mentioned it a in a previous post, but in many US States (possibly all), employer's are not required by law to provide paid vacation. I think these are all factors that influence opinions, and where your seeing some differing opinions. Neither is right or wrong.

There are plenty of colleges in the U.S. that have 90%+ acceptance rates.....but they also don't tend to be first choice colleges. Flagship Universities in most states are difficult to get into, but the state college system is often easier. Private colleges you have heard of with good or great reputations - or ones that are good values - are difficult to get into - but there are hundreds more that are either not very good values or don't have good reputations - often both. If you want your kid to have lots of choices - and I'm not talking Ivy League - just a lot of choice - its competitive. If you are hoping to make it cheaper through merit grants - its very competitive. Having good grades, test scores and activities is important.

 

[crisi]

It doesn't even necessarily sound like it is opinion but it's mandated that kids attend a certain amount of time irrespective of their performance. I will worry about it when my son is older, but it is obvious even without this thread that high school sports in the states are viewed much differently in terms of commitment.

There were 17 spots on my son's 9th grade baseball team. Sixty kids tried out. Which ones is a coach going to take? When 10th grade rolls around, fewer kids will try out, but it will still be more than there are spots on the team. If you had a kid who didn't come to practice or missed games, its far more fair to take the kid who will show up. When schools are big, and sports teams have a small number of slots, there are choices to be made. Same with drama - there are eight parts - and 100 kids auditioning.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

There were 17 spots on my son's 9th grade baseball team. Sixty kids tried out. Which ones is a coach going to take? When 10th grade rolls around, fewer kids will try out, but it will still be more than there are spots on the team. If you had a kid who didn't come to practice or missed games, its far more fair to take the kid who will show up. When schools are big, and sports teams have a small number of slots, there are choices to be made. Same with drama - there are eight parts - and 100 kids auditioning.

I think what @Soap_1984 is saying is that in Canada we don't put the same kind of emphasis on school sports. Nobody shows up to high school football games other than the parents of the players. We don't even have school hockey or baseball teams for the most part. In general, the more competitive levels of athletics are done at the club level. I'm a sports fan, and I don't even know who the best Canadian University Football Teams are. I'd be surprised if they even got more than 1,000 "fans" out for a game.

Outside of a handful of niche University programs, I don't think in Canada the competition to get into Universities are that fierce either. They literally just look at grades and have a cutoff point. If you don't get in, you can usually go and work for a year and come back as a "mature student" the following year and basically get in (provided you have the prerequisites). Which school you attend isn't even really seen to be that big of a deal either, at least not for your bachelor's degree. Once you get into graduate studies, things change a bit. But by that point, your no longer the one pulling your kids out of school for a trip to Disney.

 

[crisi]

No one ever went to baseball games except for the parents and the girlfriends of the players. That doesn't stop 60 kids from trying out. But if you want to play baseball at 16, its high school or pretty much nothing when the high schools are playing.

As for competitive:

McGill University: 41.7% acceptance rate

University of British Columbia: 52.4% acceptance rate

Queen’s University: 42% acceptance rate

McMaster University: 58.7% acceptance rate

University of Waterloo: 52% acceptance rate

University of Montreal: 57% acceptance rate

University of Toronto: 40% acceptance rate

Like in the U.S., if you just want to get into University, you can find somewhere to go. If you want your kid to get into McGill, that's competitive. It isn't as competitive as Harvard (6% or so), but the University of Minnesota is 44%.

 

[CanadaDisney05]

No one ever went to baseball games except for the parents and the girlfriends of the players. That doesn't stop 60 kids from trying out. But if you want to play baseball at 16, its high school or pretty much nothing when the high schools are playing.

As for competitive:

McGill University: 41.7% acceptance rate

University of British Columbia: 52.4% acceptance rate

Queen’s University: 42% acceptance rate

McMaster University: 58.7% acceptance rate

University of Waterloo: 52% acceptance rate

University of Montreal: 57% acceptance rate

University of Toronto: 40% acceptance rate

Like in the U.S., if you just want to get into University, you can find somewhere to go. If you want your kid to get into McGill, that's competitive. It isn't as competitive as Harvard (6% or so), but the University of Minnesota is 44%.

Not sure where those stats are coming from, but in general a near 50% acceptance rate isn't really what I would consider "ultra competitive". You basically need grades above 70 - 80% to qualify. A lot of kids who don't qualify will enter in a program with lower grade requirement, and simply transfer programs after a year. I've also never heard of anyone caring (again, outside of very niche programs) about extra curriculars or stuff like that as part of an admissions process. These are essentially the "top" schools in the country too. In my personal experience, I've never heard of someone being "wowed" that you have a bachelors degree from McGill (other than current students), like they would be if you said you had a degree from Harvard. Once you get out into the real world, a degree is a degree as long as its in the correct field. So I personally don't feel like there is that much pressure to get into a "top" school for your bachelor's degree.