Explosions and shootings in Paris

[lizabu]

Did anyone happen to see the interview aired on CNN last night with the young couple who escaped the massacre at the concert Friday night? I saw part of it and could not contain tears. The young woman in particular had me mesmerized by her steadfast expression of her experience and her determination to face death with only love in her heart as her silent defiance of the murderers she was faced with. Her description of the fact that in the midst of the horror and her extreme fear she also felt the love in the hearts of her fellow captives flooding the room is something I will never forget. Such a bittersweet and amazing interview.

They were showing the video from the restaurant this morning. It's impossible to watch and not cry. You see the bartender holding a diner as they hide behind the bar.

 

[erin1715]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but have you seen the messages from the group Anonymous lately? Apparently they have been exposing supposed recruiters information for ISIS, and have shut down thousands of twitter accounts related to ISIS. And there was a new message just the other day from Anonymous that was a digital voice and very intimidating. It seemed like this was out of a movie. So odd.

 

[erin1715]

Also, I read that when the massacre broke out during the concert in Paris, the band and crowd was singing along to a song called "Kiss the Devil."

I'll just leave that here.

 

[cabanafrau]

Also, I read that when the massacre broke out during the concert in Paris, the band and crowd was singing along to a song called "Kiss the Devil."

I'll just leave that here.

I'll file that under don't judge a book by its cover. Simply based on name alone most media outlets assumed the band performing was indeed from the death metal genre. Incorrect.

I was not familiar with this band until this happened and still really haven't heard their music. Based on the reports that have come out in the aftermath my first question would be, is that song title in fact a sly play on words?

 

[cabanafrau]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but have you seen the messages from the group Anonymous lately? Apparently they have been exposing supposed recruiters information for ISIS, and have shut down thousands of twitter accounts related to ISIS. And there was a new message just the other day from Anonymous that was a digital voice and very intimidating. It seemed like this was out of a movie. So odd.

I posted earlier on that I was (and am) torn by Anonymous' revelation they have entered the fray. I desire the defeat of ISIS. I'm also nervous about the capabilities of hackers to strike at will, absent oversight of any kind. What happens when their interests diverge from mine?

 

[wilkeliza]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but have you seen the messages from the group Anonymous lately? Apparently they have been exposing supposed recruiters information for ISIS, and have shut down thousands of twitter accounts related to ISIS. And there was a new message just the other day from Anonymous that was a digital voice and very intimidating. It seemed like this was out of a movie. So odd.

Also, I read that when the massacre broke out during the concert in Paris, the band and crowd was singing along to a song called "Kiss the Devil."

I'll just leave that here.

I'm confused if you think this is some conspiracy or not? Anonymous always does a digital voice because they cover the identity of whomever is their representative at the time. They truly try to stay anonymous as possible and these guys tend to be better at it then our government intelligence agencies to be honest. With the song choice the band is what it is. I don't know if they chose a specific song to do this or just a time since it would be next to impossible to know the set list and make sure things are going exactly on time so the stadium happened while the rest of the attacks also happened.

 

[lizabu]

The anti Muslim sentiment could be helped a lot by Muslims getting much more aggressive and public in attacks against ISIS. I am not being anti Muslim but ISIS lives and indoctrinates in their midst. They are in a better position to expose this evil.

I support and hope we strengthen our immigration policies but that alone will not work. These guys don't live in a vacuum. Someone always knows and the civilized world needs to increase the pressure for them to come forward.

They have spoken out against ISIS repeatedly. There is also the "not in my name" campaign on social media. Please understand that Islam is a religion of peace so your suggestion to "get aggressive" is something that goes against their beliefs. Muslim people are more likely to pray for peace and quietly suffer while they being are targeted. And as for ISIS recruiting and indoctrinating in their midst, they are actually doing so in all of our midsts. We are all equally responsible. The difference is that Muslim people have been asked to be held accountable for others who falsely commit crimes in the name of their religion. When the KKK burns a cross we do not hold all Christians accountable for the actions of that group. But for some reason Muslim people are all painted with the same brush.

 

[wilkeliza]

I posted earlier on that I was (and am) torn by Anonymous' revelation they have entered the fray. I desire the defeat of ISIS. I'm also nervous about the capabilities of hackers to strike at will, absent oversight of any kind. What happens when their interests diverge from mine?

That's how we get the Ashley Madison hack. Yes some people were all for it but honestly it is no ones business but the cheater, their spouse, and the person they are cheating with. The hackers (I don't think it was anon actually) decided they get to decide who is evil and who is not and release the information.

 

[lizabu]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but have you seen the messages from the group Anonymous lately? Apparently they have been exposing supposed recruiters information for ISIS, and have shut down thousands of twitter accounts related to ISIS. And there was a new message just the other day from Anonymous that was a digital voice and very intimidating. It seemed like this was out of a movie. So odd.

I have heard about them getting involved. They claim that they have taken down 5,500 social media accounts belonging to ISIS members. If they have the skills to sabotage ISIS or help take them down all the power to them. At the same time I understand PPs concern about them having no one to oversea them.

 

[DopeyDame]

very unlikely

simple story from the French point of view.

France has put chicanes (zigzag) on a road between Spain and France. This main highway was used by Go Fast drug smugglers.
This was put in place to give the police a chance to look inside the cars as they pass, and to break down speed.

What happened ?

France was fined by EU.
Reason ? The Schengen Treaty states that you MUST be able to cross borders at speeds in excess of 20MPH (30Km/h roughly)

Now, the border tightening is a joke. It's only PR nothing more.

Stronger border control is only blocking those who do not pose a threat.

Borders have never prevented criminals to come through.
Think of your Mexico/USA border. You, americans, have very strict immigration laws, you have very efficient Border Patrols, and CBP sure do their jobs. You've got a wall.
How many illegal immigrants do you have ?

Now you need to understand that Europe is not the USA

I live in the north of France. Actually I'm less than 5 miles from Belgium. (which has been a rear base for the terrorists last week)
What is the border like ?
It's a city street. No, don't think it's a street where you drive through a gate. Up the road is one country, down the road is another.
No, Belgium is on the right hand side of the road, and France is on the left hand side of the road. And that street is miles long. And such streets are all over the border line.

So to cross from one country to another, you just need to cross the road. (2 lanes city street).

How do you tighten that ?

we even have houses where the house itself in one country, and the garden is in another country

how do you control that ?

We accidentally drove into Germany on our last trip to Europe. True story. We had intentionally crossed the boarder into Austria, got lost, and half an hour later realized we were in Germany again. No clue when or how that happened. I love the open European boarders for the most part, but I was bummed that I traveled through four countries and only got one stamp in my passport. #firstworldproblems.

 

[CPanther95]

That's how we get the Ashley Madison hack. Yes some people were all for it but honestly it is no ones business but the cheater, their spouse, and the person they are cheating with.

You mean the potential cheater, their spouse, and the Ashley Madison subcontractor paid to upsell those morons.

 

[wilkeliza]

You mean the potential cheater, their spouse, and the Ashley Madison subcontractor paid to upsell those morons.

Yes haha. I forget most Ashley Madison people didn't even physically contact another person it was mostly digital. Still cheating but it could have been worse.

 

[cabanafrau]

That's how we get the Ashley Madison hack. Yes some people were all for it but honestly it is no ones business but the cheater, their spouse, and the person they are cheating with. The hackers (I don't think it was anon actually) decided they get to decide who is evil and who is not and release the information.

Last I knew it was done anonymously. Personally my money was on there never being a "hack" in that case, merely those in charge of the site opening another revenue stream whilst imploding their business model.

I have anxiety about not being careful about who's in charge of the cookie jar.

 

[wilkeliza]

Last I knew it was done anonymously. Personally my money was on there never being a "hack" in that case, merely those in charge of the sight opening another revenue stream whilst imploding their business model.

I have anxiety about not being careful about who's in charge of the cookie jar.

Sorry I wasn't clear enough. The hackers were anonymous but they may not have been Anonymous the organization. There are a few other groups working like anon but they aren't the Anonymous Org and don't follow their rules.

 

[cabanafrau]

Sorry I wasn't clear enough. The hackers were anonymous but they may not have been Anonymous the organization. There are a few other groups working like anon but they aren't the Anonymous Org and don't follow their rules.

Nope, I wasn't clear. We're on the same page.

 

[asta]

They have spoken out against ISIS repeatedly. There is also the "not in my name" campaign on social media. Please understand that Islam is a religion of peace so your suggestion to "get aggressive" is something that goes against their beliefs. Muslim people are more likely to pray for peace and quietly suffer while they being are targeted. And as for ISIS recruiting and indoctrinating in their midst, they are actually doing so in all of our midsts. We are all equally responsible. The difference is that Muslim people have been asked to be held accountable for others who falsely commit crimes in the name of their religion. When the KKK burns a cross we do not hold all Christians accountable for the actions of that group. But for some reason Muslim people are all painted with the same brush.

Well obviously their their tactics are not working. My religion is also one of peace but that does not allow me to bury my head in the sand and deny barbaric acts if they are committed in my midst. In our history there have been many young men who love peace who have been called to fight wars against tyrants and madmen. I am positive they hated doing that just as much as any Islamic person but responded when called. Muslims have no excuse for allowing this barbarism to come from their countries when they do nothing to combat them.

You may blame all parts of the world for having pockets of Islamic terror but their origins and headquarters lies in the Middle East. Other than not being vigilant and determined enough in stamping them out, I do not think we are equally responsible for their evil.

The KKK is a repugnant organization but there is a reason they are not committing acts of mass murder like ISIS or other terrorists who say they are doing so for Islam. Maybe we should examine why and how the scale and scope of their violence is not comparable. But remember one thing above all - one type of barbarism should never be used as a reason to deflect from the terror at hand.

 

[JaxDad]

I have heard about them getting involved. They claim that they have taken down 5,500 social media accounts belonging to ISIS members. If they have the skills to sabotage ISIS or help take them down all the power to them. At the same time I understand PPs concern about them having no one to oversea them.

There is also the potential that the actions of Anonymous could damage ongoing intelligence gathering efforts on ISIS...

 

[Jon84]

There is also the potential that the actions of Anonymous could damage ongoing intelligence gathering efforts on ISIS...

It's unlikely that ISIS will be using Twitter as a communication method that is anything more than a marketing or recruitment tool.

Pretty sure they'll be using at least basic encryption, but nothing as far as TOR

 

[cabanafrau]

They have spoken out against ISIS repeatedly. There is also the "not in my name" campaign on social media. Please understand that Islam is a religion of peace so your suggestion to "get aggressive" is something that goes against their beliefs. Muslim people are more likely to pray for peace and quietly suffer while they being are targeted. And as for ISIS recruiting and indoctrinating in their midst, they are actually doing so in all of our midsts. We are all equally responsible. The difference is that Muslim people have been asked to be held accountable for others who falsely commit crimes in the name of their religion. When the KKK burns a cross we do not hold all Christians accountable for the actions of that group. But for some reason Muslim people are all painted with the same brush.

I absolutely agree it is the responsibility of ALL people who wish to live peacefully in respect of our differences to stand together against those who would destroy it. IMO there is some measure of validity in the criticism of the muted response of Islam against ISIS and their ilk that is not born out by their reluctance to speak out more vociferously or aggressively if you will when they have demonstrably done so in other issues. All Muslims are not a threat. I'm sure many more Muslims have actually been personally impacted by this horror than most non Muslims. What is desperately needed IMO is the overwhelming majority of Muslims to openly stand with everyone who desires to peacefully coexist regardless of tradition -- and be openly embraced by those of other traditions who desire the same thing. When the majority of civilization truly stands together and tells the barbarians No Means No I believe the thugs will wet themselves and run.

 

[cabanafrau]

There is also the potential that the actions of Anonymous could damage ongoing intelligence gathering efforts on ISIS...

I hadn't even considered the dangers of that wrinkle.