Ethical/moral vs common sense....

[The Mystery Machine]

Agree with LuvOrlando. You are probably being manipulated.

Do they have food and shelter?

 

[holycow]

I'm sorry. If someone is in need and it is going to cause you grief, regret then NO you shouldn't do it. You are not doing it with a cheerful heart.

There are other avenues this family can take to get help.

TELL THEM NO>


We just had this happen where I had this woman invade my life she killed me with kindness and then her husband went to my DH and asked for money for a few DAYS.....3 months later.....we finally sent a letter from an attorney and he coughed up the money. I kept seeing them with new clothes and posting on Facebook about their daughter starting college....now she won't even talk to me.

Like I did anything to her!!!! We tried to help and they took us for a RIDE.


sorry I haven't talked about this with anyone and when I read your post it all came out.

RUN the other way!!!! SAY NO!

 

[kellyg403]

Thanks all for the replies. Its a difficult situation all the way around and I wish I could be more specific but that is not appropriate.

I have thought of other solutions, but there is a 'my way or the highway' type of mentality and always an excuse or reason why an 'idea' wouldn't work.

In the end its not really about the money or the helping..its about the people. Honestly. I do the best I can to live a drama free life, some people do their best to keep drama unfolding as they sit back and watch. That would be these guys. The mere thought of living that day to day just makes me wanna run away from home. Right now they live about 3000 miles away so I can pretend I don't know things ... That being said I think I am being manipulated, because they know I really don't want to hurt them but I am by pretending the relationship is something it truly and honestly isn't. As the days go by I am sure I will find out some things are pure lies, it always happens. This time I swore I would not get involved until I knew the entire truth of the situation. And I am sticking to that, feeling guilty or not. I have worked hard for what I have, I give freely when there is a need which has placed me in this situation to begin with. This time, nope..not gonna do it.

Kelly

 

[bookgirl]

Yes, but they all involve having these people around day and night and I can't do it. Literally thinking about it makes me want to throw up. The amount of drama long distance is bad enough...daily..can't do it. Just can not do it.

Kelly

Don't let them move in.....bad mistake. I'd pay for two weeks at a extended stay motel before I'd move in someone that I don't get along with. Heck depending on the person I'd pay for a month!!!!!

 

[kellyg403]

Don't let them move in.....bad mistake. I'd pay for two weeks at a extended stay motel before I'd move in someone that I don't get along with. Heck depending on the person I'd pay for a month!!!!!

The solution!

 

[ksjayhawks]

Practice the following phrases until you feel comfortable using them:

"No."

"That is not possible."

Repeat them over and over and over when asked for help. Do not say anything more or it will give them reason to hope you will give in or something to argue with you about.

You do not owe them anything. If someone has lost a job, they can apply for unemployment, go to a food pantry, go to churches or other community groups that offer various sorts of assistance, look for a cheaper place to live, cut down on expenses, etc.

Doing these things is their responsibility, not yours. They will figure out a way to survive. Stay out of it. When they call and ask, say your stock phrase once, if it is brought up again, get off the phone immediately. If other friends and family ask you to help them, use your stock phrases once with them also. If it comes up again, change the subject or hang up the phone or look them in the eye and say "I have given my answer. It is "stock phrase you said" so do not bring up the subject again." If they do, leave or act like they never asked it and talk about something else.

By using the same phrase over and over and refusing to get drawn into a discussion, people will understand that you will not help. Do not give in, even once!

 

[kellyg403]

There is your answer.....

Everyone here is right...

These people need to go to the correct service agencies and help themselves....

Very obviously, you did absolutely NOTHING to contribute to their current situation, so you have absolutely NOTHING to feel guilty about.
It concerns me that one might feel 'guilty' for no reason...
It concerns me that one might feel 'guilty' for having a roof over your head and something to eat. This kind of guilt is not normal or healthy.
People that I call 'takers' are masterful at using guilt trips to get what they want for free.

"Don't cast pearls before swine"

I don't actually feel guilty over those things, I feel guilty because I don't necessarily like these people, I don't believe I am their last resort etc. I feel guilty because I feel badly that I think badly of people who obviously are down on their luck. If it was me, I would have already applied for services or something and gotten a job of McD's if they had an opening just to keep the cash flow coming in. I know the economy is bad, which makes me feel worse because maybe they are honest in that there are NO JOBS. I don't know their area, never been there so I am not certain.

It does not help that I can honestly say that not one time that I have hung myself out there has it been good. Not once. They are nice for a week or two and then back to the mudslinging, tall tell telling mode.

Kelly

 

[gator75]

Dh and i are currently in this situation with his parents. all their kids are grown and gone they own their shelter and cars and no bills , they came to us about two weeks ago wanting money for food and propane to heat their stove everything was screaming don't do it well... we did and the thing about it is that they came to us because of their pride. they are to prideful to go to apply for the help they need , so they come to their son for help no embarrassment there so now everytime i think of how they could get heat assistance right now I want to scream. I now know that we will turn them down in the future ,and we won't feel bad morally or ethicly because they aren't even trying to help themselves.

 

[tlbwriter]

I feel guilty because I feel badly that I think badly of people who obviously are down on their luck.

How much of it is actually luck?

 

[PrincessKsMom]

Don't let them move in.....bad mistake. I'd pay for two weeks at a extended stay motel before I'd move in someone that I don't get along with. Heck depending on the person I'd pay for a month!!!!!

I thought the same thing. DO NOT LET THEM MOVE IN. Your home should be your sanctuary. There are red flags everywhere. You KNOW they'll be taking advantage, you KNOW they're scamming you and playing you. You do not need to feel guilty because you won't let them throw your life into turmoil. If you do not value yourself, no one else will. Firmly offer some other suggestion or support, but not at the expense of yourself, your sanity and your happiness.

 

[Wishing on a star]

I feel guilty because I don't necessarily like these people, I don't believe I am their last resort etc. I feel guilty because I feel badly that I think badly of people who obviously are down on their luck.

Well, if obviously, these people are drama motivated losers, then where is the guilt in seeing the truth???
There should be NO guilt involved.

You use the word 'mudslinging'.....
And thus my reference to the old adage "Do NOT throw pearls before swine" (those who, like pigs, choose to be in the mud)

Even if in this one particular instance, there was a big layoff or something, that still does not change the truth.

See the truth, and the truth shall set you free!

I have been in this situation, with actual family... and now, I will only do very little to help. Because, it never really helps in the long run, does it. When people have no problem taking freely from others, then YES, I would not 'like' these people. And I would feel no guilt about that fact.

And, I am with the others who say that, no matter what, people usually choose their lot in life.... My husband and I went to college. He has a good degree... Right out of college he went about looking for work as long term proposition to develop in his profession, to have job security, retirement, etc.... We are now just a few short years from realizing that....

Now, the family members that I just mentioned...
While supposedly well intentioned... They have simply shifted from one bad decision and hard-luck story to the next, for the last 20 years...

To me, there are clear and obvious differences in these two pictures.
At some point personal accountability has to be acknowledged.

I had to learn a long time ago that one can't feel guilty for seeing the truth... I love my family member... Does it hurt very very deeply to see the situation that they, and now their innocent children, are in... Of course.... But I do not feel one, tiny, iota, of guilt about the fact that I do not 'like' the way they have lived their life, the awful toll that this has taken on their poor innocent kids, whom I have known and loved since birth....

Do I love them... yes.
Would I be 'taken' by them.... no
Do I feel any guilt about that... none at all.

 

[LuvOrlando]

Thanks all for the replies. Its a difficult situation all the way around and I wish I could be more specific but that is not appropriate.

I have thought of other solutions, but there is a 'my way or the highway' type of mentality and always an excuse or reason why an 'idea' wouldn't work.

In the end its not really about the money or the helping..its about the people. Honestly. I do the best I can to live a drama free life, some people do their best to keep drama unfolding as they sit back and watch. That would be these guys. The mere thought of living that day to day just makes me wanna run away from home. Right now they live about 3000 miles away so I can pretend I don't know things ... That being said I think I am being manipulated, because they know I really don't want to hurt them but I am by pretending the relationship is something it truly and honestly isn't. As the days go by I am sure I will find out some things are pure lies, it always happens. This time I swore I would not get involved until I knew the entire truth of the situation. And I am sticking to that, feeling guilty or not. I have worked hard for what I have, I give freely when there is a need which has placed me in this situation to begin with. This time, nope..not gonna do it.

Kelly

For what it's worth, I think you are doing the right thing Try not to be too hard on yourself with the guilt.

 

[kellyg403]

How much of it is actually luck?

Not one bit.

I just happened to read a little blurb on facebook...glad I didn't rush out to Western Union, seems like there is going to be a party...and I am evidently invited in spirit or money only....I knew there was more to the story.

Guess its going to be the blow out of the century..a goodbye to all their loving friends who have done so much for them..

Kelly

 

[bumbershoot]

I have thought of other solutions, but there is a 'my way or the highway' type of mentality and always an excuse or reason why an 'idea' wouldn't work.

Right now they live about 3000 miles away so I can pretend I don't know things ...

...because maybe they are honest in that there are NO JOBS. I don't know their area, never been there so I am not certain.

3000 miles from NC is around Seattle, yes? There are jobs (knock wood), depending, of course, on what you do. Hubby has friends in many industries, and the ones who have a spouse working and are doing OK, well they still don't have jobs, but the ones who were 100% motivated...do have jobs. It's actually been amazing, seeing how people switch careers, move around to different sorts of positions, in hubby's group of friends and acquaintances. If they are up here, I'm sure we'd be willing to brainstorm for them, to think of a good company, if we knew what their skills were...

But I have a feeling that that's not going to be "their way". Hubby's sister did that to us. She needed help with daycare for her girls a few years back, when my son was a baby. She was leaving her husband and needed help, financial help. I instead offered to watch the girls for her. All day. All work days. She would need to feed them, but I'd watch them. Well...suddenly her (active heroin using, ex-con, awful friends, angry that she was leaving him) husband needed to know EXACTLY where the girls would be. And if he were a reasonable human, that would be fine. But DH knew him and absolutely refused to let that happen. So we couldn't watch the girls. And ultimately, all she wanted was money. It was all a big excuse.

If they are "my way or the highway", hopefully they can understand it when you use that phrase as well, especially since you are the ones who could give the help.

 

[cm8]

Golfgal..you were close! No kiddies involved thank goodness, just adults. No medical issues, but job loss.

This is where my sticking point is..my common sense says there is way more to the story, my head is screaming no and my heart is saying what would you want someone to do for you????

I lean towards the hard way, trust me...and I feel really really really bad about it.

Kelly

I WAS in the same situation with my sister, noticed I said WAS. It came to the point that it was affecting my marriage. My husband did not agree with me "loaning" my sister money especially more of it when she didn't pay it back and had the means to. The breaking point came for me when she told a mutual friend of ours that she had no INTENTIONS of ever paying me back as I was "well off" and wouldn't miss it anyways I was really hurt and torn too especially when her then husband left her new baby, home, and 3 other children with no money, and no way to pay her bills; It really pulled my heart strings, cause I did not think it was fair for my nieces and nephews to struggle for the decisions that the parents made. I didn't help her that time, choose to be happy in my marriage and save myself some dough at the same time. I still have yet to regret it!