DVC T &C Personal Use - Only Thread to Discuss!

[tx911]

If that bothers you, and you feel the odds are against you, than I get why you are frustrated

if I can book my home resort at 11 months, and have never been shut out if it, then I am extremely happy, and simply don’t feel the same as you that things are stacked against me.

Have I had to take PV at BWV, BLT, VGF and RIV from time to time at 11 months when I owned all those resorts? Yes

Have I been able to book RV at all of those at 11 months? Yes.

And, my satisfaction with DVC as it currently works doesn’t mean I don’t support DVC going after commercial renters.

It

I'm fully satisfied, and haven't really had any significant trouble booking what I want.

I'll be even more satisfied when the commercial renters are taken down.

Just because the wrong-doing hasn't had a dramatic effect on me doesn't mean I don't want it stopped.

 

[AstroBlasters]

This year was the most I have rented, a bit less than half. I have made a profit with DVC. Is that my goal? No, but I probably wouldn’t have bought certain contracts if I couldn’t rent. For example, I bought a loaded SSR contract at $100pp and was able to book VGC studios at the 7 month mark that rented at $25pp. That made my SSR contract basically free, well $25pp. Now those points for me are “free” to use on stays I normally wouldn’t do. But there are years where I won’t use all of them, but others where I need all of them.

The SSR mafia….

 

[Sandisw]

Yes and no. While more people may be competing, the amount of inventory they can sit on does not increase. Possibly your 3 new owners have since added on. Or at the time yours sold, other BWV contracts were sold as add-ons. But I think the point bigger than any of that is HOW people typically use their contracts, and the difference is striking between commercial and personal use. The first thing I did with my Direct VGF points was book SSR for my niece. Never would I have done that if the plan was to rent. I used my own BW points for BW View when standard was unavailable… I would’ve waited for standard if my intention was for-profit and not personal use. And it would’ve been much easier because again, I could snag anything, not just what works personally for my goals schedule. As long as it’s something high/higher demand, pretty easy to offload after the fact.

Possible…but what if they haven’t? What about owners who want to stay Epcot area during Food and Wine who specifically buy to book only those times?

My post was more about why I don’t think that with commercial renters gone that those who are getting shut out of, let’s say BWV RV
year after year are all of a sudden going to be able to get them with ease at the same level they could in 2016.

Do I think that the owners who buy up those commercial renters contracts will act the same way as they do?

Of course not…because they hold a lot of rooms over the course of a year and your owner will not.

And ,if you remember, one comment the board said last year was that they didn’t believe that this was a widespread problem (which they also said about walking).

The good news is that seem to have finally decided to stop those who have obviously bought for the wrong reasons.

 

[Sykes]

100% bots are booking dining reservations and experiences, lightning lanes, and, in the past, VQ. We know this because they offered these services for money. Those are low level bots with little ROI. For us to know if people are using bots to rent rooms, someone would have to show you the script/code, which is never going to happen, but it's hard to imagine there aren't scripts/bots being used by companies that make millions a year.

There's currently a paid service available uses a bot to scrape the DVC website for room availability data and automatically notifies subscribers of availability that falls within the alert criteria that they specify. The subscriber still has to click on a link to manually book the reservation, but once upon a time I tried it and had near perfect success securing hard-to-get reservations (from cancellations) before they went to waitlists, etc.

I'm not a particularly good software engineer but I could scrape together a bot to automatically book hard-to-get reservations in less than a day or two. It's not a particularly difficult task and I can't imagine someone who is doing this for a living would pass up such a tool.

 

[VGCgroupie]

There's currently a paid service available uses a bot to scrape the DVC website for room availability data and automatically notifies subscribers of availability that falls within the alert criteria that they specify. The subscriber still has to click on a link to manually book the reservation, but once upon a time I tried it and had near perfect success securing hard-to-get reservations (from cancellations) before they went to waitlists, etc.

I'm not a particularly good software engineer but I could scrape together a bot to automatically book hard-to-get reservations in less than a day or two. It's not a particularly difficult task and I can't imagine someone who is doing this for a living would pass up such a tool.

I thought Disney shut all these down...

 

[DougEMG]

Just as nobody buys DVC because they get 10% off at Wetzel's Pretzels, nobody should buy DVC because they can rent their points.

The contract does give owners the right to rent points, so you are 100% wrong. What is in question is how many points and how often you can rent your points.

 

[tx911]

The SSR mafia….

That ain’t working, that’s the way you do it.

 

[Mouseforward]

I can give you a different example - the Amex airline lounges that Centurion/Platinum cardholders get to use.

15 years ago you could be the sole cardholder, go in there with an entire family of 6, for unlimited time, and use it both for departures and arrivals.
Due to overcrowding (a genuine concern), they imposed the following restrictions over time:

• Bring up to 2 guests
• Use for departures only
• Use for up to 3 hours before flight
• Further decimating guest policy - no guests at all without extra payment per guest

Most cardholders were cheering after each restriction thinking the overcrowding would improve. "Bye Bye big families!". "Bye bye little children!". "Bye bye hungry/greedy arriving passengers!". YAY!

Meanwhile the fee for the Platinum card has doubled. Cardholders who want to maintain some prior benefits like family access also now have to pay for family members ($200/person) to get companion cards.

And guess what - the lounges are still overly crowded and frequently exceed capacity... So who gained from all this? Amex!

I was trying to think of an example, but this is the exact fear I have. My example was too political to put on this forum, but frequently were told that the small incremental change is not gonna lead to something bigger and it’s for the greater good. Not surprisingly in very short time all rights are taken away.

 

[Sandisw]

I'm fully satisfied, and haven't really had any significant trouble booking what I want.

I'll be even more satisfied when the commercial renters are taken down.

Just because the wrong-doing hasn't had a dramatic effect on me doesn't mean I don't want it stopped.

I think I have said many many times that if DVC is going to enforce the commercial renting clause, against those who are clearly commercial, then I am fine with that.

Just not bothered that it exists…just like restrictions… they can stay or they can go… not bothered either way.

 

[Sykes]

I thought Disney shut all these down...

One of the high-profile ones is back, although I suspect that it never went away and really just went underground. If I was a commercial renter running one for my own benefit, though, I'd want as few people to know about it as possible.

 

[VGCgroupie]

I was trying to think of an example, but this is the exact fear I have. My example was too political to put on this forum, but frequently were told that the small incremental change is not gonna lead to something bigger and it’s for the greater good. Not surprisingly in very short time all rights are taken away.

Except this is not a change, commercial renting has always been prohibited.

 

[Cyberc1978]

One of the high-profile ones is back, although I suspect that it never went away and really just went underground. If I was a commercial renter running one for my own benefit, though, I'd want as few people to know about it as possible.

It would be kind of difficult to hide. If you are hiding how would you move your rentals?

 

[tx911]

I was trying to think of an example, but this is the exact fear I have. My example was too political to put on this forum, but frequently were told that the small incremental change is not gonna lead to something bigger and it’s for the greater good. Not surprisingly in very short time all rights are taken away.

I just don’t agree with the “turn a blind eye because the solution has a small chance of negatively impacting the innocent“ mentality.

My hope is that DVC will tread lightly other than shutting down the obvious big players. This practice is wrong, against the rules, and should be stopped.

I can’t see how that would negatively impact the average user, but if it does more changes can be made. I just don’t think doing nothing is the right play.

 

[tx911]

I think I have said many many times that if DVC is going to enforce the commercial renting clause, against those who are clearly commercial, then I am fine with that.

Just not bothered that it exists…just like restrictions… they can stay or they can go… not bothered either way.

The difference is commercial renting is against the rules. Restrictions are the rules, albeit implemented recently. They are not moral equivalents.

 

[Sykes]

It would be kind of difficult to hide. If you are hiding how would you move your rentals?

You'd be hiding the fact that you're using a bot and instead latching on to the plausible deniability of just being really good at securing high-demand reservations the old-fashioned ways.

 

[Mouseforward]

Except this is not a change, commercial renting has always been prohibited.

But now it’s changed to be any reservation that isn’t personal. Words mean something it wasn’t an accident.

 

[davidhr]

There's currently a paid service available uses a bot to scrape the DVC website for room availability data and automatically notifies subscribers of availability that falls within the alert criteria that they specify. The subscriber still has to click on a link to manually book the reservation, but once upon a time I tried it and had near perfect success securing hard-to-get reservations (from cancellations) before they went to waitlists, etc.

I'm not a particularly good software engineer but I could scrape together a bot to automatically book hard-to-get reservations in less than a day or two. It's not a particularly difficult task and I can't imagine someone who is doing this for a living would pass up such a tool.

I know this app. Once the developer was promoting it and I didn't want to be the party pooper in that post (reddit I believe) to point out it definitely is against DVC TOS. It's not a huge app as far as I know and that's why it didn't bother me too much.

 

[VGCgroupie]

But now it’s changed to be any reservation that isn’t personal. Words mean something it wasn’t an accident.

You could never commercially rent the words did not change.

I guess you and Sandi finally disagree on something.

 

[Mouseforward]

You could never commercially rent the words did not change.

I guess you and Sandi finally disagree on something.

Are you gonna have to apologize again? When did I ever say that I disagreed with commercial restrictions.
Read what I said it was only two sentences personal use and commercial are not synonyms.

 

[VGCgroupie]

Are you gonna have to apologize again? When did I ever say that I disagreed with commercial restrictions.
Read what I said it was only two sentence- personal use and commercial are not synonyms.

Have you read the whole thread? Renting infrequently when the need arises IS PERSONAL USE. It has always been allowed and is still allowed so the words did not change.