DVC Purchase – What exactly are you getting?

[DVC Mike]

What exactly are you getting when you purchase a membership in the Disney Vacation Club?

Some people assume that for the next ‘n’ years of their membership contract, they will get all the cool things that they heard about during the DVC sales presentation. They might even expect VIP treatment as they visit Disney Parks, including a bunch of member “perks”.

However, this is not strictly true. Yes, it is possible that might happen – but it is not guaranteed. So then, what actually is guaranteed?

Basically, all you are purchasing is the right to try to reserve an accommodation (a room) at your particular home resort (and all reservations are subject to availability on a first come, first-served basis). Bottom line, that is all that is “guaranteed”.

There is no guarantee that you will continue to be able to use your points to reserve any other DVC resorts. It is legally possible (though not very probable) that your home resort or any other present DVC resort might be removed from the DVC multi-site timeshare plan.

Future resorts built by Disney Vacation Development are not guaranteed to become part of the existing DVC multi-site timeshare plan. It is theoretically possible that you won’t be able to use your points to book new DVC resorts built in the future.

Our ability to use our points to book reservations in the “Disney Collection” (at Disney hotels at Walt Disney World, Disneyland and other Disney Parks around the world, or to book reservations on Disney Cruise Lines) is not guaranteed. The same applies to the Adventurer Collection (Adventures by Disney) and the Concierge Collection. The number of reservation points required to book these collections can be revised or adjusted upward at any time without notice, and the continued availability of these collections may be terminated at any time.

Even the “World Passport Collection” is not really guaranteed, in that while DVC will use reasonable efforts to make agreements with exchange companies such as RCI, there is no guarantee that they will be able to (however unlikely that is).

All of the member “perks”, such as discounts on Annual Passes, recreational opportunities, dining, tours, and shopping may be modified or terminated at any time by DVC. The continued availability of these discount programs is not guaranteed. Perks have come and gone in the past.

So remember when you sign a DVC purchase contract, all you are purchasing is the right to try to reserve an accommodation (a room) at your particular home resort.

Everything else is subject to change.

Now granted, as long as Disney Vacation Development continues to successfully develop new DVC resorts and makes money selling them direct, they will have good reasons to continue to offer special programs and perks to enhance the value and appeal of what they are marketing.

As we’ve seen, Disney may continue to further restrict the availability of these special programs and discounts in order to further differentiate buying direct from buying on the resale market.

I can't predict the future, but I suspect many of the things above that I say are possible will never come to pass. I'm just noting them as possibilities since there are so few guarantees in life.

http://i235.************************************************************* DVC Mike

 

[sue]

Part of owning a DVC is being flexible. We have always had great luck in making any reservation we wanted. True, you may wish to stay at AKV and end up staying in OKW, but we look at it as a great way to see multiple resorts during any given year. We also have traded points through RCI. Both trades were with resorts in Hawaii. We loved both vacations and would trade again knowing we had great resorts.

I don't think Disney is out to rip off any of their DVC members. If they were, do you think so many of us would be buying multiple contracts?

DVC maybe isn't for everyone and everyone should research it before buying into it, just like you would for any other purchase you make.

We have found DVC to be exactly the timeshare we thought it would be and wouldn't give it up for anything.

 

[Shazzasmd]

As someone pondering buying into DVC, it's good to see posts that make us think about what we will be getting. It also hammers home the importance of buying at the right resort for you, if you have strong preferences.

 

[dvcbrad]

Well stated, Mike. In my reading of these boards, I think there are a lot of unreasonable expectations regarding what "Members" are entitled to. All of the addtional little perks, etc., are really nice to have, but there's no obligation on DVC's part to do so. That being said, I'm definitely glad they do, though. (other than the annual waste-of-paper & postage mailing of the points charts ... ha!)

 

[DVC Mike]

I don't think Disney is out to rip off any of their DVC members. If they were, do you think so many of us would be buying multiple contracts?

I didn't mean to imply that DVC is out to rip anyone off.

I am as (if not more) happy with my DVC membership than the day I purchased my first contract. I still believe in the product, and I’m glad that Disney has continued to invest in it and retain the value proposition. I am a happy DVC member and I promote it as a great option for many people.

My intent was to point out what is “guaranteed” and particularly what isn’t. Many of the things that I mentioned as possibilities are extremely unlikely to ever occur.

The post was primarily for those people who are either researching their first DVC purchase or those who just bought in to understand that they purchased a timeshare and didn’t join an elite club where Disney will treat them as VIPs. I know most of the regulars here are already aware of this. We bought future accommodations at what we believe is a discounted price. As I stated – everything else is indeed subject to change.

 

[ELMC]

I didn't mean to imply that DVC is out to rip anyone off.

I am as (if not more) happy with my DVC membership than the day I purchased my first contract. I still believe in the product, and I’m glad that Disney has continued to invest in it and retain the value proposition. I am a happy DVC member and I promote it as a great option for many people.

My intent was to point out what is “guaranteed” and particularly what isn’t. Many of the things that I mentioned as possibilities are extremely unlikely to ever occur.

The post was primarily for those people who are either researching their first DVC purchase or those who just bought in to understand that they purchased a timeshare and didn’t join an elite club where Disney will treat them as VIPs. I know most of the regulars here are already aware of this. We bought future accommodations at what we believe is a discounted price. As I stated – everything else is indeed subject to change.

Mike,

I think this post will serve as an excellent resource to refer potential buyers to when they have questions about the perks/benefits of buying DVC. It's an excellent, factual based write up that will be very helpful. Thanks for taking the time to put it together.

Dan

 

[nunzia]

Well said...When I first came here looking into DVC, DVC Mike was one of the first to explain it all in organized thought and was very helpful. People would be well advised to apporach their DVC purchases in the way outlined in the original post. Bottom line is that all you are guaranteed is a chance to stay at your resort..the rest is fluff that can be changed at any monemt..will it be? As Mike said, probably not. However..the first thing that came to roost in my head about DVC was Buy Where You Want To Stay..since that is all that is contracturally guaranteed. I jumped through hoops to get exactly what I wanted at the resort I love (small contracts at VGC) and I have no regrets.

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

i think that was a good -"over all"- review.

here's been my learning curve. the basic thing we expected was
having no problems booking @ our home resort. what we got
was a big pain. ( still not happy from all the emotional stresses
we were forced to endured. ) however, it turned out liked the old
saying ," if the thing don't kill you, the stronger it will make you."

the dvc guides department need better monitors. there's are
some "conflicts of interest" situations that i read on here.

however, the primary reason that you pointed out for dvc ownership,
is the same reason we brought--we would still be happy if
we were limited to our home resort.


the biggest disappointment came from the misleading info about
trading. by looking back, i suspect our first guide did not fully
understood either. however, we made no connections with the new
ones so we went on our own.

then there are the cm's +owners. one here mentioned going up there
before work to the towl? ( is that a special perk? we can't visit the
lounge unless we're staying there on points & blt is our
home resort. ) now i can see them adding their families & friends.
the problem is limited space. when the system is bent to a level
effecting the targeted area, new restrictions are needed. this is just
one example, based on our home resort. we are paying for our
dvc, then we expect dvc to protect our investments. the reference
is about dvc selling "deluxe". to me, being in a deluxe room, means a
room that hasn't been vandalized. or having workers using a dvc room
to have off-duty parties. or renters crowding extended families, from
the pools to the rooms. ( recently, there was poster seeking to rent
a studio for 7.) now extend that out to the common areas, it
will have a negative effect especially on safety. fire, 4 example.

on another thread, someone mentioned similar "over-crowded",
& then those likely. i was surprised that renters were
not considered. i think dvc need to set restrictions on managing
this group. to me, it is getting out of control. ( just reading here,
they are the ones trying to work/over work the system. ) .
besides getting the cheaper rooms, then the large jump in
resales, & the fact that dvc hit "20" years. i don't know the
precise numbers of dvc owners, but the 20 years past means the
first generation has past the "first marker". so after 20 years
vacationing @ wdw , are increasingly renting available points.
so dvc now has owners, traders, & renters. and it is that
sub group that i think is most worrisome..."not" renters-family,
friends, or "contacted" ones like dave ; but those looking
for deluxe rooms to "party" like a "dorm." it "is" that group
that i am noticing , because of the intrusions and the risks they
bring.

since that rough beginning, things have been better than we expected.

recently there has been some postings on getting the cheapest &
then trying to "bride" for better rooms, & so forth. i think they are
heading toward trouble. first, they seem focusing on saving
nickels & dimes.....and not thinking about the real costs. i get the feeling,
they are going to come back with alot of regrets and projecting
dvc is unfair.

dvc to me, is like other timeshares...a tool for setting up vacations.
the difference is dvc has the potential for mega vacations because
of it's relationship to wdw. it the same with dcl cruises. yes we
could have done cruises on the other lines for less than half.
however, we have never regretted any of our dcl cruises. i want /
expect dvc to be manged @ the same levels, to prevent those
destroying the rooms, and over crowding. ( pools, parking lots,
the kids clubs, so forth...)

so for us, getting the dvc basics--is all we need to be happy.
as for all the "rest"...are icing on the cake. dvc need managers
with disney insights, to keep the train on the tracts.

 

[JimMIA]

There is one other thing any DVC owner is guaranteed, and two other things that you can almost bet the farm on.

The other thing which is guaranteed is that you will have a 30-50 year financial committment to paying annual dues. That is just as much of a "guarantee" as the ability to use your points at your home resort -- in fact, it's the flip side of that pretty coin. Annual dues will also make your purchase price look like chump change.

Unfortunately, this "inconvenient truth" is one of the most ignored guarantees for many prospective DVC buyers.

One of the things you can pretty much bet the farm on is that annual dues will rise over time. Yes, I know, there have been years where dues have gone down a miniscule amount at a resort here and there. But, over time, DVC's dues -- already pretty high compared to other systems -- will increase.

The other virtual slam dunk is that for someone buying DVC today, if they sell their DVC, they'll lose a substantial amount of money. There really isn't a good exit strategy with any timeshare, but DVC bucked that tide early on. Early in DVC's history, many owners actually made a profit sellinng after a few years, but those days are gone. Many direct purchasers are already paying close to double what the same points are selling for resale today. When they sell, the resale prices will be even lower.

Because of those three factors, I think any prospective buyer should answer one very important question before they ask "Is DVC for me?"

They should first ask, "Do I want to commit my family to a 30-50 year financial obligation to a timeshare?"

 

[DougEMG]

The other thing which is guaranteed is that you will have a 30-50 year financial committment to paying annual dues. [/I]

Doesn't Disney also foreclose on people that don't pay their dues? So are you really even guaranteed to have that financial committment?

Just curious, what actually does happen when Disney forecloses? Say that the MF ever got to be so big that it was cheaper to just book the resort from Disney (can't image this ever really happening), what's to stop the owners from just walking away?

 

[JimMIA]

Doesn't Disney also foreclose on people that don't pay their dues? So are you really even guaranteed to have that financial committment?

I'm not sure of the precisely correct legal terminology. They certainly do foreclose on people who don't pay their mortgages.

I know they cancel reservations and freeze accounts in cases where owners don't pay the dues. They also place liens on delinquent accounts. I assume if that went on for very long, they'd retake control of the account somehow, possibly by foreclosure.

I would say the committment is an integral part of the guaranteed right to use the points. If you don't pay the committment, you lose the guaranteed use of the points. Whether you keep that committment is another matter.

Just curious, what actually does happen when Disney forecloses? Say that the MF ever got to be so big that it was cheaper to just book the resort from Disney (can't image this ever really happening), what's to stop the owners from just walking away?

The property (the account) would be resold, and the person who originally bought it would be responsible for any unpaid balance after the proceeds of the sale were applied. If that were just dues, it might not be worth suing for, but if there was a large deficiency balance on a mortgage, they could sue to recover that. Whether they actually would or not would be a business decision.

And obviously, any kind of negative legal action like a foreclosure would have an effect on the person's credit.

 

[ELMC]

The other thing which is guaranteed is that you will have a 30-50 year financial committment to paying annual dues. That is just as much of a "guarantee" as the ability to use your points at your home resort -- in fact, it's the flip side of that pretty coin. Annual dues will also make your purchase price look like chump change.

I think that this is a great point and it's one that is too often overlooked when people are deciding (or not deciding) to purchase DVC. And that's where the math comes in. It's not like you're forking over $10,000 to purchase a (resale) contract then you have 30 years of vacations ahead of you. You have to amortize that $10,000 over the 30 years and then add that to the cost of dues to get the actual cost of your vacations over those 30 years. If it makes sense at that point, great. If not, walk. But I think that a large percentage of people don't ever get to that point in their decision making process.

 

[princessaloha]

There is one other thing any DVC owner is guaranteed, and two other things that you can almost bet the farm on.

The other thing which is guaranteed is that you will have a 30-50 year financial committment to paying annual dues. That is just as much of a "guarantee" as the ability to use your points at your home resort -- in fact, it's the flip side of that pretty coin. Annual dues will also make your purchase price look like chump change.

Unfortunately, this "inconvenient truth" is one of the most ignored guarantees for many prospective DVC buyers.

They should first ask, "Do I want to commit my family to a 30-50 year financial obligation to a timeshare?"

My DH and I spent quite a bit of time last night (and numerous other nights) discussing this. The purchase price is easy. It's the ongoing yearly costs that in the end are of concern. Although the MF are chump change to us, the costs for airline (currently $5K and going up each year), tickets and food (another $2K and up) (not taking in consideration souvenirs, travel to other off site locations etc) are now going to be a given in our lives for the next 30 + years.

$7k/$8k x 30yrs = $210,000/$240,000. FOR 1 WEEK, that's only 7 days. Now that's no chump change. Figure in MF and we're looking at a quarter of a million dollars to go to WDW for the next 30 years. There better be some darn good rice krispy Mickey heads and turkey legs at the park!

We understood that going in but it didn't really hit us until last night.

I hope other people run hard numbers on the "other reoccurring" costs involved prior to a purchase. Sorry, just in the middle of the "what have we done, biting our nails" nervous stage. Will probably be over it tomorrow.

 

[ELMC]

My DH and I spent quite a bit of time last night (and numerous other nights) discussing this. The purchase price is easy. It's the ongoing yearly costs that in the end are of concern. Although the MF are chump change to us, the costs for airline (currently $5K and going up each year), tickets and food (another $2K and up) (not taking in consideration souvenirs, travel to other off site locations etc) are now going to be a given in our lives for the next 30 + years.

$7k/$8k x 30yrs = $210,000/$240,000. FOR 1 WEEK, that's only 7 days. Now that's no chump change. Figure in MF and we're looking at a quarter of a million dollars to go to WDW for the next 30 years. There better be some darn good rice krispy Mickey heads and turkey legs at the park!

We understood that going in but it didn't really hit us until last night.

I hope other people run hard numbers on the "other reoccurring" costs involved prior to a purchase. Sorry, just in the middle of the "what have we done, biting our nails" nervous stage. Will probably be over it tomorrow.

How about going for 2 weeks every other year? You'll save a ton on flight costs.

 

[princessaloha]

How about going for 2 weeks every other year? You'll save a ton on flight costs.

Aloha ELMC! Nice to see you. Thank you for the reminder. That was our original plan, so we can still go skiing every other year, plus we keep telling ourselves there's always Aulani. But...the waiting...gives us more time to run hypothetical numbers over and over and over. until we're questioning ourselves to death. I was ok until this morning. Not sure what changed, the tides? full moon? Hopefully I'll be back to normal tomorrow.

 

[ELMC]

Aloha ELMC! Nice to see you. Thank you for the reminder. That was our original plan, so we can still go skiing every other year, plus we keep telling ourselves there's always Aulani. But...the waiting...gives us more time to run hypothetical numbers over and over and over. until we're questioning ourselves to death. I was ok until this morning. Not sure what changed, the tides? full moon? Hopefully I'll be back to normal tomorrow.

Don't worry...you can always rent out your points and get some positive cash flow and save all the money for flights, travel, souvenirs, etc. etc. It will make a big dent in the $250,000!

 

[princessaloha]

Don't worry...you can always rent out your points and get some positive cash flow and save all the money for flights, travel, souvenirs, etc. etc. It will make a big dent in the $250,000!

Ha! That would be smart but knowing us, we'll want every single stinking point for ourselves!!!! plus will probably add on too. sigh...a fool and his money.

 

[tpartcart]

I must admit after reading these posts that I too had second thoughts about our purchase. So much so that I had panic attacks on our long drive home after purchasing DVC that morning before leaving WDW. We have only had our membership since summer 2010. We have made three trips since and loved every minute so far. We will return this year with some extended family in Aug. In reading this realized that I purchased DVC for a personal preference reason. On every trip to Disney World I began silently thinking and planning for the next trip - I loved it that much. I wanted to be able to visit often enough that I could take a few days to relax and not feel like I had to rush from park to park trying to get it all done. It was exhausting. Now, with DVC we go on a leisure trip twice a year. For example, If we buy a 4 day ticket, we may split the tickets between the two trips and make sure we have time for the pool, waterparks, and other non-park time. It really does feel more like vacation when you stay in a deluxe resort and don't try to "do it all" in one trip. Once retired, I can see myself relaxing with a book by the pool and perhaps not visiting the park at all. I live in a northern state and believe that the grey winters with no greenery - greatly attributes to my love of WDW in Florida.

 

[Lil' Grumpy]

wow, i got to say , there are some very smarties here!

....i would never have considered some of these observations &
with them, come more options

working the system, why not buy direct? and on credit. and
this does not rate your other credits, keep it for 15, 16, 17
years, & instead of unloading it on the resale market, just
"quit" it goodbye. so what you will no longer buy dvc after that?
or you could pay cash.

basing on resales , you'll be ahead..far ahead.

what wrong with dvc? who's minding the store? the facts are
also self evident.

"rules/regulations" have the same methodically as setting limits.
to obtain an organization, & pass the test of time, a
structure must be part of the foundation. those calling the dvc
"shots" are worrisome. it almost like they are banking that
dvc owners will never understand their operations and/or
expect them to seek dvc values besides the "its face values.".


right now, they know who buying direct or resales. they also
know the difference between renting and owners. they also
know who's booking @ the home resort. if dvc recognized these
facts in their room assignments would also could used by
guides to sell. there are hundreds of li'things they could set
up to promote their business interests, selling new contacts.

why are so many guides are lacking dvc knowledge is a problem
inside the system & it is costing them. why they don't value
their direct owners is also costing them. for example, since
we are both professionals ( me & my wife) , we have 2 distinct
peer groups - that can easily afford dvc.

random renting , i read it all the times and new threads all about
it. all kinds of references, that i never used to see here
since coming here , ( 2003-prior to joining). this is a real
disappointment to me, based on our several "tours"--starting
in 2002. one of the biggest reasons we didn't buy until 2009-
we were told that if we did not used our points, that they
would be lost. though i didn't used the exact term "renting",
the guides knew exactly this option i was asking about.
now reading all the problems here, i think it is grossly unfair
that dvc do not stop their abusers, from the vandalism
we have encountered & not being able to enjoyed towl
from over crowding.

some things don't make sense...why isn't the barrier @ the
walkway.....on the blt side instead of the contemp.?
that would keep those watching the fireworks where
they are supposed be instead near the automatic doors
where they could walk on in.

what i expect to get from dvc , is what we were promised
that they used to make the sell.

 

[bakerworld]

Exactly what you are getting is a premium resort bed at a moderate resort price and that is exactly what we wanted.

The irritation are the people who assume we get more or assume they bought Disney vacation club so their entitled to more than a bed (altho, I do think this is because for the 1st 10 years DVC did include day tickets - kinda made their own bed with that).

I always say I am a member of a vacation club and that gets me a premium resort bed (and mattress topper) at a moderate resort price (and no mattress topper) which having slept in both many times my back thanks me every time it spends the night in that premium bed.