Don't Delay the DTV Transition!

[mkingdomlvr]

(skipping comment on the ridiculous remark...)

The point is MOST are already covered and don't need the coupons for the converter boxes. The ads for this have been on TV for at least a year. How much more time do people need to fully understand and prepare for this? Someone commented on her 90+ year old relative not knowing what a website is. While I don't doubt that a lot of older folks are in the same position, they also listed a phone number. Now I suppose some could argue they don't have a phone (which might be true). I think it's impossible for every aspect of a conversion like this (which hopefully be in place for a long long time) to be considered. Some people will not understand or not take the time to prepare. The government can only do so much. That's where regular people (like yourself) come in to try and make sure those that truly need help will get it. There will be some people who will fall through the cracks. That's sad but it's a harsh reality of life.

and once again, I must ask-When did watching TV become a right that must be guaranteed by the government in some way?

If you haven't heard about this in 2 years, haven't done anything about it in 2 years-guess what? You're out of luck.

 

[bicker]

While I would usually agree with you about yet more government funding of some program or another, in this case it was the legislative actions of the government itself that led to the need for these converter boxes.

And too be clear -- the money for the coupons is not tax revenues. The money for the coupons comes from the money raised in the auction of RF spectrum that the digital transition makes possible. That's one reason why I mentioned that the delay shouldn't happen: It deprives the people who paid for the coupons already redeemed of what they paid for.

The television signal has historically been "free" if one was willing to settle for the limited channels available by antenna.

Another clarification: The television signal remains free. Nothing is changing in that regard. As you point out, one must purchase a television that works; that has always been the case and remains true.

Now, the government has taken actions that make those previously purchased televisions unable to receive that signal.

Doing so once every fifty years is not unreasonable. Actually, I think it would be reasonable to expect that new technology will render older technology obsolete every twenty years or so. This is long overdue.

I think they have a responsibility to those citizens, many of whom are poor and elderly. That's just my opinion.

And the CECB coupon program effectively addressed that concern. The only issue now is that many folks procrastinated, and that irresponsibility is being made everyone else's problem.

Since you seem quite knowledgeable in this area, I have a question that I can't seem to find the answer to: If I have older, non-digital TVs hooked to cable in the back (but without a cable box), will I need to get a box for those TVs? I've seen this answered both yes and no, so I'm not sure. Thanks!

If you've seen this answered both yes and no, then you have gotten the correct answer.

Unfortunately, that's not only a joke, but the actual reality. The DTV transition (planned for February 17) has no specific impact on whether or not your current (analog) television will work with cable. That is completely independent. In some areas, you already couldn't use that television with cable. Also, for some service providers, like DirecTV and Verizon FiOS, it is already too late -- those old televisions don't work with those service providers without a box.

Also, going forward, more and more areas, and more and more service providers will be switching more and more of their service from analog-and-digital to digital-only. When that happens with your service provider in your area, you will need to have a box for each television. However, even then it won't be straight-forward: Service providers are moving channels to digital-only bit-by-bit, not all at once.

So your decision to get boxes (or upgrade your television) may come down to when your specific service provider moves enough of the channels you care about to all-digital, in your area.

 

[mkingdomlvr]

And too be clear -- the money for the coupons is not tax revenues. The money for the coupons comes from the money raised in the auction of RF spectrum that the digital transition made possible.

And as I said earlier-if the county I live in purchased bandwidth in that auction-the taxes I pay to the county will be used for that purchase. While it is true that the coupon program is not federal tax revenues, I fail to see how those costs will not be passed on to the taxpayer in some way.

 

[Free4Life11]

And as I said earlier-if the county I live in purchased bandwidth in that auction-the taxes I pay to the county will be used for that purchase. While it is true that the coupon program is not federal tax revenues, I fail to see how those costs will not be passed on to the taxpayer in some way.

Why don't you do some research to see if your county DID purchase it?

Or let's put it this way. Verizon, I believe, paid $4 billion for their portion of the airwaves...so technically Verizon paid for the coupons and then some!

Just please don't tell me you are a Verizon customer....LOL.

 

[bicker]

And as I said earlier-if the county I live in purchased bandwidth in that auction-the taxes I pay to the county will be used for that purchase.

No counties purchased bandwidth.

While it is true that the coupon program is not federal tax revenues, I fail to see how those costs will not be passed on to the taxpayer in some way.

Because they're paid for from proceeds of the auction only.

 

[bicker]

The big winners of the auction were AT&T ($6.6B), Verizon Wireless ($9.3B), and Frontier Wireless ($711M).

 

[moon]

Oh get over it! This isn't just about YOU and your family. It's about improving the quality of TV signals for the MAJORITY of Americans. You are obviously upset about the DTV so of course I don't expect you to have noticed a difference. Could it be that you live next to a broadcasting tower and have always gotten good reception? If so consider yourself lucky!

Let me tell you, there is a VERY visible difference in the broadcast quality.

Did you watch the presidential debates? They were broadcast in HD and the picture was so amazing! You might not see it, but I've seen the difference and it's remarkable.

I just wanted to point out something. A lot of people seem to believe that DTV and HDTV are the same thing. They are not. DTV stands for Digital TV. HDTV stands for High Definition TV.

 

[bicker]

True: All HD broadcast in the US is DTV, though not all DTV broadcast in the US is HD.

And it raises a question, in my mind: Is there any English language, commercial DTV station in the US that is not a shopping channel, that is not broadcasting in HD? I personally don't know of any.

 

[Free4Life11]

I just wanted to point out something. A lot of people seem to believe that DTV and HDTV are the same thing. They are not. DTV stands for Digital TV. HDTV stands for High Definition TV.

Thanks for pointing that out. But I do think more shows will be shot in HD as time goes on.

 

[Charade]

Thanks for pointing that out. But I do think more shows will be shot in HD as time goes on.

True. Another point is that without the digital TV system, there wouldn't be HDTV (via broadcast over the air).

 

[shortbun]

You're mistaken. The extent to which the digital transition has been promoted is unprecedented. That was really my point, in some of my earlier postings: that there is no excuse for having gotten to this point without being prepared for the transition. To be unprepared, you would have had to either deliberately resisted taking appropriate action, or deliberately avoided the reasonable venues for distributing information you'd need to take appropriate action. It's no different from people throwing out flyers from the City that provide new information about the rules for recycling, and then getting upset when their recyclables are left sitting on the curb.

No one has been callous, except perhaps the folks who through their inaction have provided the seed for this fabricated panic some anti-transition advocates were just dying to capitalize on.

The vast majority are already covered. It is believed that there hasn't been a significant increase in the level of preparedness in the last month or so, i.e., that there isn't a big difference between how many people are unprepared now versus how many people will be unprepared whenever the transition takes place (one month from now, three months from now, six months from now, a year from now, etc.) -- that many of those who are still unprepared will not take effective action until after the transition, itself, forces them to do so.

All of this is your opinion and what I say is mine. That doesn't make me 'mistaken', it simply means we see things from different prospectives. I think the very poor and housebound or aged should be approached and helped, you don't. I think having a deadline in the middle of winter when these folks can barely get out to get groceries and have no transportation to places like malls, Best Buy, Radio Shack is a bad plan; you think any plan in place must be carried forward so as not to be too sympathetic with 'no excuse' slackers. It's just a difference in our belief systems.

As far as 'fabricated panic' is concerned, I don't understand your panic. I'm not panicked at all; I simply think communities need to do a little better job educating their citizens prior to the change. I've had nothing in my mail, nothing on my door knob. I see the anchors from the TV stations making this an opportunity to get more screen time but 'unprecedented' promotion? Naw.
You DO seem to be the panicked one here with all the posts. I appreciate the technical way that you have presented your material but I have read nothing that makes me think it's just drop dead necessary that we proceed on February 17th.

 

[shortbun]

and once again, I must ask-When did watching TV become a right that must be guaranteed by the government in some way?

If you haven't heard about this in 2 years, haven't done anything about it in 2 years-guess what? You're out of luck.

Yep, out of luck, out of sight and out of mind.

 

[bicker]

All of this is your opinion and what I say is mine.

I didn't intend it as opinion, but rather as a correction of a misstatement you made about this not having got much attention. People here can judge for themselves, so I don't know why you would highlight the issue again. However, since you did: If you watch television, then you've seen the public service announcements, and you have seen your local news people highlight the transition. If you don't watch television, then this isn't an important-enough issue for you to warrant concern.

I think the very poor and housebound or aged should be approached and helped, you don't.

That is not true. Again, not an opinion, but a fact. Here, you're making a comment about what I think, and you're wrong. Just plain wrong. I'm the absolute arbiter of that. And I think the poor and housebound and aged have all been provided more than sufficient opportunity to prepare for the transition.

I think having a deadline in the middle of winter when these folks can barely get out to get groceries and have no transportation to places like malls, Best Buy, Radio Shack is a bad plan

Excuses were presented for every single month of the year: February was the month that had the least amount of excuses. Remember, they cannot do the transition during tornado season, nor during the holidays.

Regardless, as has been my point since the first message in this thread, THIS is not the time to bring up objections to the transition, or the transition being in February. That was decided almost three and half years ago. There were public hearings. All proper process set forth by the principles of our government were followed. There was more public review of this than there was regarding the war. It now comes down to deciding whether you respect the laws of the country and keep the commitments you've made, or not.

As far as 'fabricated panic' is concerned, I don't understand your panic.

I'm ready for the transition; I have no panic. Also, fabricated panic is not panic. You apparently have misunderstood what I wrote.

The fabricated panic I referred to is that which is highlighted by those who are pointing to it as reason to delay the transition. It is fabricated because there really isn't a substantial number of people who are panicked. I suspect they fabricated panic as support for their contention that the law should be changed. It is a tactic of deception they are engaging in.

I've had nothing in my mail, nothing on my door knob.

The decision was made by your elected representatives and their appointees that that was not needed. Again, THIS is not the time to bring up objections to the transition, or the transition being in February. That was decided almost three and half years ago.

You DO seem to be the panicked one here with all the posts.

Then you've misinterpreted what you've seen. I'm not panicked, but irate that people are actually engaging in abuse of process, and seeking to reward procrastination and punish diligence.

 

[Green Tea]

I agree the date should stay as it is. There has been plenty of warning, instruction ad naseum during the local news, and more opportunities to call with questions than McDonald's has hamburgers. If someone hasn't listened, it us their own fault. Rules and laws and deadlines always impact someone. If the country waits until everyone says ok, it is never going to happen.

 

[Charade]

All of this is your opinion and what I say is mine. That doesn't make me 'mistaken', it simply means we see things from different prospectives. I think the very poor and housebound or aged should be approached and helped, you don't. I think having a deadline in the middle of winter when these folks can barely get out to get groceries and have no transportation to places like malls, Best Buy, Radio Shack is a bad plan; you think any plan in place must be carried forward so as not to be too sympathetic with 'no excuse' slackers. It's just a difference in our belief systems.

As far as 'fabricated panic' is concerned, I don't understand your panic. I'm not panicked at all; I simply think communities need to do a little better job educating their citizens prior to the change. I've had nothing in my mail, nothing on my door knob. I see the anchors from the TV stations making this an opportunity to get more screen time but 'unprecedented' promotion? Naw.
You DO seem to be the panicked one here with all the posts. I appreciate the technical way that you have presented your material but I have read nothing that makes me think it's just drop dead necessary that we proceed on February 17th.

Well, the whole country isn't snowed in and besides that, they've been running commercials since LAST winter. Seems to me that the people who don't have cable or satellite and only get over the air programming tend to watch much more local TV than those with cable and sat should have seen plenty of commercials with the free phone number to call to get the coupon and then make arrangements to get (or have someone get the box for them) long before the deadline. Honestly, how much hand holding do people require?

 

[bicker]

And to put a finer point on it: How much hand-holding is society supposed to provide? Look at things that are more important, like Medicare and such. That is several orders of magnitude more important, and our nation doesn't do that much more to hand-hold people through the system, in proportion to how much work there is to fully take advantage of what the service offers.

However, we're again getting into issues that are long-past the discussion phase. The transition itself, and the manner in which the transition is publicized, were discussed through all appropriate national procedures four years ago. All that we're talking about now is the coupon program starting up a waiting list, and the February 17 date. The only way to defend a delay is to prove that the specific people who need the aforementioned "hand-holding" had a compelling reason to wait until 40 days prior to the transition to order their coupons. Given that the official "test" days for the transition were in November and December, there is no such reason, and with no defense against their own procrastination in that regard, there is no reason to delay the transition.

 

[ford family]

All of this is your opinion and what I say is mine. That doesn't make me 'mistaken', it simply means we see things from different prospectives. I think the very poor and housebound or aged should be approached and helped, you don't. I think having a deadline in the middle of winter when these folks can barely get out to get groceries and have no transportation to places like malls, Best Buy, Radio Shack is a bad plan; you think any plan in place must be carried forward so as not to be too sympathetic with 'no excuse' slackers. It's just a difference in our belief systems.

As far as 'fabricated panic' is concerned, I don't understand your panic. I'm not panicked at all; I simply think communities need to do a little better job educating their citizens prior to the change. I've had nothing in my mail, nothing on my door knob. I see the anchors from the TV stations making this an opportunity to get more screen time but 'unprecedented' promotion? Naw.
You DO seem to be the panicked one here with all the posts. I appreciate the technical way that you have presented your material but I have read nothing that makes me think it's just drop dead necessary that we proceed on February 17th.

Reading the Bradenton Herald this morning, there is an advertisement for Target. One of the products advertised is a converter box for USD5 after a Government coupon for USD40. There is a web address as well as a free phone number to get the coupon.
Family members and organisations who generally look out for the elderly and infirm should simply add "DTV updated?" to their checklist.

ford family

 

[bicker]

"We ask that any legislation implementing a delay in the DTV transition include exemptions for channels that have been reallocated, approved, or are pending approval for public safety communications," the groups said in a Jan. 9 letter to President-elect Obama.

Signing the letter were Chris Fischer, president of Association of Public-Safety Communications Officials-International (APCO); Chief Russell Laine, president of International Association of Chiefs of Police (IACP); Chief Larry Grorud, president of the International Association of Fire Chiefs (IAFC); and Ralph Haller, chairman of the National Public Safety Telecommunications Council (NPSTC).

[Source: Multichannel News.]

Practically speaking, this could cause a domino effect: Channel A must transition on time to make room for Emergency Services, but if Channel A transitions, Channel B must transition because of RF interference, and if Channel B transitions, then Channel C, in the next city, must transition because of RF interference, and so on... This exemption, carried to its potential logical conclusion, could mean that a substantial portion, perhaps most, of the transition would have to happen on February 17 anyway. The government cannot change the laws of physics.

The need to implement the transition on time, to allow Emergency Services to start using their allocated spectrum, is just another reason why the DTV transition should proceed on scheduled without any delay.

 

[bicker]

Another good set of reasons to keep the DTV transition on its original schedule:

As for lawsuits, those who are adversely affected by a delay are more likely to file lawsuits. Stations who have signed contracts for tower, antenna, transmitter to start right after Feb 17 could be facing penalties or financial losses if they have to postpone. Stations who have shut down or reduced their analog signal, but with a limited or no digital broadcast who are prevented from firing up their post-transition broadcast by another analog station are facing loss of business. Question for the lawyers on whether the stations or other adversely affected businesses such as those who brought the vacated frequency bands would be able to sue or ask for court relief if Congress passes a new law extending the analog shutdown date. Could make for a legal mess in a hurry.

 

[DISUNC]

My point is, watching TV is NOT a right. It is a privilege for those who can afford it. Last I checked, radio was still free, so the claim that these people will not have access to emergency messages, weather forecasts or the news is just bunk.

I am old enough to remember when broadcast TV was FREE!!!!!! Really FREE!
All you had to buy was a TV & rabbit ears. ..oh yeah and a nickel TV Guide.

Where I live, 19 years ago you were able to get 5 channels with just rabbit ears, however since then the Transmitting Towers all mysteriously STOPPED working. Suprise, the one & only cable company made out like a bandit. So now I pay for commercial TV....and nuttin is on.
It's all a racket!

Also, The Emergancy Broadcast system failed miserably. The one and only time the System was suppose to be activated since it's inception, was on 9/11/01. Not one msg was ever Broadcasted by the EBS. So all those "TEST" beeping on your screen & interupting your viewing all these years were all for nothing.