Do you think I am wrong?

[NotUrsula]

There are cheaper plans and prepaid.The only thing with prepaid is that most people end up using it more than they thought. My mom was an example of this..she had a prepaid..then my Grandmother got sick so between calling doctors and notifying family etc she was paying through the nose. I ended up putting her on my plan.

While that can be a problem, it is easily fixed. These days there are plenty of "unlimited" prepaid choices, too. The base fee is more expensive than a metered prepaid, but still usually less than a contract plan. Still, even if it is the same price, the ability to just stop paying without penalty is worth something when you are living on the edge.

I had my identity stolen by a black-market cell phone ring. They opened dozens of phone accounts in my name, and the phone company cut off the service after the bill went unpaid for 60 days, though it didn't show up on my credit report until 10 months later. As an example: on one account the phone charges for the use of the phones totaled up to $560, but the penalties and interest for not paying the bill for 10 months totaled up to another $3K. That won't happen with a prepaid, even if the minutes on it are unlimited.

 

[mrsklamc]

I find this ironic....some people are awfully judgmental of others' judgmental-ness.

 

[cmbonneville]

I am working with near homeless families. I notice that they have cell phone plans that cost upwards of $140.00 a month.

These families will be taken care of by our program, but they must be responsible and save money so that they will not be in this position again. They learn to budget through weekly meetings dealing with their personal finances.

Do you think I am being unreasonable to ask these people to give up these expensive cell plans? Do you think it is cruel to make a parent take the cell away from their children also on the plan?

I realize that there will be a breaking contract fee, but it is much cheaper than paying $140 a month, IMHO. I am looking into these cell companies willingness to allow them to get onto a cheaper plan and not pay the fee.

I am extremely frugal and might be skewed on this subject. Thanks!

OP - Before I even read through the gazillion reply posts I have to say I agree with you for good reason...

I work at a homeless housing program for women.. I see the same things - brand new cell phones, add-on's, and irresponsibility...

There are some very reasonably priced cell phones out there - and many free programs (like Safelink and I believe assurance) that offer certain individuals free cell phones and a limited number of minutes

The program where I work has a rule that we don not allow budetting for things that are not necessities. Cell phones truly are not necessities - regular old plug it in the wall phones work and answering machines are pretty reasonably priced - not too mention that someone else who answers might be able to write down a message on a piece of paper - archaic I know!

What we do is teach budgeting, money management, and life skills in an effort to help the women in the program reach self-sufficiency. So, in order to continue in the program they must budget, save, and pay program fees first and foremost - while being allow to budget for things like daycare, bus passes, and prescription expenses - but cell phones that comes out of spending money! Before you know it, most residents don't choose to continue the expensive plans and often take the hit for $200-250 against their credit, rather than suffering monthly

Just my two cents...back to laundry

 

[gillenkl]

If a family is near homeless, how can they afford a cell phone at $140 a month? Ridiculous. OP, you aren't wrong at all.

 

[mamaLori05]

funny what has become "needs" in this society! A family who was about to lose their home was interviewed in our local paper and the reporter asked them if they had given up their cellphones and cable television, and they said "they couldn't live without their phones and cable." They would rather lose their home than make any kind of sacrifice. I don't know how our parents and grandparents managed to get through the day without such basic neccessities!

It's really sad isn't it!!!

 

[leahjade]

Until you've been there, I'm not sure anyone can really understand what it is like and the sad fact is that all giving up cable and cell phones does is makes life more difficult/less enjoyable while the foreclosure goes on ahead

But that's why these people got into trouble to begin with. Usually financial problems don't happen overnight. When money starts getting tight, you need to give up luxuries (yes I do mean cellphones and cable!) to get back on track so you don't lose your house. Yes a few hundred dollars every month DOES make a difference. There is a big part of society who does not know how or is not willing to make any kind of sacrifice. And why should they? Government will bail them out over and over again, and middle class people like myself will continue to have my taxes rise to cover for irresponsible people.

 

[luvsJack]

Actually, if you go back and read the posts you were one of several. I guess those posts can be perceived in different ways, but they appeared in more than one case to be advocating cell phones for teens so they were not different. Not too much far crying there.

I'm all for empathy and budgeting.

I was one poster who mentioned why a teen feels a phone is important. I, in no way, meant that the teen MUST keep the phone or even should keep the phone. I was simply stating how the teen feels. Having the phone taken from them is not going to change the way they feel, that doesn't make it any less necessary to do so.

And I also said that my own teens were able to keep things like that when we were having struggles, if they found a way to pay for it.

 

[Ka' eo]

I find this ironic....some people are awfully judgmental of others' judgmental-ness.

There might actually be confidenitality issues at stake here. Technically this is a client relationship and may be subject to confidentiality. Posting their situation and being highly critical of them in itself is potentially very hurtful to that family. Can you imagine someone 'helping' you and turning around and writing scathing things about you in a public forum?

A question was posed, "Am I wrong?" People are certainly entitled to answer. I have not read any attacks or flaming here really. I think this thread has been remarkably respectful given the potential for volatility this subject holds.

 

[jodifla]

But that's why these people got into trouble to begin with. Usually financial problems don't happen overnight. When money starts getting tight, you need to give up luxuries (yes I do mean cellphones and cable!) to get back on track so you don't lose your house. Yes a few hundred dollars every month DOES make a difference. There is a big part of society who does not know how or is not willing to make any kind of sacrifice. And why should they? Government will bail them out over and over again, and middle class people like myself will continue to have my taxes rise to cover for irresponsible people.

Actually, in Michigan, it's more like both people have lost their jobs, and it's just an eventuality that they'll lose their home unless they are lucky enough to find replacement work. Very, very few people could last years on just their savings, especially paying for their own health care as well.

Most people would be in default within six to eight months, I'd bet.

And our jobs are tied to our phones and Internet, it's how all our business is done; it would be the only hope of getting more work, so we certainly wouldn't drop that.

 

[Colleen27]

But that's why these people got into trouble to begin with. Usually financial problems don't happen overnight. When money starts getting tight, you need to give up luxuries (yes I do mean cellphones and cable!) to get back on track so you don't lose your house. Yes a few hundred dollars every month DOES make a difference.

Well, no, that sort of thing isn't always (or even usually, IME) what got them into trouble in the first place. For most of the people I know who have lost homes, it has been due to prolonged and/or repeated unemployment. So it wasn't a case of money getting tight; it was a case of having enough to pay the bills and save a little one week, and no income at all (or a small unemployment check) the next. The unemployment rate around here is around 20%, nearly triple what it was 3 years ago. That's a lot of very serious financial problems that did develop over a very short time.

 

[leahjade]

Way too often it's a case of people spending beyond their needs in the first place. A friend in the real estate business says she sees it every day. People buying way too much house than they can afford, then when something happens, they owe even more than their house is worth. She said people don't want to begin with small starter homes any more and get a lot of equity before they buy up. No, young couples want the huge houses that come with the mortgage and taxes they can't afford. Even in this bad economy, people are not maker smart choices and are not willing to sacrifice. Being in the business for thirty years, she has seen such a change in how people handle their finances and what they feel they are entitled to and not in a good way!

 

[OceanAnnie]

Regardless of the path that got the couple to the end destination, the end result is the same. They are holding on to bills they can't pay or else why would they ask for help? They need to prioritize, budget, re-think.

I'm amazed at how many ways that can be "wrong" on the budget board no less.

 

[Colleen27]

Way too often it's a case of people spending beyond their needs in the first place. A friend in the real estate business says she sees it every day. People buying way too much house than they can afford, then when something happens, they owe even more than their house is worth. She said people don't want to begin with small starter homes any more and get a lot of equity before they buy up. No, young couples want the huge houses that come with the mortgage and taxes they can't afford. Even in this bad economy, people are not maker smart choices and are not willing to sacrifice. Being in the business for thirty years, she has seen such a change in how people handle their finances and what they feel they are entitled to and not in a good way!

Again, not everyone fits into these tidy little assumptions, as though bad things only happen to the stupid, greedy, and short-sighted. The people who are losing their homes here are people who settled for starter homes and in many cases a longer commute rather than take on a mortgage they had to stretch to make. That doesn't matter when the jobs go away, though. The bank will foreclose on someone missing their $800/mo mortgage payments just as quickly as on someone who can't make their $1500/mo mortgage payments, and at least the people who bought those bigger, newer, more centrally located homes have some options as far as short sale because they have a more desirable property to unload.

It is very frustrating to see the broad brushes come out on this subject when in so many cases it was the people who tried to be responsible who are getting the most screwed. We have friends who did everything right and lost everything, burning through every dime of their savings, cashing out their retirement accounts, and still losing their modest homes before they could find work. If they'd been stretched to the max for a McMansion, they'd at least have had hope for a short sale - those homes have lost value, but are still selling. Homes in my community aren't selling until they're bank-owned and listed for less than the cost of a new car.

 

[leahjade]

There will always be hard luck stories but you can't argue with the fact that according to the Yale Press in 1975 American saved an average of 12% of their income compared to -2% in 2006. People need to be educated on how to live within their means and to be prepared for emergencies and life changes. There is an entire generation of people who think nothing of charging a $5 cup of coffee every day yet do not have an emergency fund or retirement account.

 

[Colleen27]

There will always be hard luck stories but you can't argue with the fact that according to the Yale Press in 1975 American saved an average of 12% of their income compared to -2% in 2006. People need to be educated on how to live within their means and to be prepared for emergencies and life changes. There is an entire generation of people who think nothing of charging a $5 cup of coffee every day yet do not have an emergency fund or retirement account.

Those changes can't be laid solely at the feet of spending habits, however. There is a whole generation right now trying to meet 21st century expenses on 1970s wages. Look at the graphs of income over time - the median income has only risen about $7000 in inflation adjusted dollars since 1975. In that same timeframe, the median housing value has more than doubled. Health care costs have quadrupled since 1990. Education and good financial habits are part of the puzzle, but no amount of budgeting is going to make those numbers work.

 

[PrincessDadx2]

Those changes can't be laid solely at the feet of spending habits, however. There is a whole generation right now trying to meet 21st century expenses on 1970s wages. Look at the graphs of income over time - the median income has only risen about $7000 in inflation adjusted dollars since 1975. In that same timeframe, the median housing value has more than doubled. Health care costs have quadrupled since 1990. Education and good financial habits are part of the puzzle, but no amount of budgeting is going to make those numbers work.

If that were true then we would all be bankrupt

Food costs have dropped as much as healthcare have risen for example. The biggest problem I see is the 21st century lifestyle. It is still easy to live a 70's lifestyle:

One car
1,000 SF house
No Starbucks, Ipod, cable, cell phones, vido games, DVDs, digital cameras, large screen TVs, computers, "organic" food, vacation at the relatives, no eating out except for birthdays, etc. etc.

Single income, 70's lifestyle (actually probably saved up to 90's now ), and proud of it

 

[mrsklamc]

Prices are driven by supply and demand. Housing prices wouldn't have gone up that much if people weren't willing to pay them.

Another problem is changes in the way credit is used. People think they're OK as long as they can make the payments and it simply ain't so.

Also, medical insurance has changed from something meant to protect you from disaster, to something that makes your our of pocket expenses minimal every single time you go to the doctor. Medical expenses have many factors but this is just ONE reason costs have gone up so much.

Anyway- there tend to be two types of poverty. One is caused by a catastrophic life change-divorce, loss of income, medical expenses, what have you. These are the people most likely to dig their way back out of it. Then there are the folks who believe living off welfare and community action programs are a way of life- they learned it from their parents. It is much harder for these families, or their children, to get out of poverty. Many of them truly don't understand that the reason they have no money is because they need to 'Stop Acting Rich,' (which by the way is an excellent book by Thomas J. Stanley.)

 

[Shelly F - Ohio]

I worked in the customer service dept at our natural gas company and you would not believe what people spend money on before paying for their gas. I have had them tell me the cable bill was $100 and that is why I did not pay my gas bill. Another person who I informed that the collector was coming that day to shut off her gas said to me, "oh can he wait till I return the DVD player I bought?" This was years ago when DVD players first came out and cost a few hundred dollars.

What they also don't understand is that if you have kids if you have your utilities shut off, the utility company can call the children services agency. Not providing a necessity such as utilities for a child is neglect. Which will result in a home visit from a social worker.

Some people just don't have their priorities straight.

PP I have to agree with you, people have become so a custom to being on welfare and using the system. They are leaches of our tax dollars. They sit at home wait for their so called paycheck as they call them and then buy ribs, steaks and other high dollar items. Then when they have no money to pay for bills they turn to crime. I say they should only be allowed on welfare for 2 years and that is it. We need to break this cycle.

 

[luvthemouse71]

Actually, in Michigan, it's more like both people have lost their jobs, and it's just an eventuality that they'll lose their home unless they are lucky enough to find replacement work. Very, very few people could last years on just their savings, especially paying for their own health care as well.

Most people would be in default within six to eight months, I'd bet.

And our jobs are tied to our phones and Internet, it's how all our business is done; it would be the only hope of getting more work, so we certainly wouldn't drop that.

This is the thing..yes, there are lots of irresponsible people. But many of us don't realize(or are in denial) that many Americans are a few paychecks away from being homeless/in severe financial trouble...Look at the dependence on credit that goes on..in the cafeteria at the hospital, the vast majority of people whip out the credit card to pay for everything-if you use mostly cash(which I do..old fashioned that way) you get looked at like you have 3 heads.

It's easy to shake our heads at the obviously poor but we have to realize that most of this country is on thin ice.I'm very grateful that I'm in a field where there are still jobs..but I know many smart, educated, hard working people that have lost jobs and are really struggling to find a decent job..I can see why people seem to give up after a point.

 

[saveaquarter]

These threads always devolve into everyone patting each other on the back for their good choices and responsibility, while tsking and headshaking at the presumed actions of those whose lives they know absolutely nothing about.

It all boils down to just one thing; there but for the grace of God go I.