DL FastPass being scaled back?

The following article is courtesy of:

http://miceage.com/allutz/al071304b.htm

Meanwhile, about the same time the Thunder accident was happening, news began to spread amongst Disneyland CM's (cast members) that a radical rethinking of the parks FastPass strategy had just been approved by TDA, and that those changes would be coming sooner than anyone thought.

Beginning Monday, July 12th they were conducting a "test" by not offering FastPass at Pirates of the Caribbean or the Haunted Mansion. The FastPass machines at those two rides have been covered up, and they have tried to restore as much of the original queue setup at those two rides as they could with such short notice.

But there are other radical changes coming to all of the Resorts FastPass locations, besides this "test" at Pirates and Mansion. Before we get to those however, it would probably help explain the current Team Disney Anaheim (TDA) mindset behind these big changes if we go back a few years to the beginning of FastPass.

In early 1999 Paul Pressler had just become Disney's parks and resorts chief, and Cynthia Harriss had assumed the role she was being groomed for by Paul as Disneyland's president. Paul was enamored of a new concept for a ride reservation system that seemed to be the answer to the consistent customer complaint at Disney parks; the lines are too long. FastPass looked to Paul as though it could be the answer to customer dissatisfaction without having to actually spend capital on pesky new rides and attractions for which neither he nor Cynthia had much passion for.

And so Paul and Cynthia both latched on to the slick PowerPoint presentations created by the marketing and finance departments that showed FastPass would increase both the customer spending numbers as well as the customer satisfaction numbers. There were still folks working for Paul and Cynthia though that had a great deal of experience in operations management of Disney parks, and they were more skeptical of the wonders of FastPass as touted by the marketing department. One of those people was Al Weiss, the Walt Disney World (WDW) president who felt that too much FastPass would likely overwhelm a parks infrastructure and literal design intent, especially at his older Magic Kingdom park.

Cynthia, on the other hand, just about tripped over herself to support Paul's FastPass plan and couldn't get FastPass installed fast enough at Disneyland. Despite objections from her operations management teams, Cynthia instructed her executives to approve a massive slew of FastPass installation projects in 2000. Practically every E-Ticket in the park had FastPass installed on it, and even a few D-Tickets like Roger Rabbit and Autopia got the FastPass treatment. The only E-Ticket that seemed to escape FastPass was the Matterhorn, and that was only because the cost estimates kept soaring with every fiscal years proposal to radically redisign the Matterhorn queue and boarding area to make it FastPass friendly.

Fast forward to 2003 and Paul Pressler suddenly resigns to go to The Gap, and is replaced by Jay Rasulo. Jay Rasulo has a very different style than Pressler, and Jay takes a hard look at the '03 numbers now that FastPass has been established for several years. Jay is surprised to learn that not only did the quantum leaps in customer spending and satisfaction failed to materialize for the most part, but that Disneyland is now saddled with rising customer complaints stemming from the overburdened infrastructure issues caused by FastPass.

It seems Cynthia never did quite see the writing on the wall regarding FastPass, and up until the very end she refused to even consider implementing the limited operating strategy that had been successful in the Florida parks for several years. In October of '03 Cynthia suddenly resigned to send more time with her family and FedEx her resume to The Gap's headquarters up in San Francisco. And that brings us to Jay Rasulo's hand-picked successor to Cynthia, Matt Ouimet.

We've mentioned here earlier this year that Matt was unimpressed with FastPass and would be looking at it with a critical eye. And after listening to his operations management in the parks, something Cynthia rarely did, Matt gave the go ahead to radically rethink the way Disneyland and California Adventure (DCA) offer FastPass to its customers.
Following here are some of the changes currently approved for FastPass attractions in Anaheim. Read 'em and weep FastPass ticket collectors:

Pirates of the Caribbean will no longer offer FastPass, effective immediately. In September the marquee will have all references removed, the machines will be removed, and the queue will be restored to its pre-FastPass condition.

The Haunted Mansion will keep its FastPass machines closed for 9 months out of the year. Haunted Mansion will only offer FastPass during the Haunted Mansion Holiday season, and even then there may be slower weekdays when it is not offered.
Winnie The Pooh will have its FastPass operation permanently removed in the fall, and minor queue modifications will be made. It is still undecided whether or not Splash Mountain will move back to its old FastPass distribution area where the Pooh machines currently are. Big Thunder Mountain will continue to offer FastPass, although it will not offer it on slower weekdays.
Roger Rabbit will continue to offer FastPass as the only FastPass attraction in the northern half of the park, although it will not offer it on slower weekdays. It's a small world holiday will not offer FastPass again. This Christmas season they will restore the queue they used during 1997-99 before FastPass. Star Tours will have its FastPass operation permanently removed in the fall.

Autopia will continue to offer FastPass, although it will only be offered on weekends and during busy seasons. Indiana Jones and Splash Mountain will continue to offer FastPass, although there will be slower weekdays in the off season when it is not offered at either attraction. Space Mountain and Buzz Lightyear will both open in 2005 with FastPass. They plan to evaluate whether to keep FastPass on Buzz Lightyear later in 2006.
The changes at DCA have primarily taken place already:

The FastPass areas were shuttered at It's Tough to be a Bug and MuppetVision earlier this year, and the machines will be permanently removed this fall. Who Wants to be a Millionaire - Play It! will have its FastPass removed this fall, and the attraction itself may not last too long into 2005. All of the other DCA attractions will retain their current FastPass setups, however there will be slower days in the off season when it will not be offered on some or all of those attractions.

Those are some pretty big changes, don't you think? Matt and his executives are fully prepared to receive some fairly nasty complaint letters for a couple of months, but Matt is convinced that this is the right thing to do for the long term good of both parks. Especially at those big E Ticket attractions like Pirates that can consistently cycle through 2,750 riders per hour, it makes sense from just about any angle you look at it.
But it's just one more example of Matt and his hand picked executives being willing to make some tough decisions that will benefit the park and its patrons in the long term.
 
Well it looks like they have a cheerleader in you but for myself it just about cements my decision to spend less time in the parks and go offsite. I'm sorry to see fast pass eliminated, it will certainly make us rethink our touring plans for Nov-Dec. It now makes sense to spend the bucks to get a room at Universal so we can use their system for a few days.
 
I'm sorry to see fast pass eliminated, it will certainly make us rethink our touring plans for Nov-Dec. It now makes sense to spend the bucks to get a room at Universal so we can use their system for a few days.

The Miceage article details the upcoming Fastpass changes at Disneyland not WDW. Apparently FastPass was over-implemented at Disneyland leading to overall congestion in the parks. WDW hasn't implemented FastPass on the scale that Disneyland has.

carl
barrel of :tongue:
 
We WERE going to DL in August but we've now scuttled that trip...All because of the FP decision. I just disagree that FP has actually caused congestion and if it has then perhaps it should be tweaked rather than removed...Perhaps fewer FP's should be issued per hour which would increase the cycle time of those in line. Perhaps they should have put all FP systems on line with each other thereby enforcing the one per time window philosophy...

I want to wait in as few lines as possible. The lines are not a part of my magical vacation and FP was a great solution.

I think Rasulo and Ouimet are doing good things overall though and I'm willing to give them the benifit of the doubt on this (I'll admit if I'm wrong), but my family won't be one of their test subjects, just in case.

Oh, and Mr. Weiss, if you're reading this...Please don't even consider doing this at WDW!!!!
pirate:
 

Hate to break this to you guys, but we've been discussing this for 5 days now on this Thread.

Peter, you should re-consider your trip to DL. This FastPass change really sounds like it will help DL. You have no idea how crowded the walkways get on a summer weekend (I'm sure the words "mosh pit" have been used). They're only talking about scaling back *some* of the FastPass machines (like Pirates & HM).

Anyway, you should look at the other thread because there are some good points made. Also, if we could keep the discussion on that thread, it'll make it easier for those trying to follow it than having to read two threads with duplicate posts.

Thanks,

Sarangel
 
Thanks Sara, want to merge this thread to the other?

Re: DL, we've been each of the past two summers and frankly aside from the totally out of control 'Fantasmic' situation and the ridiculously long lines for extremely low capacity 'Splash' every thing was great, so unless it's JUST the summer WEEKENDS (of which we were purposly NOT a part of) that need addressing I just didn't see anything that was wrong with FP or DL crowds. But either way how can putting more people in already crowded lines help the overall crowd situation? I think it seems simplistic to think that those holding FP's will just trade that for a 60 minute stand in line (and quit wandering the busy walkways)...I think the more likely result is that the guest will simply leave and not come back.
pirate:
 
***"Hate to break this to you guys, but we've been discussing this for 5 days now on this Thread"***

Not that it matters, but in BigDisKids defense, he posted this thread over on the Dis board...... probably never saw ours, ( I'm usually the one who posts here without scrolling down first;-)
 
How about unlimited fastpasses to the first person on this thread who knows how to spell "dessert".
 
I apologize if you've seen this already. I orginially posted it on the DVC Board.

I didn't think it would get moved so fast, but I can understand your concern about beating an already dead horse to death.



;)
 
dessert.

Stand and deliver!! ::yes:: :wave: pirate:

I do tend to have a DRY sense of humor. Now back to my spelling lesson. I'm having trouble spelling my ..............last name. ;) :p

Now if we can get a bunch of people to spell "definitely" correctly.......there's no A.:teeth:
 
Just a note for anyone trying to read this from the beginning... I merged 2 threads on the same topic, so it may seem a little out of order.

Sarangel
 
Originally posted by Sarangel
Hate to break this to you guys, but we've been discussing this for 5 days now on this Thread.

Peter, you should re-consider your trip to DL. This FastPass change really sounds like it will help DL. You have no idea how crowded the walkways get on a summer weekend (I'm sure the words "mosh pit" have been used). They're only talking about scaling back *some* of the FastPass machines (like Pirates & HM).

Anyway, you should look at the other thread because there are some good points made. Also, if we could keep the discussion on that thread, it'll make it easier for those trying to follow it than having to read two threads with duplicate posts.

Thanks,

Sarangel


I am happy that Disneyland is scaling back their fastpass system. What I haven't seen mentioned here yet is how disneyland has a multi-tiered level of fastpasses. Unlike Florida where you can only get one fastpass at a time, you can actually get several fastpasses at Disneyland. Many of the rides in Disneyland are not connected and you could actually hold up to 5 Fastpasses at a single time. This is depending on which rides you choose. On top of THAT, many packages offer a nearly unlimited supply of Fastpasses. with those, you can hold a fastpass for each of the fastpass attractions at the same time. Granted, you could only have one fastpass at a time for say Splash Mountain, but you could also have a fastpass for every other single fastpass attraction in the park.
There are other minor issues which I think adds to the fastpass burden in Disneyland. Park hopping is much easier there so you are much more likely to have people holding fastpasses for DL and DCA at the same time. And we could also discuss the attractions CM's that take the "anytime fastpass" books and distribute them amongst their friends.

Disneyland just went way overboard with fastpass and it is a product that I truly enjoy. While it helps some rides, it seems to have hurt others like Pirates. A perfect example was during the POTC premiere last year. When they were constructing the stadium seating for the event, fastpass at Pirates had to go bye bye. And what happened to Pirates line? It was generally a 15 minute wait. The crowds were still there but it has such a high throughput. The next week, same level of crowds and the line is in the 30-45 minute range once fastpass is back.
As for scaling back the days of the program, it'll be no different than how it's done at WDW from what it sounds like. I remember many days in the off season, the fastpass machines were closed in the WDW parks because it was needed. It seems that'll be the same MO for Disneyland
 
Scoop, I agree that Ouimet and Emmer seem to to "get it" so I'm willing to wait and see what happens out there...But as I said, I'm not sold and I won't be their test track dummie thus they've caused us to cancel our visit...Time will tell if this is a mistake or not.

DL experts, please tell me how it could be better to eliminate FP at main attractions rather than scale them back (the numbers) or put all machines on line together (to enforce the 1 FP rule)?

pirate:
 
Let's keep this thread focused on the DISNEYLAND FastPass system & the proposed changes. I've split off all the general FastPass discussion into it's own thread.

Thanks,

Sarangel
 
Originally posted by dcentity2000
Fastpass limits options as you are impelled to be in a specific place within a specific time period.

Rich: I had to think about this. Fastpass limits options because you have a set time to ride an attraction.

I guess you're right - but only if you actually use your pass. You are committed to something. So for that window of time, you either elect to take advantage of that opportunity and forgoe all other options or you don't.

Now doesn't the same hold true no matter what ride you're in line for? How does FP create this situation on its' own?

This make you feel a little bit herded as there is less spontenaity about the whole experience... at least for me. That's why, although I love the occasional fastpass, I couldn't hack it being everywhere.

You lost me. You feel herded because the spontaneity is gone? I view herded as forcing masses of people in one certain direction. I don't understand how certain individuals being granted a specific time to ride an attraction generates that situation as a whole.
 
I think many people who complain about fastpass don't use it properly. I've seen people get their fastpass then sit outside the ride until it's their time. I've also heard (and read on these boards) people complaining about 'those' people who get to go to the head of the line, not understanding that everyone can get fastpasses.

I think it's great, no matter what Disney's original motives were. Last summer we were able to hit 12 major attractions at MK before noon by taking advantage of EE and FP. It made for a hectic morning, but a very relaxing afternoon.
 
Originally posted by Peter Pirate
Scoop, I agree that Ouimet and Emmer seem to to "get it" so I'm willing to wait and see what happens out there...But as I said, I'm not sold and I won't be their test track dummie thus they've caused us to cancel our visit...Time will tell if this is a mistake or not.

DL experts, please tell me how it could be better to eliminate FP at main attractions rather than scale them back (the numbers) or put all machines on line together (to enforce the 1 FP rule)?

pirate:

I'll use recent visits as an example. Normally Haunted Mansion and Pirates would have a summertime standby wait of 30+ minutes. This pretty much requires you to get a fastpass if you want to ride the attraction. Since they've done away with fastpass on the two attractions, the lines have been 15 minutes or less. Today at 4:30 both attractions were at under 10 minutes. They have such a high throughput that it just was not needed. An added benefit with Pirates is that the queue is now retained in that "courtyard" area that housed the lines and fastpass machines. This eliminates the line from going out into the walkway of the already crowded ROA area. 'Twas very nice to be able to walk through there fairly easily.
star Tours had a standby wait of about 20 minutes and without fastpass it would have been 10 minutes and under.
I say if the attraction doesn't need it, don't have fastpass on it.
Mansion needs it for Haunted Mansion Holiday but not for the rest of the year. Splash, Space, Big Thunder, Indy, and Roger Rabbit need it the most imo. Small World Holiday and Haunted Mansion Holiday definately need it too.
Another observation of mine was some of the traffic jams that were created from poor planning. Pooh took over Splash's old fastpass distribution area and they built a new fastpass distribution area for Splash next to Haunted Mansion's exit. In this one spot, you get all the people exiting from mansion "running into" all the people trying to get fastpasses for Splash or entering the Splash standby line. Get rid of fastpass for Pooh. It's the middle of summer and it has a 5 minute line. Move Splash's fastpass distribution area back to the old spot and you've solved a nasty traffic jam.
It may seem like I'm negative on fastpass but i'm not. I really love fastpass and use it to my advantage.... HOWEVER, it is not perfect and has definately been overused in DL.
 
... why couldn't they go to the method used by US/IOA ? There is a touch screen kiosk, offers FP for three rides. You simply touch the screen for the ride ride want, very simple to operate.
 












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