Disney's Legacy FastPass Failure

[morethananyonex]

Do folks really want to go back to that? Yup. I do.

That is one ride, and one of the only (or simply the only) ride that had this issue this bad. One ride that is largely the reason for the lovely tiers at DHS. Or wait, are those tiers now fan favourites? Do folks really want those tiers? I would gladly take those lines for TSMM in exchange for the old system back with all the aspects of it that I love compared to FP+. FP- was by no means a perfect system, but overall IMO the good parts outweighed the flaws. I cannot say the same about FP+.

Now ask yourselves, would you rather have a system that allows you to reserve TSMM in advance (with the same small number of daily FP as before) OR would you rather the chunk of money spent on FP+ went towards new attractions at DHS that can take the pressure off TSMM? Do folks really not want new attractions? What's so special about this??

 

[juliebug1997]

We never rode stand by on TSMM. As soon as we saw when our next FP was available, we would be hanging around the FP machines or get in the long line. We were able to get three in one day.

 

[KYDisneyDad]

This is my confusion. You say you could not get more fast passes unless you inserted multiple tickets. Do you mean current plastic tickets purchased for that day? or just tickets (old plastic park tickets)? I have no problem with people riding a popular ride 2 times if they had to wait the allotted time to get the new fast pass. I am just confused as to whether people were able to get really crafty under the old system and ride many times and go back to back? I know people were able to do it when they were introducing the new system in November and people were pulling crazy number sod tickets. Really just trying to understand. I quoted a person who said if they were industrious they could get more than one ticket from the fast pass, I thought they meant in waiting in that one line? Am I misunderstanding?

If this is what you meant, then my apologies......
Under legacy fastpass guest were able, with their valid park ticket that had to have been used to enter that park on that day, obtain a paper fastpass for a later return time. The restriction on this were that you could obtain another fastpass from any other attraction that offered them ( Even the SAME attraction you had already obtained one from earlier) in generally a couple of hours or so. That was the system and it was available to any park guest. Those who arrived earlier could naturally get more Fastpasses per day.

What you mentioned in Nov what the "double dipping" of using paper fastpass while also testing FP+ 3 a day reservations. Many people had a problem with this claiming they were "cheating" . This ended with the removal of paper fastpass machines that left us with this mess we are in now....

 

[Caboosey]

I say this all the time but I will say it again. Yes, it's true that some of us got more than 3 Fps in a day at a park. Usually, because we were there at RD. But ANYONE was able to do that if they wanted to. Of course, most don't want to get up at the butt crack of dawn for a Space FP. Fine. It is not MY fault that they won't get there when I do. Why should my family feel badly or be accused of abusing a system because we got there to start getting FPs? When it tells me right on the FP when I can get the next one. That makes absolutely NO sense to me. Believe me, no machine ever gave us a FP that we weren't ENTITLED TO.

Word.

 

[minniemous]

So let me get this straight.....because you didn't know the ins and outs of the old system then it was unfair, but because I researched it and knew how to get around and get multiple fastpasses a day within the rules set BY Disney I was misusing it? Am I understanding your correctly?

I will not miss running from ride to ride to get fastpasses, but I do not like the limitations or the tiered system that is in place. I hate only getting 3 per day and I hate that it is available for rides that do not need it therefore causing new lines to form there that weren't there before to let fastpass people in. I agree with only being allowed to prebook 3 if any at all, because honestly that should be done a day in advance for onsite guests and day of for off site (yes I am in the camp that onsite deserves a bit of a perk, oh well). Then I think after the precooked number when you are in the park you should be able to do like the old system and go to a ride not a dumb kiosk and scan your band and get a time to come back.

Knowing how to tour the parks and utilize your time wisely was not a misuse of the old system. It was research and time and a well planned day/trip. This new system hurts my head. We are going in May and the fact that I have to decide now where I want to be and what time drives me insane!! The planning out where to be and what time is why we stopped doing the plus dining and switched to quick service dining, because I hate ADRs. Even now I have two for my upcoming trip for the Star Wars Character meals and ugh....knowing I have to be in HS at this time on this date and I can't change my mind is frustrating. As is my prebooked FP for Anna and Elsa.

Sorry, not trying to attack, but it bugs me when people say the things you said....

You are really misunderstanding me. When I say I did no know the ins and outs what I am trying to say is I do not understand if it was something that was abused.

I do NOT mean that abuse equals getting a fast pass waiting the amount of time and then getting another. I read a lot of things on these boards I do not understand if there was real abuse or if it was even possible.

I know for a fact when I was there in November people were pulling many many tickets using old room keys. That is not right. I have also heard people say stuff like if you can do it, it is not abuse in relation to this. I really do not agree with the idea that finding a loop hole makes it ok. (Not saying this is your opinion)

I was under the impression that perhaps this is always something that people could get a way with under the old system. This is what I mean I do not understand. I was hoping to get the information. So I thank you for what you did say regarding the old system.

I have no problem with people having a well planned vacation and if they are getting around the parks in a well planned fashion.

However I think Disney wants to make a system that will allow everyone to enjoy the parks without having to dedicate a crazy amount of time to be come a WDW expert. Most people do not have the time, inclination or energy to do it and perhaps this is part of the reason why they are doing this. Perhaps it has nothing as to why they are doing it.

I could care less if people are planning to an inch of there life and getting more out of the parks than me. I am always interested myself in learning more because I do love visiting Disney so much. I simply did not.. and still do not understand if there actual abuse of the system. Not what you are talking about. I do not consider that abuse.

 

[practicallyperfect77]

Now just imagine all those people in that line sitting on their couch and hitting a button on their computer to reserve it for October 24, 2014! The return time is already out to "noon". If that many people can do it from their couch while slurpping down a bowl of ice cream then what do u think your return time will be?

As long as it's Oct 24th and not the 30th....that's when I'll tentatively be back. I'll be staying up late that night to reserve right when it comes available. It'll be interesting to see if all times are available.

 

[minniemous]

If this is what you meant, then my apologies......
Under legacy fastpass guest were able, with their valid park ticket that had to have been used to enter that park on that day, obtain a paper fastpass for a later return time. The restriction on this were that you could obtain another fastpass from any other attraction that offered them ( Even the SAME attraction you had already obtained one from earlier) in generally a couple of hours or so. That was the system and it was available to any park guest. Those who arrived earlier could naturally get more Fastpasses per day.

What you mentioned in Nov what the "double dipping" of using paper fastpass while also testing FP+ 3 a day reservations. Many people had a problem with this claiming they were "cheating" . This ended with the removal of paper fastpass machines that left us with this mess we are in now....

Thank you. For the explanation. This makes sense. I really did not understand.

 

[jtowntoflorida]

This was our experience in October of 2011, 2012, and 2013, and how we were able to ride TSM 4 times in one day. We shared this technique with many other friends and family members, who all rode TSM at least 3 times in a day at various times during the year:

At RD, pull TSM FP. If you're good and fast, you should get the first return time: 9:40-10:40, which also means that you can pull your next FP at 9:40. Ride SB for ride #1. At precisely 9:40, pull your second TSM FP...by this time the return time was typically early afternoon. Then ride TSM for the second time with FP#1. At 11:40 your FP window opens again, so that's when you pull your third FP, which by then was for sometime in the evening. By the end of the day, you've ridden TSM 4 times...once SB and three times with FP.

This worked for us for three trips, and it was awesome because the only rides we do at DHS are TSM and Star Tours, which was a ride for which you never really needed a FP.

It wasn't until FP+ was introduced that TSM FPs were all gone within the first hour of park opening. Typically, there would still be TSM FPs available until at least late morning (and sometimes as late as 1:00 or 2:00).

So, FP+ is a definite downgrade for us. With FP+, we'll likely have to be satisfied with two rides at most...once SB and once with the FP+ we've schedule 60 days in advance.

 

[wdwfanatic80]

You are really misunderstanding me. When I say I did no know the ins and outs what I am trying to say is I do not understand if it was something that was abused.

I do NOT mean that abuse equals getting a fast pass waiting the amount of time and then getting another. I read a lot of things on these boards I do not understand if there was real abuse or if it was even possible.

I know for a fact when I was there in November people were pulling many many tickets using old room keys. That is not right. I have also heard people say stuff like if you can do it, it is not abuse in relation to this. I really do not agree with the idea that finding a loop hole makes it ok. (Not saying this is your opinion)

I was under the impression that perhaps this is always something that people could get a way with under the old system. This is what I mean I do not understand. I was hoping to get the information. So I thank you for what you did say regarding the old system.

I have no problem with people having a well planned vacation and if they are getting around the parks in a well planned fashion.

However I think Disney wants to make a system that will allow everyone to enjoy the parks without having to dedicate a crazy amount of time to be come a WDW expert. Most people do not have the time, inclination or energy to do it and perhaps this is part of the reason why they are doing this. Perhaps it has nothing as to why they are doing it.

I could care less if people are planning to an inch of there life and getting more out of the parks than me. I am always interested myself in learning more because I do love visiting Disney so much. I simply did not.. and still do not understand if there actual abuse of the system. Not what you are talking about. I do not consider that abuse.

In the fall there was abuse going on in my opinion, so if that is when you traveled, my apologies, I misunderstood. Our last trip was June and it was still just stick your room key in and get one fastpass. Not the double dipping that was going on in Sept/Oct/Nov/Dec with people testing FP+ and using current room keys AND old room keys that were linked somehow.

I am sorry that you experienced that.

As for the research....I didn't really. My research has come in the form of SEVERAL trips and learning the system and how to best utilize it for my family. I will learn again, just frustrating. And while I know that Travel Agents are the anti thing here for the most part because everyone here (for the most part) wants control of their trip, if you are someone that does not have the time or want to invest the time, research and find a good TA that SPECIALIZES in Disney. The good ones would have helped you with all of this and taught you how to use legacy fastpass to your advantage.

 

[dissupermom]

"since you can't please everyone, then please no one"... with all the complaints, disney will say, fuggetabottit and get rid of all FP, be it +,-, 3/4, 1/2, and make everyone stand in one long line.. I'm just so happy to be there, for me, it's whatever!!!

 

[KYDisneyDad]

Thank you. For the explanation. This makes sense. I really did not understand.

Well in my defense I did have to make my annoyingly necessary 180 day in advance dining reservations today on the exact same irritatingly slow glitchy and poorly designed MDE website that I did A YEAR AGO at this time. The only difference being a prettier but still poor user interface, so I'm feeling especially anti MyMagic today!!!

Hope we can all work through this mess together and learn from each other, even if we disagree, because with this new mess of a system we all need to know as much as possible!!!!!

 

[Mad Hattered]

Once again....

Let's say every person is booking 2,3,4,5 or 6 spots from their couch....

 

[siskaren]

This is my confusion. You say you could not get more fast passes unless you inserted multiple tickets. Do you mean current plastic tickets purchased for that day? or just tickets (old plastic park tickets)?

I have no problem with people riding a popular ride 2 times if they had to wait the allotted time to get the new fast pass. I am just confused as to whether people were able to get really crafty under the old system and ride many times and go back to back?

I know people were able to do it when they were introducing the new system in November and people were pulling crazy number sod tickets. Really just trying to understand. I quoted a person who said if they were industrious they could get more than one ticket from the fast pass, I thought they meant in waiting in that one line? Am I misunderstanding?

There's no way I'm aware that people were able to use the old FP system to ride multiple times back to back unless they were using the FPs from other people in their group who didn't want to ride. So for instance, if you had a group of say 6, but only 2 were interested in riding EE, all 6 could pull FPs, but then the 4 who didn't want to ride could give their FPs to the 2 who did, and those 2 could ride 3 times in a row. But one person couldn't insert their ticket, get a FP, then insert it again and get another, which is what I meant by not being able to get multiple FPs without inserting multiple tickets.

But last November when both systems were being used, people somehow found out that old KTTW cards were working in the machines, as well as current KTTW cards, plus they were able to book FP+ ahead of time, and some people took advantage of this by bringing a bunch of old KTTW cards, which I will agree was abusing a loophole.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

I do NOT mean that abuse equals getting a fast pass waiting the amount of time and then getting another. I read a lot of things on these boards I do not understand if there was real abuse or if it was even possible.

This was only possible during the "testing" of FP+ when they paper FP machines were still in the parks.

I know for a fact when I was there in November people were pulling many many tickets using old room keys. Yes did this happen when Disney was allowing some guest to pre-book and still had the paper FP machines in the parks. That is not right. I have also heard people say stuff like if you can do it, it is not abuse in relation to this. I really do not agree with the idea that finding a loop hole makes it ok. (Not saying this is your opinion)

I was under the impression that perhaps this is always something that people could get a way with under the old system.This was NOT possible until Disney started "testing" for the new FP+ system. You had to have a ticket that was used to enter the park for the day to be used in the paper FP machines. Old room keys and old tickets would spit out a paper stating that it was not valid to get a paper FP. Nor get you get one before your allotted time. This is what I mean I do not understand. I was hoping to get the information. So I thank you for what you did say regarding the old system.

I have no problem with people having a well planned vacation and if they are getting around the parks in a well planned fashion.

However I think Disney wants to make a system that will allow everyone to enjoy the parks without having to dedicate a crazy amount of time to be come a WDW expert.The new FP+ has nothing to do with spreading FPs out or to make guest experiences better. Not saying it hasn't be a side effect but the new system is about making money for Disney and to lock guest into Disney parks before they ever leave home. Most people do not have the time, inclination or energy to do it and perhaps this is part of the reason why they are doing this. Perhaps it has nothing as to why they are doing it.

I could care less if people are planning to an inch of there life and getting more out of the parks than me. I am always interested myself in learning more because I do love visiting Disney so much. I simply did not.. and still do not understand if there actual abuse of the system. Not what you are talking about. I do not consider that abuse.

My comments are above in red

 

[surferdave]

Near the end legacy Fastpass was old software and probably obsolete. The fact (or theory rather) that Disney had to turn off safeguards in it that let you scan magnetic strip cards that weren't valid park tickets, like expired room only key cards, to get it to work with FP+ in the interim says a lot about how dated the security structure was. I remember defending the likelihood that it was time to replace it last year for such reasons.

That said, as far as I've ever heard it worked like it was supposed to work when its features weren't defeated for FP+ testing, and guests had to wait 2 hours to get another Fastpass once they had one. It could have been replaced like for like or with some subtle protocol modifications for far less than they've spent on this ambitious system they've created.

 

[morethananyonex]

Once again....

Let's say every person is booking 2,3,4,5 or 6 spots from their couch....

*****snipped the pictures for space*****

This wasn't a FP- problem/failure. This was, and still is, a TSMM and a DHS problem/failure. FP+ didn't add additional tracks to the ride. FP+ didn't build additional family friendly headliners at DHS. Those are the two solutions to the problem. All FP+ did was move that line online, while adding a whole bunch of restrictions to the people waiting in the line.

 

[minniemous]

Well in my defense I did have to make my annoyingly necessary 180 day in advance dining reservations today on the exact same irritatingly slow glitchy and poorly designed MDE website that I did A YEAR AGO at this time. The only difference being a prettier but still poor user interface, so I'm feeling especially anti MyMagic today!!!

Hope we can all work through this mess together and learn from each other, even if we disagree, because with this new mess of a system we all need to know as much as possible!!!!!

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

This wasn't a FP- problem/failure. This was, and still is, a TSMM and a DHS problem/failure. FP+ didn't add additional tracks to the ride. FP+ didn't build additional family friendly headliners at DHS. Those are the two solutions to the problem. All FP+ did was move that line online, while adding a whole bunch of restrictions to the people waiting in the line.

 

[sethschroeder]

Once again....

Let's say every person is booking 2,3,4,5 or 6 spots from their couch....

So what???? Would you rather stand in line 30 mins for a FP- AT the park or keep hitting refresh for 5 mins on your couch?

Again the current state of MDE is not what the end result should be. You should enter at 11:59 and by 12:05 have your FP+ picked and submitted. There should be no endless errors or just days of downtime we see now.

Also to those point out the FP+ kiosk... That will not be an issue for long once everyone off-site starts booking online 30 days out. You will still have a few lines but that will mostly be for people who are really out of the loop going to Disney likely for the first time with FP+ in place.

Finally to everyone complaining about tiers and all the other things. Tiers are in place because MORE people are actually using FP+ now (likely over using to capacity). I also don't see a connection between FP+ = less happy people with their trips. IF Disney can work out the kinks in the technical system and start managing the FP+ allotment better you will see happiness go up.

To throw back the 1+1=2 back at you
If people were getting 4/5/6/7/8/9 FP- in a day that means 1/2/3 people were not using ANY FP-. If there person for the first time ever uses FP+ on their next trip it likely will be a revelation that is just amazing to "skip" the line....

 

[Angel Ariel]

Here is the Legacy FastPass distribution line on one of the slowest days of the year. You have to stand in a long line to get the FastPass and then return later to wait in line again. What is so special about this????? Do folks really want to go back to this????? I, for one.....do not. This happened to me at other rides too and I don't miss it!!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqNZcBgWSxs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs_l2-Vqo0M

I can honestly say that in all of my trips since FASTPASS was implemented - in both WDW and DLR - I have never personally seen nor stood in a FP distribution line like this.

IMO, it's more than a bit disingenuous to post that video of the massive TSMM distribution line and act as though lines like that appeared for every ride that had legacy FP.

Overall, yes, I'd rather potentially have issues with a ride or 2 (and I say potentially because I want to be very clear that I *never* experienced a distribution line (or any legacy FP line for that matter) like those posted), than have the current system.*

*to be further clear - I don't care whether the system is paper or RFID. It's the rules of the system that bother me (and that could be changed). If the tech reliably worked (which is a separate issue), I wouldn't have an issue with the tech itself.