Did you see the girld get beat up by her ex-friends?

[harleyquinn]

Matt Lauer looked and sounded like he was VERY annoyed with the woman. And the Sheriff?? You could just SEE that he wanted to tell the world what he really thought of those girls.

ITA! I could just feel the Sheriff holding himself back. He came off professional and in control, but you could just tell he was really upset about the situation.

 

[mgilmer]

The adult system has one method of dealing with convicted defendants: incarceration and probation. You do your time and that's it. The juvenile system, on the other hand, has a much broader base of penalties to use.

News flash: it can be much harder to fulfill the requirements that a court sets out for a juvenile defendant than it is to fulfill an adult sentence.

I am sorry, sir, but as a therapist for disturbed juveniles for many years and having testified in court cases for truly disturbed juveniles (not monsters like these budding sociopaths), that is complete crap. You will not find ANY juvenile that would rather go through the adult system than the juvenile court system. And the last time I looked, you did not find any criminal defense attorneys trying to get their criminal juvenile clients transferred to adult criminal court because it was easier for them. The fact you would even make such an argument proves my point that those of your profession deserve all the lawyer jokes.

 

[CapeCodTenor]

I just watched the video, well, parts of it anyways. And I saw charge them as adults and lets bring back public humiliation. Put them in a public square in stocks, just like they use to do to those who broke the law. And when they've done time in the stocks, lock them up for a very long time.

 

[dkdaisy]

Original posted by mgilmer

OFF TOPIC RANT

Just as Fagin taught his charges, I am sure. The law is the only profession that makes its living off the misery of others (criminal defense attorneys, personal injury attorneys, divorce attorneys, etc.). At least in medicine, doctors are trying to get people to get well or relieve suffering. All lawyers care about is getting their thug clients off even when they know they are guilty. Anything for a buck. And if you think average older juveniles (16-17) are not able to recognize the gravity of what they do, you do not deserve to be teaching. As I said on another thread, there is a reason for all those lawyer jokes and it is not admiration.

OFF TOPIC RESPONSE

While there are dishonest lawyers (as there are dishonest doctors, teachers, engineers, janitors, etc, etc, etc), not ALL LAWYERS care about getting "thug clients off even when they know they are guilty". Many lawyers don't even work with criminal cases. These are the lawyers that handle estates, divorces, child custody cases, etc. Painting all lawyers with one brush is just as ignorant as saying all Muslims are terrorists or all people of hispanic descent are illegal immigrants (I am NOT trying to start any sort of political or otherwise arguments here, nor will I respond to any). Grow up.

OP - sorry for the brief hijack. I'm done....

 

[ilovepcot]

Darn that Constitution for providing the right to be represented in court by a "scumbag" lawyer.

The defendants' inability to recognize the gravity of what they did is precisely why they should not be tried as adults, but as juveniles. But hey, what do I know, I just train and teach the future "scumbags" of America.

Wait a minute. Not fooling me one bit! You stayed in a Holiday Inn last night, didn't you?

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

I am sorry, sir, but as a therapist for disturbed juveniles for many years and having testified in court cases for truly disturbed juveniles (not monsters like these budding sociopaths), that is complete crap. You will not find ANY juvenile that would rather go through the adult system than the juvenile court system. And the last time I looked, you did not find any criminal defense attorneys trying to get their criminal juvenile clients transferred to adult criminal court because it was easier for them. The fact you would even make such an argument proves my point that those of your profession deserve all the lawyer jokes.

Interesting. One of my main areas of practice and now research is with children and the juvenile court system. I didn't realize I was so misinformed about one of my specialties.

Of course defense attorneys don't want clients transferred to adult court even if they would receive a lighter or easier sentence, because the adult record is permanent. The juvenile record can be expunged.

My point was simply that if these defendants are to be rehabilitated, it's not going to happen in the adult system. In the juvenile system, it's still not likely to happen, but it's at least possible. Of course, if they're lucky enough to have a such a caring therapist like yourself, I'm sure we can expect success.

Oh, and thanks for the assumption about my gender.

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

OFF TOPIC RANT

Just as Fagin taught his charges, I am sure. The law is the only profession that makes its living off the misery of others (criminal defense attorneys, personal injury attorneys, divorce attorneys, etc.). At least in medicine, doctors are trying to get people to get well or relieve suffering. All lawyers care about is getting their thug clients off even when they know they are guilty. Anything for a buck. And if you think average older juveniles (16-17) are not able to recognize the gravity of what they do, you do not deserve to be teaching. As I said on another thread, there is a reason for all those lawyer jokes and it is not admiration.

Wow, I missed this gem of a response. Please place me on your ignore list. I don't wish to be attacked.

 

[mgilmer]

Of course, if they're lucky enough to have a such a caring therapist like yourself, I'm sure we can expect success.

Oh, and thanks for the assumption about my gender.

Ok, Ma'am, I have had a great deal of success with my patients who, like the victim in this case, have suffered immense physical abuse, sexual abuse, or emotional abuse. And guess who has, without exception, stepped up to represent the perpetrators of that abuse? That's right -- lawyers! And guess how they always try to "help" their clients? By further victimizing my patients, of course! Heaven forbid they ever have their clients admit their errors. That never happens. It is not in their financial interests to do so. I stick by my original statement about lawyers and scum.

 

[Jennasis]

Come on guys...take it outside.

Seriously. No need for bashing of people or professions which have nothing ultimately to do with the topic at hand.

 

[MushyMushy]

I saw it on one of the morning programs this morning. It was awful. I work in schools, and it saddens me regularly just how vicious kids can be these days.

One of the anchors on the show talked about how scary it was that the girls seemed to have a total disconnect from any sort of empathy at all. Scary...


P.S. Another Trek fan here too!

What is it with kids and fighting anymore??? A fight breaks out daily in our school, and we live in a relatively calm rural small town. It's unreal. Today in one of my classes, one boy stabbed another with a pencil (drawing blood) and the other punched him back and they were just laughing about it. I seriously think it was a bonding experience for them. It's insane.

Ok, Ma'am, I have had a great deal of success with my patients who, like the victim in this case, have suffered immense physical abuse, sexual abuse, or emotional abuse. And guess who has, without exception, stepped up to represent the perpetrators of that abuse? That's right -- lawyers! And guess how they always try to "help" their clients? By further victimizing my patients, of course! Heaven forbid they ever have their clients admit their errors. That never happens. It is not in their financial interests to do so. I stick by my original statement about lawyers and scum.

You have patients?

You seriously sound like you need to be one yourself. EVERYone deserves fair representation, whether you like it or not. I, for one, am glad we have attorneys to help us when we need it. Yes, even the bad guys.

 

[GeorgeG]

I saw a little bit of it. I'm glad the teens will be charged as adults. This was definitely malicious intent.

I think there needs to be a new classification of charging teens. They are growing up too quickly these days and they know what they are doing, especially with bullying and group bullying being such a problem. With technology like TV & YouTube teaching them how to be vicious, being charged either as an adult or only as a juvenile, seems inaequate nowadays.

A felony is a felony. Nobody should get a free ride because they're not officially an adult. Kids today think they're grown up way too young. If that's how they want to behave they should have the snot slapped out of them (sorry, but after seeing the video that's the nicest way I can put it).

 

[budbeerlady]

A felony is a felony. Nobody should get a free ride because they're not officially an adult. Kids today think they're grown up way too young. If that's how they want to behave they should have the snot slapped out of them (sorry, but after seeing the video that's the nicest way I can put it).

You might have a side point I would like to bring up. If we had ever thought about acting that way we would have had it hard upside the head. The kids are brats who need to be slapped hard over this, since atleast one of the parents wont do it. And throw the dumb mom in with them for good measure. What is the matter with people now days!

 

[poohandwendy]

Darn that Constitution for providing the right to be represented in court by a "scumbag" lawyer.

The defendants' inability to recognize the gravity of what they did is precisely why they should not be tried as adults, but as juveniles. But hey, what do I know, I just train and teach the future "scumbags" of America.

Not sure I would agree that they are showing an inability to recognize the gravity of what they did as much as showing evidence of people who are lacking conscience. I think the girls just plain didn't care what the consequence would be for their actions. I think they should be tried as adults because they premeditated this attack and show no remorse.

But, I do agree that they absolutely have the right to good counsel.

 

[DizBelle]

Ok, Ma'am, I have had a great deal of success with my patients who, like the victim in this case, have suffered immense physical abuse, sexual abuse, or emotional abuse. And guess who has, without exception, stepped up to represent the perpetrators of that abuse? That's right -- lawyers! And guess how they always try to "help" their clients? By further victimizing my patients, of course! Heaven forbid they ever have their clients admit their errors. That never happens. It is not in their financial interests to do so. I stick by my original statement about lawyers and scum.

SOME are scum. By no means are all scum.....

There's scum in every profession.

 

[imsorry]

Wow, I missed this gem of a response. Please place me on your ignore list. I don't wish to be attacked.

Well, I can only hope it is your day off. I am retired and have time to "Dis". I hope that parents and students who are paying exorbitant tuitions are not paying you to teach law while you are *here* defending your position.

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

Well, I can only hope it is your day off. I am retired and have time to "Dis". I hope that parents and students who are paying exorbitant tuitions are not paying you to teach law while you are *here* defending your position.

Slow day at the office. Final exams are written, final lectures are prepared, no articles to work on (waiting for editors to get back to me), and nobody came for office hours. But thanks for the concern.

If you'd like to attack me further, please come over to the "are lawyers really that bad?" thread, rather than take this thread further off topic.

 

[imsorry]

Slow day at the office. Final exams are written, final lectures are prepared, no articles to work on (waiting for editors to get back to me), and nobody came for office hours. But thanks for the concern.

If you'd like to attack me further, please come over to the "are lawyers really that bad?" thread, rather than take this thread further off topic.

OK, and I'm sure you have a bridge to sell me..............slow day........and you are still there at 7:30? Who are you billing for these gems?

 

[nuttylawprofessor]

OK, and I'm sure you have a bridge to sell me..............slow day........and you are still there at 7:30? Who are you billing for these gems?

Well, let's see. I got to the office at 8, responded to some emails, held 2 hours of office hours that nobody came to. Meanwhile, I read the newspaper, reviewed the new volume of the Journal of Legal Education (snoooooze), looked at the last two issues of the ABA Journal (fascinating articles about Mac v. PC use in the legal profession and another interesting article on the ABA accreditation of law schools), and played on the DIS. I got ready to meet with some colleagues for a lunchtime brown-bag discussion, but the session was cancelled. I spent the next couple hours reading here and on two different lawprof blogs. I responded to some more emails as they came in and celebrated my school's higher ranking this year in US News.

I left the office at about 2. I stopped at the supermarket to pick up some household supplies. I came home, cleaned the kitchen, and played around on the internet and DIS some more. Remarkably, I have a computer in my office AND a computer at home: actually a PC in the office and a Mac at home, which is probably why I found the ABA article really interesting.

None of my time was billable. That's one of the benefits of my job... no more billables. Anything else I can answer for you? Please feel free to PM.

 

[Conservative Hippie]

I heard about it and it is only adding to my resolve to homeschool. That happened not too far from here, and if those are the kinds of kids that go to school here I do not want my DD anywhere near them.

 

[denisem]

The defendants' inability to recognize the gravity of what they did is precisely why they should not be tried as adults, but as juveniles.

This "inability" is also a classic description of sociopaths.

I don't use this term lightly: I'm aware being a teenager today isn't easy when you mix in the usual hormones/drama/impulsiveness/stupidity. Stuff happens. But this was an obvious premeditated (approx.) 30 minute beating coupled with videotaping for YouTube AND making smart-*** comments about "missing cheerleading practice" and "the beach" while in police custody.

THAT frightens me. It wasn't an instantaneous "talking smack" and taking a swing at each other on the playground. This was gang mentality behavior that stayed true to form before, during and after the incident.