Demand based ticket pricing

[minnie-apple-mouse]

They definitely should but I still haven't seen reports of phased closings during that time. You'd think in theory that if Disney says the parks are so crowded that we would see these things.

Have you been there then? Access is one thing, getting anything done is far different.

Phased closings are horrible. It also means the days around it are very close to phased closings as well, esp XMAS week.

I'm saying it is getting worse/busier every year. Should they just keep on the same path and phase close even sooner and more often?

Spreading guests into the rest of the year may be beneficial.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

They definitely should but I still haven't seen reports of phased closings during that time. You'd think in theory that if Disney says the parks are so crowded that we would see these things.

OCT 15? Think of XMAS week?

Definitely not right now, was in Magic Kingdom yesterday, it was horrific. I blame a lot of my displeasure on the sun, but it was crazy busy. We did 2 of our fastpasses, ate at Casey's and Peco's bill (food was actually pretty good but the wait time and rudeness of people was astounding), and then headed back to the hotel for the pool after giving up hope of getting anything done without being miserable. They had the parade route for Festival of Fantasy roped off for 3 hours! Is that really necessary? Hoping the rest of the week goes better...

 

[Mac30188]

The unprecedented crowds in October are only strengthening the position that Disney needs to make changes. The easiest (and most stockholder friendly)way is to raise prices to keep attendance from hitting capacity. To a certain extent, demand based pricing has already been implemented successfully in resorts with different seasons and specials. The idea that the concept would be expanded until there are no slow seasons and no days that Disney hits capacity would be their Utopian goal. What makes me sad is the lack of previous expansion has Disney playing catch up. Therefore the supply side of the equation is lagging and largely constrained. The only way to accomplish the goal short term is drive down the demand through pricing. The real issue to fault Disney for is that leading up to this point they were very reluctant to invest in ride expansion in WDW until the supply/demand problem was on their door step. Previously they pocketed the profits rather than investing in the park and that is why some families will be priced out of Disney vacations. As far as right now, they are doing the right things of rapidly expanding and trying to manage the glut of demand.

 

[Eoghann]

Honestly, you actually think folks walk up to MK XMAS week, are THEN told the MK is full-and they either just stand there all day or go back to the hotel, because nobody "encouraged them" or "reminded them" there are 3 other parks?

There are signs everywhere for drivers, boats tell you, buses at the resorts will tell you. Even if you did get all the way to gate, and I know this may be hard to believe but even the Disney cm's will recommend you go get on a bus to another park.

Believe me, the other parks are packed as well, you will get in though....for now.

When I talk about "encouragement" I'm not talking about CMs suggesting it, I'm talking about putting enough things in those parks to make people want to go there first.

For the majority of visitors, they go to Disney to see the Magic Kingdom. The other parks are an add on, not the reason for the visit and that's why only the Magic Kingdom has capacity problems. This is something that Disney have fed into forever. Their adverts sell the Magic Kingdom above all else. The MK has more rides than all the other parks put together. The only parade is in the MK. The "must do" fireworks show is in the MK.

The original point being this could be fixed without demand pricing. They're doing that for the extra money not for capacity reasons.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

The unprecedented crowds in October are only strengthening the position that Disney needs to make changes. The easiest (and most stockholder friendly)way is to raise prices to keep attendance from hitting capacity. To a certain extent, demand based pricing has already been implemented successfully in resorts with different seasons and specials. The idea that the concept would be expanded until there are no slow seasons and no days that Disney hits capacity would be their Utopian goal. What makes me sad is the lack of previous expansion has Disney playing catch up. Therefore the supply side of the equation is lagging and largely constrained. The only way to accomplish the goal short term is drive down the demand through pricing. The real issue to fault Disney for is that leading up to this point they were very reluctant to invest in ride expansion in WDW until the supply/demand problem was on their door step. Previously they pocketed the profits rather than investing in the park and that is why some families will be priced out of Disney vacations. As far as right now, they are doing the right things of rapidly expanding and trying to manage the glut of demand.

I agree, beyond successful the route they took, time to grow further.

A lot of folks (many on here) think a crash/bubble is coming, maybe they are listening.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

When I talk about "encouragement" I'm not talking about CMs suggesting it, I'm talking about putting enough things in those parks to make people want to go there first.

For the majority of visitors, they go to Disney to see the Magic Kingdom. The other parks are an add on, not the reason for the visit and that's why only the Magic Kingdom has capacity problems. This is something that Disney have fed into forever. Their adverts sell the Magic Kingdom above all else. The MK has more rides than all the other parks put together. The only parade is in the MK. The "must do" fireworks show is in the MK.

The original point being this could be fixed without demand pricing. They're doing that for the extra money not for capacity reasons.

Correct.

You mean like DS, DHS PH3, TSM 2, Star Wars, Toy Story Land, Frozen, Soarin 2, ROL and Avatar type things?

Those will help-but MK XMAS will always be the draw.

Having incentive to visit the rest of the year is logical IMO. Even with the coming expansion-maybe more so.

 

[crazy4wdw]

The unprecedented crowds in October are only strengthening the position that Disney needs to make changes.

Touring plans has October 5 at the MK rated as a "10" in terms of the day's attendance. That's Christmas Day and New Year's Eve type crowds. According to touring plans "this is the first time ever that Magic Kingdom has seen a crowd level ’10’ outside of summer or holidays."

 

[rteetz]

Have you been there then? Access is one thing, getting anything done is far different.

Phased closings are horrible. It also means the days around it are very close to phased closings as well, esp XMAS week.

I'm saying it is getting worse/busier every year. Should they just keep on the same path and phase close even sooner and more often?

Spreading guests into the rest of the year may be beneficial.

I understand and no I've never been during Christmas but will going to tiered pricing during this time really help crowds go down? I think Christmas week is just always going to be crazy.

 

[rteetz]

OCT 15? Think of XMAS week?

I'm confused now I thought we were talking about Christmas.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

I'm confused now I thought we were talking about Christmas.

I'm saying the report today is super busy-XMAS week will be much busier. The attendance is indeed trending up.

 

[rteetz]

I'm saying the report today is super busy-XMAS week will be much busier. The attendance is indeed trending up.

Well attendance has been up the entire year so that isn't surprising. But like I said will raising the prices actually get people to not go during Christmas week? I don't think so.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

Well attendance has been up the entire year so that isn't surprising. But like I said will raising the prices actually get people to not go during Christmas week? I don't think so.

Will keeping them the same or lowering them reduce the crowd level?

Offering another solution for cheaper will indeed change some minds IMO.

 

[rteetz]

Will keeping them the same or lowering them reduce the crowd level?

Offering another solution for cheaper will indeed change some minds IMO.

Well they definitely won't be lowering prices. Tiering will likely be current price during what is considered the slower times. +5-10 for moderate times, then plus another 5-10 for high times like Christmas.

 

[Josh Hendy]

I don't think the other three parks will ever be as packed at MK is.

I think that's another way of saying that as long as Disney sells multi-day tickets with steep discounts for extra days, the other parks will always be "half parks for half price".

 

[Josh Hendy]

As for the crowding, or perception of crowding ... remember that Disney can either operate all the rides, restaurant, lunch counters, shows at high capacity, or they can cut back on staff and reduce the number of tracks, vehicles, tables, servers, cashiers, cooks and adjust individual venue operating hours and schedules. Plus bus and monorail schedules. Mode 'B' might give the feeling of huge crowds due to people milling around. Waiting for the parade starting over 1 hour before because they're not certain of being able to get in and out of Pirates in that time ... for example.

It may be that there really is an unprecedented surge of travelers to Orlando this autumn ... or it may be Mode 'B'.

I'd be interested in hearing evidence to support either theory. Are the resorts super busy, in the places where it would show like around the pools (assuming pools aren't roped off and in mode 'B')

Is Universal crazy busy this month? Are the offsite resorts full and is I-Drive jammed most of the time? (compared to previous autumns)

A Disney-only surge would tend to make me suspicious. I know about pixie dust and everything but ... what about flue powder. And we know that announcements of future attractions (Frozen, Avatar, Toy Story, Star Wars) don't cause a surge of visitors, they tend to cause a drought as people "save up" and wait in the weeds for the new thing.

 

[Mac30188]

It could be a multitude of factors including the general public slowly getting the subtle message from Disney to visit during off times a little too well.

1) You have a growing outlet of services aimed at helping people pick the best time to go to Disney and many recommend the fall times.
2) Pricing in fall is cheaper then pricing in summer
3) The Halloween party makes Sept/Oct a "holiday season"
4) Disney brand has had a very strong resurgence based on the popularity of Star Wars and Frozen. Even this year, the prediction from my daughters class of 3-4 year olds is half of the girls will dress up as Elsa for Halloween. That is absolutely amazing considering the movie came out 2 years ago.
5) This is certainly in the top third as far as weather. Not as sweltering as Summer, but still solid swimming weather. The rain probably keeps it from being the absolute best month, but it is close.
6) Economy has rebounded to the point that more people are ready to go on vacation.

 

[crazy4wdw]

It appears that the ticket price increases are coming soon! Mousesavers and Undercover Tourist are suggesting that folks buy tickets now as an increase is coming, most likely before the Christmas holidays.

 

[crazy4wdw]

It could be a multitude of factors including the general public slowly getting the subtle message from Disney to visit during off times a little too well.

2) Pricing in fall is cheaper then pricing in summer

This will change in 2016. The rates for most of the resorts for summer 2016 and October 2016 are the same. The only "fall" rates are for Nov. 14 -18 and Nov 26 - Dec 10.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

I think that's another way of saying that as long as Disney sells multi-day tickets with steep discounts for extra days, the other parks will always be "half parks for half price".

Yep, and we prefer that to just 2 bigger parks.

 

[minnie-apple-mouse]

As for the crowding, or perception of crowding ... remember that Disney can either operate all the rides, restaurant, lunch counters, shows at high capacity, or they can cut back on staff and reduce the number of tracks, vehicles, tables, servers, cashiers, cooks and adjust individual venue operating hours and schedules. Plus bus and monorail schedules. Mode 'B' might give the feeling of huge crowds due to people milling around. Waiting for the parade starting over 1 hour before because they're not certain of being able to get in and out of Pirates in that time ... for example.

It may be that there really is an unprecedented surge of travelers to Orlando this autumn ... or it may be Mode 'B'.

I'd be interested in hearing evidence to support either theory. Are the resorts super busy, in the places where it would show like around the pools (assuming pools aren't roped off and in mode 'B')

Is Universal crazy busy this month? Are the offsite resorts full and is I-Drive jammed most of the time? (compared to previous autumns)

A Disney-only surge would tend to make me suspicious. I know about pixie dust and everything but ... what about flue powder. And we know that announcements of future attractions (Frozen, Avatar, Toy Story, Star Wars) don't cause a surge of visitors, they tend to cause a drought as people "save up" and wait in the weeds for the new thing.

Can totally believe this is possible, but just can't quite get my arms around the reason.

Sept/Oct attendance only has 3 scenarios, either it went up, down or stayed the same.

Using an example

If there were 10,000 guests on a day last Sept/Oct.

Prices went up, park was not updated-so this September/Oct there were 9,000 guests..BUT.. manipulated to look much busier.

Now they raise prices even further so next Sept/Oct there will be 8,000?

OR:

There were 10K last Sept/Oct.

This year again 10K but looks more like 12K

Raise prices to make it 9K?

OR:

There were 10K last Sept/Oct

This year 11K looks more like 15K

Raise prices and "only" increase it to 12K (when it might have went to 13K, 15K)?


So depending on the "cover charge" and the "in park guest spending" and the "resort occupancy" the dining/drinking/souvenirs etc-find the same revenue from the fewest possible guests correct?

Keeping in mind many will leave/not come back simply because it was soo busy (even if that was intentional) no matter how expensive/cheap and/or because its become too expensive.


Which one do you think it is?