Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

[knockUout]

I am an owner that rented points at 10 months for a priority resort in March. These points were banked from 2018 with an April use year. In March I was asked by David's to return the 70% payment and cancel the reservation (this was right before the check-in date). I replied to David's that these points would expire April 1, 2020 which David's knew from the original contract signed. I inquired if the renters had insurance and never received a reply to that question. I was asked to not cancel the reservation online because the points would not be allocated properly. I inquired to the status of the remaining 30% and was told that would need to be used to compensate the renter. I called DVC and asked about my point status (this was in March). I was told they would expire April 1, 2020. I conveyed this to Davids. The only response was that the 30% would be used to compensate renters. In April, I reached out to Davids and offered to reschedule for THIS FAMILY once word was received that my points could be used by Oct 1, 2020. I never received a reply to this offer.

Today I received an email from Davids.
"We wanted to reach out to you today with regards to the points that were to be used for the ********** that were due to expire at the end of March 2020. AS you may be aware DVC has released a new policy extending the expiration date of April and June use years...... We would like to extend the opportunity to re-rent these points so that we may continue to offer your guests an amicable solution for their cancelled reservations as well as to provide you with compensation for the 30% balance left owing to you should we successfully re-rent your points. If you are interested in renting these points please let us know the following information so that we can determine how they apply to the extension. Use year? Points due to expire? Were these points previously banked from 2019 to 2020 use year? IF you answered yes to the above question, how many points were previously banked from 2018 into 2019? How many points in total would you like rented?"

I emailed back asking if my original renter was wanting to reschedule. Reply from Davids was that the family received a voucher for 24 months and Davids did not know if my original renter could travel in the available time frame. "If you are willing to re-rent the points, we will be re-renting the points to a new guest so that we are able to collect the funds from that new reservation so that we are able to put the funds towards the ********* (original renter) travel credit."

What to do??? I have followed this entire thread and I don't anticipate receiving the 30% that I was owed. This is not a large amount of points. (less than 100). I thought I would send the renter 1/2 of the money that I had received (the 70%) from davids in a rather anonymous manner. The reason for not the entire amount was that these points were booked 10 months prior for a highly desirable location and I would cover my maintenance fees. "Share the loss" I have not contacted the renter.
My business has been shuttered for over six weeks and it appears no govt. assistance is available. I don't plan on utilizing the points myself that were returned to me. My thought actually was to see what plan Davids had and if the original family didn't want to reschedule, I would try to book a reservation and gift a stay to healthcare workers who took care of Covid patients. (resort stay).

Advice please.

 

[knockUout]

I am really not comfortable with Davids voucher plan, new contracts, etc. Fool me once.........

 

[McCrae]

I am really not comfortable with Davids voucher plan, new contracts, etc. Fool me once.........

It’s cod liver oil time...

 

[Bearval]

This is not correct. Credit card companies don't do this to be nice. They have legal obligations which require them to payback their customers if a contracted service is not provided. When reviewing an application for a charge back they make a call on who is correct. if the losing party disagrees they can take the dispute to court.

That is not exactly true,most if not all credit cards have a clause in the contract that you already have agreed to by filling out the application where you surrender your rights to sue them in a court of law. You have agreed to binding arbitration and to use the arborbitor of their choosing .

 

[CraigInPA]

I am an owner that rented points at 10 months for a priority resort in March. These points were banked from 2018 with an April use year. In March I was asked by David's to return the 70% payment and cancel the reservation (this was right before the check-in date). I replied to David's that these points would expire April 1, 2020 which David's knew from the original contract signed. I inquired if the renters had insurance and never received a reply to that question. I was asked to not cancel the reservation online because the points would not be allocated properly. I inquired to the status of the remaining 30% and was told that would need to be used to compensate the renter. I called DVC and asked about my point status (this was in March). I was told they would expire April 1, 2020. I conveyed this to Davids. The only response was that the 30% would be used to compensate renters. In April, I reached out to Davids and offered to reschedule for THIS FAMILY once word was received that my points could be used by Oct 1, 2020. I never received a reply to this offer.

Today I received an email from Davids.
"We wanted to reach out to you today with regards to the points that were to be used for the ********** that were due to expire at the end of March 2020. AS you may be aware DVC has released a new policy extending the expiration date of April and June use years...... We would like to extend the opportunity to re-rent these points so that we may continue to offer your guests an amicable solution for their cancelled reservations as well as to provide you with compensation for the 30% balance left owing to you should we successfully re-rent your points. If you are interested in renting these points please let us know the following information so that we can determine how they apply to the extension. Use year? Points due to expire? Were these points previously banked from 2019 to 2020 use year? IF you answered yes to the above question, how many points were previously banked from 2018 into 2019? How many points in total would you like rented?"

I emailed back asking if my original renter was wanting to reschedule. Reply from Davids was that the family received a voucher for 24 months and Davids did not know if my original renter could travel in the available time frame. "If you are willing to re-rent the points, we will be re-renting the points to a new guest so that we are able to collect the funds from that new reservation so that we are able to put the funds towards the ********* (original renter) travel credit."

What to do??? I have followed this entire thread and I don't anticipate receiving the 30% that I was owed. This is not a large amount of points. (less than 100). I thought I would send the renter 1/2 of the money that I had received (the 70%) from davids in a rather anonymous manner. The reason for not the entire amount was that these points were booked 10 months prior for a highly desirable location and I would cover my maintenance fees. "Share the loss" I have not contacted the renter.
My business has been shuttered for over six weeks and it appears no govt. assistance is available. I don't plan on utilizing the points myself that were returned to me. My thought actually was to see what plan Davids had and if the original family didn't want to reschedule, I would try to book a reservation and gift a stay to healthcare workers who took care of Covid patients. (resort stay).

Advice please.

Ask yourself this question...

Am I confident that David's will pay me the 30% after they previously stiffed me on the last reservation?

If you say yes, I'd like to sell you a really nice bridge in New York...

 

[McCrae]

That is not exactly true,most if not all credit cards have a clause in the contract that you already have agreed to by filling out the application where you surrender your rights to sue them in a court of law. You have agreed to binding arbitration and to use the arborbitor of their choosing .

I am based in the U.K. where no such conditions apply. Fully a Accept that different laws apply depending where you are based. Where do you live?

 

[disneypharm]

Isn’t that for the credit voucher? Think if the above happens it falls on the owner to refund.

Well, I can't imagine the new renter's contract (for new reservations) will omit the above clause. I assume that David's has learned his lesson and includes it in all renter's new contracts going forward.

 

[Bearval]

I am based in the U.K. where no such conditions apply. Fully a Accept that different laws apply depending where you are based. Where do you live?

I do not live in the U.K. so I do not know the language in the credit cards agreements there, but I can tell you that I have cards from 3 major C.C. companies and they all have the same clause for binding arbitration.

 

[Sandisw]

I am an owner that rented points at 10 months for a priority resort in March. These points were banked from 2018 with an April use year. In March I was asked by David's to return the 70% payment and cancel the reservation (this was right before the check-in date). I replied to David's that these points would expire April 1, 2020 which David's knew from the original contract signed. I inquired if the renters had insurance and never received a reply to that question. I was asked to not cancel the reservation online because the points would not be allocated properly. I inquired to the status of the remaining 30% and was told that would need to be used to compensate the renter. I called DVC and asked about my point status (this was in March). I was told they would expire April 1, 2020. I conveyed this to Davids. The only response was that the 30% would be used to compensate renters. In April, I reached out to Davids and offered to reschedule for THIS FAMILY once word was received that my points could be used by Oct 1, 2020. I never received a reply to this offer.

Today I received an email from Davids.
"We wanted to reach out to you today with regards to the points that were to be used for the ********** that were due to expire at the end of March 2020. AS you may be aware DVC has released a new policy extending the expiration date of April and June use years...... We would like to extend the opportunity to re-rent these points so that we may continue to offer your guests an amicable solution for their cancelled reservations as well as to provide you with compensation for the 30% balance left owing to you should we successfully re-rent your points. If you are interested in renting these points please let us know the following information so that we can determine how they apply to the extension. Use year? Points due to expire? Were these points previously banked from 2019 to 2020 use year? IF you answered yes to the above question, how many points were previously banked from 2018 into 2019? How many points in total would you like rented?"

I emailed back asking if my original renter was wanting to reschedule. Reply from Davids was that the family received a voucher for 24 months and Davids did not know if my original renter could travel in the available time frame. "If you are willing to re-rent the points, we will be re-renting the points to a new guest so that we are able to collect the funds from that new reservation so that we are able to put the funds towards the ********* (original renter) travel credit."

What to do??? I have followed this entire thread and I don't anticipate receiving the 30% that I was owed. This is not a large amount of points. (less than 100). I thought I would send the renter 1/2 of the money that I had received (the 70%) from davids in a rather anonymous manner. The reason for not the entire amount was that these points were booked 10 months prior for a highly desirable location and I would cover my maintenance fees. "Share the loss" I have not contacted the renter.
My business has been shuttered for over six weeks and it appears no govt. assistance is available. I don't plan on utilizing the points myself that were returned to me. My thought actually was to see what plan Davids had and if the original family didn't want to reschedule, I would try to book a reservation and gift a stay to healthcare workers who took care of Covid patients. (resort stay).

Advice please.

Honestly, if it were me, I would simply decline the offer to re rent the points to a different owner unless I was paid the additional 30% before making the new rental as well as the additional $1/point he is now charging the new renters,

If that does not happen, then you believe you have fulfilled your End of the contract and will walk away without the 30%

I would not refund the renter because it sounds like they decided the voucher was better for them.

 

[McCrae]

I do not live in the U.K. so I do not know the language in the credit cards agreements there, but I can tell you that I have cards from 3 major C.C. companies and they all have the same clause for binding arbitration.

I don’t doubt you, are you based in the US?

 

[DisneyBB]

Well, I can't imagine the new renter's contract (for new reservations) will omit the above clause. I assume that David's has learned his lesson and includes it in all renter's new contracts going forward.

It is in the new owners one that I would have to refund the renter. Can’t be in both otherwise who is getting the money?

 

[DisneyBB]

I am an owner that rented points at 10 months for a priority resort in March. These points were banked from 2018 with an April use year. In March I was asked by David's to return the 70% payment and cancel the reservation (this was right before the check-in date). I replied to David's that these points would expire April 1, 2020 which David's knew from the original contract signed. I inquired if the renters had insurance and never received a reply to that question. I was asked to not cancel the reservation online because the points would not be allocated properly. I inquired to the status of the remaining 30% and was told that would need to be used to compensate the renter. I called DVC and asked about my point status (this was in March). I was told they would expire April 1, 2020. I conveyed this to Davids. The only response was that the 30% would be used to compensate renters. In April, I reached out to Davids and offered to reschedule for THIS FAMILY once word was received that my points could be used by Oct 1, 2020. I never received a reply to this offer.

Today I received an email from Davids.
"We wanted to reach out to you today with regards to the points that were to be used for the ********** that were due to expire at the end of March 2020. AS you may be aware DVC has released a new policy extending the expiration date of April and June use years...... We would like to extend the opportunity to re-rent these points so that we may continue to offer your guests an amicable solution for their cancelled reservations as well as to provide you with compensation for the 30% balance left owing to you should we successfully re-rent your points. If you are interested in renting these points please let us know the following information so that we can determine how they apply to the extension. Use year? Points due to expire? Were these points previously banked from 2019 to 2020 use year? IF you answered yes to the above question, how many points were previously banked from 2018 into 2019? How many points in total would you like rented?"

I emailed back asking if my original renter was wanting to reschedule. Reply from Davids was that the family received a voucher for 24 months and Davids did not know if my original renter could travel in the available time frame. "If you are willing to re-rent the points, we will be re-renting the points to a new guest so that we are able to collect the funds from that new reservation so that we are able to put the funds towards the ********* (original renter) travel credit."

What to do??? I have followed this entire thread and I don't anticipate receiving the 30% that I was owed. This is not a large amount of points. (less than 100). I thought I would send the renter 1/2 of the money that I had received (the 70%) from davids in a rather anonymous manner. The reason for not the entire amount was that these points were booked 10 months prior for a highly desirable location and I would cover my maintenance fees. "Share the loss" I have not contacted the renter.
My business has been shuttered for over six weeks and it appears no govt. assistance is available. I don't plan on utilizing the points myself that were returned to me. My thought actually was to see what plan Davids had and if the original family didn't want to reschedule, I would try to book a reservation and gift a stay to healthcare workers who took care of Covid patients. (resort stay).

Advice please.

As it’s already been said don’t refund the renter they have been sorted out. Def agree with only rebooking if 30% given to you now. Or I like your idea of gifting the points as you have the 70%

 

[cmrdgrs]

Your post knockUout reinforces for me what I have been saying from the beginning on this thread (and people disagreed with me) -- David does not have good records on the type of points (banked, current UY or borrowed) for each of his owners and how that matched up to his renters. If he did have these records or could pull reports on this information he wouldn't be asking the following in his email to you:

If you are interested in renting these points please let us know the following information so that we can determine how they apply to the extension. Use year? Points due to expire? Were these points previously banked from 2019 to 2020 use year? IF you answered yes to the above question, how many points were previously banked from 2018 into 2019?

This is just crazy to me!!!!

As for your question -- I agree with Sandisw -- decline the invitation to re-rent and call it a day. But, they are your points, you should do what you think is best for you. If you could use the additional 30%, maybe you want to re-rent. The email does say you will only get paid IF they can re-rent the points.

 

[Dracula]

It is in the new owners one that I would have to refund the renter. Can’t be in both otherwise who is getting the money?

Can you guess the answer to the question of who gets the money when the owner returns the 70%, and the renter gets nothing? Let me help: starts with a “D”, and ends with a “D”. Inside you can find a bird from ancient Rome. And he also killed Goliath.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

Ooh I think I know but I thought we couldn’t use that language in the DIS??

 

[Bearval]

Honestly, if it were me, I would simply decline the offer to re rent the points to a different owner unless I was paid the additional 30% before making the new rental as well as the additional $1/point he is now charging the new renters,

If that does not happen, then you believe you have fulfilled your End of the contract and will walk away without the 30%

I would not refund the renter because it sounds like they decided the voucher was better for them.

I agree that I would want the 30% upfront. If they tell you they cannot do that because you may not fulfill your end of the deal tell them they are the only ones so far that didn’t hold up their end once already.

 

[Grumpy by Birth]

"If you are willing to re-rent the points, we will be re-renting the points to a new guest so that we are able to collect the funds from that new reservation so that we are able to put the funds towards the ********* (original renter) travel credit."

Wow. That seems to be the very definition of a Ponzi scheme.

 

[AquaDame]

I've read some of this thread but not all (144 pages is a lot!) and it seems like the majority here are owners... may I ask, what would you prefer your renters do?

My husband has almost entirely decided he will not be going on our trip in October* baring a miracle, which makes me wonder if I shouldn't at least ask David's what the status of the points they used for our reservation is. I do not want the owner out anything, but if its easy and their points won't expire... I'd kick myself for not asking. I know October is so far away, but if I do try wouldn't sooner be better? The other option of course is to just eat it and stay home and have no one check in... would our owner get a refund of some kind if we just no show?

*Our debate about it was sparked again today because our Governor announced today that all large gatherings are cancelled through September here. So while Oct 4th seems far away, for all intents and purposes decisions are being made that far out already.

 

[WDWEPCOT]

Definition of Ponzi Scheme
a form of fraud in which belief in the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors.
So yes you are correct!

 

[starry_solo]

I've read some of this thread but not all (144 pages is a lot!) and it seems like the majority here are owners... may I ask, what would you prefer your renters do?

My husband has almost entirely decided he will not be going on our trip in October* baring a miracle, which makes me wonder if I shouldn't at least ask David's what the status of the points they used for our reservation is. I do not want the owner out anything, but if its easy and their points won't expire... I'd kick myself for not asking. I know October is so far away, but if I do try wouldn't sooner be better? The other option of course is to just eat it and stay home and have no one check in... would our owner get a refund of some kind if we just no show?

*Our debate about it was sparked again today because our Governor announced today that all large gatherings are cancelled through September here. So while Oct 4th seems far away, for all intents and purposes decisions are being made that far out already.

You can ask David's, but they will go with the "no refundable" clause of your original contract (if the resort is open in October). If you stay home, the owner would still be charged the full points cost unless they found out you didn't check in and could cancel the rest of the reservation, but then those points would be put in holding.

See if they will let you change the name of the guests on the reservation?