DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[mickeyluv'r]

This is the primary consternation of most former DAS users entering other accommodations. Many queues are difficult to navigate backwards to exit with ECV. Enter an internal medical issue - like driving impaired down a narrow alleyway at speed with people on the sides -- not a good situation for many stakeholders.

I wonder if WDW might start limiting the use of ECV's in queues, and ask riders to swap to a wheelchair. Still not easy to leave a queue, but maybe easier than an ECV if they might need to exit?

I agree many queues are not designed to allow 2 wheelchairs/ECV's to pass each other. That was my first thought when I heard about the new policies.

 

[lanejudy]

But that’s not the same thing as saying that DAS doesn’t impact SB wait times.

Maybe I'm not understanding the current discussion...I thought it was about the impact of the new DAS rules on the posted standby wait time. Yes?

The other day it was discussed and many argued that the standby wait accounts for the 4:1 or 8:1 or whatever ratios for each LL-to-standby. If so that ratio already includes an estimate of DAS users. So if DAS users were already accounted for in the standby wait, shifting those DAS parties from LL to standby doesn't have impact to the posted wait time. Yes the standby queue is physically longer but with a shorter LL queue it moves faster, therefore the posted wait time doesn't see a significant change.

Or is your position that DAS parties were never taken into account for the posted standby wait times? And thus now adding them physically into the standby queue increases waits? I guess I don't agree with that because I believe WDW's (usually inflated) standby wait times already accounted for DAS parties. So we'll agree to disagree on that point.

 

[theMoreDisneytheBetter]

Maybe I'm not understanding the current discussion...I thought it was about the impact of the new DAS rules on the posted standby wait time. Yes?

The other day it was discussed and many argued that the standby wait accounts for the 4:1 or 8:1 or whatever ratios for each LL-to-standby. If so that ratio already includes an estimate of DAS users. So if DAS users were already accounted for in the standby wait, shifting those DAS parties from LL to standby doesn't have impact to the posted wait time. Yes the standby queue is physically longer but with a shorter LL queue it moves faster, therefore the posted wait time doesn't see a significant change.

Or is your position that DAS parties were never taken into account for the posted standby wait times? And thus now adding them physically into the standby queue increases waits? I guess I don't agree with that because I believe WDW's (usually inflated) standby wait times already accounted for DAS parties. So we'll agree to disagree on that point.

Ah - this is the confusion. I thought that someone was upset about the rule change and was talking about the old DAS rules (aka people arguing that DAS doesn’t impact SB/LLs so Disney is just being greedy by making the change).

 

[dbriggsq]

You can do the video chat from the comfort of your hotel room before entering a park. Many non-US posters have suggested using a VPN. While I understand there is no DAS chat link from the EU/UK websites, the US site no longer indicates “US only.”

I suppose we could do it from the hotel room but there have been reports of people waiting several hours and/or being disconnected from the chat and having to try again the next day. Not ideal at the start of a holiday. VPN I’m not sure about- we would have to pay for it and not sure it would work. The point still is that our outlay by the point of arrival in the US is several thousand in airfare and DVC points which are forfeited on check in. People might suggest buying the new Genie+ but these can be booked 7 days in advance in the US - no availability in the UK - so by the time we arrive most rides would be booked

 

[nalababybear]

Yay for the scholars. Fact is, companies have a fiduciary duty to their shareholders to make as much profit as possible. If a company believes that making social and sustainability changes will help them increase profit, they'll do it, otherwise they won't.

The issue fir many is that Disney has been a very vocal supporter to the underdog while also balancing profits and able to lead from the front. That luster has worn off a bit for many lately.

Still.leading imho, but the gap has narrowed considerably.

Ah - this is the confusion. I thought that someone was upset about the rule change and was talking about the old DAS rules (aka people arguing that DAS doesn’t impact SB/LLs so Disney is just being greedy by making the change).

That's many many pages ago... hundreds.

 

[ellataylor]

I suppose we could do it from the hotel room but there have been reports of people waiting several hours and/or being disconnected from the chat and having to try again the next day. Not ideal at the start of a holiday. VPN I’m not sure about- we would have to pay for it and not sure it would work. The point still is that our outlay by the point of arrival in the US is several thousand in airfare and DVC points which are forfeited on check in. People might suggest buying the new Genie+ but these can be booked 7 days in advance in the US - no availability in the UK - so by the time we arrive most rides would be booked

I had similar concerns about using a VPN. I’m also a technophobe so wasn’t convinced I’d be able to get my head around it.
But I’ve used it for DAS several times now and it’s very easy to download and use

 

[dbriggsq]

I had similar concerns about using a VPN. I’m also a technophobe so wasn’t convinced I’d be able to get my head around it.
But I’ve used it for DAS several times now and it’s very easy to download and use

Which one do you use?

 

[lanejudy]

@dbriggsq I understand the concern with an expensive trip and uncertainty. If I were in your situation I would first speak to my medical provider to get their recommendation of whether the trip should be attempted, and any suggestions of additional precautions. If it’s decided to make the trip I would practice wearing N95 masks at home (indoors and outdoors) for longer periods since you mentioned it’s difficult to breathe. If it eases your mind to pre-register for DAS in advanced, the cost for a VPN may be worth that peace of mind. And most of all I’d set my mind on expecting a different sort of visit this time, maybe more resort-hopping, shopping, Disney Springs, fewer big attractions, etc. I think your visits are 2 weeks so maybe you could do light days with short queues the first week, and plan LLMP for a few days in the 2nd week. That way you can pre-book after arrival. You might also want to look into upgrading your mobile service to an international plan; sometimes that can be done for just a month without impacting your usual service.

Ultimately, it’s a decision only you and your family can make if a trip will be worth it this year. Maybe banking points or renting your points out this year is an option while waiting to see how this all plays out.

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

Currently studying to get my master and my Sustainability teacher would disagree with you. It's quite a 1970s opinion to say that the only responsibility a company has is to make money. Nowadays, the opinion of scholars is: to be sustainable in the long run you have to keep a balance with social and environmental aspects as well, not just economical.

You are studying for your masters? Good for you, Karin! For as long as we chatted I did not know that. Busy times for you.

Anyway, your point about sustainable businesses having competing interests other than just profits is very true. Good point.

 

[PrincessDadx2]

I'm sorry you're feeling the way you are and it seems like you're just venting your frustration here but the simple point I was making is those who are physically handicapped have been in standby lines for years, it may not have been you, but it was someone else and there was no product being sold back then. I hope you're able to find a different location to vacation if you're done with Disney.

I don't really need you as a therapist, but OK. We disagree. Sure, some physically handicapped people always waited in line just like some people refuse to get a handicapped tag. They have their own reasons, but if they asked Disney would have provided them DAS if their condition impacted their ability to wait in a line. Let's just call it non developmental issues that impact the ability to stand in long lines.

When fast pass was free everyone had access to the LL and everyone dealt with the system. When Disney started to charge for that access they created a huge incentive to commit fraud for a DAS pass and created dissatisfaction in the people who were paying for the access. Disney has the feedback. Their "solution" to the problem they themselves created was to walk back what they have previously provided to their non developmental DAS community. In essence blaming actual non developmental disabilities that they previously acknowledged for years that should have accommodation for the fraud that Disney incented. I think this is a punk move. I believe they could have reached a better solution, but maybe I am the naive one. Others smarter than I have pointed out the legal issues with managing other solutions to accommodations. At the end of the day it is a direct conflict between meeting non developmental needs that they previously acknowledged vs. maximizing profit. Disney made their choice and so did I.

 

[Disneychick75]

I don't really need you as a therapist, but OK. We disagree. Sure, some physically handicapped people always waited in line just like some people refuse to get a handicapped tag. They have their own reasons, but if they asked Disney would have provided them DAS if their condition impacted their ability to wait in a line. Let's just call it non developmental issues that impact the ability to stand in long lines.

When fast pass was free everyone had access to the LL and everyone dealt with the system. When Disney started to charge for that access they created a huge incentive to commit fraud for a DAS pass and created dissatisfaction in the people who were paying for the access. Disney has the feedback. Their "solution" to the problem they themselves created was to walk back what they have previously provided to their non developmental DAS community. In essence blaming actual non developmental disabilities that they previously acknowledged for years that should have accommodation for the fraud that Disney incented. I think this is a punk move. I believe they could have reached a better solution, but maybe I am the naive one. Others smarter than I have pointed out the legal issues with managing other solutions to accommodations. At the end of the day it is a direct conflict between meeting non developmental needs that they previously acknowledged vs. maximizing profit. Disney made their choice and so did I.

Iger has always been "all about profit" even at the expense of guests. IMO, people satisfied with WDW must not have visited much before he became CEO in 2005. Eisner vs Iger = day and night difference in food quality, resort cleanliness, and making sure guests are happy. It took a couple of years before things began to slide but slide they have.

 

[Einstein509]

Iger has always been "all about profit" even at the expense of guests. IMO, people satisfied with WDW must not have visited much before he became CEO in 2005. Eisner vs Iger = day and night difference in food quality, resort cleanliness, and making sure guests are happy. It took a couple of years before things began to slide but slide they have.

THIS! Yes they have slid. I thought Chapek was bad, but Iger isn't much better in terms of profits at the expense of the guest experience.

 

[Karin1984]

Which one do you use?

I have used both Nord VPN and Express VPN. Lot of VPN providers offer a first month free option or have special offers for reduced rates for the first three months etc.
- Buy a VPN
- Download & install
- Set it to a city in the US
- Go to the US Disneyworld website
- Go to the DAS pages and open a video call.

 

[PrincessV]

Dumb tech question: I’ve downloaded the Zoom app for my iPad - do I need to set up an account to use it for DAS video chat, or will they send me a meeting ID I can plug in to use without my own account? Sorry - I’m a Teams user and Zoom is totally foreign to me lol! I already have DAS set up but may need to make a party change in a couple days and would like to have things set up, just in case they need to video conference for that. TIA!

 

[mistysue]

I don't really need you as a therapist, but OK. We disagree. Sure, some physically handicapped people always waited in line just like some people refuse to get a handicapped tag. They have their own reasons, but if they asked Disney would have provided them DAS if their condition impacted their ability to wait in a line. Let's just call it non developmental issues that impact the ability to stand in long lines.

When fast pass was free everyone had access to the LL and everyone dealt with the system. When Disney started to charge for that access they created a huge incentive to commit fraud for a DAS pass and created dissatisfaction in the people who were paying for the access. Disney has the feedback. Their "solution" to the problem they themselves created was to walk back what they have previously provided to their non developmental DAS community. In essence blaming actual non developmental disabilities that they previously acknowledged for years that should have accommodation for the fraud that Disney incented. I think this is a punk move. I believe they could have reached a better solution, but maybe I am the naive one. Others smarter than I have pointed out the legal issues with managing other solutions to accommodations. At the end of the day it is a direct conflict between meeting non developmental needs that they previously acknowledged vs. maximizing profit. Disney made their choice and so did I.

I'm not sure why anyone would believe fraud is the only issue here. What percentage of park goers can be given basically unlimited use of the LL for free due to a disability before it would be legitimate users causing the issue? 5%? 10%? 20%? Then realize those people might on average have around 4 people with them, meaning we're looking at at least double the % of disabled users getting into that line.

There are two things, which have come up repeatedly through this thread that make your comments incomplete. One is that the number of people with disabilities (legit ones that would qualify for some level of assistance) keeps rising. Close to 3% of kids have ASD, 9% ADHD, over 4% considered fully disabled on census (which will have some ASD overlap, but much of that is other disabilities) up to 16% have a sensory disorder, IBD has more than doubled, It's actually really easy to put together that easily a good 1/5 people in the parks could ask for DAS and if diagnosis alone passed as reasoning most people walking around would have access through their own or a condition of a person in their party. We aren't talking about 1% of the population, we're talking about something that is bordering on common. Then add in physical handicap- which would be ON TOP of all of this.
The other part, which you seem to be glossing over - if someone's ONLY disability was that they were in a wheelchair, they weren't supposed to be getting DAS before now, so this isn't a change. I'm sure plenty of people ended up with it because they either demanded or ran into a CM who didn't want to argue. Me stating this is not accusing anyone of doing anything wrong, but they made the line accessible so there wasn't a need being met by DAS, it was just a perk. (crappy trade I'm certain, and this doesn't apply to people when there is something beyond the stuck in a chair situation going on)

It's not just fraud, legitimate usage was too high. That doesn't change because people's feelings are hurt. Yes, taking away free FP made some people realize they needed an accommodation they may have been able to sort of patch together by themselves under the former system, but one person having used it before doesn't make them somehow "more special" and "more deserving" than the person who didn't know it was there. When my youngest was a toddler we were told he would never walk. We didn't know stroller as a wheelchair existed. I had a 2 year old I had to carry through every line, who couldn't even sit up by himself. At 3 he surprised us all and his muscles started working. I'm sure there's a family out there with a similar story- but knew about stroller as wheelchair - that doesn't make them NOW more entitled to it than we are just because they had it before. If we have the same needs, we should be accommodated in a way that meets those needs regardless of past visits.

So there need to be alternate accommodations. The solution to "anything at all doesn't work right in my body" can't be unlimited LL. Hence redoing queues so chairs can go through, and telling people to leave and return to the line. This covers a very large chuck of the disabled community. If someone's needs are met through other means, they don't need the DAS just because they got one before. Nobody is entitled to it only because they knew about it first.

 

[mommy2paisley]

I'm not sure why anyone would believe fraud is the only issue here. What percentage of park goers can be given basically unlimited use of the LL for free due to a disability before it would be legitimate users causing the issue? 5%? 10%? 20%? Then realize those people might on average have around 4 people with them, meaning we're looking at at least double the % of disabled users getting into that line.

There are two things, which have come up repeatedly through this thread that make your comments incomplete. One is that the number of people with disabilities (legit ones that would qualify for some level of assistance) keeps rising. Close to 3% of kids have ASD, 9% ADHD, over 4% considered fully disabled on census (which will have some ASD overlap, but much of that is other disabilities) up to 16% have a sensory disorder, IBD has more than doubled, It's actually really easy to put together that easily a good 1/5 people in the parks could ask for DAS and if diagnosis alone passed as reasoning most people walking around would have access through their own or a condition of a person in their party. We aren't talking about 1% of the population, we're talking about something that is bordering on common. Then add in physical handicap- which would be ON TOP of all of this.
The other part, which you seem to be glossing over - if someone's ONLY disability was that they were in a wheelchair, they weren't supposed to be getting DAS before now, so this isn't a change. I'm sure plenty of people ended up with it because they either demanded or ran into a CM who didn't want to argue. Me stating this is not accusing anyone of doing anything wrong, but they made the line accessible so there wasn't a need being met by DAS, it was just a perk. (crappy trade I'm certain, and this doesn't apply to people when there is something beyond the stuck in a chair situation going on)

It's not just fraud, legitimate usage was too high. That doesn't change because people's feelings are hurt. Yes, taking away free FP made some people realize they needed an accommodation they may have been able to sort of patch together by themselves under the former system, but one person having used it before doesn't make them somehow "more special" and "more deserving" than the person who didn't know it was there. When my youngest was a toddler we were told he would never walk. We didn't know stroller as a wheelchair existed. I had a 2 year old I had to carry through every line, who couldn't even sit up by himself. At 3 he surprised us all and his muscles started working. I'm sure there's a family out there with a similar story- but knew about stroller as wheelchair - that doesn't make them NOW more entitled to it than we are just because they had it before. If we have the same needs, we should be accommodated in a way that meets those needs regardless of past visits.

So there need to be alternate accommodations. The solution to "anything at all doesn't work right in my body" can't be unlimited LL. Hence redoing queues so chairs can go through, and telling people to leave and return to the line. This covers a very large chuck of the disabled community. If someone's needs are met through other means, they don't need the DAS just because they got one before. Nobody is entitled to it only because they knew about it first.

I wholeheartedly agree with all of this! Also, I feel for you before you knew about stroller as a wheelchair, as I had a similar experience. My twins have a genetic disorder which caused them not to walk until they were almost 3. When they were 2, we went to Disney, and we couldn’t take their stroller anywhere. My husband would take my older two kids to a ride for rides swap, but I couldn’t possibly carry both boys around more than a couple minutes, and I broke down at the Soarin building after seeing sooooo many scooters riding around, but I couldn’t take my stroller. That’s when a wonderful CM told me about stroller as a wheelchair, and by the time we all had ridden Soarin, she had a red tag for us right there. It was amazing the different it made for our trip!! Anyway, that’s a bit off topic, but reading your story made me think of that nightmare turned more magical by a great CM lol.

 

[mistysue]

I wholeheartedly agree with all of this! Also, I feel for you before you knew about stroller as a wheelchair, as I had a similar experience. My twins have a genetic disorder which caused them not to walk until they were almost 3. When they were 2, we went to Disney, and we couldn’t take their stroller anywhere. My husband would take my older two kids to a ride for rides swap, but I couldn’t possibly carry both boys around more than a couple minutes, and I broke down at the Soarin building after seeing sooooo many scooters riding around, but I couldn’t take my stroller. That’s when a wonderful CM told me about stroller as a wheelchair, and by the time we all had ridden Soarin, she had a red tag for us right there. It was amazing the different it made for our trip!! Anyway, that’s a bit off topic, but reading your story made me think of that nightmare turned more magical by a great CM lol.

I'm so glad someone found you and helped! I can't imagine reliving that x2! I just remember this one time I ended up putting my extra shirt on the ground and actually lying him down in line with people vocally judging us for it. Sorry, yes, I'm putting my huge baby on the ground because we can't carry him anymore. No, he's not so spoiled he is refusing to sit or walk.

 

[sarahk0204]

Dumb tech question: I’ve downloaded the Zoom app for my iPad - do I need to set up an account to use it for DAS video chat, or will they send me a meeting ID I can plug in to use without my own account? Sorry - I’m a Teams user and Zoom is totally foreign to me lol! I already have DAS set up but may need to make a party change in a couple days and would like to have things set up, just in case they need to video conference for that. TIA!

I do not know what Disney will do, but as a Zoom user who sets up meetings for various groups, I send out meeting IDs. Most of the people don't have Zoom accounts.

 

[koszmok]

My daughter uses a powerchair, and while we've never needed to leave a queue, it would be a challenge if we needed to in many situations.

This is true for anyone with or without DAS. Once you are past the LL entrance, the same issue occurs. It negates part of the "what if x happens and I need to leave the line" argument some use when applying for DAS. You'll still encounter the same scenario in LL queues, pre-shows, etc.

The difference is less likely that you need to leave the line after 10 min in the LL.

Than after spending 60 min in the standby.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The difference is less likely that you need to leave the line after 10 min in the LL.

Than after spending 60 min in the standby.

That will always depend on a person and what is their situation is. With some people their condition is very unpredictable and by that very nature it cannot be predicated by saying what your above point is. The PP point however was about difficulty leaving a line, queue after merge, pre-show, etc physically speaking.