Curious about others thoughts on the "Fairness" of the ADR system

[Brian Noble]

I think it is unreasonable to book two meals for the same time expecting to go only to one or the other. If a CM at DRC spots double booking, they will ask why you've booked it that way---unless you've got a plausible story for why you need both (e.g. a large party splitting up), they won't let you keep them both.

That said, people do it, and they are within their rights to do so. I'm sure they are not bothered in the least that I disapprove.

I expect that if faced with evidence of many people doing this, Disney will respond by taking a credit card guarantee and imposing a 24 or 48 hour cancellation period. Cancel within that period or no-show and pay a penalty. I think this is very unlikely, though. I suspect the number of people who legitimately miss a dining reservation (too tired---got hung up in a long line, etc.) far out-numbers the people who double book for flexibility.

In the end, though, the current system isn't so much unfair as insane. I used to make those 180-day ADRs, and have just given up. I always changed them (and usually many times) anyway, so now I reserve the one or two "big ones" that we really want early, but I just fill the rest in as needed much closer to the trip, or possibly even during it. If something isn't available, I'd be happy to eat at the better CS locations, but so far, I've always been able to get something.

 

[Took]

I think the current system is "fair" in the strictest sense, but I don't like the 180 days option. It seems to me that 60 days would be more reasonable.

Took

 

[Markstudy]

I think the current system is "fair" in the strictest sense, but I don't like the 180 days option. It seems to me that 60 days would be more reasonable.

Took

The bigger question is..... why does Disney do 180 days instead of 60?????

My guess ..... 100% of people can figure out where to eat 60 days out... so you would get 4,000 calls at 7:00am on that day..... and since there is no way to handle that kind of volume on a phone-bank... you'd have a lot of unhappy campers

By doing it at 180 days out.... only 10% of the people are ready with their plan (maybe 400 calls)... then the next 85% of callers drift-in over the next 120 days.... much more manageable from the point-of-view of a phone-bank staff.

 

[dzorn]

Doesn't surprise me that she was wrong...although it was the letter from Disney, which she sent to me, that mentioned encouraging me to book before I got onsite! I don't know if I kept it or not. I'll check my paperwork and post it if I can.

I must say, my "Disney specialist" isn't a real expert on Disney. Last time I was down there I asked about EMHs- whether we could park hop into a park during EMH or if we had to be there early enough to get the wristband. She assured me that we could get into the park at any time. Her boss, who was in the back room, yelled out to us that if we weren't at the park before the regular closing time, we wouldn't be admitted for EMH. That's just one of the things she didn't know about!

Actually she had it right her boss was wrong.

Denise in MI

 

[Island Mouse]

I also have no problem with anyone booking multiple ADRs at the same time or within a few hours. <snip>
IMO, there are a number of legit reasons I could see to do this and frankly, if I call 180 days out and obtain on a first come first serve basis, that's no one's business but mine and the restaurants. That is what first come, first serve is about and IMO, it's very fair. If you want something specific at a specific time slot and can't be flexible, call at 6:59 am 180 days out and your odds are just as good as anyone else's.

I agree with this point. Everyone has the same opportunity to call at 180 days out. I never feel bad for planning ahead. If I called this morning and got the chef's table at V&A's for 180 days from now, I wouldn't feel bad for all the people who called after I did trying to get it and were denied. In a way I would feel victorious and I am sure others who get the hard-to-get ADR's (CRT, Le Cellier, etc.) feel the same way. It all comes down to doing what is best for your family, even if it means booking multiple adr's for a single meal. If Disney really wanted to limit it, they would require a credit card for all ADR's. They haven't done that yet so obviously the situation isn't as bad as some make it out to be. I understand it is a bummer to not get the ADR you want when you call less than 180 days out. Just keep trying, maybe someone will cancel...

 

[Tink888]

I agree with this point. Everyone has the same opportunity to call at 180 days out. I never feel bad for planning ahead. If I called this morning and got the chef's table at V&A's for 180 days from now, I wouldn't feel bad for all the people who called after I did trying to get it and were denied. In a way I would feel victorious and I am sure others who get the hard-to-get ADR's (CRT, Le Cellier, etc.) feel the same way. It all comes down to doing what is best for your family, even if it means booking multiple adr's for a single meal. If Disney really wanted to limit it, they would require a credit card for all ADR's. They haven't done that yet so obviously the situation isn't as bad as some make it out to be. I understand it is a bummer to not get the ADR you want when you call less than 180 days out. Just keep trying, maybe someone will cancel...

If different members of your party are booking ADR at different places for the same times and you explain to Disney what you're doing, I don't think you run the risk of getting your ADR's canceled.

IMO, The problem with booking multiple ADR's is that it's inconsiderate to other guests. If you're staying for 5 days, you need only book 5 breakfasts/lunches/dinners. Other guests trying to book shouldn't run the risk of being denied because someone else can't make up their mind or decide where they're going to be that day. Not all guests have their trips booked 180 days out. If you do your planning, then you know where you'll be and where you want to eat. Multiple booking is kind of like planning for not having a plan.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but if the logic that "it all comes down to doing what's best for YOUR family applies" and somebody used that logic to justify pool hopping (better for the family to stay in a value and hop on over to SAB) or smoking on a balcony, line cutting, etc., people would be having a fit. I know there are rules against everything I mentioned and there isn't a "rule" against booking multiple ADR's but all of it really comes down to being considerate of other guests. Yes - it is your family's vacation and you want it to be great but you aren't the only one vacationing (and dining) at Disney and it's nice to be considerate of other guests (regardless of whether or not there's a rule in place). Just something to think about.

 

[Clotho]

Considering most restaurants out in the "real world" will take reservations as much as a year in advance, the 180 day mark is a limiter that makes it a little more reasonable timewise for people to be ready to make their decisions. It is difficult to stomach the idea of making plans for dinner for 6 months from now, but it is a fair system and makes sense for a vacation that people start saving and planning for sometimes years in advance.

 

[carj]

I think that the ADR system is okay. I was able to get every ADR that I wanted at about 45 day prior to our June 22 trip. (It did take me a couple of calls to get CRT for breakfast )

We have 3 ADRs for our 7 night trip.
CRT breakfast (pre-paid)
Ohana breakfast
Garden Grill lunch
We also have a Pirate cruise (CC required)

I like to enjoy a nice meal as much as the next person but it is just food. That is not why we are going to Disney. If we did not have a single ADR, I would move on and enjoy my trip. We did not do the dining plan because it dining is not the focus of our trip. There are plenty of great places to eat at home, I don't want to spend my trip worried about making a reservation.

I guess from my very limited experience, the ADR system was fair. (I got what I wanted )

When we went to Disney in 2000 for our honeymoon, we walked up to places every night for dinner. Some places we were not able to get into but we were able to walk up. It sounds like that is not possible anymore. If I hadn't been reading these boards though, I would not have made ADRs because of my previous experience.

 

[Lady Radington]

I do think the current system is fair (if a little crazy!), however i wish it was easier to walk up at the time when you want to eat. That said, last year we went for 14 nights. We didn't make a single ADR until we arrived at our hotel and were able to make reservations only a day or two in advance of when we wanted to go, for most of the places we liked the look of. We are however a couple and do not have kids, so it was very easy for us to do this.

To me it would not be a holiday if i was having to rush around from one place to another, sticking to strict time constraints, as this is what we do in our everyday lives and we like a break from it.

We travel all the way over from the UK and this Summer we are staying for 16 nights. Having to make plans and reservations for 48+ meals well in advance would be a nightmare!

We always research the parks and restaurants before we go to see what we like the look of, what has changed and note the more popular restaurants, but we certainly like to be spontaineous when we get there.

I don't think Disney will do anything, for now, about double booking restaurants, as either way they know someone will fill the table. I see this issue as being a double edged sword really. For those who do like to make reservations in advance it is a hinderance, however so long as the second reservation is cancelled a day or so before, it is a real life-line to those who ask on the off-chance, or walk up that day.

I will not be making any reservations for our 16 night trip in July, partly out of principle, but partly because we have no idea what we will feel like eating on the day.

 

[GoldieSaysMeep]

If different members of your party are booking ADR at different places for the same times and you explain to Disney what you're doing, I don't think you run the risk of getting your ADR's canceled.

IMO, The problem with booking multiple ADR's is that it's inconsiderate to other guests. If you're staying for 5 days, you need only book 5 breakfasts/lunches/dinners. Other guests trying to book shouldn't run the risk of being denied because someone else can't make up their mind or decide where they're going to be that day. Not all guests have their trips booked 180 days out. If you do your planning, then you know where you'll be and where you want to eat. Multiple booking is kind of like planning for not having a plan.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but if the logic that "it all comes down to doing what's best for YOUR family applies" and somebody used that logic to justify pool hopping (better for the family to stay in a value and hop on over to SAB) or smoking on a balcony, line cutting, etc., people would be having a fit. I know there are rules against everything I mentioned and there isn't a "rule" against booking multiple ADR's but all of it really comes down to being considerate of other guests. Yes - it is your family's vacation and you want it to be great but you aren't the only one vacationing (and dining) at Disney and it's nice to be considerate of other guests (regardless of whether or not there's a rule in place). Just something to think about.

I guess if you want to spend your whole trip being nice to other guests, go for it. Personally, my only concern when I am on a $3000 vacation is the enjoyment of myself and the people I am with. Your comparisons don't make a lot of sense to me. I wouldn't pool hop, because I am not paying for whatever pool I might be hopping to (and it just seems annoying to travel to swim at another resort). I wouldn't smoke (if I was a smoker, which I am not, but have traveled with one) in a non-smoking area. I wouldn't line cut because line rules are first come, first serve. The same as the ADR line.

The difference is, you are paying for that pool at your hotel. It is clearly posted that you are not allowed to smoke on the balcony and if it is not posted then it is presumed to be allowed. Line cutting is a weird comparison. I am pretty sure line cutting is not allowed but common sense says first come first serve. Just like ADRs.

If multiple ADRs were such a big problem, Disney would strictly forbid it or require cc deposits (something I would GLADLY pay to end this nonsense).

I have multiple ADRs for my Sept. trip and I have absolutely no intent of cancelling or skipping any of them. They are not for the same restaurants and they are for different times, but several days I have an early lunch and a late lunch and one night I have an early dinner and a late dinner. At least 3 CMs at the dining line have told me they will absolutely not be cancelling my ADRs.

It is ridiculous, IMO, to get all upset about what other people do on vacation. Everyone has the same chance to book whatever they want at 180 days out. If they don't then that's really not anyone's fault but their own for not planning ahead.

Sorry, but on my vacation, I don't honestly care about what other people are doing. I only care about my group's enjoyment and that is my focus and I'm going to book meals in a way that works for us. I guess that makes me a horrible person in the eyes of some but I really do not care.

You know, I really think WDW should go back to allowing walk ups when the ADRs are not there on time like they used to do. This would alleviate most of the problem.

You have an ADR. You show up at your time. If you show up 20 minutes late, an a walk up showed up at your time, you just might have to wait...

 

[thegrimdwarf]

I guess if you want to spend your whole trip being nice to other guests, go for it. Personally, my only concern when I am on a $3000 vacation is the enjoyment of myself and the people I am with.

Wow. I sure hope I don't run across you and the only people you care about in the parks.

Just an FYI -- everyone else has to pay, too.

 

[GoldieSaysMeep]

Wow. I sure hope I don't run across you and the only people you care about in the parks.

Just an FYI -- everyone else has to pay, too.

Really? They Do?

I have never been inconsiderate of another person in any of the parks whatsoever. I seriously fail to see how my eating an early lunch at 11:30 and then a late lunch around 2:30 impacts anyone in any way shape or form. If they wanted to eat at wherever I am eating that badly, they could have called and beat me to it.

It's not as though I am shoving children out of the way to get on the rides.

 

[thegrimdwarf]

Really? They do?

I have never been inconsiderate of another person in any of the parks whatsoever. I seriously fail to see how my eating an early lunch at 11:30 and then a late lunch around 2:30 impacts anyone in any way shape or form. If they wanted to eat at wherever I am eating that badly, they could have called and beat me to it.

It's not as though I am shoving children out of the way to get on rides.

Hey, you're the one who declared a complete lack of concern for anyone but yourself. It doesn't have anything to do with your dinner reservations.

 

[GoldieSaysMeep]

I am not going to ruin this thread or take it OT by arguing with you. Just one last point and that is I would be willing to bet most people who are on vacation at WDW are there for their family time and that their primary interest on vacation is their own family.

How only being concerned with your own family and doing what works best for you on vacation (within the rules) translates suddenly into = "rude" is puzzling to me.

Back to the topic at hand...

 

[thegrimdwarf]

I am not going to ruin this thread or take it OT by arguing with you. Just one last point and that is I would be willing to bet most people who are on vacation at WDW are there for their family time and that their primary interest on vacation is their own family.

How only being concerned with your own family and doing what works best for you on vacation (within the rules) translates suddenly into = "rude" is puzzling to me.

Back to the topic at hand...

Good enough, but I do have to say there's a vast difference between your family being your "primary" concern and your "only" concern. There's a LOT of really rude behavior in the world, and if more people stopped acting like they're the center of the universe, things might be different.

 

[emmabemmainc]

Good enough, but I do have to say there's a vast difference between your family being your "primary" concern and your "only" concern. There's a LOT of really rude behavior in the world, and if more people stopped acting like they're the center of the universe, things might be different.

ITA.

I probably shouldn't be shocked at the PP's attitude, but I still am. That's a good thing, right??!! Wow. I wish I could be that self-centered. It would probably make things a lot easier for me.

 

[asmit4]

ITA.

I probably shouldn't be shocked at the PP's attitude, but I still am. That's a good thing, right??!! Wow. I wish I could be that self-centered. It would probably make things a lot easier for me.

I agree, and I have to say that most people on the DISboards also agree with you even if they don't come out and say it. I also think I would rather a poster come on, and say "this is who I am, this is what I think, and I know it's wrong" vs. a poster that says "this is who I am, this is what I think and I'm right".

I fully admit there are things that I do that are a bit selfish or self centered now and then but I at least have the ability to know better.

 

[thegrimdwarf]

ITA.

I probably shouldn't be shocked at the PP's attitude, but I still am. That's a good thing, right??!!

Indeed it is it a good thing! I was hoping for a 'well, maybe I didn't word that right' or something...but sometimes, people tell you all you need to know about them with very few words.

 

[GoldieSaysMeep]

I can honestly say I am absolutely shocked that so many people would have a problem with someone eating at 11:30 and then at 2:30 and would equate that to being a rude person. That is what works for me with the way I eat. I can not stomach food when I first wake up and I can't sleep if I eat really late...

So I'm curious, why is that wrong?

 

[thegrimdwarf]

I can honestly say I am absolutely shocked that so many people would have a problem with someone eating at 11:30 and then at 2:30 and would equate that to being a rude person. That is what works for me with the way I eat. I can not stomach food when I first wake up and I can't sleep if I eat really late...

So I'm curious, why is that wrong?

As I've already said, it's got NOTHING to do with your dining plans.